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fang of vog vs warmaster's rocket hammer

18 replies [Last post]
Sun, 12/16/2012 - 16:35
Slothalot

I have found myself using my rocket hammer over my fang 100% of the time, I have not started the shadow lairs yet, and was wondering if I should keep my fang of vog for the future, or sell it because i could use the money.

Sun, 12/16/2012 - 16:51
#1
Traevelliath's picture
Traevelliath

Fang of Vog is used for the charge and the charge alone. Other than that, it's as fast as a Sealed Sword, with the damage of a Brandish.

I'd still say keep the FoV for the sake of having it around. FoV is still the best weapon to dominate the Royal Jelly with. However, I'd at least consider getting an Elemental Brandish or Avenger. The Hammer is fun, but you really cannot use it effectively in Shadow Lairs, relative to the Brandish and Sealed Swords. Shadow Lairs specialize in giving you very little space to manage, with a variety of hazards in all directions. You can just use the first swing of the combo... but then the DA would be the better choice due to the spectacular charge and the potential damage of the full combo. You can use the dash to eliminate bigger targets, but the Brandish can do it in a safer fashion, as well as also having a beastly AOE charge.

TL;DR, keep em, but try Brandish/Sealed Sword

Sun, 12/16/2012 - 17:42
#2
Slothalot
thnx

thank for the advice
I've almost got my gran faust so this was very helpful

Sun, 12/16/2012 - 19:20
#3
Bopp's picture
Bopp
obligatory

You might find my detailed sword guide useful. It includes a direct comparison of all of these elemental swords.

Can you make a profit selling FoV? I would think that the market would be over-supplied, due to everybody running FSC all the time.

Mon, 12/17/2012 - 08:13
#4
Orbwanter's picture
Orbwanter
-

The Hammer is fun, but you really cannot use it effectively in Shadow Lairs, relative to the Brandish and Sealed Swords.

Disagreeing here. Rocket Hammer is GREAT in UGWW for flattening Kats and Howlitzers. Didn't bring mine to UIMF or UFSC because I was bombing/gunning, so I can't say how it performs there, but it's my primary weapon for Legion of Almire, Ghosts in the Machine, and the boss of Heart of Ice.

Mon, 12/17/2012 - 14:20
#5
Aureate's picture
Aureate
Processing Thoughts of You Always

I just acquired a FoV; sorry to say it got me killed a few times when I was experimenting with it. The swings are slower than one would expect from a 3-swing sword - it felt slower than using my Divine Avenger, and the hitbox certainly seems rather smaller. It's a fun weapon to play with, I admit, and it decimates turrets with its charge attack, but the amount of fire resistance necessary to make it 'safe' to use the charge and the slowness of its swings are putting me off rather.

Now if only there was a weapon with FoV's charge and WRH's standard attack pattern...

Mon, 12/17/2012 - 15:04
#6
Bopp's picture
Bopp
good summary

Now if only there was a weapon with FoV's charge and WRH's standard attack pattern...

That pretty much sums it up. FoV has an awesome charge attack --- basically Levi/CIV on steroids --- but mediocre regular attacks. WRH has an awesome regular attack --- if you shield-cancel after the dash --- but a mediocre charge attack. Although both are elemental swords, their tactical niches are quite different.

Mon, 12/17/2012 - 15:59
#7
Fehzor's picture
Fehzor

*Guy comes onto forums; asks for help*
*Regular finds post, puts down opinion that they read from whenever ago*
*OP reads thread... Thanks for the help! Takes the advice to heart...*
*Other regulars come onto forum, correct and add to the point, make a thread worth reading- that they've all read before*
*OP never returns*

My opinion on the matter, because I enjoy arguing:

FoV is only really in the game for novelty- most of what its charge does is better taken care of by WRH's normal attack. The only time its better to use FoV's charge over WRH's normal is when there are multiple targets, and you're able to hit all of them. That and the jelly king. Him too, as he bumps you back.

Their tactical niches are exactly the same (unless you're using FoV as set up), except that with WRH you don't have to wait around holding a charge- you get to use your shield... but the tactic is the same- find a time, and use the charge/2nd hit on an enemy. It is also important to note that ASI is valued more by WRH while CTR is valued more by FoV.

Tue, 12/18/2012 - 10:00
#8
Laraso's picture
Laraso
Fang of Teamwork

It should also be mentioned that the Fang of Vog is an excellent suicide weapon for giving away your heat a the end of a level, if there are no stage hazards available and you lack a Gran Faust.

Tue, 12/18/2012 - 12:46
#9
Aureate's picture
Aureate
Processing Thoughts of You Always

@Laraso: I managed to kill myself using the FoV in the entrance hall whilst experimenting with the charge. It was pretty embarrassing when Thunderbog turned up after that >.>;
It seems more efficient than using the Gran Faust to kill yourself, though, even with double max fire resist. Maybe I should experiment by committing seppuku some more in the t3 version of ATH...

@Fehz: I know I really shouldn't be doing that sort of thing, but I can't help myself D;

Wed, 12/19/2012 - 02:49
#10
Batabii's picture
Batabii
From what I've seen, FoV is

From what I've seen, FoV is actually faster than sealed sword, and the good chance of STRONG fire compensates a bit, though hammer is much faster.

FoV's standard attack is only as "mediocre" as Levi. It doesn't even need to charge for a burn.

Also killing yourself is stupid. Don't encourage other people to be lazy/impatient. Heat will get maxed in no time at all.

Wed, 12/19/2012 - 03:07
#11
Aureate's picture
Aureate
Processing Thoughts of You Always

@Batabii: Really? FoV seems to be about the same swing speed as Sealed, which makes its combos rather slower since it needs longer to complete its attack combo. Rocket Hammer seems to take about the same time to complete, except it lunges you forwards a lot more.
I'd consider wasting my heat to be stupid, where other people in the party might have used it.
FoV's standard attack follows the same pattern as Levi, and gets the bonus of fire proc and elemental damage, but it does come with the drawback of the much slower swings.

Also, in general, I did a little testing and double max seems to cut the fire proc rate on the charge to about 50% or thereabouts. Still need to experiment a lot more with it, however.

Wed, 12/19/2012 - 06:01
#12
Bopp's picture
Bopp
data are readily available

Combos per minute at ASI+0:
* FoV: 26
* DA: 29
* Levi: 31
Combos per minute at ASI+6:
* FoV: 32
* DA: 37
* Levi: 38
(See here.) So FoV is significantly slower than Levi. I do agree that its charge attack is much better, and its regular attack fire is nice.

If you shield-cancel after WRH's second stroke (the dash), then you can go really fast. I can achieve at least 48 almost-combos in a minute at ASI+6. (By almost-combo I mean all strokes except the last one.)

Wed, 12/19/2012 - 14:43
#13
Aureate's picture
Aureate
Processing Thoughts of You Always

Huh, the hammer takes longer than I thought, then; marginally faster combos than the DVS. I guess it just seems that way because nobody actually uses the full combo of the weapon... Thanks for the link, I guess I'll be rolling for ASI on my FoV in the forseeable future. Either that or looking for max fire resistance on my Volcanic Demo and Vog Cub, since the double max that set normally gets isn't actually enough to reduce the self-infliction rate to safe levels. e.e

I don't suppose anyone has a chart with effects of fire resistance levels on the self-inflict rates for the charge, by the way?

Wed, 12/19/2012 - 15:00
#14
Bopp's picture
Bopp
I haven't seen it

I haven't seen such a chart. It would be nice. I guess you'd collect such data by charging FoV over and over again, standing on a heart fountain.

You're going for ASI on your FoV? Do you already have big CTR? That's what I'd go for. Big CTR and big fire protection. Then pretty much anything you're fighting is just dead. Kind of like Blitz Needle. In fact, FoV and Blitz have about the same charge rate, but FoV lets you move at normal speed while charging, while Blitz slows you down a fair amount.

Wed, 12/19/2012 - 23:13
#15
Batabii's picture
Batabii
Stop processing thoughts of me

FoV is slower than levi, I'm not arguing that, however there's no way each swing is slower than each swing from DA/GF.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 04:52
#16
Aureate's picture
Aureate
Processing Thoughts of Hurr Durr

Bluh.
The issue I have with getting CTR is that it would also require me to max out my fire resistance. Currently, I'm using Volcanic Demo and Vog Cub, which gives me double max; even so, the self-infliction rate seems to be at roughly 50% or so, which takes more bars off my health than I can really afford to use on a regular basis. I'm not really sure at what fire resistance the self-infliction level would be reduced to what I would consider acceptable (self-infliction somewhere around 1/4 or 1/3 of the time)... although I suppose I could just increase my ASI by using full Vog instead. :P

I didn't say the swings were slower than DA/GF - I just said it feels that way because the combo is three swings, instead of two, which makes it take rather longer to complete.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:17
#17
Etharaes's picture
Etharaes
Chaos Set + FoV = Death

The one place where FoV really shines vs the Warmaster Rocket Hammer is donating heat to other players, willingly or not.

Thu, 12/20/2012 - 11:22
#18
Batabii's picture
Batabii
Hurr Durr of Derp de Hurr

Fire resist doesn't affect self-inflicted fire CHANCE, it affects fire DAMAGE, from what I've seen (divine veil+volcanic demo suit here)

Also I'll have to test but I'm pretty sure FoV's self-burn is less than 50%. I'll check the damage too, but when I get burned by fire grates in FSC I usually take a ridiculous amount of damage even with fire resistance.

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