Blitz Needle (and the other type versions of it):
The gunner version adds to an already powerful gun by making it draw more quickly when firing, and making you walk faster. The change would definitely make people with blitz needles very happy, but I feel the change makes the gun too over the top. Since it's probably the best gun in the game, it makes sense to have the drawback of a slow draw and a slow walk so players have to fire this powerful thing carefully. If I used the gunner version of the blitz on vana I would have a much easier time than usual, which does reduce the difficulty of not only this boss but others as well.

If these changes are put on a blitz I wouldn't complain though since I am a blitz owner and would enjoy them very much despite the concerns.

As it relates to swords and bombs, it's already powerful enough as it is, the gunner version goes beyond that.

Valiance:
The gunner version has small bullets as opposed to the big bullets of the traditional valiance. It would be strange to make this change when the alternate damage type valiances have the big bullets of a normal valiance. The change is superficial so there's really no issue here.

As it relates to swords and bombs, no change.

Callahan and Iron Slug (and the new versions):
All the changes here are great. The both had more drawbacks than the blitz needle making them not very desirable. Particularly how the player would fall down after a charged shot. The gunner versions fixes their drawbacks making them more competent weapons. They shoots just slightly faster, by like a quarter of a second, and the charged shot won't make a player fall clumsily.

As it relates to swords and bombs, it used to have no chance, but the gunner version makes it a desired piece of equipment.

gunner Argent Peacemaker and gunner Sentenza:
Without using the original guns, since they're not available in the depot, they seem to fire faster, but I can't say for sure. Also the charge shot seems less likely to backfire since originally using it would allow enemies to get at you, but that doesn't seem to happen as often. Whatever's been upgraded with these, it won't damage the metagame by being overpowered compared to anything else.

gunner Biohazard and gunner Neutralizer:
Keep all the changes. Do not not release this. I want them badly now.

That's all I got. I'm not an expert in this area of the game, but in general I like what I see. This would definitely get more people to use guns.

Are these names subject to change, or are they finalized? I do have a few name ideas for the new pulsar weapons. I was thinking Aurora for the Ice one and Quasar for the fire one.

Would you fix wall bug? It stops me and some other people from using many guns?
I thought that it will be the first thing that you will make for gunner update.

@Untrustful PMoS is still good. While these new sets have net status values of 0, it has +2. It also has superior defense, and equal offensive totals compared to the Shade/Pathfinder/Sentinel sets. It's a little better than them!

_____________________________

Here's what I've observed of the new guns, and my thoughts on them. I'll follow a simple structure of:

Weapon
Observations

Feedback

_____________________________

Magnus Series
Iron Slug, Winter Grave, and Callahan all behave identically, with equal damage but differing statuses and damage types. They shoot like the Magnus line in the live server, however, they have much faster movement while reloading and charging. The charge attack now pierces enemies, and Iron Slug can stun.

It seems like these changes make the Magnus line much more viable; the normal shots are now largely inferior to the charge attack, but they still have their ability to stunlock and deal decent damage to single targets. The charge attack seems to work better against multiple enemies- which is, to say, "most of the time". I kinda wanted to see a slow-firing, no-charge style in the Magnus line, but I guess this works too.

Pulsar Series
Movement speed while charging and firing seems to be higher. Firing movement is slower than charging movement. Supernova deals more flat damage than the other variations.

The Supernova buff is great, but I don't like the movement changes. Polaris is already an extremely spammy weapon; now it's both incredibly easy to use safely and has no real weakness. Before, if you were caught while shooting, you'd eat a hit; now you can sidestep as much as you like. It'd be understandable on something like an Antigua, but this is way too powerful. I was hoping the Pulsars would get a clip size reduction and faster bullet speed with bullets that take longer to expand, not this..

Blaster Series
Identical across the board, with different damage types. Increased movespeed while firing/charging. The aftereffects for each charge attack are all the same color. Valiance seems to have smaller bullets than the others, for some reason.

The Blaster is now the 'vanilla' gun. Reliable, but simple, it deals decent damage while letting you move freely. Unlike the Pulsar series, this is perfectly reasonable, because the knockback is minimal and the damage is single-target. It'd be nice if those graphical errors were fixed, but that's about all I can say to these. Nice, nice, nice.

Alchemer Series
General movespeed buffs, like with the others.

A "heavier" Blaster, just like on the live server. I'd like to have seen some changes on the hit registration for these and the direction of the ricochets, but unfortunately, I don't see those.. There is still a slight delay before a bullet deals damage in the area it hits, and the ricochets on normal attacks still randomly fly to the left. I'd like to see Alchemers have instant hits and fixed ricochets.

Autogun Series
Movespeed buffs. Attacks now start firing and pull back a little faster. Blitz damage unchanged, Grim Repeater has similar damage.

I'm extremely disappointed with these changes. Not only have Autoguns been made much safer, their damage has not been changed. Blitz is still the most insanely, brokenly, overly-damaging weapon in the game, and it now has a shadow-damage counterpart and is much safer. Please nerf this, especially if the movespeed is here to stay. Also, the Grim Repeater's firing sound is a little quiet- not the bullets, those are loud as ever.

Catalyzer Series
Movespeed buffs. Charge attack and normal attack are inverted, as are their damage values. Shots that stick to enemies can be detonated by any weapon.

Very nice! It's been a long time coming and it's finally came- the inverted firing, I mean. Please remove the screen-shake effects from the explosions, now that there are many times more explosions. I don't like having the camera thrust into the ground every time I make things go kaboom. I want to see things going kaboom!

Antigua Series
Movespeed changes.

Not much to say here. Now that the Magnus line has the multi-hitting piercing-shot charge attack, I'd like to see Antiguas' charges changed to be hitscan in a straight line- that means, no projectiles or travel time, like a long-range sword attack. Also, the Gilded Griffin looks more draconic than griffin-like. Any chance its name could be changed to reflect this? First thing that comes to my mind is "Draglock", a portmanteau of "dragon" and "glock".

Well, I guess that's true. I think spreading all that damage over a big AoE is pretty considerable in practice, though, but I guess that was a stupid reason to throw that in. I often support Vortex Bombs and Rocket Hammers even though they're a bit more effective because they're harder to use than other weapons. I say something among the lines of "it takes skill to use well, therefore it should be stronger". How could I forget that now?

Maybe I need to sleep.

Scrapping that part.

I noticed that the freezing pulsar often froze then broke enemies, slowing them down in order to deal more damage to them.

This is pretty huge. I was going to go into a rant about 'TWO DOZEN NEW GUNS' and how there aren't any but, honestly?

All the guns are new. None of the guns are what they used to be.

Significantly faster movement speed
This right here is going to change everything. You can move at full speed while charging anything. Even Blitz. Even Callahan. While shooting, speed seems reduced with about the same amount as when charging bombs.

It's huge. It's so huge that swords and bombs seem entirely pointless in comparison.

I'm not against it, but you are going to have to hurry up with a bomber update and even a sworder update, because anyone who is not a gunner is going to be underpowered now.

Autoguns
When I first noticed that the regular shots on Blitz are faster, my gut instinct was to think "Oh great, they buffed Blitz, the last thing that needs it."

Honestly, seeing how powerful all the other guns have gotten, it was needed.

Volcanic Pepper and Plague finally got their damage buff. Pepper also had a significant speed and range buff. This is all very awesome. Pepper is a monster now.

The fabled, overdue Iron Slug Buff
Stun and the penetrating bullet we all asked for except it doesn't penetrate but mops all the enemies with it. It's amazing, and everything we ever wanted from the Slug. You can even move at full speed while charging now, making this the gun equivalent of Brandish. You can hit monsters multiple time with a single charge shot and it's incredibly satisfying.

The collision boxes are still a bit on the wonky side, and it can be hard to hit things like trojans with it.

TWO DOZEN NEW POLARIS
Damage nerf. Good. I agree that with all the changes to everything else, increasing the bullet speed seems like the right move.

Valiance and elemental Valiance and shadow Valiance and piercing Valiance
I thought these things were going to be overpowered but they're just normal-powered when you look at all the other stuff.

Catalyzer
Catalyzer is an amazing crowd clearing weapon now, this is exactly what needed to happen to it. In fact, I suggest this:

Catalyzer is the most powerful handgun line on the test server. It's amazing when paired with Iron Slug and Volcanic Pepperbox. Tag a lot of enemies with the cata, punch through all of them with slug and make them explode, use Pepper to take out single targets fast.

Overall
I can't wait to go with full-catalyzer parties. Alchemers seem like they'll be a dying breed. plz buff sudaruska

Also, with all of this mobility and the amazing charges on the guns, I suspect Chaos is going to become even more popular than it already is.

Hipster guns are dead, long live the hipster guns.

I have finally got the taste of the test server and those guns and to realize all the guns are SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO GOOD.
-
-
-
-
Magnus Series

The long waited Iron Slug buff has finally came after 3 voging years and man it is sure making use of it, now it can penetrate threw targets which makes it a really great weapon now far from it used to from a worst gun and weapon in the game into a powerful force of nature.

Not only that the Magnus line no longer takes a dump on your movement speed which makes it even better, yes other guns have that too but that helps the magnus line alot. Slag walkers prepare to be destroyed. >:D
-
-
-
-
Catalyzer Series

Now it has become even more a gun for bombers (which it's a good thing BTW) mainly because the features of the line has been reverse, now the charge attack is the main attack and the main attack is the charge attack meaning you can spam SPAM the attack button and get alot of enemies with orbs in the point you be nuking all the enemies in the area.

Also now you can detonate the orbs with any weapon now which allow you to use another weapon while you detonate the orbs, the only problem I see about it is you can no longer break blocks now and the charge attack is useless now and be a waste of time to charge it. But all and all it now better and it's alot more fun to use I hope it stays that way.

Also because of the new change it maybe useful in lockdown when you ever get spawn camped by the enemy team, have a team of catalyzers and spam them away from your spawn and if they stay while the orbs are still moving around them attack them with your sword or your other gun or whatever and take them out, just wanted to put that out there. :)
-
-
-
-
Blaster Series

Now there is more flavors to choose from besides Valiance, a elemental, shadow, and piercing version and are all great to have.

the only thing I worry about is the normal Valiance it may end up being underrated again and hardly even used, maybe buff the damage of the normal Valiance a tiny bit that will most likely make it even with the other three blaster lines.

I will be adding more about the other lines tomorrow, but for now that is all. for now

Also hello Zeddy I miss you, how it going the king of shard bombs.

Antigua Line
Sent is less useless compared to obsidian carbine (grem high compared to poison med).
Movespeed buffs on shots. Great change for a light gunner weapon.
Damage is probably nicely balanced in PvE due to the majority of the damage being hidden behind the damage boost against single monster types.

Autogun Line
Normal shot is now much more usable. I didn't go too far into timing, but the movespeed decrease on charge should stay as it is (lots of other guns got movespeed buffs - this one shouldnt). It is a heavy gunning weapon. I expect to move slow just like heavy swords at the expense of increased damage potential.

Alchemer Line
No longer feels like a heavy gunning weapon. Put back the movespeed decrease upon shots/charge.

Catalyzer Line
Inverted charge/normal seems like a push to remove the tactical advantage of placing fewer hard hitting shots for more of a spammy weapon. I don't like it, but am not completely against it.
I wont have the time, but I hope someone can test the charge shot "blocking". (Is it still useless on Battlepods, Pit Bosses, ect?)

Valiance Line
Did not test. I expect this to be a medium damage weapon line. From above, it seems this was implemented well.

Pulsar Line
Did not test. From what I read above, it looks like it was handled well with multiple statuses and decreased damage. I consider this a medium damage crowd control gun.

Magnus Line
Great changes. This is now a medium damage gun (high damage, slow attack speed) with a heavy charge and acts like it. It should probably have the movespeed decrease on the charge.

Overall
All guns basically got any movespeed decreases removed. I believe it belongs on the heavy guns (all alchemer shots, blitz charge, magnus charge).
This would greatly change the dynamics and make these lines too overpowered. Alchemers specifically could easily hold their ground before these changes (minus not having a pierce variety).

I have a lot to say on the matter, but I'll make this brief as I am still testing a bit more.

Make normal Neutralizer shots break blocks, please.

Honestly, after playing some more, I don't think my earlier post did this any justice. I've just been comparing the guns against the guns, and not against the other weapons. AND I paid no attention to how much damage they were doing, exactly. Consider this a 'second opinion'.

Here's what I've seen from a comparison between Acheron and Callahan, with no damage bonuses or heat levels, against the T3 training bags. Note that Acheron is one of the most powerful swords, if not THE most, in the live server.

The numbers for Acheron are the first hit, last hit, charge hit, each charge's explosion, and an estimated total charge damage for single targets and multiple targets. (melee + 3 explosions vs. melee + 7 explosions)

Acheron
Resisted: 98/132/228/64, 420/740
Neutral: 149/205/376/94, 658/1128
Weak: 209/272/437/128, 821/1461

The numbers for Callahan: normal shot/charge shot/estimated charge damage for single target and multi-target. (3 hits, 7 hits)

Callahan
Resisted: 27/49, 147/343
Neutral: 89/245, 735/1715
Weak: 155/306, 918/2142

Comparing these, Acheron has higher single-target damage, but Callahan has far and away the better charge damage (excluding against resistant enemies, because of the split-type damage on Acheron).

Acheron requires you to be closer to your target(s), but a Callahan can deal damage from farther away. Acheron's charge attack is easier to land, but you have to be closer; with a Callahan, you need to lead your targets, but you're extremely safe. This is not good. You should not deal massive damage while also being safe, you should deal massive damage because you're not safe, and deal "okay" damage when you're safe. Rocket Hammers are a good example of this; they're not as easy to handle as other swords, but when you get the hang of them, they're better, but not absurdly.

I suggest that the Magnus lines allow you to move while firing normally [alternatively, just increase the power of the normal shots just a bit], with a lower movespeed when charging (slightly better than the live server, worse than now). This way, the basic shots would be a little more useful, and the charge attack stays as powerful as ever- but now you've got a reasonable amount of risk involved.

______

The Autoguns now have their damage matched up closer to the Blitz Needle... and they've been made much safer. This isn't okay either. Just look at the damage the thing puts out! It needed a light nerf before, not a buff that takes out a big part of its weakness.

The thing that was holding Autoguns back before is that they made you move slowly while charging, and pinned you in place for a very long time while firing. Now, they only have the second part of that. I'll admit that it does feel a lot more fluid to charge without being slowed down, but if this is here to stay, autoguns should have their charge damage decreased.

______

Antiguas need a little more help. They've been left in the dust.

Compared to the new blasters, they deal about the same amount of damage in the same amount of time. The difference for Blasters is that they need to land only a few shots, not several- and they deal a bit of knockback! Also consider that each Antigua shot deals the same amount as a single bullet from an autogun (firing normally).

I'd like to see something special for Antiguas that matches their six-shot style- bonus damage on every third shot on the same target. Swapping targets or missing a shot breaks your chain. You'd be rewarded for aiming well; managing each of those 6 shots all at once would lead to some sizable damage. I still like that 'hitscan charge attack' idea.

______

Pulsars are a little too easy to use; I stand by my previous post and want to see them changed up a bit.

When I read "the shots get more powerful as they travel", I assume it'd be something like 1/3 of before is "wiffle-ball", 2/3 is "normal", and the very end of the shot is "cannonball". For pulsars as they are now, they're just split into halves..

I say they should only expand until a little later, dealing no damage at extremely close range, dealing more damage than before to make up for it.

______

Nothing new to say about the other guns.

for the most part the changes are pretty minor but very needed, cant see much i disagree with, though the "Dozens of new guns" line was kinda BS, the "new" guns are just standard variant to pre-existing guns...

but hey playing a gunner wont be a waste of time now. so kudos.

also, having to swap back and forth between the new gun and the old gun to figure out what you've changed is a pain in the neck, next time you open the test servers for an update please post a change log so we dont have to waste time figuring out what to test.

The movement speed buff across the board seems undeserving for the Pulsars and Autoguns. No risks are taken through spamming these powerful weapons. This is the main complaint I have with these guns. It's too safe to use in regards to explosive damage or masterful crowd control. The autogun's draw speed is also over the top.
- Pulsar Damage nerf is suitable along with the increased bullet speed.
-Please keep all the changes made to the Magnus Gun Tree.
-Catalyzer Line changes are amazing, however the explosion radius should probably be smaller.
-Antiqua line seems solid. Low risk gun with low damage. As it has been.
-Blaster line is just a damage type variant, can't go wrong really.

There is a LOT of new armor. It's actually quite confusing looking at them all. Some of them look very similar as well. Most of them provide the same stats as each other with only one thing setting them apart.

An example. Sacred Falcon Keeper Armor versus Sacred Falcon Sentinel Armor. The Sentinel Armor gives damage bonus low, while the Keeper armor gives construct bonus medium. There is absolutely no reason to pick the Keeper variant. I hope that these armor sets that are so close to each other are actually on the same branch, because if they're separate armor lines it seems extremely superfluous to have them all.

Increased movespeed while charging: not much I've got to say about that, I really don't see the need for that outside of the Catalyzer line

Autogun and upgrades:
Plague Needle & Pepperbox damage buff: thank you, they feel more like sidegrades now instead of a status dealing downgrade. While Pepperbox served well against monsters with piercing resistance, it fell short in all other areas. Plague Needle is a colliseum recipe line, yet was inferior to bliz in all circumstances. Grim Repeater is a nice addition to the Autogun line.

Pulsar and upgrades:
In my opinion, these look quite good. One minor complaint though: Permafrost & Wildfire are both pulsars. While Permafrost is a shadow damage pulsar, Wildfire is once again an elemental pulsar. I feel this one will fall short vs Polaris. With shock itself dealing elemental damage, and briefly stunning the target, Wildfire will not prove as good as the Polaris. A suggestion would be move Wildfire to the Catalyzer line, as to give it an elemental upgrade.

Catalyzer and upgrades:
Changing around the mechanics really gave this gun a much needed buff. One downside though, interacting with blocks, switches and the bunch is a royal pain, you're dependant on it's charged shots for that. If normal shots would be given this ability, it will make a great gun line.
The mechanics could use some more work though, in it's current state, it provides insane amounts of burst damage if multiple people use this gun.

Blaster line:
Hard to go wrong here, this will add much more future for the standard Spiral Order line of gear. Any chance to see this expanded to swords, bombs and armor?

Callahan and variants:
No longer being blown to the ground on a charge attack is a great change, though I haven't really used the line in the past.

Alchemer:
Didn't notice any big changes

@Becketta

Well, fire causes damage, catalyzer charges are now set off by any damage. including thaw damage from freeze.

Well, I'll leave the fact I was heavily dissapointed by the lack of real new weapons, all are just using existent gun mechanics, and basically the rest is just some tweaks here and there. For such a longely awaited update, this is not sufficient.

I think you should not allow gunners to charge up at running speed, this is just madness. It's already enough most guns got a buff... Gunning should bring safety but at the cost of damage dealing, charging guns makes up for high damage, fine, but it should come at the cost of safety. Which was the case before, THIS SHOULD NOT CHANGE unless you just want to break the whole balance of classes.

This update is looking good, I can literally see myself using other guns other than Blitz and Alchemers seriously if these changes go forth. Thanks for actually implementing suggestions from the suggestion forum into the new guns, like piercing Magnus and inverted Catalyzer.

So all of my feedback is based on me playing solo vs. common enemies. Please keep his in mind!

______

MSD Reduced:

I have to say, the MSD reduction is a welcome change for me. I never felt movement was a problem, but I always was using MSI High in the clockworks to alleviate my slowness. It makes a gunner feel like how a gunner is suppose to feel in a video game; mobile! It almost seems too good though, I never have to stop shooting anymore; I can walk by Mecha Knights and won't have to worry about them hitting me, and that's without my MSI High.

______

Antigua (Argent Peacemaker, Sentenza, Gilded Griffin, & Obsidian Carbine):
Changes: Shooting speed increased; Obsidian Carbine damage nerfed, as well as Strong Poison has been reduced to Moderate Poison.

The changes are disappointing. While the shooting speed increase is nice, it didn't solve the problem Antigua has; it still has mediocre damage and DPS vs. their brother guns, I still wouldn't find them comparable to Alchemers to deal with single enemies whatsoever. The charge attack is as bad as usual; it's too risky to use for how long it roots you in place. Obsidian Carbine's nerf was inevitable and necessary; I'll miss you Strong Poison.

Suggestions:

-Buff damage on normal attacks.
-Make the charge attack only shoot the bird.

______

Alchemer (Nova Driver, Umbra Driver, Storm Driver, Magma Driver, & Hail Driver):
Changes: None.

Nothing has been changed (as far as I can tell) and I'm happy to know that. These guns are perfect as they are already and there's no reason to change anything.

Suggestions: None.

______

Autogun (Blitz Needle, Grim Repeater, Plague Needle, & Volcanic Pepperbox):
Changes: Shooting speed increased; Plague Needle and Volcanic Pepperbox damage buffed.

I really like the shooting speed increase, now the normal attacks are actually usable. BUT, I also feel that it was increased a bit too much; the guns are suppose to feel heavy, but now they're so fluid it's somewhat awkward that they fire so fast. I don't want it reduced back to normal like a lot of people are asking because the normal attacks SUCK on the regular server. Don't revert it altogether, just tone it down slightly. The MSD reduction on this line is completely misplaced, for how much power you're wielding in the charge, you shouldn't be able to move so fast. I have a bit of a problem with how Grim can knockback enemies along with having the damage of a Blitz; Volcanic should keep it's unique knockback to itself. Plague Needle and Volcanic Pepperbox are actually decent weapons now thanks to the damage buff, they stand properly next to Blitz and Grim now in damage. However, the biggest problem of the line is still present; the Blitz and Grim guns still output a ridiculous amount of damage in their charge attack. With addition to Grim, Royal Jelly will be an even bigger joke than it is with DR, not to mention the whole level before the fight. An even bigger problem then that is that with Grim, it covers Blitz weakness vs. Constructs and Jellies, it'll truly be a mess of overpowered Knights running around with two Autoguns. The damage on the charges NEED to be reduced.

Suggestions:

-Slightly reduce shooting speed increase buff.
-Remove the MSD buff.
-Nerf damage on Blitz Needle and Grim Repeater charge attacks.
-Remove knockback on Grim Repeater's charge attacks.

______

Pulsar (Polaris, Wild Fire, Permafroster, & Supernova)
Changes: Shooting speed increase; Polaris damage nerfed and is now in line to Wild Fire and Permafroster.

Okay, the bullet speed increase was unnecessary. It's now even more spammable than before and that's really a bad thing when conjoined with the MSD reduction, it's literally brain dead easy to stay safe with this line; I used Permafroster in a Deconstruction Zone and the Gremlins couldn't break through my wall of endless spam. This needs to be reverted. The damage nerf on all the status dealers are welcome though. Supernova is still pretty mediocre; it needs something to make it more appealing like Stun or a damage increase. The charge attacks are still terrible, it needs to be changed altogether to something new.

Suggestions:

-Remove the shooting speed buff.
-Give Supernova stun or buff damage.
-Change charge attack.

______

Magnus (Callahan, Winter Grave, & Iron Slug)
Changes: New charge attack; charge attack buffed. Iron Slug can now stun.

WOW, these new Magnus guns make me giddy with excitement. Using the charge attack no longer flings you back into a helpless position (it was cute, but c'mon, it was definitely annoying) The charge attack is truly AMAZING. It's so AMAZING, it went from UNDERPOWERED GARBAGE TO OVERPOWERED GODLINESS. It's really that good! It pierces through enemies multiple times and inflicts a crippling moderate stun or freeze to boot, critically damaging them, or even more often, killing them. And that's where I feel one of the problems lie; it's way too good, even Iron Slug shreds Gremlins with the charge attack, I don't even need Winter Grave to destroy Gremlins! I really think that the damage on the charge attack should be reduced, it does too much at the moment with little risk involved. The normal attacks...they're still really bad; just give it a damage increase.

Suggestions:

-Reduce charge attack buff by some amount.
-Buff normal attack damage.

______

Blaster (Valiance 1, Valiance 2, Arcana, Riftlocker, & Phantasmos)
Changes: Two Valiances; one is the classic version, the other version shoots smaller bullets with less knockback, but a longer range charge attack. The specialized types follow the classic version.

All new damage type variants are welcome, but thanks to them Valiance is looking to be in a position much like Supernova, being overshadowed by their brothers. I think Valiance needs to be given a damage buff to be more appealing. Of the two Valiances, the classic version is of course better, the other one is severely underpowered, even with the long range charge attack that's still garbage since it does so little damage. The Blaster guns are good and reliable as before, but Valiance could use a damage buff and all the guns could gain Valiance 2's charge attack, though it needs a damage buff as well.

Suggestions:

-Keep Blaster the same, but give it the longer range charge attack.
-Buff the charge attack damage.
-Buff the damage of Valiance.

______

Catalyzer (Biohazard & Neutralizer):
Changes: Shooting speed increased. Normal attacks and charge attacks mechanics inverted. Catalyzer charges (the normal attacks) damage nerfed. Anyone's weapon (minus Catalyzer normal attacks) can detonate the charges now.

Honestly...I really don't like the new Catalyzer. I mean, it works even better in groups (despite how chaotic it is for party members), but now it's just underwhelming at what it does outside of that. The normal attacks are now charges you can place on enemies. You can place charges really fast now, making it incredibly good at spreading poison with Biohazard, but the damage was so heavily nerfed on explosions that using Catalyzer on enemies that aren't in groups make it feel stupidly weak. Also now with how easy it is for charges to be set and detonated, I'd really like to be able to disable the screen shaking whenever they go off, it's really hard to get back into focus when it happens so many times. That being said, I do feel that it's more balanced towards the game than it was before, so as much as I'll miss the original Catalyzer, I'll accept this. Just...make sure that the detonations will actually work in Lockdown, please. :(

Suggestions:

-Keep Catalyzer unchanged.
-OR if not that, buff the normal attack damage AND reduce the shooting speed increase buff.
-Add some way to disable the screen shake on detonations or remove screen shake.

______

Overall, I think that this update is looking good, really good, I'm happy! But honestly, it feels a bit underwhelming how you devs put it, making it sound like the guns were going to get a complete mechanic overhaul, but it's more of a big tweak. But that's not a bad thing, a lot of the weapons are actually good now that are comparable to Alchemers, like Magnus and Blaster lines, but there's still a lot of problems that are present though.

Pulsar is really doesn't need a faster attack speed, Blitz and Grim are too absurdly powerful with their charge attacks and while the normal attacks feel better to use, the current speed is a bit too much, and Antigua is still really weak when compared to all the other weapons that got buffed, it needs better damage period. Catalyzer...I'm mixed about it, it's balanced, maybe, but I dunno, it just feels weak. I really want something to be done about that. The blanket MSD reduction was actually very nice, but it might be too much of a reduction. Firing guns feels very fluid as a lot of them got firing speed increases, but again some are misplaced like on Pulsar or are just unnecessary like on Antigua.

I hope to see that these weapons get the changes they deserve so they'll be seen more often around the game when the update goes live. Thanks again OOO for taking suggestions on the guns, especially in Magnus' case, the gun is really beautiful now (just do something about the normal attacks) and I can't wait to start using the coolest gun around!

Everybody has mostly said what I wanted to say about the Magnus lines.

My proposed nerf for it would be to bring back the knockdown after the charge attack. It really suits how powerful the charge is now.

Now since the Supply Depot has added many new items inside, I think it would be better to categorize the equipment more clearly, when I just went into SKPreview, I had spent around 20~30 minutes just trying to recognize the equipment I saw in the Supply depot

Something like:
1.
(Normal) (Elemental) (Pierce) (Shadow) (Fire Resist).......
Helmet
(Armor)
Sword
Gun
Bomb

2.
(Normal) (Elemental) (Pierce) (Shadow)....
Helmet
Armor
Sword
(Gun)
Bomb

It doesnt mind if there is repeatation of the equipment in a few tab (For combuster who deal Normal and Elemental, we can find Combuster in both Normal and Elemental Tab)

Something like that, It would be easier to browse what the players are trying to buy.

>Movement speed increased

Movement speed when shooting seems to be very reasonable, it's pretty good change. Movement speed when charging is suprising change. In my opinion giving 100% speed when charging is strange and does not make much sense, even animation will show that - when charging knights walks, but it walks with running speed. Lol.
Anyway, increasing movement speed when charging is very fair for weapons like Callahan, because it had around 10%. Now it's very good weapon.

>Magus Line

Change of charge made that weapon finally worth thinking about it. It's small nuke versus groups of enemies like wolvers, plus movement speed 100% while charging. Charge is OK, but damage of normal shots still should get some buff, because Callahan still will not win with Blitz Needle.

>Catalyzer Line

Suprising change that made that weapon very powerful, usefull and not overpowered. Great idea that every damage source can make orbs detonate, so it makes it great teamplay weapon. Still, charge damage should be increased since its only one pure damage source of that weapon and now its nothing.
Normal shots can not destroy blocks etc, and I hope this will be fixed.

>Autoguns

Starting from Blitz Needle - that weapon should never got buffed. Faster attacks made that weapon even more powerful and more safe to use. Well, this is bad.
Altrough pepperbox is now great weapon, which I will craft for sure. Damage buff is OK, attack speed is awesome, charge is powerful. +

>Blasters

Not much to say, additional damage types were needed, so everything is now ok.

>Alchemers, Pulsars

Didn't got any change and it's totally good choice.

Magnus line

the charge is something... really~ you shot nuke bomb while having fast movement, people just going to get this weapon for it charge.. you should buff normal shot damage to make it more useful.

Pulsar line

this gun going to shake my screen in lockdown --a
better keep old fire speed or reduce chance to inflict status effect.

Catalyzer

i hope this gun going to shine later... but at least give it more normal shot damage to compete against other gun.

Quick disclaimer before I begin; I have not tested the guns beyond level 1 due to the absurd length of time it would take to max them out. I would rather keep what little sanity I have left. I am thus also largely unfamiliar with the scope of damage they output and will go by what other players have observed in this regard.

That being said, on with it.

General
It seems that you move at a faster pace whilst firing than previously. I feel this increase in mobility is perhaps unnecessary and should be considered to be reverted considering gunslingers generally fire from a distance instead of being up-front like swordsmen and demolitionists. I feel the same can be applied to charging a gun, and I will give special remarks on certain guns below.

Blaster-line
Handles just the way I expected. It doesn't do anything new with the gun although I don't believe that is necessary. It is delightful to inflict high damage against enemies weak to a particular element.
Minor oversight: the special variations of the Valiance appear to use the same blast colour as the standard Valiance. This is not present with the lower tier guns.

Alchemer-line
Again, handles just the way I expect it to. Not much else to say, really.

Antigua-line
I feel like a broken record when I say they handle just as expected. I would however like to suggest that the charge attack to be changed to either one powerful shot or two standard followed by a powerful shot. The time spent firing in a standstill position is not worth the risk considering the line of fire is incredibly small and easily evaded and the bullets preceding the final shot only inflict regular damage.

I also wonder why the Raptor has an underside ornament while the Blackhawk and Silversix do not.

Magnus-line
This is the one I'm the most excited about. Though the damage doesn't appear any different (refer to the disclaimer) though the charged shots now pierce through enemies and knock them back, allowing multiple hits with a single bullet. This is extremely powerful and more than makes up for the otherwise lackluster and risky standard fire (though they still serve as decent turret interrupters). I also noticed that the Iron Slug finally inflicts Stun with both its standard fire and charged shots, though the tooltip is not present. A much welcome buff, indeed.

The Winter Grave is a delicious gun, and the chance of inflicting freeze makes it all the more intriguing. I can see this gun becoming particularly popular in PvP. I also find it interesting how it receives a 4* version instead of branching out at 5*, but I'm not complaining.

Should the mobility during charging be reverted I suggest this line be brought in line with your standard gun as the previous charge mobility was incredibly slow and dangerous.

Catalyzer-line
These guns are absolutely hilarious to use. An excellent crowd-clearing gun with the everpresent nasty screenshocking. The reverse fire is a welcome change and I can see this gun becoming incredibly popular as a result. If I have any criticism about it it would be that detonating the explosive bullets is too easy as it can in fact be triggered by inflicting any damage whatsoever, even status damage like fire. Since the charge-up is still incredibly fast I would suggest that you make it so that explosive charges can only be detonated with a Catalyzer charge as opposed to any damage source.

Pulsar-line
I have heard the damage was reduced which I find appropriate, though the increased bullet speed has me on edge. Pulsars didn't achieve their fame solely through their damage, but because of how poweful the knockback of the explosions were and how infuriatingly devastating being shock-locked in a Polaris barrage was. I feel the speed-buff was unnecessary and should be reverted, or that the clip-size be reduced to two instead of three should the speed be preserved.

An elemental Supernova with a chance of inflicting fire, Wildfire is pretty standard all things considered. The Permafroster on the other hand seems to cancel itself out more often than not due to my instinct of barraging with a Pulsar, which makes it seem like a conflicting status to give it. Reducing the clip-size could potentially help remedy this though I feel gunslingers who wield this gun would be more reserved about barraging with this gun in general should they wish to exploit its status. Otherwise it is practically just a Shadow Pulsar.

Autogun-line
Mixed feelings here. On one end, the increased fire rate and flourish of the standard fire is a much welcome change, though on the other hand the increased mobility whilst charging is completely unnecessary given that they are still absurdly powerful at higher tiers. I would suggest they are reverted to the original mobility whilst charging. The increased damage of the Pepperbox-line is much appreciated, however.

I've observed that the Grim Repeater behaves like the Pepperbox, which is an interesting prospect. It appears to share the same output as the Blitz Needle.

Low-tier Guns
It is refreshing to see that the low-tier status guns inflict status with standard fire as opposed to charge shot-only. The addition of the Proto Duelist is also interesting and allows newer players to have a sneak-peak at the Antigua line. I fail to see what's different about the Punch Gun and the Pummel Gun outside of the increase mobility whilst charging, and I also find it curious how their charge-shots do not pierce enemies like the Magnus-line. Is this intentional?
A definite oversight is that the Spitfire is the only status gun that does not inflict status through standard fire. Please fix this.

Antigua
I’m so happy about the changes to the Antigua line. The speed tweaks were nice, but the addition of the Griffin is the real cherry on top. I’ve been using Antiguas as my main gun for as long as I’ve had access to them, and the one thing that’s always bugged me was the lack of a piercing Antigua, since it forced me to go melee when facing fiends and beasts (or break out the blitz, but I don’t really like using most autoguns because they clash with my normal playstyle). The bonus damage vs fiends on the griffon is perfect, since that’s the family that most gunners have the roughest time with. However, I do have some issues with the guns. First off, it can be a little hard to tell the Peacemaker and the Griffon apart at first glance, which could get you in trouble down in the clockworks, since if you draw the wrong gun by mistake, there’s a 50/50 chance you’ll end up trying to use it against a monster that’s resistant to that damage type. The other issue is with the charge attack. I’ve never really liked the Antigua charge, since you could’ve inflicted the same or greater amount of damage in the time it takes you to charge up and fire with the normal attack (the uselessness of this charge attack sticks out a lot compared to other guns, especially since this update is making those charges much more effective). Having the charge consist of just firing the bird/tentacles with a damage buff (say, two or three times what it does at the moment) would do a lot to help rectify that issue.

Autoguns
I’ve never really got any use out of the various autoguns aside from the pepperbox (which I’m glad to see is getting buffed), and I’m very much on the fence about the way the gunner update is changing them. I love the model for the grim repeater, and I’ll definitely be getting one for deconstruction zones, slime compounds, and compound 42. However, the changes to how you move and fight while wielding one don’t really sit right with me. Autoguns are very powerful, you shouldn’t be able to use them with impunity like this update allows you to (if anything, the rampant blitz abuse has shown that some more penalties might be warranted).

Pulsar:
I’ve never really liked the Pulsar line, they’ve always come across as very spammy weapons, and not in a way that actually helps the party (not to mention what people do with them in PvP). The changes here don’t seem to be making it any more broken, but they’re not fixing it either, which is a problem.

Blasters: If I wasn’t so in love with Antiguas, I’d definitely be using blasters as my default ranged weapon, now that they have specialized damage (though I have the feeling that these changes will make the Valiance even more obsolete). They’re a good general purpose weapon, but I think that very fact will cause them to be abandoned in favor of more specialized weapons, unless the blasters have spectacularly good UVs.

A lot of people have said that the antiguas aren't so great because alchemers are more damaging etc.

The big thing that antiguas have going for them is their clip size and fast bullets. This is advantageous in that it enables you to dominate the area around you in terms of breaking blocks, controlling aggro, and crushing weak enemies. What it cannot and should not do is straight up damage-- this is a role better filled by 2 shot guns, like the alchemers.

Lets take 2 situations:

The middle arena in Spiral Court II - http://media.spiralknights.com/wiki-images/d/de/Map_Scarlet_Fortress_Spi...
(You're at a distance, and kats spawn to shoot at you)

and

The explosion block + slimes arena in Cravat Hall III - http://media.spiralknights.com/wiki-images/9/9e/Map_Scarlet_Fortress_Cra...
(There are 4 sets of explosion blocks on respawners in the corners; slimes spawn)

The first of these (Spiral Court) benefits from something like nova driver more. This is because multiple enemies = easier to clip them 9000 times with an alchemer, and kats have a tendency to clump toghether. I can stay in the middle to distract them + kill them all while my swordy friends sneak around the edges to help me out, and there are few switches/blocks for me to shoot at in the first place.

The second of these (Cravat Hall) has explosion blocks. If I shoot my nova driver, I'm likely to blow up exploding blocks all over my team members, as well as myself. If I use my argent peacemaker, I can control exactly which set of blocks I blow up, and if I play my cards right, can outdamage landing alchemer shots with less effort and less practice. This is especially important when I'm not a gunner, and just want a gun that can break stuff + control the environment around me.

Its a subtle difference that cannot be quantified easily, but an important one when considering how the items play out. I think that while Gilded Griffin is relatively average at fighting beasts and fiends in today's metagame compared to many other options, that there is easily a bounty of plausible scenarios and new enemies that could change that. I really think that you guys saying that the new gilded griffin/antiguas in general are bad should take another look. And yeah, the charge is hard to use and kind of bad. But it can be used for crowd control with practice, though rarely.