Spiral Knights - Experiment: Playtime per 100 energy. Data needed.

Experiment: Playtime per 100 energy. Data needed.

29 replies [Last post]

Sat, 06/25/2011 - 09:56

Darkgeek

Legacy Username

Experiment: How much playtime do you really get for a mist tank's worth of energy?

So, after reading numerous energy threads, I have noticed that a lot of people either complain or comment that a mist tank gives you an hour of playtime.

I decided to start an experiment: gather data on how long it takes to play the levels, plus the energy used (ME or CE, doesn't matter). Average out the data per 1 energy, than multiply that by 100. With enough data, people can say , "You get about ____ playtime on a mist tank."

If you would be so kind as to help out, please record the level name, the energy spent total, the stratum number, and the time it took to complete the level.

Example:

Scarlet fortress spiral cou819rt II - 13 energy (energy gate) - stratum 2 - time 7:14

Remember, this is just an average. Lots of different levels are good, because the average player will hit many different stages.

If anyone has any comments, criticisms, or data, please leave a post.

Thanks!

Edit: I still have not thought up a way to tell when the experiment is over. It could either be when a set number of players contributed, when a certain number of level records has been reached, a time deadline regardless of info, etc. Please leave a post concerning how you think this should work. Thank you for your time!

Edit: Originally, there was a "detailed" version of the level data, but the version that I have here is good enough for now.

Running totals:

T1
Energy: 792
Time: 12:02:23
Time per 100 energy: 1:31:12
Levels documented: 77
Contributing players: 3 (Flehrad, tleilaxu, Yobilat)

T2
Energy: 123
Time: 1:20:47
Time per 100 energy: 1:05:40
Levels documented: 11
Contributing players: 1 (shiftynou)

All tiers
Energy: 915
Time: 13:23:10
Time per 100 energy: 1:24:20
Levels documented: 88
Contributing players: 4 (Flehrad, tleilaxu, Yobilat, shiftynou)

Sat, 06/25/2011 - 10:10

Gigafreak

Legacy Username

A couple concerns... Perhaps

A couple concerns...

Perhaps you should separate it by tier and also separate boss stages? Early tier stages go by faster than later tier stages, and boss stages are long. They might be outliers.

People who complain about Mist energy are typically beginners, meaning they are running the fast Tier 1 stages and using a lot of energy revives, thereby consuming it much more rapidly than an average player. Should this be kept in mind? This is not the total goal of the research, but might allow for comparing the energy consumption rate of a beginner vs. the average player.

Should it count towards the time if the party decides to hold off until a favorable level to cycle in ("wait for the Arena! ...for another fifteen minutes")?

Sat, 06/25/2011 - 10:14

Crixdec

another factor is solo vs

another factor is solo vs party, usually solo is much slower than in a party so thats another factor

Sat, 06/25/2011 - 11:32

Darkgeek

Legacy Username

Great ideas.

Gigafreak and Crixdec, great ideas.

My only concerns are that this is a volunteer project, and I am lucky to get any data, so I don't want to ask too much from the players.
The tier number idea is good, I think that stratum number (still one number, but more accurate) will be good.
The number of players is included in the detailed description section.

However, I will modify the main post to add those in. I should have included an example, too.
Also, as for the boss stages, I will be able to tell because of the name (Gloaming Wildwoods, Royal Jelly Palace, etc.)

Thanks!

Sat, 06/25/2011 - 10:22

Gigafreak

Legacy Username

I'm quite interested in

I'm quite interested in seeing any results this thread gets. Both from scientific interest as well as to spite the energy complainers if the average mist tank happens to end up lasting more than two hours.

"You get enough free energy to spend 10% of your life playing this game! Did you really need more than that?"

Heh.

Sat, 06/25/2011 - 10:49

Darkgeek

Legacy Username

Oops...

Hypocrite alarm!
I just realized that I haven't posted any data into my own project!!!

Sorry about that, I will try to get it this evening...

Sat, 06/25/2011 - 11:22

shiftynou

Legacy Username

sounds fun

Sounds like fun. I'd be happy to start tracking when I log-in later on this evening.

Sat, 06/25/2011 - 12:51

bushwhacker

Legacy Username

I haven't kept track of the

I haven't kept track of the time, but does it make a difference that I make a profit enough to actually buy more CE after my runs?

Sat, 06/25/2011 - 12:58

Darkgeek

Legacy Username

Bushwacker, please restate.

Sorry, bushwacker. I can't figure out what you are trying so say. Maybe it's just my hard head.
This thread is for figuring out how much playtime you get out of 100 energy (the equivalent of one mist tank). The profitability/crowns doesn't really figure in here.
However, there are some other threads that deal with how many crowns you make per level.
Did I answer your question, or did I get it wrong?

Sat, 06/25/2011 - 13:53

Flehrad

Legacy Username

I posted my pdf in the other

I posted my pdf in the other thread about earning CE, but in my file, I've also got approximate playtime based upon the mist regeneration rate, since you get 1 mist back ever 13.2minutes. So this is the minimum time for me solo'ing each of the levels in T1, with my energy costs and crowns.

http://www.mediafire.com/?a7f9be1v187zvzc

Sat, 06/25/2011 - 13:57

#10

tleilaxu

Legacy Username

Snarbolax run time: solo.

Power Complex, Wild Path - 10 energy - stratum 1 - time 7:42 - 1 player.
Lichenous Lair, Shocking Synthesis - 10 energy - stratum 2 - time 5:39 - 1 player.
Graveyard - 16 energy - stratum 3 - time 8:46 - 1 player - 2 energy gates opened.
Gloaming Wildwoods, Terrilous Trail - 10 energy - stratum 5 - time 7:10 - 1 player.
Gloaming Wildwoods, Roarsterous Ruins - 10 energy - stratum 6 - time 11:18 - 1 player.
Lair of The Snarbolax - 10 energy - stratum 7 - time 3:37 - 1 player.

Totals:
Time = 44:12 (Slightly more, actually. I didn't count Basil.)
Energy = 66.

Notes:
Broke every brazier and patch of grass. Disturbed every grave.
Only got 3 Fruminous Fangs.

Sat, 06/25/2011 - 14:37

#11

Darkgeek

Legacy Username

Awesome!

Flehrad and tleilaxu, thanks!

Flehrad,
Massive amount of data, it's going to take me a while to work through all that. Good job! Only thing is, I am kind of wary of other web sites, next time could you put it in a post? Thanks! By the way, good idea calculating the playtime based on ME regeneration. That was smart.

tleilaxu,
Good job posting this, great job with all the data! You got nearly all the things in the detailed list, and in a neat format, too. However, check the stratum numbers. I think that you meant "depth", not "stratum", as there is no stratum 7. By the way, for all of you who want to participate, please don't count the party lobby, terminals, subtowns, etc. Those don't require energy to enter, and don't include combat, so don't technically count as playtime. Also, the "Broke every brazier and patch of grass. Disturbed every grave." part means that you did a thorough run, not a quick dash (which is good, because the average player is more likely to break everything in sight).

For now I am going to put updates in separate posts, and the total average in the main post.

I'll post the compiled data as soon as I get it organized.

Sat, 06/25/2011 - 14:41

#12

tleilaxu

Legacy Username

RE: length of experiment.

The length should be whenever you get 50+ data points for any given strata. Boss strata should be considered separate from generic strata, e.g. my Gloaming Wildwoods data should not be averaged with Flehrad's Graveyard, Wasteworks, and Concrete Jungle data. Of course, it'll take longer to gather T3 times, but you don't really need those if Gigafreak's "people who complain about Mist energy are typically beginners" is true. :)

Sat, 06/25/2011 - 15:10

#13

Darkgeek

Legacy Username

Compiled data + comments

tleilaxu,

Concerning your idea for the length of the experiment, I think that is a good idea. I would like to wait a bit longer to see if someone comes up with something else, and then I will choose the best one. 60 would be a nice number, because that is two stratums (six levels) times ten runs. Also, I would guess that the average play-time for a mist tank would be about one and a half hours, but only time (and data) will tell.

And here comes the data...

Donated by Flehrad

Clockwork Tunnels - Wild Path
Wolver Den - Frosty Fury
Aurora Isles - Jelly Farm
Graveyard
Wasteworks - Slimeway
Concrete Jungle - Totem Trouble
TOTAL: Stratum 1+2 - 66 energy used - time 79:12

Concrete Jungle - Totem Trouble 2
Treasure Vault - Fortune Smiles on the Greedy
Deconstruction Zone - Radioactive Recycling
Jigsaw Valley - Jade Tango 2
Deconstruction Zone - Cold Storage
Clockworks Tunnels - Mechanized Mile
TOTAL: Stratum 1+2 - 60 energy used - time 52:48

Power Complex - Mechanized Mile
Power Complex - Slimeway
Thunder Fist Arena - Fiendish Fray
Gloaming Wildwoods - Terrilous Trail
Gloaming Wildwoods - Roarsterous Ruins
Gloaming Wildwoods - Lair of the Snarbolax
TOTAL: Stratum: 1+2 - 60 energy used - time 79:12

Scarlet Fortress - Spiral Court
Cooling Chamber - Slimeway
Blast Furnace - Slimeway
Cooling Chamber - Infernal Passage
Cooling Chamber - Haunted Passage
Cooling Chamber - Mechanized Mile
TOTAL: Stratum 1+2 - 62 energy used - time 52:48

Clockwork Tunnels - Wild Path
Graveyard
Aurora Isles - Stone Grove
Graveyard
Wasteworks - Slimeway
Concrete Jungle - Totem Trouble
TOTAL: Stratum 1+2 - 60 energy used - time 66:00

Deconstruction Zone - Circuit Breakers
Devilish Drudgery - Wired for Synergy
Power Complex - Mechanised Mile
Jigsaw Valley - Perimeter Promenade II
Deconstruction Zone - Savage Salvaging
Blast Furnace - Mechanised Mile
TOTAL: Stratum 1+2 - 60 energy used - time 66:00

Ice Maul Arena - Beastly Brawl
Treasure Vault
Aurora Isles - The Jelly Farm
Wasteworks - Mechanised Mile
Deconstruction Zone - Radioactive Recycling
Concrete Jungle - Totem Trouble II
TOTAL: Stratum 1+2 - 60 energy used - time 66:00

Donated by tleilaxu

Power Complex, Wild Path - 10 energy - stratum 1 - time 7:42 - 1 player
Lichenous Lair, Shocking Synthesis - 10 energy - stratum 1 - time 5:39 - 1 player
Graveyard - 16 energy - stratum 1 - time 8:46 - 1 player - 2 energy gates opened
Gloaming Wildwoods, Terrilous Trail - 10 energy - stratum 2 - time 7:10 - 1 player
Gloaming Wildwoods, Roarsterous Ruins - 10 energy - stratum 2 - time 11:18 - 1 player
Gloaming Wildwoods, Lair of The Snarbolax - 10 energy - stratum 2 - time 3:37 - 1 player

Total totals (for this post):

Energy used: 494
Time: 8:26:12
Time per 100 energy: 1:42:28

(Someone please tell me if I got that right)

Whew!

Just to let you know, danger rooms and the number of rooms that you do in an arena are important, because they dramatically affect the time.

Sat, 06/25/2011 - 16:51

#14

Twiddle

It's about 2 hours on 100

It's about 2 hours on 100 mist energy. This does not include crafting costs. Mid game crafting costs significantly impact how long you play, unless you use CE to cover those costs. At around 4*, you need CE for better equip.

Sat, 06/25/2011 - 18:12

#15

Darkgeek

Legacy Username

Response to Zanoni

Zanoni, the rough amount of play time that you get from a mist tank is well known (forty-five minutes to two hours fifteen minutes, depending on the levels and player expertise), but I think that a solid number instead of a range would work better.
Maybe I am wrong, but I still think that a number should be found.

Sun, 06/26/2011 - 08:06

#16

Darkgeek

Legacy Username

Data.

Finally, I got some data from a T1 run that I did.

Deconstruction Zone Circuit Breakers - Stratum 1 - 3 players - 10 energy - Time 5:35
Wolver Den High Voltail - Stratum 1 - 3 players - 10 energy - Time 5:50
Graveyard - Stratum 1 - 3 players - 1 energy gate - 13 energy - Time 8:26
Gloaming Wildwoods Terrilous Trail - Stratum 2 - 3 players - 10 energy - Time 14:31
Gloaming Wildwoods Roarsterous Ruins - Stratum 2 - 3 players - 10 energy - Time 11:31
Gloaming Wildwoods Lair of the Snarbolax - Stratum 2 - 3 players - 10 energy - Time 5:30

Total time: 51:23
Total energy: 63
Time per 100 energy: 1:21:34

I'll update the running totals in a minute...

Sun, 06/26/2011 - 10:41

#17

Flehrad

Legacy Username

I am fairly trusting of

I am fairly trusting of mediafire, but I didn't post it into a post directly since it was an excel spreadsheet and would get rather messy. In my spreadsheet pdf, it is solo, no danger rooms, no additional power-ups or unlocks, and anything above 60 energy units meant I did die and needed a revive.

Sun, 06/26/2011 - 15:54

#18

Yobilat

Legacy Username

Interesting initiative but

Interesting initiative but knowing how long 100 energy give me playtime isn't really worth collecting data. I mean it would be far more interesting and profitable if you could collect data as shown in Flehrad PDF (maybe not as detailed). You would not only know how long 100 energy gave you time but for example how long you need to play to get this 100 energy, which levels are most profitable(CR wise - personally i treat materials and tokens as a bonus), which activities are worth spending CE (number of revivals, gates with boxes,challenges(these actually give a lot of money but they take a lot of time if u try to solo them with crappy eq and annoying enemies like constructs or anything which evade bullets) etc. These data are actually helpfull for new players or other crybabies and maybe then they will start having fun with this game while making money - which determines progress.

Nevertheless I'll try to collect some data for you.

Sun, 06/26/2011 - 16:57

#19

Flehrad

Legacy Username

I started doing it because I

I started doing it because I read that you could earn 4k crown in a T1 run lol, and I was like, what? no way... so after running and calculating, I have yet to actually get a raw 4k of crown collected, let alone profit from energy use. I then started to take into consideration the collection of tokens and materials but its hard to record all of what you get, and then market prices change so it's kind of even harder to place a definite value upon them.

Sun, 06/26/2011 - 18:58

#20

crazy10101

Legacy Username

Flehrad, try running t1

Flehrad, try running t1 danger rooms, and going solo. Over at silver pawn, for example, I can get 1k raw profits usually on my t1 runs. 4 of those, I can get myself a 3* recipe, or I can get a 2* recipe a run. The only time I lose money is when I dive down to the t2 basil for 3* recipes. It's pretty much self sustaining, and will continue to be so up until about 5.5k CE. By the time CE does get there, either silver pawn will have been closed, or I'm in t2.

Sun, 06/26/2011 - 19:55

#21

Flehrad

Legacy Username

Well, I am not running danger

Well, I am not running danger rooms at the moment as I was trying to see how it racks up statistically if you clear the complete stratum/tier with spending the minimum 10 energy/stratum. I also don't run danger rooms as I often won't have enough energy to complete the T1 run if I do, and if I die, I wouldn't be able to revive lol....

Sun, 06/26/2011 - 20:29

#22

Darkgeek

Legacy Username

Responses.

Yobilat, thank you for deciding to contribute data even though you think that it isn't worth it. That is very kind of you. By the way, there is at least one thread that keeps track of how many crowns you gain per run. Check it out. My only defense for this project is that the data might come in handy for planning about how long a run will take you (in case you have a tight schedule), or that when the next person complains/comments that you "only get an hour of energy", you can correct them. Aside from that and the sheer curiosity , there is little reason to run this experiment.

It will be a week until I get more data, but by then I will have printed out a sheet for tracking the numbers. Thank you all who have contributed so far!

Sun, 06/26/2011 - 21:24

#23

nearo

Legacy Username

Eh,

It all depends on your play speed, and what level you get, there's so many variables.

Mon, 06/27/2011 - 10:31

#24

Yobilat

Legacy Username

https://spreadsheets.google.c

https://spreadsheets.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AhabYTr_pQNwdGVoSTF...

here's my data for today

Mon, 06/27/2011 - 12:32

#25

Darkgeek

Legacy Username

Compiled data + comments.

Flehrad, just wanted to let you know that most people complete danger rooms, but some do not (insufficient gear, second half of the tier, not enough energy to revive in case of death, etc.). By not clearing the danger rooms, you are adding a bit of reality into this experiment. Thank you.

nearo, you are right; there are many variables. If I wanted to do a super-accurate project, I would have to account for all of them. However, with the limited amount of time that I have at my disposal, I am merely trying to figure the average amount of time that a mist tank will give you. The number will not be super-accurate, but between the rushers ("CL3@R TEH LVL N0W") and the cautious players ("@UGH!!! ST0P!!! SL0W D0WN, U W1LL G3T K1LL3D"), I think that it will average out reasonably well. After all, it is impossible to tell exactly how long 100 energy will last, but with enough data I can get a reasonably good figure.

Yobilat, thank you for the data, I will compile it in a minute. You kept the format pretty consistent and neat, good job. My only concern is that you did the same gate three times, but it IS a good gate.

And here the compiled data is now...

Donated by Yobilat

Scarlet Fortress Spiral Court - Stratum 1 - 1 player - 10 energy - Time 4:11
Cooling Chamber Slimeway - Stratum 1 - 1 player - 10 energy - Time 5:13
Graveyard - Stratum 1 - 1 player - 10 energy - Time 6:32
Wolver Den Frosty Fury - Stratum 2 - 1 player - 10 energy - Time 5:17
Ice Maul Arena Fiendish Fray - Stratum 2 - 1 player - 12 energy - Time 12:17
Ice Maul Arena Slimey Showdown - Stratum 2 - 1 player - 10 energy - Time 11:37

Scarlet Fortress Spiral Court - Stratum 1 - 1 player - 10 energy - Time 3:22
Cooling Chamber Slimeway - Stratum 1 - 1 player - 10 energy - Time 5:01
Graveyard - Stratum 1 - 1 player - 10 energy - Time 4:56
Devilish Drudgery Hiring Freeze - Stratum 2 - 1 player - 10 energy - Time 5:47
Cooling Chamber Haunted Passage - Stratum 2 - 1 player - 10 energy - Time 5:19
Lichenous Lair Cold Fusion - Stratum 2 - 1 player - 10 energy - Time 4:31

Scarlet Fortress Spiral Court II - Stratum 1 - 1 player - 10 energy - Time 4:18
Cooling Chamber Slimeway - Stratum 1 - 1 player - 10 energy - Time 7:22
Treasure Vault - Stratum 1 - 1 player - 10 energy - Time 3:34
Cooling Chamber Infernal Passage - Stratum 2 - 1 player - 10 energy - Time 7:29
Ice Maul Arena Fiendish Fray - Stratum 2 - 1 player - 10 energy - Time 14:02
Ice Maul Arena Slimey Showdown - Stratum 2 - 1 player - 10 energy - Time 12:31

Total time: 2:03:19
Total energy: 182
Time per 100 energy: 1:07:45

Mon, 06/27/2011 - 12:58

#26

Yobilat

Legacy Username

Glad i could help. Reason i

Glad i could help. Reason i was doing single gate was simple - profit (graveyard,2 arenas,chance of challenge gate) so as you can see my time/100 CE is pretty low because im not sightseeing. And my equip is getting better(runs was done with 2*gear except 1*gun and 3* shield, now i have 3*gun and 3* sword), so expect time be even lower. Tommorow ill try to diversify and do 2 or more gates.

Mon, 06/27/2011 - 23:28

#27

shiftynou

Legacy Username

some more data

Tier 2 - Strata 3

Iron Edge Arena: Fiendish Fray - 2 players - 10 energy - 7:57
Devilish Drudgery: Toxic Workplace - 2 players - 10 energy - 4:09
Dark City: Sinful Steps - 2 players - 10 energy - 4:18
Dark City: Plazamonium - 2 players - 10 energy - 5:11

Tier 2 - Strata 4

Treasure Vault: Fortune Smiles on the Greedy - 3 players - 10 energy - 2:50
Wasteworks: Haunted Passage - 3 players - 10 energy - 4:04
Scarlet Fortress: Spiral Court II - 3 players - 10 energy - 9:10
Scarlet Fortress: Cravat Hall II - 3 players - 10 energy - 8:03

Total time: 45:42
Total energy: 80
Time per 100 energy: ~57:08 (think I did that right)

All clears were thorough.

Tue, 06/28/2011 - 12:38

#28

Darkgeek

Legacy Username

Comments.

Yobilat, a good portion of the playerbase will actually run the same gate multiple times because it is profitable. By doing it multiple times, you were emulating what some of the players would actually do. However, diversifying your selection of gates will help a bit more.

shiftynou, thank you for donating data. This is the first T2 data that I've gotten, so I am going to take a slightly different course with the project. I will have averages for each of the individual tiers, and then one big, total average that will encompass all of the data for all of the tiers. And don't worry, I checked your numbers and everything is spot-on (I got 57:07 instead of 57:08, but I was not counting the 0.5).

Note to everyone, I am going to stop "compiling" data unless it is in an external spreadsheet or extremely hard to read. Pretty much everyone who has contributed to this project so far has been doing an excellent job keeping their data in a concise, easy-to-read format. Thank you all so much.

Tue, 07/19/2011 - 19:09

#29

Darkgeek

Legacy Username

Data.

And here is some more data!

Note: The following level records were taken during the latest power surge weekend. I have modified them to accurately reflect the energy that I would have used had it not been the PSW.

T1:

Scarlet fortress spiral court - Stratum 1 - 1 Player - 0 Revives - Danger room - 13 energy - Time 5:22
Clockwork tunnels haunted passage - Stratum 1 - 1 Player - 0 Revives - 10 energy - Time 7:55
Flame lash arena cadaverous clash - Stratum 1 - 2 Players - 0 Revives - 10 energy - Time 10:37
Gloaming wildwoods terrilous trail - Stratum 2 - 2 Players - 0 Revives - 10 energy - Time 7:05
Gloaming wildwoods roarsterous ruins - Stratum 2 - 2 Players - 0 Revives - 10 energy - Time 10:19
T1 totals:
Time: 41:18
Energy: 53
Time per 100 energy: 1:17:55

T2:

Deconstruction zone radioactive recycling - Stratum 3 - 1 Player - 0 Revives - 10 energy - Time 9:08
Concrete jungle totem trouble 2 - Stratum 3 - 1 Player - 0 Revives - 10 energy - Time 6:10
Wasteworks slimeway - Stratum 3 - 1 Player - 0 Revives - Danger room - 13 energy - Time 19:47
T2 totals:
Time: 35:05
Energy: 33
Time per 100 energy: 1:46:18

Total:
Time: 1:16:23
Energy: 86
Time per 100 energy: 1:28:49

Search

Experiment: Playtime per 100 energy. Data needed.