Spiral Knights - Damage list in Lockdown

Damage list in Lockdown

46 replies [Last post]

Wed, 08/22/2012 - 12:18

Killbotxtreme

Despite the fact that there is a wiki about how much damage a weapon does, that doesn't exactly apply for Lockdown. So I decided to test all the weapons I had that were 5 stars and level 10. I may be adding more weapons to this forums if it is useful. I may also have to test for resistance later on, but resistance in lockdown only makes a bit of a difference (about half a bar). I am wearing full skolver while testing ALL of these including the guns. I have max damage bonus on the swords with the striker as well (keep that in mind).

Barbarous Thorn Blade: 290 damage first/2nd swing (resistance: unknown).
Barbarous thorn blade: 373 damage/ 3rd swing (resistance: unknown).
Gran Faust: 413 first swing (resistance: unknown)
Gran Faust: 515 second swing (resistance: unknown)
Polaris: 173 per bullet (resistance: unknown)
Sentenza: 83 (resistance: none)
Glacius: 362 (resistance: full skolver)
Glacius charge: 236 per ball and 715 for the swipe (resistance: full skolver)
Valiance: 102 per shot (resistance: full skolver)
Hammer: 377 (resistance: none) I edited it because I realized my hammer was not level 10. But now it is!
Hammer Dash: 262 (resistance: none)
Hammer: Last swing: 449 (resistance: none)
Dread venom striker: 172 per hit (I am not sure if the silhouette hit or not, but I tested 2 times, both did same damage.) (resistance: full skolver)
Storm driver: 140 (resistance: none)
Umbra driver: 173 (resistance: none)
Leviathan Blade: 1st swing: 273 (resistance: Full vog) 3rd swing: 337 (resistance: Full skolver)
Leviathan Blade: Charge: 1 swing: 482 (resistance: full mad bomber)

More tests:
Barbarous thorn blade very high damage bonus: First swing: 289
Barbarous thorn blade max damage bonus: First swing: 315
Barbarous thorn blade damage bonus max attacking someone in death warning: 415 damage
The people in the first 2 tests all had no pierce resist (both were full snarbolax with no pierce uvs)

I know the resistance for some of the hits because I actually got some friends to cooperate, but on others I just hit someone randomly. After some simple calculations, I figured that 1 bar is about 40 damage. So a full resistant armor set would take off about 5-30 damage if the armor does not have any UV's. I also figured out that if I hit somebody that has 1 bar left with a gran faust, I would still get the same amount of damage as if I hit him once when he was at full health. If this thread is useful I will try my best to post more weapon stats on here, if not to the graveyard!

UV resistance:
Full damage bonus BTB vs full skolver (no uvs): 290 damage
Full damage bonus BTB vs full skolver with one pierce low: 284

Sun, 09/02/2012 - 17:45

Killbotxtreme

Also,

I would like to thank all of the people who helped me test whether willingly or unwillingly :)

Here is a list of people who were a great help in these experiments:
Snarkey
Whats-his-face
Zat-bust
Spongerino
Tmdals
Solimando
Excaliburlegend
Neonlighter
Nazogrande
Bienya
Drdrj

I might have forgotten one guy please remind me :P

Wed, 08/22/2012 - 12:41

Kyvriz

Hp bar

You can convert the raw damage number to number of hp bar by dividing by 40.

For example, for BTB first swing, you will see 290 damage as 7 / 7.5 bar hp lost.

Wed, 08/22/2012 - 13:01

Killbotxtreme

Yes

You are correct.

Wed, 08/22/2012 - 16:58

Bert-Banana

Hammer = 370 damage.
Is that initial hit or the one hit and the one that registers in the lunge?

More hammer tests would be nice, because I am just SUCH a Hammer spammer.

Wed, 08/22/2012 - 17:42

Killbotxtreme

Hey snarkey!

Thanks for your help testing.

The hammer= 370 damage is that very first hit
I did not dash after that or anything

I'll need a cooperative guy to test on

Wed, 08/22/2012 - 17:58

Tenkii

speaking of resistance...

If you wanted to really go with raw numbers, have you considered doing the test with Recon's Deathmark?

Correct me if I'm wrong (and I'd be curious about it too, since I act upon this assumption), but doesn't deathmark completely remove your target's defense?

Wed, 08/22/2012 - 19:26

Lightyourfire

It does

That would be a useful thing to test more accurately

Wed, 08/22/2012 - 21:11

Noomad

So who's gonna make the

So who's gonna make the "Lockdown Test A" and "Lockdown Test B" guilds? :D

It would be really awesome to find out the numbers for weapons with

Recon mark (no defense)
Off suit (just the normal defense)
correct suit ( i.e. piercing on skolver)

But blah so much coordination involved. Also I feel like, for some reason, the devs would not want this kind of information on the forums or anywhere in existence hehe

Thu, 08/23/2012 - 09:09

Killbotxtreme

Yes I could use some help testing.

There is always 1 cooperate member in a party but the thing is everyone else in the party kills on of us immediately.... I don't know why it seems the recon deathmark makes a bigger difference in damage. For example, if I am wearing full skolver and I attack another full skolver (no UV's) with barbarous thorn blade it would do about 7 bars. If I attack a guy with no pierce resist, it would do about 7 and a half bars. While if you had death warning 2 hits might just finish you off.

Thu, 08/23/2012 - 13:36

#10

Killbotxtreme

Ok there you go!

Ok seiran there you go! Snarkey here is your hammer information. I apologize for editing the damage by a bit because my hammer turned out to be level 9 and a half <_>.

And it's weird because I attacked someone full damage bonus with barbarous and it did 315. I attacked someone in deathwarning with full damage bonus with barbarous and it did 415. It has to do something a little more than remove all its defense I would think

Thu, 08/23/2012 - 16:24

#11

Spookington

Y Halo Thar

Ah - sorry about that during LD, I had no idea what you were doing.

By "experimenting" I thought you were trying out new gear for self-improvement.

The recon mark lowers defense, but I have no idea by how much.

Thu, 08/23/2012 - 17:09

#12

Killbotxtreme

Can't think of anything

Yeah well you didn't mess anything up spookington :P

Fri, 08/24/2012 - 05:03

#13

Excaliburlegend

...

YOU FORGOT CALIBUR!!! D; *tear* Your other test dummy :D

~Calibur

Fri, 08/24/2012 - 12:54

#14

Killbotxtreme

Sorry

I don't have leviathan D:

Fri, 08/24/2012 - 14:54

#15

Excaliburlegend

DERP!

... no, like i was the other test person... Calibur... Excaliburlegend.

~Calibur

Fri, 08/24/2012 - 15:31

#16

Killbotxtreme

Wow

I don't think you looked at the list that named who helped me :)

Sat, 08/25/2012 - 12:01

#17

Killbotxtreme

Ok now...

Now I just gotta heat my umbra

Sun, 08/26/2012 - 17:10

#18

Killbotxtreme

Oh yeah I forgot to mention

If you guys have anything you want me to test or any suggestions please feel welcome to post them

Sun, 08/26/2012 - 21:09

#19

Kyvriz

Damage bonus

Barbarous thorn blade very high damage bonus: First swing: 289
Barbarous thorn blade max damage bonus: First swing: 315

So that's only ~9% difference from very high -> ultra -> max ...

Can you also do max damage bonus against a full skolver with no UVs, and with low piercing UV?

I would like to see the minimum piercing defense that would help in sustaining more hits.

thanks for the work!

Mon, 08/27/2012 - 02:06

#20

Erridunno

saaaaaad

Mon, 08/27/2012 - 08:03

#21

Lukehandkooler

"Sentenza: 83 (resistance:

"Sentenza: 83 (resistance: none)"

WOW really benefiting from +DMG maximum! before the invincibility frames get kicked in!

~Luke

Mon, 08/27/2012 - 12:01

#22

Killbotxtreme

What a disappointment

A low resist makes virtually no difference

Tue, 08/28/2012 - 01:37

#23

Havenihaveaproblem

@Haven (so i can search this later)

Would you mind giving some more information on how you conducted the experiment, especially how you got your numbers? Thanks!

Tue, 08/28/2012 - 07:18

#24

Trollingyou

I am dissapoint

Low defense UV does virtually nothing.

Also, please tell me those gun numbers are with no damage bonus (I think that's what you were trying to say).

I do think there's more to the deathmark too. My umbra driver hits skolvers harder when they have the death mark than when they don't (as in, more little bars drop to the floor). If it only affected their defense this should not happen.

Tue, 08/28/2012 - 08:56

#25

Killbotxtreme

@trollingyou

Ah sorry if it wasn't clear enough and yes all of these guns of tested had no damage bonus whatsoever.

Yes, I agree with your deathmark opinion as well.

Tue, 08/28/2012 - 09:07

#26

Killbotxtreme

@Haven

Well, for most of them I just hit somebody once and spun around the rest of the game and got my damage at the end of the game. In some chaotic situations I am not sure which guy I hit so I put "(Resistance: Unknown)" I didn't need any cooperation until it got to the glacius charge, hammer dash, the hammer's last swing, and dread venom striker. I would make the target stand still and test on him and do nothing the rest of the game. That's how I got these numbers.

As for the damage bonus difference I hit the same opponent in different rounds. On one of the rounds, I would use full skolver with striker boost, and on another round I would use half skolver/vog with striker boost. I would get my damages in those two rounds and compare them.

The deathwarning test I had a friend that let me hit him. He was a full snarbolax and I got him into deathwarning and hit him with barbarous thorn blade. It did a lot more damage even though he did not have any pierce resist in the first place. I attacked him in all three rounds when comparing damage bonuses and death warning.

As for the resistance, it took me A LONG time to find somebody with pierce low on one of the pieces. On the other piece he had a sleep low or something. I attacked him with full damage bonus and saw my damage at the end. It made virtually no difference.

And as for the weapons I didn't have, such as storm and level TEN valiance, I needed people to test for me. I told them the procedure and told them to try to specify the opponent.

Tue, 08/28/2012 - 09:16

#27

Pauling

And by spinning around, you mean...?

It's always nice to see numbers being gathered, but it sounds like your methodology involves sitting out completely during public lockdown matches. That would mean that every number you collect involves condemning 3-5 teammates to an entire shorthanded match, without you even doing so much as trying to capture.

Might I suggest testing things using guild vs guild matches? With predefined load outs, your collaborators could count hearts lost per hit on multiple armor sets, and thus gather data much faster... without causing unintentional harm to bystanders.

That said I find it interesting that the recon death mark does more damage by "removing the defense" on someone who had no defense to start. I would be interested to know if the damage done was the same for players with and without piercing defense...

Tue, 08/28/2012 - 10:05

#28

Havenihaveaproblem

Interesting

Since you seem to have calculated ~40 health per bar, did you also confirm with your opponents how many bars of damage you removed from them?

Also what shield and trinkets (if any) did you use?

You said for the death warning test you used the same opponent 3 different times. Did he communicate how many bars of health he lost each time? Was it consistent with the damage numbers you were seeing at the end of the match?

Thanks man, and sorry for all the questions. I am just trying to clarify the parameters of the study so that it can be used.

Tue, 08/28/2012 - 12:00

#29

Killbotxtreme

By spinning around I mean....

Actually spinning around helpes more than capturing because I distract like 3 opponents at a time and they end up chasing me for like a whole minute.

@haven: I think I said above I used striker boost and just regular tetras. As for the death warning person, he did not say how many bars he lost but some other people did so I was able to calculate. And it is pretty legit. Valiance 102 damage opponent loses 2 and a half bars. Barbarous 315 opponent loses 7 and a half.

Tue, 08/28/2012 - 20:30

#30

Master-User

do t2 LD and test your dmg with 3stars.

how come your only putting the dmg in the t3 LD? most people play t2 so it would be awesome if you put a t2 dmg line also :)

Wed, 08/29/2012 - 04:33

#31

Soral

data is cool

Hi.

I'd like to throw out some numbers of my own that my friend Yomigama and I did some testing on. We tested weapon strikes roughly 3-4 times per weapon individually on a few different armor sets, and these were our results. As a disclaimer, all of the gear being whacked with stuff had NO UVs on them.

Sword Damage Max Striker, Full Snarb, Barbarous Thorn Blade

vs Full Nameless:

1st Swing: 7 1/2 bars consistently.
3rd Stab: 9 to 9 1/2 bars.

vs Full Justifier:

1st Swing: 7 to 7 1/2 bars.
3rd Stab 8 1/2 to 9 bars.

We then moved on to some of the popular guns like the Antigua line and some alchemers (we only tested the Storm Driver and the Umbra, under the assumption that the base damages translate to the other status alchemers and the Nova Driver. Yomi forgot to check the amount shock ticks take off, so we don't have that info unfortunately.)

Gun Damage Max Recon (Full Shadowsun and an Elite Trueshot), Argent Peacemaker/Sentenza

vs Full Justifier:

AP: 3 to 3 1/2 bars.
Sentenza: Also 3 to 3 1/2 bars.

vs Full Nameless:

AP: 2 to 2 1/2 bars.
Sentenza: 3 to 3 1/2 bars, obviously.

Gun Damage Max Recon (Full Shadowsun and an Elite Trueshot), Storm Driver

vs Full Justifier: 4 1/2 to 5 bars.
vs Full Nameless: 4 to 4 1/2 bars.

Gun Damage Max Recon (Full Shadowsun and an Elite Trueshot), Umbra Driver

vs Full Justifier: 5 1/2 bars consistently.
vs Full Nameless: 5 to 5 1/2 bars.

We haven't tested on Wolver lines and other junk yet, but it's a fairly safe bet to say that two pieces of armor with the same defense really only save you about a half a bar to a bar. So there's some general corroboration for everyone.

Wed, 08/29/2012 - 06:36

#32

Pauling

Interesting health numbers.

Interesting health numbers. This would suggest that armor does almost nothing useful beyond providing bonuses and status resistance... I'd encourage you to file a bug report and point to this thread, because I'm pretty sure that armor is more effective in the clockworks.

If these numbers are correct, then the extreme investment in piecing max UVs puzzles me.

Wed, 08/29/2012 - 11:30

#33

Little-Juances

^
Placebo effect maybe?

Wed, 08/29/2012 - 11:54

#34

Sypsy

It's nice to see this all these analysis in one thread.

Against a max damage flourish, a vog skolver and snarby set will die in 4 first swings. I'm not 100% sure what third swings do to the numbers when it's skolver vs vog, but it may make a difference.

Pierce UV's (on skolver) will increase that number and depending on the amount, it will allow for one or two of the swings to be a third swing.
So, yes, there is still a purpose for pierce uv's.

If you have no extra damage (say a vog striker) the UV's make a larger difference.

Against a 2x pierce max skolver, a vog will do a frustratingly small amount. I wouldn't be surprised if there is a larger difference for natural armor types when damage is not maximum.

Wed, 08/29/2012 - 12:17

#35

Keveiin

I'd like to see a Damage list

I'd like to see a Damage list for Combuster Voltedge and Blitz Needle maybe it wouldn't hurt for a damage list for acheron either would it?

Wed, 08/29/2012 - 15:23

#36

Killbotxtreme

@Soral

Very nice observations! It is very interesting.

@Keveiin

I am pretty sure combuster=voltedge=glacius just like all the drivers except umbra and nova would do the same....
I don't have acheron or blitz and blitz would be extremely hard to test with all those bullets

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 13:10

#37

Addisond

Fri, 08/31/2012 - 16:05

#38

Killbotxtreme

Bump

Bump dat.

Sun, 09/02/2012 - 17:45

#39

Killbotxtreme

Umbra

Added umbra on the list. Going to add information about guns damage bonus soon and the drivers charges

Mon, 09/03/2012 - 20:39

#40

Killbotxtreme

Update

Added leviathan blade

Tue, 09/04/2012 - 01:27

#41

Yomigama

Been wanting too share are

Been wanting too share are gathered info for a while now, was too lazy :p

Armour is more effective on low damage weapons like the argent peacemaker.

Note this is just a example:

Say your wearing justifier and in one swing a da gets 12 bars off you.

Now your wearing nameless and a da gets 11 bars off you, 1 bar not a huge difference.

Now its the argents turn, once again just examples.

Say a argent gets 3 bars off someone wearing justifier, thats 12 bars in 4 shots

Now your wearing nameless it gets 2 bars a bullet, in 4 shots thats 8 bars, thats quite a armour difference compared too a high damage weapon like the da.

Wed, 09/05/2012 - 11:43

#42

Spinex

@Trollingyou

You're funny. :)

Wed, 09/05/2012 - 13:54

#43

Ramboguy

and callahan?

what about it? :D
I use that polaris and iron slug for LD could you guys make a litlle testin? :D

Wed, 09/05/2012 - 14:11

#44

Janem

Dododododo Im lazy

I havent looked at the whole thread yet, and probably won't, but can you tell me how much a blitz charge does with each bullet w/ or w/out shadowsun armor? I troll blitz sometimes, even if the inviciblity frames bug is gone.

Wed, 09/05/2012 - 21:38

#45

Trollingyou

From the looks of it....

Defense seems to be a flat amount, as opposed to a percentage. In the gun damage examples above, the AP/Senteza suffer a ~33% reduction in damage, while the storm driver only suffers a ~20 percent damage reduction. The umbras of course is lower than both of those.

This is a flawed way of doing defense. This means more damage not only equals more damage, but less percentage of your damage lost. It's almost like a built in "defense bypass" mechanic. If defense were percentage based, it would be a lot more effective.

Sun, 09/30/2012 - 15:46

#46

Killbotxtreme

Ok well.

I am going to start adding bars as well.

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Damage list in Lockdown