Spiral Knights - Greavers need a nerf.

Greavers need a nerf.

19 replies [Last post]

Fri, 03/09/2012 - 10:50

Guttler

Do you want to know why everyone is a sword user? Part of the issue is these darn bats. They hard counter gunners.

Greavers can infinitly gap close onto a knight, impossible to kite or knock away.
They get to attack multible times, impossible to block.

Their is not strategy to fighting Greavers, you just have to face tank them and kill them fast, which only sword users can do.

I can solo tier 3 arenas and CSKs, but as soon as one or two greavers spawn I just have to return to haven because I'm a gunner and they can't be dodged or kited and I don't have the damage to kill them with one hit like a swordsmen with a flourish.

Fri, 03/09/2012 - 11:00

Schattentag

False.

It is completely possible for a gunner or even a bomber to counter greavers, and the way to do that is by learning how to time things. Greavers will always stop their attacks upon being hit by anything. A skilled bomber will know when to place bombs such that they will detonate right as a greaver starts its dive. A skilled gunner will shoot the greaver as soon as it starts its dive.

I primarily use bombs and guns. Only recently did I get a sword higher than 3*. The decision not to use a sword comes with its advantages and disadvantages - bombs get crowd control and AoE damage, guns get range, and these benefits are traded for the inability to quickly dish out damage to nearby enemies (unless you unload a whole clip point-blank). Unless I make a mistake, I never have any problems with greavers when I'm using a Shivermist, a DBB, a Silversix, or a Radiant Pulsar.

In my opinion, greavers do not need a nerf. I will admit that they are quite possibly the hardest mob in the game, but that's what makes them fun.

Fri, 03/09/2012 - 11:02

Asukalan

/insert rage here

Fri, 03/09/2012 - 11:09

Demonicsothe

Oh look, this thread again

Shoot, shield bump, shoot. Back pedal the whole time.

And swordsmen do not facetank greavers. Nobody is stupid enough to facetank any sort o status fiends.

Wed, 03/14/2012 - 03:41

Asukalan

"Do you want to know why

"Do you want to know why everyone is a sword user? Part of the issue is these darn bats. They hard counter gunners."

Take a swordie with you.

"Greavers can infinitly gap close onto a knight, impossible to kite or knock away."

They are flying enemies, they are supposed to be faster and annoying.

"They get to attack multible times, impossible to block."

You know you have shield? And look above, you said they are fast, so why block them? You should run, shield makes you move slower.

"Their is not strategy to fighting Greavers, you just have to face tank them and kill them fast, which only sword users can do."

False, i handle them pretty well with Callahan, stun works really good and shoot stops them

"I can solo tier 3 arenas and CSKs"

You go solo at your own risk. Demanding to nerf something just becouse you cant SOLO it is simply pointless and shows how selfisn you are, how you want to ruin game for everyone else. The main part of SK is team play, you should know that.

"I can solo tier 3 arenas and CSKs, but as soon as one or two greavers spawn I just have to return to haven because"

Someone grew overconfident here? If you solo all other tier 3 arenas and CSKs it dont have to mean you HAVE to solo everything. You dont have to kill everything, you dont have to be best. Some things MAY be out of your reach

"I'm a gunner and they can't be dodged or kited and I don't have the damage to kill them with one hit like a swordsmen with a flourish."

No weapon can one hit kill them. Only charge. But using charge makes you more vulnerable to their attacks. They can be dodged. They can be kited.

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Fri, 03/09/2012 - 11:18

Verodius

Agreed

Either nerf these cheap pieces of [crap] (unblockable mist ftw!) or add an enemy that's impossible for swordsmen to hurt effectively (unless they have one of the 4 weapons that can hurt it) to compensate.

@Asukalanforum: under your "logic" perhaps we should add enemies that 1-hit kill all knights in the level and destroy their gear, because hey, if anyone complains about it they clearly don't know how to play the game right?

P.S. Interesting how every anti-greaver tactic on this thread only works when there's only one or two isn't there? nobody's posted a strategy for those occasions where you're under attack by 4-6 of the flying bastards.

Fri, 03/09/2012 - 11:15

Beans

Face tank?

I get a few slashes in before they attack, then shield bump them away. Letting greavers hit you, even while shielding, is pretty much asking to die.

I figure if I was using a gun I would use the same strategy.

Fri, 03/09/2012 - 11:16

Demonicsothe

Out of reach ghost blocks and

Out of reach ghost blocks and switches are OP. I can't continue on in the map if I meet one of these, and that makes me ragequit and return to haven.

Fri, 03/09/2012 - 11:26

Asukalan

Nothing is wrong with my

Nothing is wrong with my logic, i dont suggest to add OPed enemies. Something is messed with all those ppl complaining that enemies are too hard and suggest nerfing them. And their posts starts like "OMG IM PRO, i solo all clockworks but..."

What is wrong with all those ppl? Where did they get that attitude "OMG i just HAVE to kill everything, nothing can stop me". Do they ever think that SOME THINGS may be unaccesible to them?

Currently, every enemy in game is perfectly fine, no thing is OP. There is no need to any nerf. Every enemy in game can be beaten without any hassel with the help of:

- Tactic
- Good party
- Right equipment

You dont have right weapon? Make it. You dont want to make it? Die or deal with it and do other runs.

You have right weapon and you die? Guess your tactic is flawed or you dont really know how to deal with them. What makes this game unique that it values skill over gringing. We dont have silly stats that go up with hours of repating same thing. We use skills in playing to deal with dangers.

You cant deal with dangers? AVOID THEM. Its basical survival instintinct. LOL its like you see a man with a gun, you punch him in face, end up in hospital and write petition "Dear all weapon manufacturers, please make gun bullets slower and make guns shoot with delay becouse i dont have enough reflexes to avoid bullets"

BECAUSE OF PEOPLE LIKE YOU, whinners who when get killed, instead of considering it a lesson (TO AVIOD THOSE THINGS or be better prepared next time) go to forum and complain about their helplessness and hurted ego becouse they just couldnt be able to kill something, they removed beloved TORTODRONE!

Because of ppl like you, who cant learn from their own mistakes, they had to punch that pacefull tortodrone, they got owned, they complained and OOO removed it.

Now the greavers are problem again?? You go, you cant kill then AVOID THEM, not complain and ruin game for everyone.

ps. and again big LOL at OP, you ever read "about" section of game? First thing there:
"Co-operative Exploration
The Clockworks offer challenges that are best tackled with friends. Fight monsters, solve puzzles and discover treasures together!"

IF YOU GO SOLO, you do it at your OWN RISK. If you demand to change game just because you cant play it solo you are just selfish.

Fri, 03/09/2012 - 11:24

Demonicsothe

I went and looked up that one

I went and looked up that one thread Darkbrady made awhile ago.

http://forums.spiralknights.com/en/node/39692

41 responses, not too long. Good tips in there.

Fri, 03/09/2012 - 11:29

#10

Asukalan

"Their is not strategy to

"Their is not strategy to fighting Greavers"

This + you not having even avatar, makes me thing you didnt even spent a minute on searching forums to find tips about greavers, you didnt even bother to make topic like: "help, how can i kill greavers in more efficent way?". No you just rushed in here demanding to change them since you the PRO cant SOLO them. Also i have felling that you are some mid ranged T2 player who got pwned by greavers and instead of taking a lesson from it, you run crying and wiping your nose to forum to complain about them, and to help your case you just wrote you are T3 who solos everything but greavers.

Fri, 03/09/2012 - 11:52

#11

Verodius

@Asukalanforum

That might be good advice IF (big if) the Stratum themes were more tight (unlike right now, where you can go through a "Beast" stratum that consists of nothing but Constructs with 1 or 2 Wolvers per level to try and pass them off as "Beast" levels) and/or there were other enemies in the game that pulled the "HAVE THE SPECIFIC GEAR NEEDED TO DEFEAT ME OR DIE" card (pushing aside the issue that not everyone is a full 5-star who can afford to craft new gear based on their fancies for now.)

But as it is you can be doing a Construct level or some-such and suddenly Greavers and oh hey your dead for making the mistake of not bringing your anti-Fiend gear to a Construct stratum, which is only a few steps above my aforementioned gear-destroyer.

Aside from that I agree with you, don't go to fiend Stratum if Fiends give you grief.

P.S. Tortodrone doesn't really seem like he was that much even when he was in the game. Looking at this page on the wiki he was just a Trojan that could shoot missiles.

Fri, 03/09/2012 - 11:49

#12

Beans

Anti fiend armor?

I don't even have any armor with shadow def, personally. I get by just fine.

Fri, 03/09/2012 - 11:57

#13

Schattentag

What Tazurin said

Yeah, I go around T3 fiend strata in 4* demo gear (that's just elemental and normal defense btw), and I don't have issues. Regarding the thread Demonicsothe mentioned, I get by just fine with DBB and Shivermist if it's not a freeze level or a Silversix if it is. I don't have RSS or BTB.

Fri, 03/09/2012 - 12:08

#14

Kurapika

-1

Can't we keep ANY challenging enemies in the game? I loved Alpha Wolvers, then they got a nerf along with zombies. Please keep Greavers and Devilites the way they are! I don't want to see any more challenge go down the toilet!

Fri, 03/09/2012 - 12:13

#15

Severage

Quoting Demonicsothe...

"Shoot, shield bump, shoot. Back pedal the whole time.

And swordsmen do not facetank greavers. Nobody is stupid enough to facetank any sort o status fiends."

When I happen to not be using my Flourish, and am using a sword that's not good on Fiends, I just take out my Peacemaker and kill them. It's more effective than my sword, when I'm not using my FF.

-1.

HOWEVER, I DO think that Greaver's status clouds should be more visible. NOT WEAKER, but more visible.

~Sev

Fri, 03/09/2012 - 12:14

#16

Diamondshreddie

mehh..

i used to rage at these buggers too.. im a bombar and trust me , its quite hard for a bomber, charging makes you walk a lil slower and leaves you 100% vulnerable XD also theres no shadow def bomber gear :P using shards sometimes can dramatically affect them, but nitro or DBB is prolly ur best bet. as for guns... those greaves dont stand a chance hehehe shield bumbing exists u know? and there are guns that hurt mone than one enemy at a time .. BUT despite all this, i have to admit its just easier to pull out my conbuster and give em a few careful slashes right as they dive

Fri, 03/09/2012 - 13:50

#17

Psychodestroyer

......

I'll admit, greavers are annoying. But as for their operational efficiency at killing us, I think that's fairly balanced.

Players are supposed to come up with their own strategies to kill monsters. You can't run into a graveyard toting a Shadowtech alchemer and honestly expect to with without trouble.

As a hybrid player, I find it useful to switch to a gun from the Anitgua line. Their fast-fire makes them recoil every few shots, interrupting their attack.

Even while toting a sword, Greavers are no walk in the park. I sometimes have trouble even with my DTS equipped; they circle around behind me.

Point is, you can't just rush in there and expect to on-man-army-tank all the monsters in a 10 panel radius, planning has to be involved.

I don't have anti-anything gear, my only usable armour in T3 is Ashtail. Shield is BTS, no other. The best defense I have are my weapons, and my wits.

And I'm not saying I'm smart either.

As far as I can guess with a gunner:
-bring a fast-fire weapon to interrupt them. (Or your normal guns, whatever works.)
-run backwards shooting at them so they can't get you.
-the moment they rush you, shield so the bump can take effect.
-If you really think swords are so effective, ad you can't deal with them as a gunner, GET A SWORD. Don't limit yourself just because you want a reputation of something. If you can't deal with it, get something that CAN.

All else fails, get a friend who can deal with them. I have a friend who I sometimes call for fiend-control when it gets really out of hand, and he's a GENIUS at it. I have no-idea how he does it.

Fri, 03/09/2012 - 15:04

#18

Juances

The omni-mist needs a 'fix', not a totall nerf but a 'fix'.

Like idk, leave a trail of it behind the monster, similar to toxilargos instead of throwing it in your face. That should be enough.

Fri, 03/09/2012 - 15:12

#19

Demonicsothe

More visibilty on the aura

More visibilty on the aura left behind, and fix it going through mist forcefields.

That's really all it needs.

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Greavers need a nerf.