Spiral Knights - ASI VH WEAPONS ARE A LIE!!! VIDEO PROOF HERE!!!!

ASI VH WEAPONS ARE A LIE!!! VIDEO PROOF HERE!!!!

41 replies [Last post]

Mon, 11/24/2014 - 12:32

Dumb-Blonde

K guys so I spent like 20kce on this ASI VH valiance only to realize that ITS NOT ASI VH!!!!! WHAAAAATTTT. YOU HERD ME!!! ITS NOT ASI VH.

I made a video and posted it on youtube comparing asi vh valiance with no asi blaster, take a look at the result

Link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e4BhU2396eU

This really bothers me for some reason, because I wasted so much money on something that OOO ripped me off on. +1 if you want something done about this.

BUT HERE IS SOMETHING THATS EVEN MORE IMPORTANT. I have a lot of asi vh weapons, around 10, and when i was testing some stuff in training hall, someone did a gun charge (with no ASI) that seemed about 3x faster then my asi vh charge...I asked them why there charge was so fast, and they told me that weapons appear much slower than they actually are to YOU than other people. Well if that is true, then whats the FREAKING point of these freaking asi vh weaps, there not even freaking fast to the owner. I literally dont give a SINGLE CRAP if other people see my weaps fast, it just makes me jelous if they see it faster. I bought these weaps because I like fast, and is this really what OOO is going to give me? I mean seriously? your gonna make weapons with a cool looking UV but so dang effect.

There is only 1 think I can say..

GG OOO

Mon, 11/24/2014 - 12:41

Tortodrone-Mega

The speed increase is between

The speed increase is between the shots and helps with bringing the gun back up after a reload. You see others fire faster because that is how it looks for everyone. That is caused by the latency from connecting to one another. Try equipping ancient plate armor for asd then try again with your asi weapon you can see a difference in how fast you can shoot between shots and how fast your gun returns to normal after a reload.

Mon, 11/24/2014 - 12:45

Dumb-Blonde

in between shots..? just no

Bro, no offence but even if that is true it just makes my point better. I payed for this asi vh val because I wanted my shots to go FAST, hence the name ATTACK. SPEED. INCREASE.

Idc about between shots, because thats not what its supposed to do.

Mon, 11/24/2014 - 12:49

Tortodrone-Mega

thats exactly what is does

thats exactly what is does though if you expect the bullets to fly faster then you need to choose a faster bullet speed gun like an iron slug.

Mon, 11/24/2014 - 12:51

Thunder-The-Bright

algorithms are the solutions to any problem.

*slow clap*
ok, let's wrap this up.
1 you had SSB equipped. you didn't compare VH to no asi, you compared max to high.
2 pretty sure ASI affects how fast is your fire rate, not your animations for a single shot.
3 other players have their animation sped up. to another player, your animations are sped up. this is a connection thing, so that you see the shots that others fire with less delay. if you want to see yourself show off your supersonic speed, well, weapons are meant to be used, not being shown off.
also I think you are a troll.
*slow clap*

EDIT: attack speed is not bullet speed. attack speed is attack rate. besides, bullets in this game have a very high velocity, and you don't really need them to be istantaneous.

Mon, 11/24/2014 - 12:51

Tortodrone-Mega

May as well be a troll

May as well be a troll considering this should be common knowledge for anyone who has gotten to 5 star gear

Mon, 11/24/2014 - 13:00

Korakc

Tortodrone-Mega is, from what I've seen, correct. ASI doesn't increase how fast you start shooting the gun, it makes you shoot more bullets in a smaller amount of time. I have no idea how "Attack Speed Increase" is the same as "Faster Shots", so please explain that to me. Bopp is someone I know that is very knowledgeable on this subject, feel free to ask him.

ALSO:
*Okay, *it's, *Heard, *It's, *what's, *don't, *jealous, *You're, *weapons

-1

Mon, 11/24/2014 - 13:20

Vohtarak-Forum

I'm vohtarak, call me by that name

what asi is: ATTACK SPEED INCREASE
what asi is not: SHOT SPEED INCREASE

this is common knowledge and perfectly clear from reading it

if it really was shot speed increase it wouldnt be an option for swords and bombs

Mon, 11/24/2014 - 13:23

Cross-Over

-1

Straight to the point -
Reading this makes my eyes bleed.

Mon, 11/24/2014 - 13:26

Dumb-Blonde

wuddup

deng bruh i aint no dang troll idk dis crap. but you ideots r saying the "ATTACK" in "ASI" is how fast the weapon reloads. OH THATS THE MOST LEGIT THING I EVER HERD. OOO STIL NEEDS 2 FIX DIS

Mon, 11/24/2014 - 13:41

#10

Cross-Over

I am no Bopp

But let me simplify weapon-changing variants for you.

Swords:
Charge Time Reduction: Of course, you should know this. It's in the name.
Damage Bonus: Same as above.
Attack Speed Increase: Increase speed in which a sword is swung.

Bombs:
Charge Time Reduction: See above in "Sword Time Reduction".
Attack Speed Increased (Swiftstrike only): Increase speed in which you place the bomb. [All other sources are welcome for correction]

Guns:
Charge Time Reduction: See above in "Sword Time Reduction".
Damage Bonus: Same as above.
Attack Speed Increase: Increase speed in which you fire a round. Projectile speed is NOT affected.
Look into the bottom of Thunder's post for a more clear explanation; "Attack speed is not bullet speed. Attack speed is attack rate."

Re-read post. ASI changing the speed of the bullet? Eh... No, -1 still. Like said above, the bullets are already shot at a high velocity (Disregarding Catalyzer lines). I'd say increasing bullet speed will be more problematic to the game than beneficial.

Mon, 11/24/2014 - 13:59

#11

Vohtarak-Forum

I'm vohtarak, call me by that name

@OP
we all corrected your ignorance and you STILL didn't figure it out
this reminds me of that SK is bankrupt thread
may it rest in pieces

Mon, 11/24/2014 - 14:11

#12

Krakob

BUT HERE IS SOMETHING THATS EVEN MORE IMPORTANT. I have a lot of asi vh weapons, around 10, and when i was testing some stuff in training hall, someone did a gun charge (with no ASI) that seemed about 3x faster then my asi vh charge...I asked them why there charge was so fast, and they told me that weapons appear much slower than they actually are to YOU than other people.
This is latency compensation. To make your client seem more in sync with the server, your client will try to create your bullet effects when you trigger the attack, but then make sure that they disappear at the same time as they disappear on the server. If you have greater latency, the bullets will linger for longer. If you don't have much latency, your bullets will be closer to what you see from others and what's accurate in terms of speed on the server.

TL;DR or in simpler words, your bullets aren't actually as slow as they appear. Don't worry about it.

I'd tell you about how ASI functions but it appears others have already explained. Next time you buy a UV, make sure you know what it does first. Either way, your investments have hardly been in vain. ASI VH UVs are still very powerful and will provide a lot of utility for you whether it's in a way you like or not.

Mon, 11/24/2014 - 14:23

#13

Autofire

You are experiencing a PICNIC ERROR!

@OP

Sorry for everyone's anger. Anyway, ASI could be considered to be "Animation Speed Increase." In the game files, all it does is decrease the time for animations to finish.

This makes perfect sense on sword weapons, because their animation and attacks are the same thing.

For guns, this doesn't make so much sense, but think of it this way: It's like you can be quicker on the draw. There's a little delay between when you click and when the bullet comes out. (Not counting lag.) ASI decreases this. The other noticeable thing is that the wait until after you click decreases by a good deal. This is great if you kite, and probably even better if you switch-shoot. Reloading is also an animation, so it gets decreased, too.

Think of it as a fire-rate increase. You'll see that this should be useful, and even more useful than bullet speed increase, because, unlike fire-rate increase, ASI boosts your DPS. Try shooting multiple shots with your new gun and then with the old gun. I think you'll see the difference.

Fun Fact: Bombs get effected by ASI, too, despite not being able to get ASI UVs.

@Repliers

The OP payed hard earned energy on his new gun, expecting one thing and got another. While I do agree that OP should have looked into it more, you really could cut him/her a bit more slack. Being jerks makes him/her less likely to actually accept what you're saying.

Mon, 11/24/2014 - 14:26

#14

Reto-Da-Liz

This guy buys ASI VH stuff and doesn't even know what ASI does.
Some people in this game leave me speechless.

Mon, 11/24/2014 - 14:48

#15

Abelisk

2* Blaster shoots slow projectiles while a 5* Valiance shoots faster projectiles. Look at Alchemers, 2* slow 5* fast.

If you don't get what we're saying, you're probably underaged, which you shouldn't be here on SK...

Mon, 11/24/2014 - 14:59

#16

Bopp

wiki, data

Read the wiki page "Abilities" to learn what ASI does, and how big the effect is. For example, the guild Lancer Knightz has extensive data quantifying the effect of ASI on combos/clips per minute:
* http://wiki.spiralknights.com/Lancer_Knightz_(Guild)/Sword_Combos_Per_Minute
* http://wiki.spiralknights.com/Lancer_Knightz_(Guild)/Handgun_Clips_Per_Minute

Yes, it is unfortunate that network communication affects how you and other perceive your fighting. But frankly it's astonishing that we can play a real-time game with people on the other side of Earth at all.

Mon, 11/24/2014 - 15:01

#17

Dumb-Blonde

Hmm Krakob

Krakob..

This is what you said: TL;DR or in simpler words, your bullets aren't actually as slow as they appear. Don't worry about it.

See Krakob, this is exactly my problem. I don't care for my weaps to be faster then i see. I bought asi vh to have my guns quicker than ordinary ones, and if they are indeed faster but I dont see it then whats the freaking point. This is exactly what my problem is.

Mon, 11/24/2014 - 15:08

#18

Turn-Me-On

@OP Complaining without

@OP

Complaining without proper testing?

Alright genius, heres how to not make yourself look like an idiot on the forums:

1) Take off the swiftstrike
2) Shoot comboes in a 30 sec interval
3) Count number of reloads/shots fired for each gun

You'll see that the asi VH does speed it up.

Now go back to LD

Mon, 11/24/2014 - 15:14

#19

Sir-Henry-Cooldown

/epicfail Fat-Nerd

Attack Speed Increase: Increases the speed at WHICH you ATTACK.
Attack (verb): to act violently against (someone or something) : to try to hurt, injure, or destroy (something or someone)
To attack means the movement in which you are acting, with the intention to hurt.
Who even cares about bullet speed, anyway? Most bullets (exceptions being the Pulsar and Catalyzer lines) move somewhere within the same speeds, with the Antigua lines being almost instantaneous. A person with only mild skill (or AT, because who cares) still can hit a person. The ASI we're talking about, the RATE of fire, always are better for DPS.

Now think about a Polaris with BSI (Bullet Speed Increase) Maximum. That would destroy little children's dreams.

Please Graveyard this, I feel like you will only get more offense at this rate...

Mon, 11/24/2014 - 15:28

#20

Korakc

Judging from the only other video on his channel; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B8j1BZaxvkk
He's just trolling.

Mon, 11/24/2014 - 16:22

#21

Miaa-Mya

his name is fat-nerd
you're all playing video games and trying to educate him on in game mechanics
i think his name is a reference to you guys.

Mon, 11/24/2014 - 16:23

#22

Holy-Nightmare

The thread is a lie!

THE CAKE IS A LIE!

Mon, 11/24/2014 - 17:16

#23

Redmania

Attack speed increase = more

Attack speed increase = more shots per second = more dps per second

Troll OP?

Mon, 11/24/2014 - 18:00

#24

Fangel

Well then.

Makes comment about how Three Rings ripped them of despite not researching how the code in the game works.
Yeah um...

In all seriousness, do your research on what something does before you try to convince a forum of people who knows what it does that it doesn't do what it does correctly.

Mon, 11/24/2014 - 18:50

#25

Fehzor

The lancer knights data suggests that every attack speed up would be about 3.7%. I have a hunch that it's probably 4% just like damage is, but it could just as easily not be, so I'll take the safe route and use 3.7%.

Your speed started at: 1.11 times faster than base speed at zero = 11% faster than base speed
And became: 1.22 times faster than base speed at zero = 22% faster than base speed

The actual difference between these is about 1.099 (as in, if you were to count the initial 11% as the new base, like you did in the video) which is about a 10% increase in attacking speed. This isn't very much, and I really wouldn't even expect anyone to flat out notice it... consider however, that the total buff of 22% is actually a pretty big increase. If you shot 100 bullets before, you're not shooting 122 bullets. This also effects the time it takes you to get your shield up while shooting- if it took you 1 second before, it now takes you about .82 seconds. Lastly, attack speed increase is NOT a straightforward damage increase. That means that you can further boost your DPS by 22%, but more than that as a compounded bonus- if you get 24% extra damage, attack speed increase will boost that to around 51% more DPS. All of that combined together is a pretty sweet and worthwhile get if you ask me.

As for just the very high, that would be a 14.8% increase. You can say that it's not enough, or that it's not fair, but it's still an advantage that you have out of nowhere. Not your armor, not your shield, not a sprite perk... just out of nowhere. Every time you use that weapon, that 14.8% increase will be there at no cost to yourself. What about this don't you like?

Mon, 11/24/2014 - 21:53

#26

Dumb-Blonde

still....

well, I noticed polairis asi vh shots are faster than normal pola, so why not val...

Mon, 11/24/2014 - 22:31

#27

Fehzor

I believe that you're imagining things, but I'm sure a test of some sort could be devised to determine the truth if you are really so inclined. It would be a pretty huge finding if you're correct. I think the best way to tell would be to switch between negative 2 asi (full plate set) and positive 6 asi, video recording a single shot with either. The footage could then be compared side to side.

Keep in mind that a 2* pulsar can be used (and later rolled upon for a certain gun related update or sold) if you have an ASI UV on your polaris.

Mon, 11/24/2014 - 22:46

#28

Sadchan

#framerate

Mon, 11/24/2014 - 23:51

#29

Klipik-Forum

This thread is at the top of the page why exactly?

Tue, 11/25/2014 - 00:01

#30

Ewbte

/fai

Tue, 11/25/2014 - 00:34

#31

Cross-Over

Tried a Pulsar projectile speed test.
Times measured via moment of clicking / leaving from the gun to the moment it explodes.

I had absolutely no ASI perks on myself.
The average came out at 2.09 seconds.
Shot 1: 2.15
Shot 2: 2.28
Shot 3: 2.05
Shot 4: 1.96
Shot 5: 2.01

This test holds ASI perks - ASI Maximum.
The average came out at 1.848 seconds.
Shot 1: 1.81
Shot 2: 1.90
Shot 3: 1.81
Shot 4: 2.01
Shot 5: 1.71

Saw a veeerrry small difference inbetween both sets; but something that caught my eye (And it's late, so I don't know if my eye's playing tricks) was that on the ASI Max test, the bullets seemed to go farther than usual.
Edit: No, it's just my eyes. Went back to see if it was true.

Tue, 11/25/2014 - 01:37

#32

Ewbte

/shr

You know there is a connection delay, and other stuff in mechanics when you play action type of mmo to balance what many of players do at the same time, which means: what you see on monitor is not actually what you get. This must be understood by itself.

Sometimes second swing of slow swords takes two spins before hit (glitch). Which hints you cant measure times and speed in game, maybe you can open in-game files and get data from there? But this is against the ToS I think.
Also measuring that kind of stuff is nerd.

/e wonder if Fat-Nerd also a Fat-Troll
*update* he said he isn't

Tue, 11/25/2014 - 03:02

#33

Theirillusion

Not to brag or anything, but this is what I've been trying to say to people who say ASI UVs are op.

Tue, 11/25/2014 - 07:21

#34

Krakob

I literally don't even.

Wed, 11/26/2014 - 06:30

#35

Lady-Of-War

Obvious troll is obvious.
Who cares about ASI when I can pepper everyone with more danmaku than the entire population of Gensokyo can produce in one day?

Wed, 11/26/2014 - 07:04

#36

Hexzyle

Sorry Lady-Of-War, but that statement is even less feasible than division by zero.

Wed, 11/26/2014 - 11:49

#37

Vohtarak-Forum

I'm vohtarak, call me by that name

Wed, 11/26/2014 - 11:52

#38

Hexzyle

Removed desourced reply

Wed, 11/26/2014 - 12:06

#39

Vohtarak-Forum

I'm vohtarak, call me by that name

I have a habit to remove things if theyre wrong sorry if you took that as rude or something

Wed, 11/26/2014 - 20:47

#40

Hexzyle

No, that's perfectly understandable.

Wed, 11/26/2014 - 23:58

#41

Neoretro

I may not (usually) be a troll myself, but this whole thread is just too amusing.

/e gets popcorn.

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ASI VH WEAPONS ARE A LIE!!! VIDEO PROOF HERE!!!!