Here's a good idea that might peak your intrest. what if you can out with Dual-Wielding Weapons for the game. I i mean some would include ranging from pistols to swords. i mean this idea can to when i was look at the Aegis shield. it has the two little swords hiding. so i was thinking " would it be cool to use those or even have the shield as a weapon that can throw the daggers out. give it a thought... i would like to here your opinion on it guys. thanks.
A good idea
Sat, 07/30/2011 - 02:40
Sat, 07/30/2011 - 07:00
#2
There is already a bunch of
There is already a bunch of threads about this, and most of the people disagrees.
In fact, the Shield is your "main weapon". You are supposed to defend/shield-cancel/bounce with your shield to survive. Just "hack'n'slash" your way through the game will probably kill you in the first level of T2.
Sat, 07/30/2011 - 17:19
#3
The idea of dual-weapons
The idea of dual-weapons seems pretty darn good at first.
But if you think about it more, you'll find out that (unlike other games) shielding and not taking dmg is very - VERY - important in this game.
And because shielding is so important, dual weilding wouldn't do any good.
Sat, 07/30/2011 - 18:27
#4
no thought
i couldn't approve or go against this even tho i know alot of weapons the very well complement each other and would be perfect duel weilding but when it comes down to it you cant really do T3 just hitting things un like T2 and T1 and adding a new feature thats only good in 2 parts of the game instead of 3 just wouldn't seem right
Sun, 07/31/2011 - 02:11
#5
Yep
Your Knight only has 2 hands. One hold the weapon and the other the shield. Unless you are talking about guns, in which your character could dual weild 2 of the same low-recoil guns like alchemers to increase firing speed, but only using the one attack button and retaining the shield ability, then this idea is implausible. Sorry.
Sun, 07/31/2011 - 08:57
#6
Its kind of sad that this guy
Its kind of sad that this guy keeps posting stupid threads about Dual-wielding.It isnt gunna happen idiot.
He has even posted this in a diffrent forum.
Sun, 07/31/2011 - 09:14
#7
We already have dual wield.
We already have dual wield. It's called Swiftstrike.
Sun, 07/31/2011 - 10:26
#8
Swiftstrike? Care to
Swiftstrike? Care to elaborate?
Sun, 07/31/2011 - 12:15
#9
Swiftstrike buckler increases
Swiftstrike buckler increases attack speed at the cost of being a fairly weak 3* shield. So you can get an attack buff at expense of useless shielding, which is effectively what duel-wielding does.
Anyone else think dual-wielding shields would be the bomb? You could put a shield in one of your weapon slots for increased defensive capabilities.
Tue, 08/09/2011 - 13:21
#10
Uh...What?
It seems like some of you might be missing a MAJOR point here. If you can swing two Leviathan Blades at the same time and have the combined knock-back and damage of both, you don't need a shield. The whole point of dropping the shield in favor of weapon is to deal TREMENDOUS amounts damage with every blow. In my opinion, if you can drop a lumber faster than he can take a swing at you, a shield isn't remotely necessary.
I realize that this is the whole point of the Swift Strike Buckler, but it lacks the overwhelming volume of style points that comes with duel-wielding. And if the Swift Strike can't really protect you from anything, then who cares about whether it comes in the form of a damage boosting shield or two weapons used simultaneously?
Also, to LeonAlabard, your right! Any nut that runs guns-a-blazing through a Tier is going to get hammered. However, having a shield doesn't make you invincible. I've personally out lived people with much stronger shields than mine solely because I'm smart and deal with enemies on 1v1 basis. So I don't think the shield is as big a deal as your making it out to be.
In the end, all I'm saying is that it should be an option. If no one ever uses it then whatever; but if someone wants to go crazy, they should be free to do it!
Tue, 08/09/2011 - 13:28
#11
Wut
You're missing a few scenarios.
What about shield bashing?
What'll you do if you get mobbed?
What about missles and torpedos?
How are you going to get through certain environmental traps?
What if you're swinging and something just happens to get behind you and take a swing?
and more..
And to the OP, please post this on another thread, don't create a new one and add crap to the forums. This has been stated thousands of times, and unless you're illiterate or just posted this instantaneously without reading other threads, then the chances of missing the other threads about this topics are slimmer than paper.
Tue, 08/09/2011 - 15:18
#12
Of you can have duel then we
Of you can have duel then we cannot have a shield.Not even an weak shield.just no shield when doing duel.
Wed, 08/10/2011 - 04:07
#13
Duel Leviathan
You shouldn't be able to hold 2 Leviathan blades. It is a massive blade, if you attempt to hold 2 of them in front of you, unless you are really fat, it should put your centre of mass to far forward, causing you to fall.
If they allow duel wielding, it should only be small light weight things, not a massive sword, that probably weighs as much as you.
Wed, 08/10/2011 - 05:10
#14
*facepalm*!!!!!!!
Sigh.
Dual wielding...is typically a GUN type arrangement. NONE of the swords in SK so far have I seen with an attack pattern that would be adjustable to be used as a dual wield. Leviathans. Try it, and you'd behead yourself. Cutter. Fast, small yes, but can you think of a way to swing them BOTH in an attack sequence?
For dual wielding swords, you need a smaller sleeker blade that can be used flexibly in combat. Using this is SK would need a LOT of work to be created..
For the gun arrangement, you wouldn't have to drop the shield. Have 2 of the same/similar low recoil guns like alchemers, which dual-wielding of such would increase fire-rate with only ONE attack button. The shield is still available for use, as it wouldn't exactly get in the way if you're holding a gun. (Shields aren't always held, mostly they're just strapped to you forearm.)
Wed, 08/10/2011 - 09:46
#15
So what your saying is that
So what your saying is that Duel-wielding swords is out of here (unless the devs are willing to work large amounts of hours just for this), but guns may still work.
Wed, 08/10/2011 - 14:43
#16
Responses
Three things I want to address here: duel-wielding big swords (Leviathans), accommodating every situation, and none of the swords have an adjustable attack pattern necessary for duel wielding.
First, "You shouldn't be able to hold 2 Leviathan blades". Yeah um, I don't know if you noticed this, but the Spiral knights are freakishly strong little people. Not once have I seen a two-handed sword (including the Leviathan). This makes them all duel wield-able. ^_^
Second, "none of the swords have adjustable attack patterns". The solution I gave to the developers was this: when you duel-wield, you have but one attack pattern that has the effects of both swords as well as one charge attack similar to the Leviathans. The speed of the attack pattern would also be as fast as the slowest sword. This would make it tremendously easier on the developers. I can't see why this would be a problem, but if you can see a reason please tell me.
Lastly, "You're missing a few scenarios". I have a few theories about these. (1) Being able to block with the swords: honestly I don't know why you can't do this already (it happens all the time in star wars, Final Fantasy, and a host of other media), but this would allow for the shield bash/bump that can be so crucial to combat, also to be fair, the developers could make it so that it requires good timing and/or the knight receives some damage when when you block. As far as guns go, just make it so you can push enemies out of the way when they get to close. (2) The attack pattern of the weapons (and this ties into my second argument) would be multi-directional. Meaning that your attack pattern would have a couple spins in it like that of a heavy sword which would deal damage behind you. (3) I refer you to this video: (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U3fOvskjR7I). In it you'll notice that the shield is used only a handful of times and its primarily to bump enemies away and this is against Royal Jelly! Why is this possible? It's because the weapon used deals a large amount of damage, fires in all directions, and the player is in constant motion. Give the weapon the knock-back power of a leviathan and the enemies won't get close enough to hurt you.
Also, I'd like to know what chojustin meant by "environmental traps".
I hope I'm not coming off as rude. I just love duel-wielding dang it! It's just so awesome-looking!
Wed, 08/10/2011 - 14:59
#17
I could understand a dual
I could understand a dual weld weapon, that worked the same as a regular one, but with a dual-animation. Like how the silent nightblade has a sheath in one hand. But as a new game mechanic, I think it's a bad idea; purely becuase I'd rather they create new monsters to fight, as opposed to new ways to kill the same thing.
Wed, 08/10/2011 - 15:36
#18
Welp
Welp, to each his own....
I'd personally like to see both, but this is a duel-wielding thread. ^_^
Wed, 08/10/2011 - 18:55
#19
i agree
i agree with kn1ghtman duel wielding would be awesome!
Thu, 08/11/2011 - 00:56
#20
Hmm...
Sigh...
Yeah, I GET that these lil dudes are super strong, but strength isn't the issue. Having 2 MASSIVE swords like those...it would be SUPER unwieldy...A Sword bigger than themselves would have problems if you tried to co-ordinate 2 swings with different arms. I know this game has a lot of unrealistic stuff, which I don't mind at all, but this would completely take it out into another league.
Cutters...on further inspection, their attack patters could be varied slightly while dual wielding. It' combo move could involve coordinated frontal and simultaneous rear attack followed by a double sword forehand attack then a center spread attack (scissor style outwards).
I guess it'd have to be taken into consideration which weapons could be dual wielded. Not everything is so versatile...
Dual wield with 2 different swords? I dunno about that. I need to think more about this...I think it would still come to being selective about which can be dual wielded, and which are compatible with each other.
Hm.....Intriguing...
Thu, 08/11/2011 - 10:20
#21
I'm sticking to my guns....
Valkyrie, if what your saying is true, then a knight shouldn't be able to carry and use both a Triglav and an Ironmight plate shield. At least not without severe mobility issues. You see? It's already too late. The weight of weapons and shields have no consequence in this game. We're already well into that league. =/
Now, if you're still concerned about the attack patterns, let me repeat and clarify what I said before. There would be only ONE attack pattern when a knight duel wields (regardless of what the swords are). The only thing that would change would be the effect of the attacks and the speed with which they're delivered. For example, let's take a sword with a really unusual attack pattern: the cutter series, and let's combine it with something from the brandish line. When you attack, you swing the swords in the single, generic, applies-to-all-combinations style for duel-wielding except that the after-image of the cutter will appear with every swing and the pattern only goes as fast as the Brandish. Get it? There would be no reworking of the actual attack pattern based on the swords you're holding.
I hope this helps.
Thu, 08/11/2011 - 11:31
#22
Dual wielding is good
I sorta disagree that dual wielding is just plain bad. It allows players to distinguish themselves and some players can go pure dps. Shielding is a pretty good trademark, so if they are to put dual wielding, dual wielded weapons should have better attacks and charged attacks than that of the normal.
Thu, 08/11/2011 - 11:32
#23
Dual wielding with guns
Now that's a good idea. Makes gunslinger line look a lot cooler and increases their dmg output.
Thu, 08/11/2011 - 16:28
#24
FINALLY!
Yes! Finally someone who understands me! There are simply some of us who like the two-weapon style and think it should be an OPTION.
Thank you Zephyrgon. ^_^
BTW, I love the idea of a duel wielding gunner. You my friend get ten epicness points!
Hmm, I wonder what it would be like as a duel-wielding bomber? (Ô.Ô) I'd like to see that!
Thu, 08/11/2011 - 23:23
#25
DUDE!
Dude man... I'm not trying to shut this thread down. Just providing an objective opinion or POV and trying to make people argue for ideas that'll make this more plausible.
And I came up with the dual-wielding guns thingy earlier...wait...mine had attachments and hinderments...dam...
Also,K1ghtman, It's not the weight of the gear I'm worried about. If I think about it, super strong little people CAN use a heavy shield and weapon. But 2 Heavy AND long weapons is a bit much. Try it out yourself: Get 2 wooded poles that are heavy enough for you to feel the weight, but can swing easily. If they're bigger than you, bonus. Then try swinging them around in a plausible attack pattern. It'll probably end up with the poles hitting the floor alot and swinging only one at a time.
Don't get me wrong, dual wielding is cool, I just think some parts need a bit of work, otherwise OPness would occur. Like someone with a DA and GF. 3 damage groups...Or some guy with 2 Leviathans (I just LOVE leviathans ^^) doing haxsor damage to any opponent in his way.
Also, when I say I'm worried about attack patters, your solution comes to mind. The problem would be finding an attack pattern where it wouldn't look slightly awkward using the weapons, and yes, there would be only one attack pattern.
Oh and sorry, I tend to be really hard to understand in speech and writing, or the way I write or speak delivers a completely different message to what I'm trying to say.
So anyways...any additions or objections/developments on my ideas?
Fri, 08/12/2011 - 10:16
#26
You make a good point...
No worries mate. (^_^)
You make a solid argument too. It is completely implausible to swing two giant, heavy swords. I tried with just one large wooden sword and it was extremely difficult. This is why I have such difficulty watching people like Cloud on that Final Fantasy movie swing those massive swords together and still be a threat. I mean, it's just plain craziness. I still love it though, and I think it would still look awesome. Regardless of whether it is actually feasible.
Another idea we could try is to shrink the size of the swords slightly when duel wielding. That might make it a little easier on the eyes. I still like the idea of toting around two massive swords though. (^o^)
In regards to your gun theory though, I don't think I necessarily like the attachments idea. Not that it isn't completely reasonably since your shield hand is free, but if you had the option to carry one gun and a shield or two guns and shield which would you choose? This would eliminate the single gun style. The way I see it, there has to be a downside to duel wielding of some kind. Otherwise, everyone would do it. But then again, who ever heard of a cowboy carrying a shield? (Ô_o)
Fri, 08/12/2011 - 12:54
#27
Imagine that.
Imagine that. Dual-wielding DAs. (Don't let the undead and construct see this post)
Fri, 08/12/2011 - 13:04
#28
No matter how much you may
No matter how much you may say it, if dual wielding means you have absolutely no shield at all, regardless of how much OMGAMAZING knockback and damage your weapons do, you will be shredded to bits in T2 and T3. It is absolutely impossible to dodge everything, and you'll only be able to get through with a team who you need to revive yourself, and they will hate you with quite some fury.
For anyone who seriously thinks this is a good idea, try unequipping your shield and going through their last couple of tiers with a party. See how it goes. (Also the idea of doubling attack speed is a little stupid; you think holding two Levi blades means you can swing each of them with each arm just as quickly as one? that would just look ridiculous).
Fri, 08/12/2011 - 14:30
#29
Actually...
Whew. For a second I thought you were going to shoot me or something.
Anyway, It would be cool, and dual-wielding 2 big swords WOULD be awesome. Though you have the same Idea that I do that size would have to be considered. In fact, I'm actually writing a story at home on stuff I'm totally making up and the guy has 2 pretty big swords that he dual wields. They're not huge, but it takes skill.
Yeah, watching cloud being all badass with his sword is cool. I was totally like O_O OMG how does he DO that?!?!
Downside to having 2 guns and shield? I can think of a few. Extra re-loading time, needing 2 of the gun you want to dual wield, possibly it being a trinket upgrade? ^_-
Fri, 08/12/2011 - 14:46
#30
I'll say this:
If they
I'll say this:
If they implement dual-wielding, I really won't care.
But if it is a boss-run or a deep stratum run, I am kicking you from my party because I don't wanna carry your dead ass around the map.
Fri, 08/12/2011 - 16:43
#31
Whatever
*Sigh*
Okay. I give up. Look, I really don't care if you gain any special abilities from duel-wielding or lose any. At the very least I'd like to see it as a costume for the shield slot, which would give you the ability to block with the two swords and have the defensive strength of your shield. Even without boosted attack strength and knock-back. I don't care. I just want the look no matter what the effect is.
I also think it would be neat if you could (in addition to duel-wielding) equip the sword as a costume for the shield in another way: You are displayed as only holding and blocking with the single sword. And again, the defensive strength depends on the shield you equipped and you may or may not hold the weapon with both hands. You're attack animation would stay the same though. Still, I think hauling twin Leviathans or D. Avengers would be legendary! I don't care how absurd some say it is.
I'm sorry. All I'm after is the looks.
Sat, 08/13/2011 - 04:43
#32
Throwing knives.
Your
Throwing knives.
Your argument shot to the ground.
Sat, 08/13/2011 - 15:50
#33
Knife gun.
Your argument is
Knife gun.
Your argument is "shot" to the ground.
Mon, 08/15/2011 - 06:52
#34
The Valiance
Isn't that what the Valiance is?
And how does that shoot anything to the ground? Ô_o
Sat, 08/13/2011 - 21:01
#35
Um. no.
To be honest as COOL as this would be in T3 you would DIE instantly. Really you would. T3 hurts SO much Shield is 100% NEEDED absolutely NEEDED. 1 hit takes off like 8 bars of HP without shield your pretty damn screwed. not to mention the monsters usually flinch less and are more resistant to 3 hit swords especially zombies. Try doing FSC without blocking and then we'll talk.
EDIT: OH I forgot I've said something about 2-handed swords/Dual weld. If the devs decide to do it then they're going to have to add an HP bar on every single sword for when you block with your sword because it will be used as a blocking item and then if it breaks you can't attack or block.
Mon, 08/15/2011 - 06:51
#36
Redundant
I already covered this in the #31 comment. -_-
A costume would make this totally doable in T3. And you wouldn't need a health bar for your swords because the defense of your swords would be that of your shield.
Tadaa!
Mon, 08/15/2011 - 06:53
#37
I agree that shield ARE needed...
But can't this find some way around that? Like I said earlier, maybe only SOME weapons can be dual-wielded, so that the shield can still be worn.
Oh and btw nice to see you back on this thread K1ghtman, thought we lost you somewhere...
Mon, 08/15/2011 - 09:12
#38
Coment #31 to the rescue!!!
I'll say this. I personally have a Leviathan and I don't find it to be too big to duel-wield. I just don't. =/
The Troika series on the other-hand, now that's a bit big for me. But like I said in #31, you could have either a duel-wield costume or a no-shield, double-handed-grip costume. Perhaps this could be dependent on the sword's size to make it easier to handle. I don't know. That argument is up for grabs.
Also, I want to point out that the Leviathan and the Flourish have the same number of attacks. If we were to say the Levi can have three swings but can't be D-W'd, then why would the Flourish be able to? The Levi is apparently light enough.
And here's something else to chew on - The Divine Avenger is deemed a heavy sword and has only a two-swing attack pattern, yet the Leviathan is much larger than the DA, deemed a medium-weight blade, and has a three-swing pattern. Is there something wrong with this picture? I personally believe the Leviathan is deceptively light-weight. ;)
........Oh, and It's good to be back. ^_^
Mon, 08/15/2011 - 09:10
#39
Oops...
Oh wait, your talking about duel-wielding guns and keeping the shield right? Yeah, I still say it should be just for show. No bonuses.
Mon, 08/15/2011 - 09:18
#40
"I personally believe the
"I personally believe the Leviathan is deceptively light-weight."
I think that's the point of the levitan blade. Makes you look like a boss.
I still don't feel like dual weilding would go down well. It's just more to calculate. One weapon is enough.
Though it would look cool If I switched weapons, and had my previous weapon in my non dominant hand for a while. You could make nice quick change combos, like on quake how you use the lightining gun (or as halo players call it, the sentinel beam) and quickly pull out the rail gun (or as halo players call it, the sniper rifle) to chop off the last half of a players health. Of course, that's only on the quick-change mod. Basicaly I chop with a DA, pull out my faust, chop again, but swing around with the DA in my other hand. Of course, it isnt that effective using two simmilar weapons that deal different damage with the same attack pattern.
Mon, 08/15/2011 - 10:04
#41
Uhm....
Well then I guess it's just a matter of opinion. From where I'm standing though, as long as the Leviathan stays in the three-swing class, it makes perfect sense to me to be able to duel-wield it like the others. Case closed.
As far as one weapon being enough though, I still think you're going to have people that just want the look of a super-powerful knight that can swing two gargantuan swords; which is why I'm also suggesting this as a costume.
Mon, 08/15/2011 - 12:52
#42
Yeah... No.
It may seem like a good idea, but it's just a pain to add in, and would probably not be worth it compared to what they're working on behind the scenes. I don't care if you want to do great amounts of damage without picking situation-specific weapons, shielding is too big in this game to be tossed aside. Besides, you'll probably want an increase to armor strength when you get beaten down in T3.
Mon, 08/15/2011 - 13:31
#43
...
Please read the #31 and #36 comments. I've already addressed this.
-1 i dont think that is good idea.(dont think to ask WHY . Why there must be a reason)