Argent Peacemaker / Sentenza Charge tweak
Di, 09/18/2012 - 04:10
This might be subject to discussion, but AP and Sentenza are both the fastest guns when it comes to mobility. Fast shots, no knockback and a large magazine, everything you need for a good hit & run weapon.
The charge on the other side nails you to one spot for the duration of 5 fast shots, the bird and reloading.
I rarely ever see anyone charge them - for good reasons. The 5 shots are not bad against stationary enemys, but against everthing else they're useless. If you could aim while the charge fires, that would be a completly different story, though. But that's not, what I want to propose here.
What would really give the charge the certain edge would be to just skip the 5 shots. The bird itself is, if wisely used, immensely powerful and infinitly more useful if on it's own.
One might argue if this was a nerf, as the charge would be stripped of the damage of 5 regular shots, but the versatility of just having the bird makes more than up for that.
However, this is of course just an idea, so whoever feels like writing elaborate feedback to this, is welcome to do so.
Di, 09/18/2012 - 04:42
#2
The papaya agrees
Totally agreed (even though I've never used them, I have a lot of friends who get the peacemaker/sentenza JUST for the eagle and owl). If I'm not mistaken, the eagle/owl is actually able to knock the enemy back 5 times, allowing them to be hit by the eagle/owl 5 times. I've never seen anyone commenting about the first 5 shots, just the bird in the end =)
Di, 09/18/2012 - 04:51
#3
^
Same bird for both charges, mate. It don't look like any bird that I know of, more like some kind of feathered dragon.
Di, 09/18/2012 - 05:36
#4
Pretty solid
This is a pretty solid idea, i always find myself never using charge on my AP. this would make it more worth while because instead of waiting for that bird to come out and do knock back its already there.
The reason i never use the charge,well lets explore that. So your charging, you got a zombie or something like idk a Trojan either one, so you fire at it, the first 5 bullets never knock back.... so if that monster like a zombie has the chance to jump at you they stop the bird from coming and knocking them back, same with trojan they just turn around and either block or hit you.. sometimes hitting you twice if charging at you.
Di, 09/18/2012 - 06:23
#5
But maybe thats the reason it's so slow and crappy. Spamming birds alone could be OP.
They should open test server to try it.
Di, 09/18/2012 - 06:56
#6
Little-Juances is right, being able to shoot a piercing projectile just like at the start of a charge without being held up would be OP.
Unless it's a sword, in which case you can shoot three of them.
Di, 09/18/2012 - 06:59
#7
Haha
Good one Zeddy
Di, 09/18/2012 - 07:04
#8
@Zeddy
<3 thank you
Di, 09/18/2012 - 08:23
#9
--
The bird would still be tricky in JK because it gets destroyed by mini jellies. All projectiles end when they hit them (including brandish charge explosion chains).
Di, 09/18/2012 - 13:06
#10
+5
I say make it happen, isn't that bad if you have a gun answer for the avenger and faust, especially considering they'll be 5* guns.
Do only the damage shot for all of the antigua lines actually. Make it so the full magazine just turns into a mega piercing bullet. Then make the rocket launching magnus cause better kb.
Di, 09/18/2012 - 14:57
#11
Me gusta
I've tried using the charge attack in many different situations on both Sentenza and AP (as well as their predecessors, Blackhawk and S6).
But in no way is that charge attack useful outside of hitting turrets, Lumbers and maybe Jelly Cubes if you were zillions of miles away from them. You have to sit through the first 5 shots and usually by then the enemy has wandered out of shot. To really rub salt into the wound the 5 shots do as much damage as a regular shot, just faster.
Di, 09/18/2012 - 16:45
#12
there is only one place I find the charge useful...
AP charge destroys the twins, but everywhere else it makes you a wide open target. For goodness' sakes, the blitz needle does not root you as long making it SAFER and does a lot more damage to boot. There is something wrong here....
+1 to this.
Mi, 09/19/2012 - 05:49
#13
@Skold the Drac
im not realy sure on haveing a new charge attack but more on making this one better by taking away the first five shots and that stuff or haveing the bird be bigger do more damage come out at once after charge ect.
Mi, 09/19/2012 - 06:29
#14
I hope this happens.
I love this idea.
(only posting because I hope it'll count)
Di, 09/25/2012 - 07:14
#15
Ouh Shiny
+1
Totally not a bump just forgot to +1 ;P
Di, 09/25/2012 - 13:10
#16
+1
This is a really great idea, if they implement this I'd probably craft those 2 lines back.
Di, 09/25/2012 - 15:22
#17
...
Forcing the player to empty the clip before getting to the actual charge attack is ridiculous.
As it is, I find antiguas mostly useless. Having a better and safer to use charge attack would certainly help balance it against alchemers.
Di, 09/25/2012 - 22:57
#18
@Vanillateddy
I was basically attempting to say that the Antigua itself needs to have it's charge attack meld with/be similar to the sentenza/AP charge under the condition that they implement this change.
Mi, 09/26/2012 - 00:26
#19
+1
I'd like to see this happen. Birdiepowa.
Mi, 09/26/2012 - 01:45
#20
Approve~
The charge is so
Approve~
The charge is so vastly different from the regular clip, that if I wanted a stop-shoot-kill response, I'd just use my pepperbox that can KB/onehit anything anyways, rather than root myself to the ground with Sent, hit a couple guys, do no worthwhile damage and probably die.
Mi, 09/26/2012 - 03:28
#21
+1
This has been suggested many times. It's about time OOO paid attention to it.
Mi, 09/26/2012 - 05:09
#22
Ouh Shiny
@skold, Oh sorry i didnt get that thank you for clearing that up.
Mo, 10/01/2012 - 07:58
#23
what about?
love the bird, love the ide.
different topic.
what about letting us aim in an auto gun charge, while we are stationary. wouldnt that be more beneficial while we are imoblie then to just aim in one area not being able to move until the reload animation ends.
Di, 10/02/2012 - 13:01
#24
I see, you are new to this whole "forum" thing
Support is appreciated, but if you have a suggestion about a different topic, you have to make a new thread for it, not post it in someone elses thread
Di, 10/02/2012 - 13:53
#25
+1
I really like this idea (+11)
But swords have to be the dominant species, so I have to -10 it
Di, 10/16/2012 - 10:11
#26
+1
Relevant to my interest this is
Di, 10/16/2012 - 23:44
#27
Not like I haven't heard this idea before
Heard it when I suggested it way back when, and when other people say it randomly when they use it and get hit by a zombie lunge attack or something.
That being said I still agree with this. All they need to do is buff the birds damage by 25-60% to make it up to par to the damage it has now, while still making it completely useful. Only shooting the bird would make this the perfect "Get the heck away from me" charge, while still doing great damage.
Signed and signature.
Di, 10/23/2012 - 14:49
#28
+106235673457 if its possible
either moving while shooting in charge or just the bird in charge its great
why didnt i think of doing a suggestion like this..
Di, 10/23/2012 - 15:40
#29
great idea +1
great idea +1
Di, 10/23/2012 - 16:42
#30
I approve of this. +1
I approve of this. +1
Di, 10/23/2012 - 16:48
#31
derp!
I got both of them now. had blackhwak when this thread was made and now i have both of 'em! and extra undead med uv on AP >:3
+1
its really useless the pre charge shots as you need AA on and the monster is not moving in the next few seconds. I also noticed its dangerous to use charges as it doesnt not break enemie's {forgot word for it! aahhh!}
anyway, +1 to see more dark owls coming out of barrels
Mi, 02/13/2013 - 09:21
#32
5 months
and nothing changed. did they balance anything within this time?
Mi, 02/13/2013 - 09:25
#33
let me think...
practically, no. there wasn't any gear rebalance since... well, a while.
Mi, 02/13/2013 - 09:35
#34
amnesia?
Chaos set :P
Mi, 02/13/2013 - 10:05
#35
PLASS WAN
PLASS WAN BICOS I SUPÅRT DIS SUGÄSTJÖN
So, 02/17/2013 - 04:35
#36
Because otherwise it's buried
by ideas of magic and dual wielding...
So, 02/17/2013 - 09:12
#37
+1
I like this idea. Would Silversix and Sentenza be change to reflect this also?
Do, 02/28/2013 - 05:40
#38
+1.1
I really wish three OOO would post in the suggestion. . .
This idea is a great tweak to argent. It allows the charge attack to be rather less of a hindrance.
EDIT: Oh kat! I already posted.
Do, 02/28/2013 - 21:29
#39
well since it's already necroed
I'll just say my idea about making it a shotgun-type charge where it fires all six bullets and the bird at once that I had in the other thread that was exactly like this one.
Fr, 03/01/2013 - 16:10
#40
+1
Great idea
So, 03/03/2013 - 18:58
#41
Just wanted to post the exact same thing
Good thing I searched before it. So here's a bump, because I want this too :D
So, 03/03/2013 - 19:34
#42
How about just giving owl damage to all the preceding bullets in the volley? You're rooted in place as much as you are with Blitz Needle, so I don't see why the bullet shouldn't be doing the same damage.
Mo, 03/04/2013 - 20:13
#43
Welcome back, and WHAT!??
Well its nice to see this thread back first of all, because i was kind of thinking about it the other day whilst using my AP, Granted i will say im still all for this and believe heavily that it should be a buff among buffs in the future SOON, not like the core... no that's not soon enough cuz god knows when that might even be mentioned again by Nick. but like along with the sprites or something before or after in the next couple of months.
As for what Zeddy has stated above me im actually quite confused on what your trying to explain, could you explain it again more thorough or in some way that could be easier to understand.
i think i get that your saying being rooted to the ground like the blitz, but what else? Same damage as what? keeping the six or five bullets before still and the owl or just the owl or what im not sure i understand.
Mo, 03/04/2013 - 21:45
#44
@Vanillateddy
The current situation is as such:
-The regular shots of Argent Peacemaker are identical in damage to the regular shots of Blitz.
-The charge shots of Blitz Needle do exactly as much damage as the Owl of Argent Peacemaker.
-AP and Blitz both root you in place for their charge attack. I'm not sure which one is longer, but I have a feeling it's Peacemaker.
-Blitz fires 15x charge damage bullets.
-AP fires 5x normal bullets and 1 charge bullet.
Seems sorta underpowered on Peacemaker's part.
Mo, 03/04/2013 - 21:50
#45
Thank you ~.^
Okay so much appreciated btw, I now understand what you meant, going back to your balancing roots and things.
And if its not much a bother I'de like to see these two guns times and damage readings laid out. Stats :P
Yours Truly,
Vanillateddy
Mo, 03/04/2013 - 22:03
#46
+1
Yes, the 5 shots before are useless to me.
Di, 03/05/2013 - 05:40
#47
@OP/El-Odio +1
I'm not sure how many threads I've seen about this now, but I'll keep +1ing until it's actually added into the game.
Di, 03/05/2013 - 13:45
#48
@Vanilla:
You can probably check the Wiki out for damage tables.
+1.
~Sev
Mi, 03/06/2013 - 04:09
#49
@Vanillateddy
Like Severage said, you can just check the wiki for the damage values, but you might as well take my word for it since I put the Blitz values there after exhaustive research confirmed to me that they were the same numbers as on the antigua upgrades.
The the Lancer Knightz chart over charge times state that, at max CTR and ASI, Blitz can get off 17.5 charges per minute while AP can get off 14.
Mi, 03/06/2013 - 09:12
#50
1
Plz I need this for sentenza
The birds on charge are the useful part of the charge, full-auto is for the autogun line.