I love the developers, because they make this game that I enjoy, even though they produce content very slowly.

Here is a friendly tip: You should regard Spiral Knights as essentially complete. Don't expect new content every Wednesday, or even every year. Just take the game for what it is. Play it until you get tired of it, and then stop and do other things. Occasionally, when new content is released, you will be pleasantly surprised, return to the game for a while, and then go on hiatus again.

GMs are not necessarily actively working on developing the game. They are here as a sort of bridge to the community where they help our in-game problems and occasionally talk to us, typically about organizing events or something. Sometimes you can run into them in-game and they really are something special - especially when they aren't being mob-rushed in the Haven fountain.

Hyperion-senpai notice me!

You're right that no game is perfect. But many games are complete, in that they will never be expanded or improved again.

Before the Internet became pervasive, pretty much all games were sold as finished works. You bought the game for $50 or so, played it to the end, replayed it once or twice, and then were done with it. There was no expectation that the game developers would augment the game with new material.

Of course, Spiral Knights exists in the Internet age. But anyone who expects frequent content updates has not been paying attention. And accepting what Spiral Knights is and what it isn't will allow you to lead a more contented life. Cheers.

Yep. Spiral Knights is fundamentally a great idea, that deserves lots more development and support. Our lives would be slightly better if Three Rings produced more content. And maybe they will.

While we wait, each player can decide for herself whether to (A) fester with rage/sadness or (B) focus on other things in life.

Just expect the worst so that if an update happens you will be pleasantly surprised.

midnight, you are lamenting on something that isn't, but you wanted to be. point is, you can do absolutely nothing about it. the game is in this state because of its development, and if it wasn't so then maybe you wouldn't be lamenting as much, but it also would be another game. just enjoy the game for what it is instead of saying that it would have been so much better.

I think what you miss the most is interaction with players, and nothing in the game can satisfy that. I see where you come from, but it's no use stating the problem, since there's no way of addressing it directly. I think SK already reached its peak, and the only thing we can do for now is enjoy the gameplay while it's still on a server. for people like you that enjoy interaction between players more, the game lost its appeal some time in the past, and I don't think anything will change that. I can just hope OOO can prove wrong.

You guys... (gets teary) you guys make me proud.

If I could have 3 wishes

One of them would be for SK to have a dev team and budget the size of Bungie's. ~Z

Sword-Manava: hi Manava, it's Utrex! :p

Anyway, I sort of agree. But there's a game-changing, groundbreaking update coming soon and all I can say is to be patient. For the most part, whenever OOO neglects updates that add on to the game fundamentally, they take a few months. This upcoming update is taking forever. We all know what that means.

"the likelihood of us simply up and leaving Cradle is pretty weak."

DON'T FORGET:
YOU'RE HERE
FOREVER.

I'd love a sequel/prequel as much any anyone else, it's just we won't be living the Morai Wars in Spiral Knights. That doesn't mean we can't have a Spiral Knights prequel - I'd love to have a single-player/co-op first/third person Spiral Knights game up to the events we see in Spiral Knights. I can already imagine rushing to the Skylark as its powering up, grabbing onto a latch and taking off into space leaving our world behind ... And then after the credits roll a short cutscene is brought up with Captain Ozlo staring at a blinking screen, letting a grunt out, saying something about returning one day. On the blinking screen it shows an energy signal - and an outline of Cradle.

That's assuming the Swarm is an entity that can be stopped. From all we've seen, the swarm can simply be pushed back, but never stopped or killed.

The most I can think of would be if us Knights became fused with Cradle, and thus it started mechanically re-creating our homeworld as levels in the clockworks. However, the likelihood of us leaving Cradle is very small - we aren't just killing the swarm, we are protecting the Sleeper. Sleeper isn't going anywhere, and most likely the Swarm isn't going to stop leeching its energy.

You also have to understand that, game mechanics wise, a playable Isora planet would be a complete overhaul to what we currently have in the game. No elevators between randomized levels, no clockwork planet. Shroud of the Apocrea's grasping plateau should be a good indicator of why large open fields are not more common in the game - they cause horrendous amounts of lag and have terrible memory leaks. Whether or not this is just the map is another thing to worry about, but it's the only connection I can make.

It would be super cool if we were able to fight the Morai in the Clockworks, as Cradle draws in other worlds as a shield, but us leaving Cradle, the Sleeper, the Swarm... Each individual enemy and monster family...

I understand your idea, but our original plan was to get off Cradle, and if we could get off we wouldn't come back. The current story arch is that we belong on Cradle, and we won't be leaving it.

This is why a prequel or a sequel would be so much more appealing - it isn't limited by what is happening right now in our MMO, but can still use similar mechanics and world pieces, and enhance the lore.

If Team Fortress 3 were an entirely different game then it might take off. Personally I'd love a re-imagining of Isora as a prequel, but in a first or third person perspective. That's already an entirely different game, despite us still playing as spiral knights. I can't imagine it'd be an MMORPG as well.

If we made a prequel that played and worked entirely differently, then yeah, we can use one. If gameplay is important to the series as a whole, then we need to hold onto it. Rise of Knights is a good example of the same assets, different game situation.

Main issue with Isora levels is that there is no break in them. Elevators won't exist on a non-clockworks planet, making the "depth" system either useless or not correct. Gear would thus be under or overpowered, loading times would take a long time, game stutters would occur without proper loading screens...
Basically what I'm saying is that by us leaving a clockwork planet to go to Isora, we are thus creating a different slew of problems that are not problems on Cradle. Giant, empty pits are space are normal in the clockworks. Floating islands and levels make sense in the clockworks. Unless we're in some Morai building with large skywalks then there's no way this same game design would fit in with our current one. Then there's the whole point that if we're on slanted levels then height differences will be a problem, both with the camera and with bullets.

As I said, us literally leaving Cradle doesn't make sense in a lore-perspective, nor does it make sense in a game design perspective. That doesn't stop Isora from coming to Cradle, however, and creating new levels for us in the Clockworks, or even having the Morai try to hold us under siege on the surface. Neither of those things harm lore or game design (isora would be built in a floating island way, same as the rest of the clockworks), and in fact, would be really fun.

Indoors we have the perspective problem. The camera is set up to look down upon us, and if we're indoors we would need to have high ceilings and low walls - pretty much limiting all potential "indoor" maps to being in a cubical space. There's a reason pretty much all of the playable levels in this game are not indoors - and the ones that are indoors take place in very large corridors (only ones that come to mind right now are garrison + Haven arcade area).

I'm looking at it from every angle and I just plain can't see any reason for us to be on Isora in this game beyond a fan service. Isora coming to us through the clockworks is not just possible, but very exciting to think about - but us going back to our home planet with the lore where it stands, and the gameplay itself already defined? I can't come up with a logical explanation.

Too lazy to read everything, but aren't there new missions?

But think about it this way: You just bought Paper Mario. (You're old.) You play through it. You're done. Maybe play again.

(Is it legal to mention nintendo on a Sega company?)

As for roofing, the Arcade's southern half does that pretty well.

The camera is set up to look down upon us, and if we're indoors we would need to have high ceilings and low walls - pretty much limiting all potential "indoor" maps to being in a cubical space.

High ceilings means high wall barriers. In order to make such an open space feel alive you would need a lot of detail put into these walls. The arcade doesn't put focus on said walls, instead making our gaze naturally move towards the moving gears further away.

My issue isn't new content, my issue is, taking into account all the resources we currently have (lore, gameplay, artstyle, background design), a multi-stage dungeon of sorts or an overworld on another planet are... well, a bit out of line. I am 101% for Isora clockworks levels, and I am all for us visiting Isora in a game with its level design and style themed more around a more player-focused perspective, but in our current game with our current perspective, leaving the planet and continuing to fight a losing war is bad. Flashback instances, playable story, or clockwork-created Isora levels are all in our wheelhouse, but returning home to fight the Morai really isn't.

Initially the lore was that we crashed on Cradle, and were trying to find an energy powerful enough to power our ship to return home. This was it. If this was the current lore I would be on the same boat because that was the end goal.

Now our lore states we were escaping a war on our homeworld in search for a powerful energy signature for us to turn the tide of war. We discovered Cradle. Cradle fires upon us, wrecking the Skylark and stranding us on the clockwork planet. Lore continues and in our current story arc we have come to accept that we are here for some higher purpose, and that Cradle is now our home, and protecting the Core, and more importantly defeating the Swarm, is our new objective.

Again, I'm looking at this from multiple angles. Lore-wise, with all of our current lore, leaving Cradle would doom it, and potentially bring the Swarm to consume more and more until it starts expanding off of the clockwork planet. We also have no energy powerful enough for us to leave Cradle, much less win a war on our home planet.
Gameplay and game design-wise, Isora would be an entirely different game. It is not a clockwork planet, all enemies would be completely redone, certain monsters families would not exist... Basically, it's not the same game. I'm not saying that I would dislike going to Isora and exploring it - I love to explore in games, and have probably done far too much wandering in Skyrim than I should have, but Spiral Knights is a linear dungeon crawler. Weighing everything together, such as game engine, optimization, level design, art style, puzzle assets, etc... It's not really all that feasible. No matter what the situation in Spiral Knights is, the levels are all generally similar in design; combat areas with narrow passageways between them.

I'd love to see Isora, and I'd love to fight the Morai, but there's a time and place for everything... But leaving Cradle? Not now.

Future lore and game optimizations can change my mind, but looking at all our pieces in the present? I don't see it being feasible.

Who says Isora doesn't have elevators? Isora might be a highly modern and industrialized world, like maybe Coruscant or something. I could very easily imagine there being complex webs of pathways and elevators to navigate through. Want changing gates? That's more story business.

*cracks knuckles*

Suppose the Spiral Order on Isora is more like a Spec Ops unit, and they have a hub base from which they launch their missions. Spiral HQ periodically gives them different missions to complete, and they start those missions by stepping on the portal elevator, much like we do with the Arcade on Cradle. The portal elevator takes the knights to the mission portal, where they are teleported to the mission start location.
*Industrial forges are malfunctioning! Rouge robots may be to blame. Destroy the rogues and get the forges back online!
*Toxic waste is spilling from the sewage system and into the water supply! Sentient waste is also coming out. Destroy it and plug the leak!
*Sabotage! Gremlins have messed up the central power generator, and it's up to you to stop them!
*The Frostifur Pack is about to drop an avalanche down Frosty Mountain! Navigate a path to the peak stop them before they destroy the city below!

Stuff like that. Making varied environments for the knights on Isora isn't all that difficult.

Fangel, what if Isora was actually taken into cradle, and only peops that did DaN could access Isoran Cradle levels. It would be a new level design, but they could fit it in story-wise.

Gunner update wasn't even really a content update.

It just added new tools (the guns). There was no actual new content (i.e. levels, bosses, enemy classses)...

So no actual content update FOR OVER 2 years now...

Why are guns not considered content? More specifically, how are tools not considered content? I honestly don't see a difference, beyond an arbitrary line in the sand.

If OOO decided to remove every single bomb in the game, you'd say they "removed content."

I guess Red's getting on my forum ignore list now.

New weapons are content. New levels are content. Notice how people complain about mixmaster? It's because it's content behind a paywall.

Heck, costumes and accessories are non-playable content.

There was no actual new content (i.e. levels, bosses, enemy classses)...
Levels - new vanguard levels. Breaking in the Recruits gave an overworld pallet, and Dreams and Nightmares explored the core. Are you seriously calling the core opening "not actual content"? We waited 4 years for this to happen for crying out loud.
Bosses - Herex, Tortodrones
Enemy classes - If you want to get technical, all the new souls (void, flaming) are new enemies. Herex acts a bit differently from a stalker, but is largely the same. Tortodrones were added, and entirely new enemy from the days of old. In general enemy classes aren't added often, with only around 4 or 5 monster types being added post-release (minis, grimalkin, gorgoes are the only off the top of my head).

So um, don't think your examples stand.

They have added many more than five.

Of those added post release, the turrets, knockers, and gorgoes are the biggest noticeable monster additions. Still adds up to about 5 monsters, but you are right, there have been several more monsters added post-release, they just somehow slipped my mind.