Spiral Knights - Crashing the energy market

Crashing the energy market

116 replies [Last post]

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 11:34

Naruchico

Short Version: I am plotting to crash the energy market, at the moment the prices are 5-5.8k in crowns once I start stocking crowns and energy I shall be dropping these prices from the 5-5.8 to 2k and down until the market bottoms out.

Reasoning: limiting game-play time with the current energy system is aggravating and game breaking for me, and if we want to make sure the system is changed we have to do something to prove to the game creators that it is a failing system and needs a brisk change.

Thoughts and suggestions on change: remove the energy cost to do cave tromping and gate opening, you can leave it for crafting, guild creation, etc. leaving OOO the ability to make money on what it should be, instead of pay to play...cause at its current it is more so set at "you can play for free for this much time" my-swell call it a "demo".

thoughts and preemptive information: if you see prices for energy going down, and then suddenly rising from the 2k I plan to set, be prepared to blame the company this may take several months with me working at this alone, and if OOO or sega realize that the price of energy is destroying their income, they may spoof the market to guarantee their pay-check.

If you agree with me that energy is limiting our fun, please don't post alone just saying "rawr yeah its so dumb!" place your idea's for how it can change to be A: better for us and B: still a working income for OOO and Sega, they need money to keep this game working for us!

I need all the help I can get to break the market and fix the system, so show your support and sell your energy cheap, crowns are free so lets use them to get what we really want, no more game time limitation.

I would also love input from OOO and Sega as well! Its not that I hate either companies, infact I have always loved Sega, and OOO is a recently up-coming company and I don't want to disrespect them for a great game, I would just prefer to play the game as much as I like without having to pay for game-time.

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 11:35

Sturak

Legacy Username

5.8k? I wish. Don't crash it

5.8k? I wish.

Don't crash it man! I'm waiting for CE prices to hit 6000+ again so I can sell some. :p

Now that I actually have CE myself, I'd love to see prices go through the roof. :)

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 11:41

Zirp

Legacy Username

Oh, so

Oh, so the price did go up.

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 11:47

Retniwreven

Legacy Username

One person trying to crash

One person trying to crash the energy market?
Good luck. You'll need it. You'd have to make up for every single other person on the server, with all of their crowns and energy. Unless you've got thousands of dollars to spend the energy you post cheaply will simply sell out near instantly and go right back up to where it was. =/

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 11:55

Soulstaker

Guys plenty of people are

Guys plenty of people are going to crash it.there is a guild storing up CE and when they have a certain amount.everyone in guild Gunna crash it to like one thousand crowns :D

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 11:58

Sturak

Legacy Username

Right now it's only about 5k.

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 11:59

Soulstaker

Naruch when you going to

Naruch when you going to crash it?At least I have a deadline.after I get dusker coat I will buy Ce non stop then crash it with you.

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 11:59

Naruchico

Guild

do you know the guild that plans to crash it?

I am not going to try alone, I hope others will assist me in this endeavor

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 12:00

Soulstaker

Well idk just heard about it

Well idk just heard about it from some people but tell me the day you Gunna crash.

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 12:25

Naruchico

Crash

I will let everyone know what day but I have a lot to muster up to do it, but if anyone would like to help let me know!

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 12:27

#10

Soulstaker

If if it's in like one or two

If if it's in like one or two weeks then I can manage.

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 12:27

#11

Naruchico

gerryw

whats your in-game name mines the same as my forum name

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 12:29

#12

Soulstaker

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 12:35

#13

Naruchico

thanks

thanks my in-game name is Naruchico for all, send friend invites if you wanna help, we can do this!

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 12:36

#14

Soulstaker

Send friend request to

Send friend request to me.can't go on my laptop ATM.Using IPad

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 13:07

#15

Algol-Sixty

ha! this is a plan to

ha! this is a plan to fail!

First, 5kcr per 100CE seems like a fine exchange rate to me. Even T1 runs can earn you more than that, so anyone with a fairly minimal level of skill can run gates forever.

Second, as mentioned above, a few players are unlikely to make any significant impact on the market, certainly not one that will last for days, probably not even for hours. Remember, OOO already has to be selling enough CE to pay salaries for quite a few GMs and developers. Unless you are working with thousands of dollars worth of CE (millions of CE), you simply can not make an impact.

Third, even if you have enough CE, that CE would have had to have been sold by OOO. Threatening to crash the CE market is about as scary to OOO as threatening to buy out a store is to a shopkeeper. Yeah, go ahead, throw money at OOO and try to hurt them!

Last, while players control the particular number of the cr<->CE exchange rate, OOO controls the general range by the way the game is designed. In particular, the AH, Vice and bomberman appear to have added significant crown sinks to the game. Vice also reduced the need to craft somewhat, thereby reducing the demand for CE. So, while more crown sinks are needed, it is quite possible that we will never see 7kcr per 100CE again.

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 13:15

#16

Naruchico

-_-

The goal is not to buy CE with money the goal is to do it all in-game, basically and in-game boycott to make CE so cheap that OOO must change the system due to the lack of people buying CE with cash.

and I know just a few can't do it, hence why I posted to get more help in this endeavor.

and as much as you say "well you can easily get enough to play forever" we should be able to do that anyways...I mean come on, name a game you can't play as much as you want that's play for free?

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 13:23

#17

Rage-Knight

Lemme know when you're about

Lemme know when you're about to crash it. I'll sell all my CE before it starts, buy CE for all my crowns afterwards.

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 13:35

#18

Naruchico

Math

okay did my math its going to take about 26000 CE to crash the current market, so that 220 lots of 100, with that 26000 we sell 100 lots for 2000 the price will drop to a rock bottom fast, from their we drop to 1000 with the next 80 lots, and then down to whats left 500 and down till we rock bottom out, and hopefully that would shake up the system for enough time to get a response from OOO.

that isn't much if we consider you can get 20000 CE for $50 currently.

this is just with the current market stats, if anyone else has better statistic let me know!

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 13:44

#19

Quasirandom

If you want to shove crystal

If you want to shove crystal energy prices down to 2k crowns for 100 CE and get it to stay there as anything more than a temporary blip, I think you're going to need at least a couple orders of magnitude more crystal energy than you think you will.

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 13:47

#20

Merchanter

lol ill buy out all your lots

lol ill buyout all your lots before anyone else can :d

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 13:48

#21

Addy

I hope I'm on when you do

I hope I'm on when you do this.

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 13:59

#22

Ten_Tacles

Legacy Username

You know, the less crowns CE

You know, the less crowns CE costs, the more you have to sell to get money.
You are actually HELPING OOO with that xD

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 14:07

#23

Naruchico

crowns...

if you could infinitely dungeon...and if you auctioned items you would make more crowns than CE could ever make for you wouldn't you?

so the "there is no better way to make crowns" statement is a bunch of bull-honky...

crash the market, we get to play as much as we want, keep the market running, and you can sit and wait for 22 hours...or pay out to play...your choice really

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 14:15

#24

Guardianknight

CE for 2k?

CE for 2k?
I better stock up on my crowns.
As far as your plan, I have mixed feelings but I don't want to deter
you from your goal so, for now, I will only say good luck.

The one and only, Guardianknight.

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 14:34

#25

Blue-Asylum

Considering you will

Considering you will certainly need to pay $ to get enough CE to 'crash' or control the market, I'm sure OOO would love for you to try. They have a spending ceiling but you can ask them to raise it for you.

While a guild could make a temporary change, the market is just too big and basic to make serious changes too without spending lots of resources. New content and players opinions shape energy prices. I also value CE at around 5K per 100CE, thus I generally buy when it's lower and sell when it's higher.

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 14:37

#26

Naruchico

Update

we have stocked up between all of the people assisting in the crash 114400 CE, that's way over my calculations and is great, if anyone wants to contribute you can message me in-game, or here. The more CE we have the better our odds are that OOO will agree to change the system.

During the crash we plan to keep selling lower, anyone who wants to assist when we reach that phase (it will be announced when) buy high sell low, don't think about the in-game crowns, or the CE. think about how much better the game will be when you can play as much as you want without energy to slow you down!

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 14:40

#27

KujoKujo

Legacy Username

OOO isn't gonna change the

OOO isn't gonna change the system, because it's not broken.

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 14:44

#28

Naruchico

not now

it isn't broken now, the plan is to use their own system against them to boycott the energy, by crashing the market.

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 14:49

#29

Mohandar

Please reconsider.

I hate to burst your bubble, but 114,400 CE is only 1144 units on the market. I have seen 500 unit walls blown through in an hour; your wall will have all the lifespan of a snowball in hell (exothermic hell, of course). This is after you expend about 500 units to get the price down to your target in the first place. The only way such a plan could work is if you managed to get the backing of a significant percentage of all in-game CE: for example, if you and your followers had 10% of ALL in-game CE at your disposal, I would believe that you could bring CE prices to 2k and keep them there for a week or more. As it stands, you may have a difficult time even reaching 2k per 100CE, let alone maintaining it. I urge you to reconsider your plans, unless you wish to fulfill the old adage "A fool and his money are soon parted."

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 14:57

#30

Naruchico

Understand

I understand that factor, hence why I am recruiting people to help, if we can manage to sway the CE market long enough OOO will take notice, and possibly listen to us as the players.

this is a players effort to get the attention of OOO to see changes that will increase our fun and their wallet, I would pay into a game that I can play without hindrance, compared to a game that cons you into paying to get more play-time, that's something that facebook games do...not "play for free" mmorpgs.

so let me put this simply "crash the market so we can play for free" or "pay to play as much as you want" which one sounds like OOO to you?

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 15:07

#31

Griffinbane

I just hope the "crash" will

I just hope the "crash" will last long enough for me to spend 100k crowns on CE.

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 15:07

#32

KujoKujo

Legacy Username

OOO wins no matter what the

OOO wins no matter what the CE price is. If CE costs 10,000 crowns, players will be forced to buy CE more often, because they'll no longer be able to make enough crowns off mist energy alone to buy another 100 energy. If CE costs 2000 crowns, players who want to buy items off AH need to buy more CE to afford them.

You're not going to get their attention, and you're not a hero. But if you do somehow make a dent in the CE market and bring it down to 3 or 4k, I'll be sure to dump 5 million crowns into it, then sell my energy for higher in a few days. ^^

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 15:17

#33

Naruchico

Kujo

you are a perfect example of a consumer...if you see a price you don't like, you don't worry you just pay out, if the price is too much, you save up, you never dispute about it, never ask why its so high, and don't care.

if you could run dungeons all day, all that you want, without CE or ME slowing you down you could buy and sell things in the AH all the same...look at WoWs economy...it works just great without some super money cow backing it...oh wait item drops and money from killing monsters pays for that...hmmm wonder how it could work if we didn't have to buy or wait for ME/CE....oh snap....everything would work great and be easier than it is now...

is any of this sinking in yet,

the market crash is irrelevant its the change that we are trying to obtain from it that really is the goal. turning CE into pudding so OOO realizes we don't want to wait to play...and we aren't going to pay to play, and if they want it that way then just put a bloody subscription in the game and stop with this ridiculous money grubbing situation

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 15:29

#34

KujoKujo

Legacy Username

I wouldn't say someone who

I doubt someone like me who has paid $0.00 is their ideal customer. In your rage, you're still not getting it: the company benefits no matter what the cost of CE is for different reasons. They're not going to change a thing, and they shouldn't change anything anyway.

I'm not completely against what you're doing because I will profit greatly from it if you're successful. I'm just pointing out that you'll accomplish very little in the long term, and you're not going to get the attention or game change you crave.

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 15:33

#35

Gimpyo

i dont think you can really

i dont think you can really call this a "crash" though my terminology might be off. a crash would require mass amounts of people making investments, then trying to sell for a higherprice with the bank not having enough monney to pay back. then, the people would have to be scared and mass into the back to try to get the monmey. this would leave the bank pennyless and have no way to pay upkeep, thus closeing the bank and leaving everyone high and dry. this will fail, for the game economy is computer generated, i.e. it has an infinate amount in its bank.

another crash could mean the game crashes. this requires so many people doing the same thing at once on a small server. this being an mmo, this is unlikely to happen to many poeple.

all that this "crash" will do is give opportunity to the masses of people who have too many cr to know what to do with. they will buy out all the cheap CE until they have no cr left, sell it for higher, and repeaty this process. even when the market evens out, the people can save the CE until the buying rate increases enough to be profitable, and this whole fiasco will happen again. It will be a matter of days before the price rises up to 4-5k again.

the only feasable way that this plan could work is if you and your band of players constantly kept the prices down at your said price. OOO will be doing nothing to prevent it, for it is user based. they will have no hand in it at all.

regardless, good luck. it might be nice to max out my CE bar to 99999. of course, the game would no longer be challenging and people would no longer have to really work for their things, but thats for another thread entirley.

p.s. excuse my grammar and spelling mistakes. im not on my own computer and i dont think this one has word, or some other form of grammar and spell check

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 15:40

#36

Naruchico

Fine...

the system is fine..."A unit of mist energy recharges in approximately 13.2 minutes; it takes 22 hours to recover a full 100 mist energy" so the play for free game Spiral Knights blatantly states "every 130 minutes you can play one dungeon for free" ....that sound like any play for free game you ever heard of...please go Google a play for free game, see any others that do this, that aren't on facebook...they love this style of play for free...hmm no wonder facebook games are generally hated as money grubbing games.

search for other posts on energy...seems to be a rising number of people who dislike the way the current energy system works...they should change things and people are suggesting it, looking for ways to be heard, and I'm offering a way to be heard, and as much as everyone's going "no don't please I'll have no crowns boo hoo" you'll have an infinite supply of crowns if you don't have to stop playing when your ME runs out, or you don't have enough crowns to get CE....

"We shall have no better conditions in the future if we are satisfied with all those which we have at present"
Thomas Edison

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 15:43

#37

Tersakoff

Legacy Username

Hahahaha sorry but this is so

Hahahaha sorry but this is so funny. XD
Almost like a 5 year old saying "I'm gonna be the president one day! :D "
Big plans, very very little chance to achieve them.

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 15:43

#38

Digitalartificer

This is quite hilarious

Haha the more I read this forum post the more I'm laughing. Already on your first day playing, your plotting the downfall of the market. I have to say reading through this forum, the more I realize people just LOVE to whine. Have fun being the 5000th person to fail at crashing the market. :D

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 15:49

#39

Naruchico

Work in progress

so far we have 115k CE, we are making progress, if more people would stop going "never going to happen" and help it would happen, and much faster than working against it by wasting your time going "oh lololol its another attempt thread"

I plan to make this happen, and I won't give up, one thing I have on my side atm is time and patience.

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 15:52

#40

Richy

Hopefully when you guys crash

Hopefully when you guys crash it I can buy half your CE for 2k and wait for prices to go back up to 6k in 2 weeks. Really, a bad idea. It is quite a waste of ce because prices are not going to stay that low.

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 16:01

#41

actinium

Legacy Username

It's just that your proposed

It's just that your proposed action and goal are entirely at odds. No matter how you use the system energy is being consumed and ooo makes money. The only way to boycott the system is to boycott the game and not play or buy energy. Amassing energy to sell it for cheap is essentially a charitable work that will make more people want to play the game just how it is.

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 16:16

#42

RedFortune

Legacy Username

Forum rants do not indicate

Forum rants do not indicate consensus of opinion.

Sure, lots of people ingame grumble "Hrnnggnrrrgh this energy system is stupid", but then they keep playing anyway.

Fact of the matter is, the state of the game at the moment is stable... in my opinion. You might not like the energy system as is, but I do, personally.
But I'm not going to be able to convince you otherwise no matter what I say, vica versa you for me.

I think that this "crash", if it even works, doesn't really serve to further anybody but the people who will just gobble up the thousands of CE you are selling knowing that it's stable price range is in fact around the 4-6k mark; they'll have a field day. Problem is, they're part of the reason why energy prices are "so high" anyway.

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 16:19

#43

Naruchico

A reply from customer support

Here is what OOO has stated to me from customer support

"Greetings,

In the event that the energy market should drop to under 1,000 crowns, then
all trades during that time would be at that price. The Market is highly
susceptible to supply and demand. When enough players want more crowns and
have enough energy, the cost of energy will drop, and players will get less
crowns for their energy. If enough players are running low on energy, the
costs of energy will rise.

Three Rings does not in any way directly influence the prices at the market or
the amount of Cristal Energy being traded at any time.

Best wishes,

- Clotho"

sounds like if it goes down to 1k that's the bar, as low as it goes

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 16:19

#44

Exemia

Hehe this seems like it is

Hehe this seems like it is gonna fail, and hard. The CE price will go back up in like a week. Then where will your progress be now. Just play the game. Simple!

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 16:28

#45

Rykerstrike

I dont know about you guys,

I dont know about you guys, but I for one, as a player that won't spend a single penny on this game... LOVE THIS IDEA!
Naruchico you are my hero :) My IGN is rykerstrike, you should add me

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 16:34

#46

USEFBerries

Legacy Username

If you noticed

Once you do this everyone will notice and buy as much as they can probably making the price of buying 100 CE double making it even harder to get CE for new players then from there no one will buy and start selling as much as possible then the whole CE market will keep tilting meaning some people will become rich from selling CE and some will go bankrupt for buying it ruining the whole game till OOO fixes it and most likely ban anyone who participated in this uprising. Good luck with the plans hope everything turns out good or bad whatever you are hoping to do

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 16:36

#47

PaletteSwap

Legacy Username

Announcing your intentions

Announcing your intentions before hand will flaw your result. It will be impossible to tell if the energy prices will decrease simply because everybody is selling expecting this to happen, or if people stop buying anticipating this event, or if you really are actively trying to manipulate prices. It's entirely possible that people are thinking you've got something to gain from the result and simply won't play into your hands.

In fact I bet the vast majority just see this as a plot to get them to sell all of their energy off cheap, where you'll be waiting to buy it all up at 2/5-1/2 the cost.

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 17:12

#48

Naruchico

....

If this was a plot I wouldn't be putting in myself, and wasting my time in-game saving up CE to do it, in the end it will cost me as much as everyone else. I can only give my word but for anyone who uses this for the unintended purpose of personal gain, then I say this you are trash and you should be taken out to the street with the rest of the garbage.

and on topic, if it crashes down hard and there is no CE to go around it works both ways, either everyone will rage and say that the energy system is broken and fix it, or no one will be buying CE through real money and OOO will have to act. Either way the total goal is for the system to change where Energy is not the main ability to play the game.

If you want this change, join in, if you are happy where your at now, then please keep on with what your doing while people who want change work for it.

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 17:30

#49

Reulogh

Any of the people planning or

Any of the people planning or joining to crash the market might just be one of the few who wanted to be present when this golden opportunity is presented and stock up as much ce as he wants, cheaply.

Don't mind me, I'm just skeptical.

Sat, 08/06/2011 - 17:36

#50

Naruchico

skepticism is welcome, at this point I will work on the market crash, at the same time I am also contacting OOO to see what can be done to change the system, I am trying to cover all bases to obtain the same thing, the ability to play for free without being hindered.

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