Spiral Knights - Buff the Wheel of Uselessness

Buff the Wheel of Uselessness

62 replies [Last post]

Fri, 10/07/2011 - 23:46

Eiroku

Currently the spin of the wheel gets you one of the following: a tier-leveled pickup, a tier-leveled heart, 5 crowns, 10 crowns, and 25 crowns. Are you serious? 5, 10, and 15 crowns? I get more from a silver-gold consumable. The entire thing seems like a way to lull the player into thinking "ooooh, maybe I'll get the box THIS time." and instead of giving them things that would be useful as an alternative you give them absolute crap so the crush of not getting the box hits harder, and if they ever do get one they'll be satisfied longer.

TL;DR My proposal for actually useful rewards:

10-mist mist tanks (little mini tanks, don't know if they exist already) rare
at LEAST 100, 500, 1000 crowns. I can't reiterate this enough, 5, 10 15 looks like it was accidentally left in during development. Fix it
Tier appropriate recipe rare
- Further note: Recipe I don't know. As you move up in tiers the current tier becomes more rare, but you can still earn lower tier recipes. Example: Tier 1: 2% chance of 2* recipe. Tier 2: 3% chance of 2* recipe, 2% chance of 3* recipe. Tier 3: 4% chance of 2*, 3% chance of 3*, 2% chance of 4*, 1% chance of 5 star
Keep the tier-appropriate pickups, they're not all that bad
Don't give me a heart when I have a full bar, come on. And if you do, don't make it tier-level BS, fully restore me
BONUS HEAT! Right now bosses are the hardest fights because they're bosses but they yield less heat than any other map, it doesn't make sense. Currently it's hardest fight, least reward. Why isn't it hardest fight, greatest reward? I don't understand this decision
Random item, max of 3* rare
Random usable (krogmo booster, heat booster, trinket unlock, weapon unlock, etc.) rare

I probably left a few of the ideas I had floating in my head out of the list but that seems to me a pretty decent way to make the wheel actually useful. It's pitiful right now, it's a waste of time. If the rewards don't change there's no reason to leave the wheel in, just make the box a percentage drop from a boss or something. Don't take the previous sentence seriously; I think if you take this list into consideration and actually improve the wheel then players won't find it so pointless.

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 00:04

Khamsin

Most of your ideas are awful,

Most of your ideas are awful, namely "100, 500, 1000 crowns.". That would be the best way to break the economy.

The only thing I agree with is mini-mist tanks. That would be sweet, a chance to have your level essentially "free" without breaking the economy. Rarity on par with lockboxes.

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 00:07

Eiroku

Why would it break the

Why would it break the economy? You already get WAY more than 100,500,1000 crowns during a standard tier run. I usually get 5k crowns running between tiers. Also explain the "awful" in my ideas. It's not helpful just to bash them and not be constructive.

And definitely not on par with lockboxes, I'd say at least double the chance to get one. Lockboxes if I had to guess are what a 1% chance if that?

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 00:08

Varja

i agree so&so

mini-tanks=yes
more crowns=yes (exept the 1000cr is a little to much)
recipe=no
heat=yes
random item=no
usables=yes (but must be VREY rare)

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 00:08

Madadder

i say it's currently better

i say it's currently better than nothing

i admit 1 AND I MEAN 1 mini mist tank would be nice to see

the money increase is too high at most 50 crowns should be added

recipes should only come from basil

the game doesn't care if you're at full health or not it's just bad luck

bosses are here for the tokens that they yield not the heat...

the a 3* item lower is welcome but should be very rare

no to the krogmo booster, heat booster, trinket unlock, weapon unlock, etc OOO are trying to run a business

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 00:09

Varja

And...

i remember the order of rewards i gotten

stun vial
5cr
heart
5cr
5cr
5cr
15cr
15cr

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 00:17

Eiroku

For these posts please give

For these posts please give reasons. no/yes responses are just as useless as the 5 crowns the wheel spits out.

@madadder. 50 crowns is ridiculous, you get that from a gold coin, I'd settle for a max of 250 or 500 and a minimum of 100. It's gotta be USEFUL! less that 100 is pointless, it might as well not happen at all.

Why recipes only from basil? Explain your position.

The game doesn't "care" but it KNOWS. It's not hard, programmaticly, to determine that you already have full health and skip it. The decision of which item the wheel lands on isn't happening in real time. It's randomly chosen, then it's animated.

Lol at the OOO are trying to run a business part. They JUST introduced the system that makes you pay $2.50 for a CHANCE at getting an accessory that you LOSE if you don't like it because you don't get a preview of it.

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 00:26

Madadder

someone already said it would

someone already said it would break the economy read that again. it doesnt have to be ANYTHING, i assume you've been playing for awhile before the wheel was even added.

recipes is the cornerstone of the few crown sinks we have know please don't ruin it

i'm fairly certain it was designed to randomly generate prizes not examine you and base the prizes on what your condition is

there is a preview screen at the accessory NPC, look under the left screen where he sells the tickets. aside from that, yes, a business that's what they do offer incentive to buy energy from them

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 00:35

Eiroku

Yes yes, I get it. It'll

Yes yes, I get it. It'll break the economy. No one has explained why however. Introducing new cashflow is not breaking the economy. It will take some time to adjust but economies have to grow.

> i'm fairly certain it was designed to randomly generate prizes not examine you and base the prizes on what your condition is

As far as it is right now I'd say it's not designed at all. With that said, if it's not incredibly trivial for the developers to update it to inspect the condition of the player and change the result accordingly then I can do nothing but insult their intelligence and lack of foresight.

The recipes I could care less about, but your reaction to the idea is as if they'd be a common occurrence. Make them rare, I don't care. But you have to have something in the wheel besides a .01% chance of a useful item. Like I said, if they don't update it they might as well remove it.

For the boosters, sure take them out. Leave that for OOO to make some money off of as if the CE market wasn't generating mountains of cash big enough already.

Finally I'm going to address your first point: "it doesn't have to be ANYTHING." Let me set this scene for you: Your parents take you to the county fair, you're excited you could take home a stuffed animal, that'd be nice. However, they've neglected to inform you that all the prizes available are clumps of dirt, lint and a pair of shoelaces. But you saw one kid earlier taking out a stuffed animal. The weird part about it was that the animal was in a locked crate. And to open the crate you had to go back to the front desk and buy a key.

The fact that the wheel is in the game removes your ability to say "it doesn't have to be ANYTHING" because if they didn't want it to be anything, it wouldn't; they would've left it out. But guess what, it is. This has become quite existential but I digress. They've added a county fair and filled the prize trays with dirt when they could give out decent prizes.

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 00:35

Antiope

No.

You're not going to get anything from the developers that would break their business model, so massive giveaways on energy/crowns (or their equivalents in recipes/consumables) is not going to happen. Sorry, I don't see how Three Rings is going to slash their own throats economically when everyone was perfectly content to tally their heat and move onto the next level without any such inducement a mere day ago.

I could see removal of hearts from the wheel if you're already at full life, but since mobs will continue dropping hearts and health capsules when everyone's perfectly healthy...yeah, I'm not seeing that either.

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 00:44

#10

Eiroku

You can't say something like

You can't say something like "break their business model" and not back it up. Nothing about improving the player economy breaks their business model. Nothing about adding a 1% chance of a mini-mist tank or a 3* item or 250 crowns is going to break it.

This is a new system, they have the opportunity to be new so comparing the wheel to something mobs drop is not useful. (referring to mobs still dropping hearts)

Nothing about giving the players 50 crowns at the lift will break the economy when they just got finished picking up 1000. Let's say they play an entire tier. For simplicity's sake let's say a tier is 10 maps. I average around 5k for a tier run IIRC. If I got perfect rolls on the wheel every time (perfect being the max of 250 crowns) I'd make an extra 2,500 crowns. That's the absolute perfect scenario. The more likely scenario is that I get some hearts, and some consumables, in there and most likely some 50-100 crown spins. So let's take the average case of 3 spins out of 10 being crowns, and those being the standard 100 crown roll. I made an extra 300 crowns or a whopping extra 6% crowns on my entire run. I fail to see how this is economy breaking or slashing one's own throat to steal hyperbole.

To say that everyone was fine with the old system is moot. It's not the old system anymore. "Deez is new woods" as it were.

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 00:51

#11

Madadder

pumping money into the

pumping money into the economy devalues the currency as a whole causing inflation to occur. happy now?

fine no hearts... what is equally useless to balance what was taken out? heat ember? a vita-pod? u can't just fill it with top notch stuff or it will become trivial and don't go into the amount of money or the clockwork vials and stuff

NPCs sell recipes and not magically generate from random drops. i wasnt opposed to the 3* item drop because i got pre-made items from boxes

the boosters are a CE sink. i've seen players with thousands of units of energy, now ask yourself "how can i get that player to spend energy other than runs through the clockworks and crafting? pvp is possible but it's not for everyone..." i could go on but you get my point

im not going to argue that overly bias situation so long as i had fun i would have been happy, but other than that... i am grateful for what ever the prize wheel gives me every hearts when i don't need them, you should be too instead of being selfish and asking for more more more. it makes getting the good prizes so much more rewarding

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 01:05

#12

Eiroku

Just for starters you exactly

Just for starters you exactly embodied my first point with your last sentence. They've, as far as I can tell, intentionally made the system to be barren except for the .01% chance of a box so you feel so much more warm and fuzzy when you get one that you're willing to wait even _longer_ next time.

The devaluation of currency only has a substantial impact on debt and the currently set prices (the auctionhouse) Seeing as how there's no such thing as debt we can put that one aside. Solution for the currently set prices... raise them. Whoa, holy crap, I just blew my own mind. Will the people that currently have items in the auction house lose? No. There won't be an instant explosion of money coming into the economy. Players are still going to gradually earn it. The auction house will naturally grow to the new market cap.

But you're wrong, they do magically generate them. Every night at midnight a random set is up for sale. It randomly creates a few of a certain item every day. Why relegate that to a seller when you have the opportunity of having it a rare (albeit very rare, however rare you want) from the wheel.
EDIT: I was mistaking the item sellers with the recipe sellers so I'll fix this by saying the point pretty much still stands, when basil sells a recipe it leaves his shop and you have to buy it on the AH. He's no different from the wheel; you may get lucky and get to him in time or you'll have to go to the AH.

I'm not against OOO making money. I've dumped my share of cash into their tills. What I am against is slimy psychological manipulation when they have a more "kind" way of going about it. Right now it's starvation and then a feast. You go to the wheel, you see that it's 5c and you go "Well.. that was a waste of 10 seconds." When it could be steady meals and a feast. If you got to the wheel and you're just absolutely disappointed almost every time it's not fun. If I get a passable consolation prize, not only am I going to be happy but I'm going to be more excited and more willing to get to the wheel. Not just for the feast, but for my usual meal. So instead you get to the wheel and go, "Dang, no box but at least I got 50c" or "at least I got this mini tank" etc.

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 01:07

#13

Antiope

Giving away energy on a F2P

Giving away energy on a F2P game, where their main income source is from players buying energy does indeed break the model. "Improving the player economy" is rather disingenuous because you want this "improvement" by increasing the amount of free energy that enters the system. This directly infringes on the develeper's ability to sell that energy. It's really that simple.

"Oh, but it's rare!" Not on the scale of the game, it won't be. The average player will see 100 levels before getting one of those events, but with thousands of players going through multiple levels, per day, the overall system will see a large influx almost immediately. And this doesn't even account for the fact that you're seeding the wheel with multiple rare chances at something of significant value -- these all stack in a statistical manner, so that at the very least quadruples the expected value of goods entering the market this way. Why on Earth should the developers give up a potentially large amount of their income potential?

The old system was fine, and this system is fine, because there's nothing broken with the old system. Adding a minor bonus to something that was not in anyway a subject of complaints doesn't make new complaints about the perceived stinginess of that bonus valid.

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 01:16

#14

Eiroku

I don't understand how you

I don't understand how you could be content with the wheel as it stands. It's pointless. There are a lot less psychologically crushing ways to do it. If OOO intentionally put the system in place as it is then they don't care about their playerbase at all and they're pure profit. It's OK if they are but they might as well have just pumped out another crappy eastern MMO clone. I'd like to believe they aren't that evil. That they made a game they enjoy for other people to enjoy.

With that said I don't think you understand the concept of "rare" as it pertains programmatically. They can easily set a gate in there that says "OK, 10,000 people have rolled, increase the chance by 0.01%." then someone will ding it, then the gate will say, "OK, someone got the prize, lower it's chance by 0.01%" to keep a bottlenecked flow on it. It doesn't have to be a set 1% chance where in the off chance that the planets align everyone hits that 1% chance and the market is flooded with Brandishes or something. They could even put timers on it so it's only possible for someone to win the prize in a random time interval between and undisclosed start and 2 days after the previous win. So players won't know someone has won the prize but there is a cap set on how many can enter the marketplace. It's not a simple game of rolling the dice, it can have logic applied.

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 01:20

#15

Madadder

do u know how many players

do u know how many players don't use the AH for the very reason of the 10%? lots want to avoid that and spam trade instead. ok i am wrong but i would like to emphasize "a random set is up for sale" again i would like to point back to "one of the cornerstone of CR sinks" if u haven't noticed we still need crown sinks. i might be willing to change my mind later but not for now

now you're comparing apples and oranges, its not like crowns are vital to the well being of the knights. they may extend playtime through purchase of CE but nothing that can't wait for more ME. some money (not a lot, less than 100) is better than none. this is psychological, much like playing the slots at a casino only you are guaranteed a prize, some people just want another shot at that wheel (i admit to this sometimes)

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 01:26

#16

Eiroku

My entire point is that the

My entire point is that the "another shot at the wheel" is not rewarding now. When I see 5c pop up, that doesn't make me happy that I got another shot at the wheel and say to myself, "Not bad, maybe I'll get it next time." It makes me say, "That was a waste of my time" The alternative is giving rewards that they can still control so they don't ruin their business plan but give the player actual incentive. 5c is not incentive. A heart I don't need is not incentive. A vial that I can't use is not incentive. They might as well have not run it. I return to my food analogy: Right now they're starving you and holding a feast behind a cage when they could _just as easily_ give you some scraps in the mean time.

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 01:34

#17

Antiope

I am content with the rewards

I am content with the rewards because I view them for what they are: something I didn't earn above and beyond what I would have done anyway, because the game is about the combat, not spinning the stupid wheel. You're claiming it's "psychologically crushing" but that's hyperbole. Why are you even playing the game? And if you're so set on having these fabulous rewards, when you don't get them you'll do what then, since you insist they are going to be so painfully rare?

As you're trying to sell this concept, I can't imagine that somehow this new scenario where you keep winding down the odds makes you more satisfied than the present setup because you're racing to make the jackpot an asymptotically null chance. The difference between winning 25 crowns 75% of the time versus winning 25 crowns 74.999% and a mini mist tank 0.001% is qualitatively indistinguishable, and statistically so small as to be lost in noise.

I guess I'm okay with that, if you're willing to water down your proposal so much that the average person will go on average three years before he can tell this new and improved bonus wheel is better.

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 01:39

#18

Madadder

When I see 5c pop up, that

When I see 5c pop up, that doesn't make me happy that I got another shot
i notice you refer to yourself in this instance instead of broadening to everyone. Casino slot machine often don't pay out anything yet people still continue to play them just for that chance of a pay out, just because you don't feel it doesn't mean the playerbase doesn't.

ok i'll run with the food analogy, they aren't starving you at all, you know why? because that "meal" or "feast" was the very level you had to get through to get to the end. if anything the wheel is an after dinner mint, a token saying that your meal is done would you like the next course?

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 01:40

#19

Eiroku

No more hyperbolic than this

No more hyperbolic than this idea slashing the company's economic throat.

Don't take my percentages literally, they're pure toss-ups. I was just putting forth that these are not simple dice rolls where it HAS to be 1% every time. It can be controlled by logic, it can be gated, it can be bottlenecked, it can be slowed or stopped. No matter how they do it the chances of it appearing could be completely invisible to the average player outside of "really rare, rare, common" or similar simplifications.

The average person will tell it's new because they're seeing more than crowns and vials. Variety is the spice of life. Right now there are basically 3 things to choose from. Crown, vial/heart and the incredibly rare chance of the box. All I'm saying is to introduce some new common items, some new rare items and some new really rare items. I don't care what they are. They can be completely new things. As long as there's more than 3.

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 01:42

#20

Eiroku

@Madadder

The casino slot machine analogy breaks down because slot machines have gradient prices. You can win nothing, you can win a little, you can win a decent amount, you can win a lot, and you can hit the jackpot. The current system is binary. You win a useless item, or you get the jackpot.

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 01:49

#21

Antiope

But the essence of your

But the essence of your suggestions, after all, is that the rarity is going to be such that, to avoid the issues I'm bringing up, there isn't going to be more than the three typical results on anything except the longest time scale. Okay. I'll be happy to gate it so that on a typical Monte Carlo simulation you need multiple million-trial runs to prove it's distinguishable from what it is now. You're not going to pick a figure, but I will do it for you because this is what you're trying to imply without saying so, and it only brings me back to the point in my last post. You can't have it both ways so you can get warm fuzzy feelings about possibly winning something that is a statistical aberration otherwise, because right now we already have items that aren't hearts/crowns/vials in the wheel with much better odds. If those aren't satisfactory at their present odds, then you're got enormous cognitive dissonance in insisting that these new prizes at some substantially lower probabilities is an improvement.

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 01:50

#22

Madadder

ok fine but my food analogy

ok fine but my food analogy still holds up

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 01:56

#23

Eiroku

@Antiope I didn't say they'd

@Antiope I didn't say they'd all be rare. I said introduce new options at all the rarity levels: common, uncommon, rare, "jackpot" items.

@madadder I halfway cede that point because it does make sense and I'd fully cede it if I accepted the presupposition that this is a purely additive feature to the existing game of playing a map. I halfway cede the point because it is my opinion that the experience is mentally separate, i.e., I play a map "cool, I'm done, that was fun." then *bang* I'm in the lift and ready to start fresh with another game which is the Prize Wheel.

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 02:21

#24

Antiope

So let's get this straight

So let's get this straight then, a little bonus heat and a "fix" of a 10 fold increase in crowns is what you want? It sounds like at this point you're willing to concede that bonus jackpots should payout as frequently as the multistate Powerball lottery, so can we safely bury that entirely now?

As far as crowns are concerned I'm not sure that giving away 500 crowns, which at current energy market spot price represents a full rebate on the energy cost of that particular level, is doing anyone any favors. Give it away too much and all you do is create inflation, rendering it pointless. Give it away too infrequently and, well, you're back to where we are in my jackpot argument.

An in-game economy responds quickly to changes in monetary supply. Since in principle you're making the game print more money, all that money is simply going to be sloshing around chasing the same limited things: crystal energy and player crafted items. Prices will simply rise in proportion to the amount of free money people have. If it makes you happy, I have no problems with it money increases. But I suspect such happiness will be short lived when people start asking 25000 crowns for 100 CE and the 500 crown payout buys you no more than what a 25 crown would have originally.

Edit: Vendor recipes would be broken as a money sink. Oops?

For heat, sure, why not. A small, medium or big ember for everyone once every five spins of the wheel wouldn't break anything, balance wise.

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 02:52

#25

Starlinvf

@Eiroku

All the other arguments are ultimately irrelevant once you realize that the entire purpose of the Prize wheel is to distribute the new Lockboxes, without having players in-fighting over it like they would a rare drop. The minor prizes are there simply to fill the void so players don't consider it a total loss (yet most complain about it anyway), but without having a huge impact on the economy as a whole.

What your suggesting is injecting large amounts of high value items into the system, at no additional cost or risk, and at a high frequency. If flooding a closed market with something doesn't affect the economy, I'm sure Harvard would love for you to teach a class on how this would work.

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 05:12

#26

Effrul

Guys guys guys Three Rings

Guys guys guys Three Rings are giving us free stuff at the end of every level but I don't think the free stuff I'm getting is enough free stuff! Waaahhhh!

ARE YOU *£@$ING KIDDING ME

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 07:05

#27

Crystalwyte

I'm fine with it the way it

I'm fine with it the way it is, personally. The idea of free Micro Mist Tanks (as we already have Mini at 15, I believe) appeals to me as a major ME user, and sounds decently practical, but really, that's not the point of the wheel at all.

I do think a heat thing could be valid. Not any large amount, just a single orange orb of it (small, medium, maybe large). Of course, since you're already tallying your heat up at that time it'd be slightly difficult to implement, plus it'd give away the "secret" of just how much a single orb adds to your heat anyway.

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 07:44

#28

Merethif

Starlinvf explained the

Starlinvf explained the issue. Thread closed :-D

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 07:46

#29

Mohandar

u mad

I can't believe that people are attacking the prize wheel already. There is NO penalty to you, and only benefit, at least if you look on a small scale. Yesterday you got nothing for completing a level. Today you are getting 5-25cr, very occasionally a lockbox worth ~10-20kcr, and sometimes a vial or heart. How are you possibly worse off than before?

Increasing prize wheel rewards is bad for the (SK) economy because more crowns chasing the same amount of CE means the crown cost of CE goes up. Perhaps going up to 100cr would be acceptable (that's a gold coin), but even that is pushing it. The prize wheel isn't meant to supplement your income; it's meant to be a gimmick to make you feel happier at the end of a level, and to distribute lockboxes. Effrul about sums it up, although a little less vitriol would be nice.

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 10:03

#30

Nicoya-Kitty

I still want to win a

I still want to win a chroma...

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 11:12

#31

Gwenyvier

The prize wheel was added for

The prize wheel was added for one reason, to give out Iron Lockboxes at random. The other options for it were a monster drop, treasure chest drop, or a PvP bribe prize. Monster and treasure drops would probably be so stinking rare that you MIGHT see a handful of them by now. PvP bribe reward would just piss people off. Highly sought after items that would probably end up bound to you...

Back to the real issue...
It's FREE! Completely free as long as you're around when the floor ends. You can be dead and still get the prize wheel, I know, I tried it for giggles. Quit complaining that you're not getting enough and be happy you get something for doing nothing more then you would have previously. I've gotten hearts 5 times going to Basil/subtown floors. All you'll hear from me is a quick quip about it and I'll move on. Why? Because prior to it being there I would have gotten something between zero and nothing.

Be glad the slots that don't hold a Lockbox are filled with goodies instead of a Gremlin laughing at you. (Actually... OOO put in a laughing Gremlin! I'd find that funny as hell to land on occasionally!)

~Gwen

[edit]
hey... hey you... yea you, the kid with the pants sagging around your knees you have so much money in them... hey man, i'll give you this cage full o toy for some money man. how much? uhhhh, 10 bucks, sound good man? yea, the guy over there can open the cage, bye!

Oh, one more thing...

Wheel of morality turn turn turn, tell us the lesson we should learn!

Give yourself 5 points if you catch the reference.

~Newg

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 11:15

#32

Plaguerider

I won an Iron Lockbox last

I won an Iron Lockbox last night. But do you know what I was winning from the wheel last week? ABSOLUTLY NOTHING. But we were given a means to get an additional free boost from our play, by chance of course. What I'm saying is that if we keep complaining about what is being handed to us, they may as well just take it back. I was content before it came out, but now I find it to be a fun "I wonder if today is my lucky day" moment.

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 12:09

#33

Knight-Solaire

@OP

Well, let's see...

A) It can go back to the way it was, where you get nothing at all.
B) You can start being happy the wheel gives you anything extra to begin with.

Seriously, OOO gives you an inch and now you want to walk all over them. If you can't see why 1000 crown rolls would break the economy without someone spelling it out for you, then that's exactly why no one will take these ideas seriously. Even as a pure F2P'er I can see that most if not all of these ideas are horrendous, and that you just want stuff handed to you.

Also, how is it a waste of time? It takes exactly the same amount of time as the post-level heat distribution, and both happen concurrently.

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 14:27

#34

Marazo

what ive gotten:10crblue

what ive gotten:
10cr
blue shard
heart
heart
heart
heart
heart
5cr
vial
25cr
triple heart (going into a terminal...)
25cr
vial
heart
heart

A little less on the hearts there?

PS: gold coins are worth 50 crowns, not 100

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 17:34

#35

Remiliaoftheearth

I have no problem.

Just give me cr, however little, and I'm fine.
D-9: Stun.
D-10: Iron Lockbox (or was it 11?)
D-11: 25 cr.
D12: 25 cr.
D14: 25 cr.
D15: 10 cr.
D16: 10 cr.
D17 (Boss fight: Jelly King): 2* material, was it Power Cell?

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 23:15

#36

Xmastershakex

yeahb man

yeahb man u should totaly indo this into the game

Sun, 10/09/2011 - 00:14

#37

Starlinvf

@Gwenyvier

"Be glad the slots that don't hold a Lockbox are filled with goodies instead of a Gremlin laughing at you. (Actually... OOO put in a laughing Gremlin! I'd find that funny as hell to land on occasionally!)"

No whammy, no whammy, no whammy, STOP!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fnTbO26u9bQ

Sun, 10/09/2011 - 08:08

#38

Warpmonger

... I absolutely saw no point

... I absolutely saw no point in that no whammy stop stuff, star...

In any case, perhaps the wheel should be buffed just a little bit,
for one less hearts, we don't need it especially when we are full or when we are a terminal to heal up anyway.
2. maybe just a subtle increase of crowns, 5-10-15 crowns is not enough to make me happy that i actually won something GOOD.
maybe 15-30-60?
3. And finally the mini mist tanks- I would LOVE to have something that would boost my Energy during combat especially when you die and use up energy.

well those are my points Agree or Disagree?

Sun, 10/09/2011 - 09:03

#39

Starlinvf

I must be too old when a

I must be too old when a whammy reference is lost......

Maybe this one is fresh and hip enough.... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wCy8MpT45gk&feature=player_detailpage#t=2s

Sun, 10/09/2011 - 10:30

#40

Hasturhasturhastur

I'm with the OP on most of

I'm with the OP on most of this stuff. After doing about 25 T3 levels and not receiving even one Iron Lockbox, I'm starting to become even more suspicious of OOO's "random" number generator.

In any case, my suggestions for "fixing" the wheel:
> Multiply all crown amounts by 10.
> Remove the capsules/vials and replace them with more materials.
> If a player has full health and would receive a Heart, give them 250 crowns instead.
> If the elevator is descending to a Clockwork Terminal / subtown, replace Hearts with 250 crowns in the wheel.
> Roughly double the rate of finding Iron Lockboxes.
> Add rare bonus heat (10% of what you've earned in the level?)
> Add rare non-boss tokens.

Sun, 10/09/2011 - 11:01

#41

Starlinvf

I got 2 lockboxes in one day

I got 2 lockboxes in one day while investigating something in stratum 4, and did a total of 6 levels. T2 has a lower probability of getting a box then T3, so I don't think the system is "fixed" as in boxing match.

If this is going to be such a dramatic issue, they may as well pull crowns out of the prize wheel so we can put this argument to rest already.

Sun, 10/09/2011 - 11:11

#42

Xxpapaya

Coins overload

I totally agree that we should get better stuff (the recipes, mist tanks an all) you know what i have been getting for the last few days???
1-bronze coin
2-bronze coin
3-bronze coin
4-green shard
5-silver coin
7-half gold coin
8-silver coin
9-bronze coin
etc
I had more luck killing a mob and getting skelly suit......

Sun, 10/09/2011 - 11:21

#43

Starlinvf

*facepalm*

I'm gonna assume that no one reads past the 2nd post before replying........

Sun, 10/09/2011 - 11:49

#44

Autofire

Think before you suggest stuff like this.

I can't see how some of you don't know about economy. I haven't even taken it in school yet(I'm almost 14), and even I know that getting 250/500 CR would break it.* Aside from that, you don't lose anything for spinning the wheel. You don't pay, oh say, 1 energy to spin. It's absolutely free. So what's better? 0 CR or 5? There is no need to remove it.

I do think adding tokens(Primal, Grim, and Forge) to the wheel would be fine, that actually seems to fit. A heart at full HP is no problem, that's just like the gremlin laughing thing. Also, I've never gotten a vial that I can't take. Say, I have freeze, curse, poison, and fire vials, I won't get a stun vial. If I have 3 of each, I won't even get any vials at all.

And about the materials, I've gotten 2 so far. I can't remember one of them, but the other was a Rock Salt. That doesn't drop from enemies, ever. I've never gotten a Lock Box, but that doesn't mean you should make them more common. Just buy one of the AH if you want one that badly. If they get too common, then they would become almost worthless.

*Just so you don't complain that I didn't give a reason why, it's because so many people would be getting at least 1K from a run of these things. That may not seem like much, but add it up? you're getting 1-2K per run, go on ten runs. The gain from just the wheel? 10-20K. That's enough at least 200 CE. Everyone pay CR instead of $$$ for CE. That would be bad for OOO health.

Sun, 10/09/2011 - 12:03

#45

Effrul

I cannot believe this is even

I cannot believe this is even still a discussion. LISTEN UP, YOU ENTITLED SHOWER OF WHINERS: you are getting FREE STUFF. Do you understand? You are getting stuff! For free! You did not have to do anything, beyond getting to the end of a level, which I can only assume you were going to do anyway.

Three Rings do not need to buff the prizes that this guaranteed-get-something wheel distributes. You need to adjust your expectations. You are not owed fat cash prizes because you got to the lift. Here is a little something extra on top of what you culled from the level already. You did nothing to earn this extra something, but that's OK, have it anyway. Sometimes it's not much but sometimes its rad, but it is always, always free.

Sun, 10/09/2011 - 12:10

#46

Autofire

Takes sides with Effrul

Total agree. I might send you a friend request. :)

Sun, 10/09/2011 - 14:07

#47

Crystalwyte

Agrees with above poster.

I think I might wish to do that myself...

After thinking about it more, the only thing I wish is that I might get materials more often. But oh well.

Sun, 10/09/2011 - 16:40

#48

Warpmonger

Wow... Effrul... U mad bro?

Wow... Effrul... U mad bro? :D

We REALLY do appreciate the FREE part of getting stuff so no need to go on a RAGE dude.
Its just a suggestion.

Sun, 10/09/2011 - 20:37

#49

Buzz-Bomb

Prize wheel does need a big change

Once the wheel came out I did a vana run. Got a lockbox at depth 19 then crowns and other junk the rest of the way.

They need to change the rarity of the items, like make crowns less rare but in slightly larger amounts.
I also hate getting a vial as a "prize" -.-
I mean really, how is a vial a prize?
Hearts are ok but they should heal to full, but if hearts are like that then they would need to be rarer.
I love the mist tank idea. I don't care what size the mist tank is, I just like it.
Forge, Primal, and Grim sparks should be in the wheel.
They should make mats more rare but make them better, cause I have a ton of mats and don't need more of what I'm not using.

On a side note: What is the green, chroma, frog head thing i see pass by in the wheel? And what do you get from it?

Sun, 10/09/2011 - 21:40

#50

Lanieu

I agree the wheel is nearly

I agree the wheel is nearly pointless. I got 2 boxes first night out of 7 depths. So far out of maybe 100, none.

The worst is getting hearts after beating Vanaduke and descending into the core....really? After all that, you give me a heart. Thanks.

Crowns def need a boost. 50, 100, 150 would suffice.

Vials are pointless ( I can see keeping in pills).

Sparks should be in wheel, I agree.

Heat should be.

Mini mist tanks should.

Adding in all this good stuff lowers the chance of getting it, but its better than vials....or a brimstone material.

-Lan

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