1; Forces sellers to post prices that sell quickly.
2; Crown sink.
CE should have listing price.
Fri, 08/26/2011 - 17:02
Fri, 08/26/2011 - 17:36
#2
It should work like the
It should work like the auction house. I mean, the auction house has always had resonable prices on most items. There are exeptions, but still. I'm not saying make a large fee though; prehaps 200 crowns to post an offer, and if you sell it, you get the crowns back. The market is so incredibly seller run. Plus, it would take at least some the unintentional killjoy out of power saver weekends. It's not fun to make double crowns if everything costs twice as much. They might as well make elevators cost 20 energy on weekdays, same effect.
Fri, 08/26/2011 - 17:52
#3
Taking measures to increase
Taking measures to increase competition puts you on a very fine line. While having a listing fee similar to the auction house would improve conditions for buyers, force too much competition and it may simply become unviable for sellers.
Take a look at what happens with recipes on the auction house. The listing fee puts a lot of pressure on the seller to make sure his item sells. As a result, I often see recipes for less popular items being sold on auction house at a loss, making it unviable for me to even try to compete. Obviously CE will always be in high demand so a low listing fee wouldn't be likely to cause too many problems, but the fast-paced nature of the CE market could cause even low costs to blow out quickly.
Fri, 08/26/2011 - 18:39
#4
Buying and selling recipes
Buying and selling recipes is, in my opinion, another sad system this game has introduced. I have done it occasionally, but I haven't felt very good about it. 5* recipes should be bind to encourage delving.
I've seen the majority of 5* recipes take a nose-dive since the gremlins came to Haven, and that's good. It'll make sure that the recipe price-gougers think twice before dealing in what is essentially powerleveling. Sell them because you want to pass down the good luck and good fortune of a T3 delver to people who can't access it, but making the end-level gear up for the highest bidder kinda sucks.
Oh, and I agree with LeQuack. CE should be either be marketed like the AH, or in the AH altogether.
Fri, 08/26/2011 - 19:39
#5
Recipe reselling is just
Recipe reselling is just another time vs cost thing. People pay extra to get the recipe they want when they want it instead of taking a gamble with Basil (35k for a 5* is ridiculous though). It's an excellent crown sink as well. If i resell a 3* recipe for 5.5k crowns i permanently delete 4550 crowns while gaining myself 950 crowns.
At the moment the value of time is the main thing that gets CE sold. The main thing to keep in mind with any changes to the CE market is to ensure that any risks introduced don't outweigh the benefit of saving time.
Sat, 08/27/2011 - 00:22
#6
Disagreement
I'll have to disagree with you all on certain points in regards to CE caps. Forcing a selling cap for people who purchase CE is not viable.
Why would I want to sell CE to you if I had purchased it if I knew that my hand was going to be forced into selling anything at less than the value I determine for the goods I purchased. My plan of action would be to not sell you anything at all. As even selling the CE to you causes me to lose a fee in the transaction itself. It's minimal but it's there. I could make more of a profit keeping it for myself and purchasing it from others.
The incentive is that people who are willing to put down real money in a game that's free to play are given liberties. Unfortunately for free players that means you're given the short end of the stick. If you haven't purchased CE then you are not supporting the company in the same way as a paying player. As someone who purchases CE from the other players in the market I don't particularly enjoy the price of CE rising but that's inevitable, at least until they come out with the next energy pack with whatever costume or gewgaw for you to enjoy. But the fact remains, if you dislike the system don't participate.
The system is and will continue to be seller based. As the influx of CE has to come from someone and I doubt it's the F2P players.
tl;dr - If you don't want to pay those prices for CE then just don't purchase it. Stay your hand and wait until it drops at the next sale. However if you don't want to purchase it someone will, because they care less about it than you do.
Sat, 08/27/2011 - 01:09
#7
The difference is that the
The difference is that the auction house is meant to be a crown sink, while the energy market isn't. The 2% fee is mainly to discourage arbitrage, so that the main reason to buy and sell energy is because you want more energy or more crowns, rather than trying to buy low and sell high. Making it more expensive to sell energy would lead to fewer people selling it, and thus higher prices. That's not the effect that you're seeking.
Sat, 08/27/2011 - 07:26
#8
" Making it more expensive to
" Making it more expensive to sell energy would lead to fewer people selling it, and thus higher prices. That's not the effect that you're seeking."
That's not more expensive, it's just riskier. It's a refunded listing fee. Refunded, upon sale, with a time limit. Prehaps you could leave CE up for a whole week though, I dunno. And lower prices could have lower risk. Prehaps only 100 crowns for a 5k price, but then it would jump to 1000 if you hit 10k? Variable rate might help.
We all know that just capping CE is a horrible idea, but how can we sort of anchor it so it dosent make the game less fun? Listing fees based off Last sale price instead, not the listed price. Assume that three rings said, in their little batcave, that CE = 5k value, dispite buy price.
Let's do math;
Make a graph with a table of
X-Y
0-0
1-1 (plus 1x and 1y)
2-2 (plus 1x and 1y)
3-3 (plus 1x and 1y)
A straight line. Risk is always equal.
Now let's try this instead;
X-Y
0-0
3-1 (plus 3x and 1y)
6-3 (plus 3x and 2y)
9-9 (plus 3x and 3y)
11-12 (plus 2x and 3y)
12-15 (plus 1x and 3y)
A changing curve. the slope increases and decreases at a fixed rate. The apex would obviously be 9,9, the point where the Y starts increasing more than X if you continue onward, and where X will decrease less than Y if you go backward. Make 9 your prefered CE prce, and that's the spot with even risk and reward.
If you go higher than that point, you'r risking slightly too much for not quite enough. You can still profit more, but if you screw up, your screw up is much more painful, so the price will drop due to too much risk.
If you go back from there, you won't profit much, but if you mess up, you lose almost no money, so you try to raise the price since there is no risk to you.
Therefore the best risk reward ratio will be that spot, and CE will stabilize around there.
Sat, 08/27/2011 - 09:56
#9
Also, It'd be nice if someone
Also, It'd be nice if someone put up a equation for those, I'm too lazy and I have 100 mist.
Mon, 08/29/2011 - 03:34
#10
Difficult equation.
I cannot think of any equation that obeys those numbers exactly. (I am also not exactly sure what you are sugesting, is x the Crowns put down in thousands and the Y is the crowns listing fee (in hundreds?).
Try and equation like a*(x/b)^c, where c is some arbitrary number that indicates how quickly it changes, and a and b tailor it to the sweet spot. b is the crowns put down, a is the listing fee.
if a=9, b=9 and c=2, then you have this:
3=1
6=4
9=9
11=13.5
12=16
With this, trying to make 11 and 12 lower will result in 3 and 6 being higher.
Although I don't see how this will help.
Currently you have people buying CE, and they are continually beating each other's prices. The people that want crowns, typically want them now and thus will sell the CE for them rather than putting an offer on the market, they are not the ones dictating prices.
Putting a risk in for those buying wont help, as the lower risk will be higher prices, so the prices will keep going up and up and up, it will put a lower limit on the price, not an upper limit (and we already effectively have one of them from people not wanting to waste there money).
Tue, 08/30/2011 - 16:46
#11
Err, I just mean the rise/run
Err, I just mean the rise/run changes at a fixed rate.
goes forward three, up one,
forward three, up two,
forward three, up three (middle, where CE is stable due to equal risk/reward)
Forward three, up four. ( i put up three forward 2, hmm.)
Etc, etc.
Basicaly going up from 5k, the risk gets higher, then allot higher, then to the point where it's not worth selling, and the prices are undershot to avoid nonsale, dropping it. If you go down from 5K, the risk gets lower, and lower, and sellers will put offers much higher than the current one becuase it dosent matter if CE dosent sell.
Right now that fee comes at the end of the transaction.
Forcing the poster to pay that upfront would discourage people from trying to make market caps at high prices, but at the moment the buyer pays the fee.