Leviathan Blade is actually good

37 respuestas [Último envío]
Mechnon

It does massive damage, and with swiftstrike becomes a lot faster and deadlier.

My opinion.

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Bopp
well

Everything becomes a lot faster and deadlier with ASI. So that's not any recommendation for Leviathan.

The regular attacks certainly do not do "massive damage" compared to other swords. See for example the DPS tables here.

Leviathan's charge can do a pretty massive amount of damage. Not as much as Fang of Vog, but that sets you on fire. And there's a lot of knockback, which can irritate your teammates. But the charge is definitely useful.

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Traevelliath

As is the case with most of SK's equipment, it's not a matter of Levi being bad, rather other things are better. A lot of things are perfectly viable, but mathematically inferior to other options.

If you like the Levi, then by all means ignore the numbers and have fun with it.

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Dibsville
Wait, massive damage? Let's theorycraft.

"As is the case with most of SK's equipment, it's not a matter of Levi being bad, rather other things are better. A lot of things are perfectly viable, but mathematically inferior to other options."

This. Yeah, Leviathan Blade is good, but it's nowhere near the best. Opinions are nice, but facts are better. For example, did you know Acheron on average does ~26% more damage overall than Leviathan Blade despite having the same three-hit combo? And if you want some numbers on the charge, Acheron on average does ~132% more damage on its charge when compared to Leviathan Blade. It literally does more than twice the amount of Leviathan Blade. And that's including that Acheron does reduced damage to Fiends and Undead, as well as assuming that only four hits of the charge connect rather than all five.

If you'd like to know how much stronger Acheron is than Leviathan Blade, take the third hit (the one with increased damage) of your Leviathan Blade. That's how strong Acheron's first and second hits are, and its third hit is even stronger. In fact, the third hit of Leviathan Blade is also about the same damage as the first hit of Sudaruska's and Triglav's two-hit combo. In fact, Leviathan Blade's full combo only does about 50 more damage than Triglav and Sudaruska's combo, but Suda and Trig both complete their combo faster and have a status. And this is comparing two normal weapons.

Actually, if we're comparing normal weapons, Dread Venom Striker does more damage in four hits than Leviathan Blade does in three despite Dread Venom Striker's five-hit combo coming out faster than Leviathan Blade's, and DVS has the poison status to possibly increase that damage further. Additionally, Dread Venom Striker, Sudaruska, and Triglav all benefit much more from Swiftstrike Buckler than Leviathan Blade does.

Now, if we went into elemental damage, Leviathan Blade is put in the dust by all five Brandishes, Gran Faust, Divine Avenger, and Warmaster Rocket Hammer, all of which benefit more from Swiftstrike Buckler more than Leviathan Blade does (Brandishes do because the increased damage gives a more exponential increase in damage when SSB is counted). I'll go get some numbers for this too if you'd like.

Leviathan Blade does nothing near massive damage unless you specifically mean on its charge, which in most cases only hits once (let's say this does 368 damage) while Acheron's does more than double that against Fiends and Undead (746 assuming only four explosions hit, or 378 more than Leviathan Blade), and Acheron does over quadruple the damage to Slimes and Gremlins (1506 damage with four explosions, or 1138 more than Leviathan Blade). If you mean against turrets, then yeah, Leviathan Blade hits a nice solid 1104, while Acheron will only hit about 1023 against Gun Puppies, and only 650 damage against Howlitzers, but I think the 1300 it does against Polyps makes up for it. Of course, you probably wouldn't use Acheron in a shadow area to begin with.

I'm mostly comparing Leviathan Blade to Acheron here because it has the same three-hit combo as Leviathan Blade, but Acheron's charge is arguably much better (better crowd control, safer to use, faster, not as disruptive to your party members, and more consistent). I felt like using numbers today, so uh, were any of my numbers incorrect? Because from what I see, Leviathan Blade is just a worse Acheron, is outclassed by Dread Venom Striker, highly competes with Sudaruska and Triglav, and is made obsolete by any of the elemental weapons.

I'm not trying to argue that your opinion on Leviathan Blade is wrong, I'm just trying to argue that your opinion on why Leviathan Blade is good, is wrong. Yeah, I made a seven-paragraph-long post because you said two sentences. I'm quite bored today.

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Bopp
well

I agree with your sentiments, Dibsville, but you have some incorrect facts. Leviathan's combo takes less time than Sudaruska/Triglav's. Sudaruska doesn't have any status on the combo. I don't see how brandishes benefit more than Leviathan from ASI.

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Dibsville

"Leviathan's combo takes less time than Sudaruska/Triglav's."

Sorry, honestly I thought Suda/Trig were faster. I did some testing and it seems that they're actually the same speed (from initial click to when the final hitbox becomes active), as well as when shield-canceled. However when I put on Swiftstrike Suda/Trig are noticeably faster, but that just might be me. (mind you, I'm going on when the final hitbox becomes active, rather than when you can perform your next action).

"Sudaruska doesn't have any status on the combo."

Yeah, I should have clarified that I meant on the charge-- in a manner similar to Brandishes and Alchemers, or really any weapon class, those with a status tend to be weaker than those without a status, yet Suda/Trig are still very comparable to Levi despite owning a status.

"I don't see how brandishes benefit more than Leviathan from ASI."

Honestly, I don't know what was going through my head for this one. I was doing the math in my head wrong for some reason, no clue why. Although I believe Brandish's charge may benefit more from ASI than Levi's charge does, unless you were going for a breakpoint so you could hit twice on a charge for Levi, but I don't think SSB reaches that alone.

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Bopp
no problem

By the way, the data set I linked in post #1 shows how much faster Leviathan combos than Suda/Trig (e.g 31 vs. 26 combos per minute at ASI+0). Anyway, it doesn't change the point of your post. Cheers.

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Falminar
@Dibsville | As a CIV owner, WHAT???????

CIV is my main and only 5* sword, and, Dibs - WHAT????????

Charge only hits once?

Only? Hits? Once?

WHAT??

I don't ever try using a charge like that unless I want to fling monsters all over the place, which I rarely do.

I almost always corner them, trap them against a wall before unleashing the charge. It does very little damage if I just charge in (as you mentioned), but if I corner them, I can deal much higher damage.

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Holy-Nightmare
@ Vana

Finally someone else figured out the charge spin blades.......

That's the problem with Leviathan blade though, it requires setup and a bit of "out of the box" thinking to optimize it's performance.

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Fehzor

Honestly I mostly just use three hit combo swords to finish off the occasional enemy that's leftover from the carnage after bombs and guns do all of the heavy lifting. For this, leviathan is great. I also enjoy using the charge along with seraphynx's valkyrie aura to crush less mobile things like trojans, deadnauts and turrets. I wouldn't say that leviathan is winning some sort of award for its massive damage output, but I'd say that it's actually fairly good, sure.

Also, cold iron vanquisher is primarily just bad. There are situations where it is better than normal leviathan, but those situations rely on your fighting many undead alongside a slightly less seen monster resistant to elemental (gremlins) without having more than damage high on your sword and a loadout that greatly benefits from having levi/civ.

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Dibsville

"CIV is my main and only 5* sword, and, Dibs - WHAT????????

Charge only hits once?

Only? Hits? Once?

WHAT??"

Yes, Leviathan Blade's charge only hits once. This is not Cold Iron Vanquisher we're talking about, but Leviathan Blade. Cold Iron Vanquisher has significantly less knockback on its charges, allowing it to hit multiple times in many more occasions. In contrast, Leviathan Blade usually only hits once except against enemies that take low/no knockback.

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Falminar
^

I know.

You can still trap them against a wall or corner so that they take no knockback, meaning you deal as much damage as you would to a turret.

I still deal very little damage with a CIV without doing that, and I deal much higher damage with it when I do it.

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Holy-Nightmare
...

To get the most out of a Leviathan blade you have to know when to apply it's uses.

Out in the open the charge is great for dispersing enemies and creating a lot of breathing room. If you want damage you have to lead your enemies and crush them against a wall, in a vortex, or when frozen.

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Qwez
Calibur Charge Attack

While touching an enemy, aim past them to the right. The goal is to move with the charge such that the enemy is at your 7 or 8 o'clock.

Bam. 2 hits on the charge. No need for obstructions.

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Johnkirtaen
Mostly the same as Acended Calibur

I've realized that Leviathan Blade doesn't have high reach like Other Mid-Speed swords were. Also Slight Damage increase in Late tiers Very good against Monsters in FREEZE Status.

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Baconparadox
Leviathan Blade is good, just for general purposes

Leviathan blade is obviously not for DPS since brandishes and other swords excel at it. It definitely does work well worth ASI like everything.
But I think the point of leviathan blade is to just deal consistent damage with no factors except damage increase or poison. The normal attacks is 3 hit normal. The charge, I'd think is not for damage, but defense to knock everything away from yourself. You can also use this to effectively damage immobile monsters too, but overall,

Leviathan blade is used to deal consistent damage with defensive charge to knock everything back, for regular use, not DPS

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Actionpacked
Ok. Can understand its use dropping to a Vangaurd. Lets Review.

Pros
1. It looks like ownage in design.
2. Blade damage is formidable yet dependable and type is normal so you don't have to worry about switching blades because your type of damage is what the creatures are resistant to.
3. The charge attack is a nasty Triple threat spin hit.
4. Its recipe tree is easily earned as standard equipment from missions. The newcomer who sticks to his missions without deviation will earn a weapon 3 times faster than newcomers who deviate to gather materials and raise ****10k (or is it 15k?? I forgot) then *****25k etc. to purchase the right recipe to even have the ability to craft another weapon not given in missions. And if you ask me its not smart to do early on in your spiral knight apprentice stages. Wait till you are 5 star standard then deviate because you can afford to after that. (Course those who use credit cards to buy all their gear needn't worry about this.)

5. You can spank the best of them in PVP with that blade by spamming hits viciously. Its charge attack as a counter move will protect you from most melee knights who are not that eager to rush a knight with that blade charge bar readied.

Cons
1. Damage variations and status influences such as fire, elect., freeze, & shadow are not available. (its variant just doesn't fill this void for me.)
2. It's charge attack requires you to get in real close which may end up getting you killed in truly chaotic circumstances.. unlike more ranged sword charge attacks.

Well there's my frosty 2 cents. Thank you for your time.

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Hexzyle

I learnt that if you are stunned when you unleash the Leviathan Blade charge, all of your hits land before knockback is dealt. It's amazing.

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Trymal
Actually,

I'm with mechnon. The charge is pretty decent. Especially at the Jelly Palace.
SWING AROUND AT TEH MINIES!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Plus, if you are not good with cash, the Levi can help, you don't need multiple weapons for multiple missions.

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Hexzyle

Plus, if you are not good with cash, the Levi can help, you don't need multiple weapons for multiple missions.

Correct. If you're at the Elite Orb wall that a lot of people get stuck on, saving up another three orbs to craft a second weapon up to 4 star is painful. A 4 star normal damage weapon will get you through most of tier 3 with some luck.

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Inquistitive-Ego
Ms. Proudmoore, I presume?

@Hexyle
the sentiment of crafting the Ascended Calibur (4* version) at the tier three clearance Hall of Heroes is nice, but not practical unless your willing to stick with it for a long while. My friend is using the cobalt armor and weapons because you get the recipes free, which is fine, but in the end I can out DPS and Tank him because I put in the extra effort to get actual weapons armor and shields (I'm currently running Elemental hood in the hopes of Chaos,3* Owlite Shield, Silver Six, 4* Freeze mist, and 3* Pathfinder armor because someone needs to take advantage of all of that armor) besides, Elite Orbs, while hard to come by, have two almost guaranteed sources, ICMF and Sewer Stash on Advanced or higher; and cash isn't really an issue 'til 5*

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Bopp
hate to be a downer but

I'm currently running Elemental hood in the hopes of Chaos,3* Owlite Shield, Silver Six, 4* Freeze mist, and 3* Pathfinder armor because someone needs to take advantage of all of that armor

Since it's the point of your post, I have to object: You've chosen your armor pretty well, but not your weapons. Consider switching to more interesting gun that does more damage. If you want a haze-style bomb, consider trying a status that isn't so disruptive to play.

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Inquistitive-Ego
Ms. Proudmoore, I presume?

@Bopp

actually I was originally going to be an alchemer-ist but I decided that those weapons were best for Vanaduke in the absence of a Blitz (blitz is useless against JK and ICMF and antigua came from JK and silversix is good against RT soooo)

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Jenovasforumchar
@Ego's Loadout

For the beginning it sounds like a good loadout that you have been acually planning and that will grant you a good time in IMF and is also solid for vana-runs in a Group. It is not the Loadout with the highest dps (the reason why Bopp objected), but it grants you 1. easy use, 2. the Chance to Keep your distance to enemies by the Combo of that freeze bomb and an Antigua style weapon and 3. ofc the crowd controll effect fo frost that gives you some seconds to spectate and/or rethink in a new situation.

But your loadout does still have at least one flaw in puncto damage varity: You mentioned only elemental weapons. This means, that you will deal horrible low damage vs gremlins and vs beasts. What weapons have you planned to use to deal with them?

Against Fiends and jellies, your elemental weapons are still okay if you do not want to throw out money in each direction. Not superb, but it get things done.

Back to the opening:
I can agree that the Calibur is a perfect sword for beginners who Play on a distance and use mainly a Charge to get enemieson distance, but who prefer to use a gun to Keep their own health as healthy as possible. If I would create a new account again, I would probably get calibur as my first 4* sword. However, I can strongly warn you not to upgrade it into 5 stars since ist damage will be less with 5 stars compared to its 4* Version with max heat. The 5* Version only gets stronger after 5* heat Level 7 - a heat Level that your Leviathan probably will never see in the current heat System.

TLDR:
@Ego:
Your loadout not bad, but you will have Trouble with gremlins and wolvers, so what other weapons do you have planned to get?

@Opening:
The calibur-line is an awesome sword for beginners, but never ever upgrade it to 5* unless you do it for collection purpose.

Edit:
@Bopp: '...get interesting weapons instead...'
Walz through the world with Tortostyle :3

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Bopp
not only that

Not only are both weapons elemental, but s/he's pairing a status (freeze) that works well with big charge attacks with a weapon style (antigua) that has notoriously bad charge attacks. If someone were trying to troll Bopp, this is exactly the loadout that s/he'd pick. (Hmm.) Well, let's not belabor it. Cheers, everyone.

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Fehzor

We should have a contest to see who can make the best troll-Bopp thread! I'm thinking-

Best gun to pair with combuster, and should I switch brandishes?

Hello my name is Six and I have the 4* combuster doo dad. I'm wondering what other gun I should get to go with my combuster and whether I should switch to glacius, since the fire doesn't work in FSC and I want to farm there. I just crafted silversix and am wondering if it's worth upgrading to argent peacemaker since I already have the 4* and it feels like a waste to start over.

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Bopp
7 - 2 = 5 points

Good try. You earn seven points for
1. fire not working in FSC
2. 4 stars is too late to switch guns
3. freeze
4. only elemental weapons
5. antigua-style gun
6. not mentioning reading any guides or threads about this FAQ
7. 4 stars is not too late to switch swords, rendering your post self-inconsistent.

But you lose two points for
1. referring to your sword by its 5-star name
2. using FSC for your example, where an elemental-only loadout actually is quite viable.

Edit: Awarded points 6 and 7.

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Fehzor

I used FSC because it's common and repetitive and awful, but also because the level needs something like blitz needle in spite of being so elemental friendly.

Imagen de Inquistitive-Ego
Inquistitive-Ego
Ms. Proudmoore, I presume?

@Bopp
to prevent further confusion s/he is in fact a he

I play with my brother a lot, so my loadout is in fact partly designed to help him and his playstyle (he only plays flourishes and only flourishes "because I like fancy swords"). the Flourish (and antigua, for that matter) charge attacks can do a lot of damage with good positioning because they take a long time to execute and attack in a (thin, unlike the brandishes) line, so freeze is almost required for a (frankly) bad swordsman like my little brother is.

@Jenova

As for other damage types, I own a dark chaingun, which melts slimes, and as, stated, my brother only owns piercing dmg sooo

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Traevelliath

@Six-From-Syrup
You can get those two points back by making a thread with the exact same question, while implying that the game is dead and we should all stop playing.

The-Singularity
I disagree

I disagree,with no reason.

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Fehzor

The game is so dead that I'm considering a new gun

My gun, silversix, was chosen because of its 5* description-

"An ancient handgun forged from sun silver. Its bullets serve as ushers for those that refuse to leave this world."

In this case implying the game itself.. but I recently found that it's 4* description is just as fruitful-

"A mysterious antique with a brilliant silver finish, these handguns are said to have been wielded by 'gunslinger priests' during a now forgotten time."

Since the servers are recently closing I was thinking of crafting a second silversix, so as to combine both descriptions for the perfect "endgame loadout". Alternatively, I could stop short of the last couple missions and go for black hawk-

"A shadow-aligned handgun of incredible power, it's said to contain the soul of a knight who was only two days from retirement."

What should I do?

Imagen de Bopp
Bopp
5 - 1 = 4 points

You win points for
1. "are recently closing"
2. taking descriptions seriously
3. equipping multiple antiguas
4. saying game is dead
5. inscrutable reasoning behind the "last couple missions" part

You lose points for
1. formatting post too well (except for capitalization)

You have not yet deployed my strongest irritant in its pure form.

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Hexzyle
@Inquistitive-Ego

but in the end I can out DPS and Tank him because I put in the extra effort to get actual weapons armor and shields

Yes, "in the end", but in the beginning you're spending twice as long at 3 star still collecting Elite Alchemy Orbs, while he's already 30,000 crowns ahead of you because of recipe costs, (ignoring the costs saved for the cobalt armor because it's "meh" and shouldn't really be bothered with) as well as being cleared for Tier 3, earning higher crown payouts, Shinings, and Radiants.

The cobalt armor should be dropped as early as possible, but the Calibur or Troika(and possibly the Cutter too) alone will get you far enough into Tier 3 if you're careful and learn your weapon. Additionally, the Defender upgrades into the Heater Shield, which is a decent elemental shield with higher normal defense than the Owlite, and Freeze resist for helping with those pesky Silversaps that everyone loves to complain about.

Imagen de Inquistitive-Ego
Inquistitive-Ego
2d20's+ Cha modifier-Wis modifer= what I think of you...

@Hexzyle

the cutter line doesn't even go to 4* so I don't know why your including it.

anyways, I actually got to Knight Elite literally 5 minutes after he did, which I know will extend to longer periods of time at later ranks but I am entirely prepared to spend the extra time and crowns if it means I don't have to do what he's going to do, which is get to 5* with the 'generic spiral order' stuff, then get actual armor through LD, which is extremely hard because of the like, 20 LD players remaining, 19 are pros and the other 1 is me (playing with 3* gear against 5* players with maxed gear is not actually fun, I average 1k dmg against 20k)

The only point to the Levi is that you don't have to buy any other weapons (unless you, you know, want to do damage)

I rest my case someone graveyard the thread before someone starts yelling at me again.

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Traevelliath

"the cutter line doesn't even go to 4* so I don't know why your including it."

What?
Are you sure?

"...then get actual armor through LD..."

Are you sure about this?

Imagen de Inquistitive-Ego
Inquistitive-Ego
2d20'2+Cha modifier-Wis modifier= whatI think of you

Really? I always thought that no one bought cutter because it didn't go to 5*, turns out its just a bad weapon.

As for the LD armor, I wasn't so sure it was a thing either, it was my friend that was going to do it, but I never checked until now.

anyways Levi is a mediocre weapon quick Graveyard the thread.

Sokushu
Maybe it is...

It's an ok sword to be honest, the charged swing can delay enemies even better if you have a good amount of CTR but i think it's a waste of ASI because the normal attacks don't really do as much damage as you'd want it to.