Spiral Knights - Increased Attack Speed. Not noticable on heavy swords?

Increased Attack Speed. Not noticable on heavy swords?

19 replies [Last post]

Tue, 07/03/2012 - 09:59

Lyzak

I've been working for a very, VERY long time to manufacture a Troika-line sword with a Very High Attack Speed Increase. Recently, I finally accomplished my goal, and am working to upgrade it into a Triglav. However, I'm... disappointed with the results. I literally can not see the difference in speed. At all. Compared to my Divine Avenger and Gran Faust (neither have ANY asi at all), the sword is the same speed.

What does ASI actually improve then? Is the effect pointless in heavy swords? I spend a fortune on this thing...

Tue, 07/03/2012 - 10:05

Metagenic

…

Troikas are naturally slower than Sealed Swords. An ASI UV puts a Troika on about the same speed level as a non-UV'd Sealed Sword.

Also, note that ASI doesn't make your attacks themselves faster. It only reduces the time between individual attacks.

Tue, 07/03/2012 - 10:10

Lyzak

I'm aware that they are

I'm aware that they are naturally a little slower, but what I hear is that you only need an ASI LOW to compensate for the difference...

Tue, 07/03/2012 - 10:18

Lyzak

In addition, ASI does affect

In addition, ASI does affect the actual execution of the attacks as well. This is known because a NEGATIVE asi, like on Ancient Armor, clearly slows swords attack execution down.

This is part of what has me so confused. A Negative ASI Medium is far more noticeable than a Positive ASI Very High.

Tue, 07/03/2012 - 10:34

Bopp

data

The guild Lancer Knightz has detailed data on sword speed, at least in terms of complete combos. It seems that the difference between Sudaruska and DA is larger than ASI: Low. Sorry.

Tue, 07/03/2012 - 10:47

Poopsie

...

if I remember correctly,
ASI only helps to make the speed between attacks faster (between first and second swing for heavy swords). However, ASI doesn't help at reducing the delay after last combo (after heavy sword's second swing or reload animation for gun). Hence, you don't really notice the difference if you only use full combo. I bet you could notice asi a little bit if you use this move: first swing -> shield cancel -> first swing -> shield cancel -> ...

Tue, 07/03/2012 - 10:56

Bopp

full combos

"Hence, you don't really notice the difference if you only use full combo."

Maybe not as much as in a one-swing mode --- I don't know, I haven't tried that --- but each level of ASI increases the combos per minute by about 3.5%. So yes you do see a difference if you use only full combos.

Tue, 07/03/2012 - 14:20

Alynn

Moo~~

I have a ASI HIGH Triglav. Horrible in speed and dmg. But I still love it.

Tue, 07/03/2012 - 16:01

Lyzak

Mine is VH. I love the sword,

Mine is VH. I love the sword, but I hate it for being so horrifically unbalanced. All I want to do is get rid of it now.

... I can complain about all the things wrong with the game for hours if given the chance. I'm trying really hard not to go on another obsessive rant XD

Tue, 07/03/2012 - 16:27

Pepperonius

Lyzak

My advice, as a Triglav lover, is to try and acquire a CTR med or higher Troika, and go that rout. While the regular attack is lackluster, the charge attack is tons of fun, and quite effective. Your ASI VH should sell for a fortune on auction, so you wont find yourself out cash, either.

Tue, 07/03/2012 - 16:48

#10

Lyzak

I already have FOUR of those

I already have FOUR of those CTR MED troika. (Trying to sell em! Talk to me if you want one!)

But... the charge attack isn't all that great either, compared to the damage the DA does, for example.

Tue, 07/03/2012 - 17:04

#11

Pepperonius

CTR

In FSC, I've found it does over 800 damage, which is in line with DA and Brandish charges. It is especially great in mobs, where unlike the DA and Brandish, it does full damage against the mob! Pair it up with a vortex bomb, and it is devastating.

Tue, 07/03/2012 - 17:50

#12

Tenkii

Noticeability

Just doing some math...
What gives a larger difference?
120% * 10? --> you get 12 (difference of 2)
120% * 5? --> you get 6 (difference of 1)

You can see a larger difference if something's attack speed is already high. You might contest this, but I definitely feel it with things that attack quickly (ex: I switch-shoot with guns, but with both max ASI and VH ASI loadouts, and it's VERY noticeable there).

That said, ASI is much more noticeable when applied to something like a sealed sword than the slower troika.

Also, I'll disagree with Poopsie - I'm pretty sure attack speed affects ALL aspects of the weapon type- not just the first slash. You're safer after a 2nd swing AND charge if you have attack speed than if you don't. If you don't believe me, try synchronizing with a friend while you both have different attack speeds and shield. The higher ASI guy will shield first, even if you execute the attacks at the same time.

Tue, 07/03/2012 - 20:46

#13

Lyzak

Math o.O

I get the "noticeability" factor in relation to size. But when I say "not noticeable," I mean at all. I cannot tell that there is any kind of positive attack speed bonus whatsoever.

I will concede that the Triglav has an impressive charge attack. But it's still a sword, not a bomb. I don't appreciate doing a third of what I do to everything else, AND being slower.

...Crap, now I'm back on my balanced-weaponry rant XD

Wed, 07/04/2012 - 02:15

#14

Fehzor

I have an ASI med sudaruska. I can actually notice it quite a bit over my beast/fiend med triglav... and honestly, I prefer the ASI Suda for many things.

Fri, 07/06/2012 - 13:18

#15

Orangeo

ASI is a multiplier. 0 x

ASI is a multiplier. 0 x 10000 is still zero. Better to just go full out tank since ASD won't really screw you over.

Fri, 07/06/2012 - 13:58

#16

Derpules

Full. . . tank. . .?

Tank? In SK?

Fri, 07/06/2012 - 16:46

#17

Demonicsothe

I'm confused by the

I'm confused by the multiplier comment. Do you mean to say that the 100000 would be the theoretical asi? What would the 0 be? A weapon with no attack speed at all? Other than bombs, you can't use a weapon that won't move.

Or are you talking about how attack speed decrease does not decrease you past your base? Isn't it generally believed that "negative" bonuses do impact you, such as a striker trying to charge a bomb without any ctr bonus?

Fri, 07/06/2012 - 17:32

#18

Trying

Nothing has an ASI of zero....

Mon, 07/09/2012 - 10:24

#19

Serell

....

Play with a regular suda with a swiftly tor a week. Then replace your swiftly with a new shield. You will notice a BIG change and will want to get your swiftly back and never go back.

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Increased Attack Speed. Not noticable on heavy swords?