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What is the point of F2P ?

59 replies [Last post]
Sat, 06/11/2011 - 04:37
#51
Irevolutioni's picture
Irevolutioni
After Reading some comments

I saw that many people were with my.
Because its pointless being f2p on spiral knights ?

So why did SK announce it f2p ?

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 05:32
#52
Parhelion's picture
Parhelion
"What is the point of F2P?"

"If you only can play 1 hour after waiting 22 hours ?"
Why is everyone who complains about this so addicted to Spiral Knights? 1 hour every day should be more than enough gameplay if you have a life. And even as a complete freeloader, I can easily get 2 hours of gameplay every day.

"What is the point of not gaining profit by the free way ?"
A game should not be about gaining profit, but about enjoying the gameplay and maybe the aesthetics. And there are people with full 5* armor who have never purchased any CE, your point?

"What is the point of playing hours and hours just to upgrade your armour ?"
Ever heard of this funny little thing called progression that's in, like, every game ever made? Armour is Spiral Knights' version of progressing through the game, and you should be rewarded after spending enough in-game time by being able to upgrade your armor.

"What is the point of wasting so much elecktricity ?"
What? If you mean real-life electricity (get your spelling right), then your 'logic' is reversed. Purchasing CE to play for longer would cost MORE electricity!

"What is the point being so harsh on F2Pers ? Three rings you shoulda then released it P2P failing company."
They only should've called it P2P if paying was, I dunno, ACTUALLY required? As I said before, I am a complete freeloader and I really enjoy the game (and I'm sure I'm not the only one), despite the fact that there are people like you. People who cannot do anything other than complaining about a perfectly fine game.

"Why not taking action or limiting the CE prices for both teams at a fair price."
The CE prices are player-run, and I think it should be kept that way. Even with the prices being high at the moment, it's a nice way of bringing more player input into the game.

"Why not caring about your free players."
I think they already care enough by actually offering the choice to play free to begin with. I mean, Three Rings also could've made it fully P2P, but they didn't because they want more people to play their game! And most importantly, that more people can enjoy it.

"I hate when people only live for money.
If that is the reason you live one day you will die.
ANd guess what those money won't come with you to Heaven or Hell."
As I said before, Three Rings also could've made the game fully P2P, but they didn't!
And from here on I'll stop replying as this is becoming too unrelated to the subject.

"Because its pointless being f2p on spiral knights ?"
No, it isn't. A lot of people, including me, like the game while being free players.

"So why did SK announce it f2p ?"
Because it is free to play, you mindless moron. Get that through your thick skull.

And last but not least:
"What is the point of F2P?"
The point of F2P is that people can play a game for free. And guess what, you can play Spiral Knights without spending a dime!

tl;dr I enjoy the game as a free player, you are wrong in almost every way. Stop complaining.

Yes, I know this is troll-feeding, in case you're wondering. :P

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 05:44
#53
Wire
Legacy Username
What is the point of F2P?

It's perfect for people who don't spend a lot of time playing games. I'm lucky if I have enough time in my day to use up all my ce. It's a nice, free, casual game.

I don't have any problem with the game calling itself free. Frankly, I appreciate this model over the model of many other games. Instead of there being rooms I will never be able to explore or gear I will never be able to buy, I have access to the whole thing.

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 08:06
#54
Trouser's picture
Trouser
Sigh

@zeitgeist: You admit the game is technically free to play, but keep going on about how it somehow doesn't live up to "the label with all of its implications." Clearly, you think that continuous 24/7 play is an implication of "free to play", whereas I and many others think it merely implies that it is free to play. I am playing just fine for free, enjoying myself greatly and making steady progress. Where's the beef?

Name one other free to play game that limits your play time each day? Kingdom of Loathing.

@Dirt: Dofus still limits non-subscribers to the low level areas, although they now have a micropayment currency (ogrines) which can be traded on an in game exchange. A week's subscription can be bought for 700 ogrines, costing about a quarter million units of game currency. Talk about eating into a newbie's earning potential! Some ways in which this system is worse than Three Rings's games: Once traded, ogrines are bound to the buyer's account and cannot be retraded, resulting in a sluggish market with a huge gap between buy and sell offers (as if offers to buy CE were at 5000 and offers to sell were at 8500 - no good for either buyers or sellers). Ogrines expire in a few months if unused.

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 11:53
#55
zeitgeist
Legacy Username
Trouserman - I decided to

Trouserman - I decided to give Kingdom of Loathing a try. While it's a rather silly and fun game in its own right, it plays essentially like an offline turn-based, texted RPG with... minimalist graphics. Not only that, it offers several easy ways to replenish the limiting currency, as opposed to Spiral Knights' single method (for F2P'ers) where one will not break even in a crown to CE exchange until capable of going through T2 without a hitch - a task that is far from being immediately achievable through one's own effort. Trying to compare Kingdom of Loathing with something like Spiral Knights strikes me as desperate. Also, stressing that you are playing just fine for free is a nice refrain, but keep in mind that your attitude doesn't speak for everyone - not that I'm necessarily suggesting that you are trying to speak for everyone.

It pains me to have to say this again, but Dofus has never advertised itself as a F2P game. It clearly markets itself as a P2P game, so any gripe you have about its limitations is irrelevant to the discussion of Spiral Knights, a self-proclaimed F2P game.

Nice try, but, please, try again.

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 12:37
#56
Trouser's picture
Trouser
@zetigeist

There's nothing desperate about naming Kingdom of Loathing. The game is free, and it limits the amount you can play per day. There are ways to extend your play time, but they are finite. You can only extend it so much, and then you are cut off. That it is a different style of game is of no importance whatsoever, since it is purely a counter example to your position that "free to play" implies unlimited play per day. That simply isn't true.

No, I don't speak for everyone. You're not addressing my argument, though: If I am playing fine for free, and anyone else can do so as well if they so choose, how is it not free to play? Your argument is purely subjective: it feels too restrictive for you, even though you agree that it is technically free to play. Here's a tip: If something is technically true, it is true. You just don't want to accept it.

It may be true that this monetization model hasn't been used before. I don't know. If so, way to go, Three Rings. That was a nice bit of innovation. Clearly, not everyone likes this model, but that doesn't make the game any less free for people who wish to play it free and accept the hit to their progression speed. Nor (on the original topic) does it mean that playing for free is pointless; many people are getting enjoyment out of the game this way. It's too bad if you aren't, but fortunately, you don't speak for everyone, either.

My discussion of the state of Dofus really had nothing to do with this question of whether SK is free to play or not. That was an aside directed to Dirt, who said "Granted it's been years since then and I'm not sure how it's been handled since then." There's your update, Dirt, in case you were curious. Commentary on the failings of Dofus's ogrine market was off topic, but might be of some interest to people arguing about the merits of the way the energy market is implemented, or complaining about the high crown cost of energy.

Sun, 06/12/2011 - 22:20
#57
zeitgeist
Legacy Username
Trouserman - Actually, the

Trouserman - Actually, the different style of gameplay is worth considering, especially since Kingdom of Loathing isn't so much a MMOG as it is essentially a single player RPG in an online platform, with the very slight exception of PVP. That isn't meant to be a slight against Kingdom of Loathing, because I'm sure it's a great game. However, in my mind, I'm willing to exclude it from the realm of MMOGs, since there is close to no interaction between the many players except for the forums and other various out-of-game methods, a base of communication that could just as easily exist for an offline game. If you're willing to stretch the PVP element so far as to make it support your argument, then go ahead. We'll just have to agree to disagree.

I'm not disputing that Spiral Knights is free to play, technically. I only mean to express that, in my opinion, it doesn't deserve the label because it doesn't live up to the expectations of what people have come to expect when they see it applied to a MMOG. SK narrowly avoids the distinction between that and P2P with its horribly slow ME regeneration rate.

If it makes you feel better to think I hate this game, then by all means, but I actually want this game to succeed. Unlike most of the naysayers, I put some of my hard earned money into this game because I felt that the effort involved into making this game warranted it. I don't regret it, either.

Even if what may turn out to be procedural flaws happens to be inadvertently beneficial to some, it doesn't stop them from potentially being procedural flaws. I don't know enough about this game's inner-workings to really determine whether or not they are, beyond my own speculation, and I am willing to admit that. Everything I have said so far is in support of an opinion that I am personally championing. You're free to disagree, but I'll try to defend it for as long as I see fit, unless OOO decides to silence me.

Sat, 06/11/2011 - 13:40
#58
Trouser's picture
Trouser
@zeitgeist

KoL is an existence proof that limiting your play time per day doesn't make playing a game any less free or complete. However, this is irrelevant to your point, because your point isn't about whether or not SK can be played for free, it's about whether it's Free To Play™ in the sense you expect from MMOGs using that as a label for a particular model of monetization. Is this a fair summary? (Incidental aside: As I recall, the developers of KoL refer to it as a "massively single-player online game".)

I think KoL is relevant, because I think if something can be played for free, it is Free To Play. The fact (if it's true, which I don't know) that this monetization model is new and different from that of other Free To Play MMOGs doesn't mean it isn't Free To Play, it means the Free To Play label just got a little more diverse, and that's a good thing.

It's like if there were a whole bunch of free soup kitchens serving chicken soup, and a new one opened up that serves a bouillabaisse lunch. It only serves one meal a day. It serves something different from the other kitchens, which some people will like and others wont. But, by gum, it's still a free soup kitchen!

Sun, 06/12/2011 - 08:01
#59
zeitgeist
Legacy Username
Trouserman - If you were to

Trouserman - If you were to open the argument up to every single game, MMO or not, then I could cite a bunch of games with parental controls and such. It would be nonsensical to do so. Not only that, but from my research, there seems to be absolutely no way to supply yourself with additional "adventures", the KoL equivalence of CE, outside of the game's mechanics. There is no real-money-mall to speak of that benefits players in-game. The "adventures" system exists to deter addiction and create a sort of balance in the game, not to place any duress on players to purchase things from them.

I think it's a little premature to say that it's a good thing that the Free To Play got a little more diverse. There seems to be a rather grand ambivalence towards this system and the forums aren't doing it justice. Also, I think it's rather silly to restrict people from playing SK, of all things, because that's something I would expect a P2P game to do. What's the point of content if you can't even play? Such a restriction invalidates just about every benefit the game has to offer, if it requires someone to be able to play in order to experience it.

Your analogy isn't sufficient because all soup kitchens will limit the amount of meals one can have per day, or else they wouldn't be able to provide for as many as possible. Where most F2P MMORPGs are like free all-you-can-eat buffets with optional higher-class buffet sections, if one should choose to pay for it, SK game is essentially a restaurant with free samples, except you can have a free sample every day.

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