Spiral Knights - Hunter vs the World - Survival PvP game, complete with Classes, Skills, Maps and Pursuing Gameplay!!

Hunter vs the World - Survival PvP game, complete with Classes, Skills, Maps and Pursuing Gameplay!!

375 replies [Last post]

Fri, 01/13/2012 - 19:55

Blue-Phaze

I'd like to know if you guys would like a new PvP consisting on all vs 1 gameplay. I was inspired by some 3 on 1 minigames from the Mario Party game series. TL;DR at the bottom.

Basics:
Called "Survival", the game works in rounds and is placed in a medium sized maze, probably the size of a Blast Network arena, with no dead ends but filled with obstacles such as traps and places to hide. There are no teams and no costumes or trinkets are allowed.
In each round, a player, out of a max of 6, is randomly chosen to be the Hunter (although you can only be it once per match).
The remaining players are called Preys for that round and are meant to survive while the Hunter tries to chase and kill them all.
Players are respawned at the start of each round at their respective respawn points (Hunter at the middle of the map and Preys scattered around it). The chat and name viewing during play would be disabled for the entire match, in order to prevent alliances from forming or spectating Preys from snitching the Hunter's location.

Prey and Hunter Classes:
There are three Hunter classes players can choose from (Concepts by Skold-The-Drac):
Juggernaut
Damage Bonus - Medium (Any weapon);
Movement Speed Increase - Ultra x5 (Twice the normal speed);
Attack Speed Increase - Medium;
Health Bonus - (10, 20, 40. Respectively for each Tier);
Guardian Shield.

Assassin
Damage Bonus - High (Guns and swords);
Movement Speed Increase - Ultra x3 (160% of the normal speed);
Attack Speed Increase - Very High;
Health Bonus - Half the Juggernaut's (5, 10, 20);
Half-visible when shielding (Similar to Chromalisks).

Bombardier
Damage Bonus - Very High (Only for bombs);
Movement Speed Increase - Ultra x5 (200% of the normal speed);
Charge Time Reduction - Very High;
Health Bonus - 3/4 the Juggernaut's (8, 15, 30);
Normal Shield.

(If you don't agree with any bonuses, please tell me why and how you would fix it)

Preys would be able to shield-bump the Hunter, as a standard defense, and can choose from three modified LD classes:

Strikers
Their Boost would be nerfed to be as fast as an Assassin. They'd only shield-bump if they block at the same moment they're hit.
Guardians
They wouldn't have expanded shields (only the personal, as usual) and wouldn't heal anyone in any way. Normal shield-bumping.
Recons
No Recon Markings would be emitted and they'd be half-visible, just like Assassins. Normal shield-bumping.

Since different Hunter and Prey Classes get different boosts in speed, it may seem a bit confusing how certain ocasions would behave. Aemicus gave me the idea of presenting a 0 to 10 Speed Scale which should give you a better idea of these events:
10 -- Juggernaut and Bombardier
8 ---- Boosted Striker, Assassin and cloaked Assassin
7 ---- Shielded Juggernaut or Bombardier
5 ---- Guardian, Striker, Recon and cloaked Recon
3 ---- Shielded Guardian

Stun would work as it normally does, probably dropping any speed in 1 or 2 units.

Hunter Gameplay, Status and Skills:
Gameplay
Hunters would have clear sight only in a limited radius around them, just like Graveyard levels in the Clockworks, but much more short-sighted (About 2/3 of the screen). Assassins would have an even shorter sight (half of the screen) due to their ability of spotting Preys outside the clear sight zone (See "Skills" below). Hunters wouldn't be able to shield-bump Preys, but should be really hard to take down, although not harder than killing all the Preys; in other words, it should be harder being the Hunter than being a Prey on a skilled "team" (Everyone's basically by themselves).

Status Resistances and Immunities
Hunters would have basic status resistances of 25% of their damage and/or duration, which added to other resistances of the same status would have a limit of 60%, to prevent stacking of resistances from reaching immunity.
Any player would be able to purchase an specific status immunity for an ammount of CE. The immunity would be active during every round, not only Hunter rounds and should give you bigger chances of surviving, dealing more damage and killing more Preys or even kill the Hunter itself. Costs should be lower for immunities against less effective statuses (such as Poison and Curse). Costs and duration are open for debate.

Skills
They would also have exclusive special skills to help them or their mission (All concepts by Aemicus):

Juggernaut - Bound
Active Skill. Double tap your shield button to take an immediate leap forward. Useful for ambushes, avoiding traps and escaping tricky situations. The leap's speed should be around 20 units on the Speed Scale and the distance traveled would depend on your shield power:
Blue - 10 Squares; Green - 8 Squares; Yellow - 6 Squares;
Orange - 4 Squares; Red - 2 Squares; Broken - Unavailable.

Assasssin - Flair
Passive Skill. Whenever any Prey is behind an Assassin's blind sight, they are covered with a really blurry red aura, for easier Prey spotting. Similar to this, but much blurrier/weaker outlines (Auras). Excuse my bad editing, I made it on Paint '-'

Bombardier - Short Fuse
Passive Skill. The time it takes for a bomb to explode, after its placement, is reduced by half.

Rounds and Points:
The round ends after a single minute or when the Hunter has killed every other player. If the round starts with less than 6 players, it will last less 12 seconds for each missing player. If all Preys are killed, the Hunter is given 15 points and they get nothing. The Hunter also gets 1 point for each kill (total of 20, for a complete service in a filled room).
If the time runs out, the Hunter gets nothing, the Prey survivors get 10 points each and the dead are given 5 points. If the Hunter is killed, it gets nothing and the killer is rewarded 20 extra points (added to survivor points, 30 in total).
You are given 2 points every time you manage to chop off 3 bars of health from the Hunter. You'd better watch out though, you might get killed.
The match ends after every player's been the Hunter once (Maximum duration of 6 minutes).

Costs, Bribes and Rewards:
For tradition's sake, Survival's Entry Fee will be worth 200 Crowns, and the rewards will add up to 70% of the total money spent with those fees, just like in LD and BN.
Rewards (in crowns):
1st -- 300
2nd - 280
3rd - 260

If a player happens to have as many points as another at the end of a match, the one with the biggest Damage/Second rate (Damage dealt divided by time spent alive) shall be the first of them both (Idea by Darkbrady).
Bribing King Krogmo for Krogmo Coins or other prizes would work as usual.

Extended Mode:
A long-lasting version of the game would also be playable with some changes on the 6-player game (called Frenzy Mode):
- Maximum number of players would be 11.
- Maps would be bigger, maybe the size of a Treasure Vault.
- Each round would last up to 3 minutes (Maximum duration of 33 minutes).
- If there are less than 11 players, there would be less 18 seconds for each one missing.
- Prey respawn points would be farther from the Hunter's, as a consequence of a bigger map.
- Entry Fees would be worth 1000 Crowns and Rewards would be changed to:
1st -- 2050
2nd - 1800
3rd - 1550
4th - 1300
5th - 1000

Artworks:
If you'd like to complement the idea with artworks of any kind, I'll feature and credit them here:
Maps (Currently, all made by Oakgear)
Trenches - Extended Trenches
A grassy, dirty and mysterious landscape with dying fiendish trees. the prime one, in the middle is much bigger than the others and has fiendish markings scarved on it, which were probably used as part of some ritual. Hills and trenches would be an important factor on the map, causing knights to look for alternative ways to go around those hills.
Fallen Gear - Extended Fallen Gear
An old factory's multiple gigantic gears fell from great heights with enough brutality to pierce trough the steel floor, interfering on other engines. These gears can be turned by other switches to reveal their hollowed parts which let knights pass through it, acting as gates.
Sewers - Extended Sewers
The sewers underneath Haven have become a stranded battlefield. Knights can't walk on water, but can change its level if both main valves are hit. This control over water level would change the map completely, revealing passages and covering others whenever water level is changed.
Castle - Extended Castle
A Firestrom Citadel styled Castle, cleary abandoned seen that vines cling to its grey walls. The map's elevation gets higher the closer it is to the north side and is composed by staircases which may move at random moments, one at a time, giving or preventing access to certain areas.

Symbol
Survival
The symbol configures both kinds of players in the game: The Hunter, at the back, with serious eyes, focused on a Prey right in front of it. (Concept by Oakgear and artwork by Severage)

TL;DR:
New PvP mix of 'Hide and Seek' and 'Tag', adapted to SK with three new classes, maps, abilities and 'all VS one' gameplay.

Thoughts?
I'll edit this as I get more suggestions.

Fri, 01/13/2012 - 20:30

Xylka-Mkii

hmm.... Sounds ok, but could

hmm....

Sounds ok, but could use some more detail. Not saying that its not enough, its a great start, but more detail is always great. the points system threw me off a bit, other than that the idea sounds not too bad. Ill support this.

Fri, 01/13/2012 - 20:37

Holonimbus

Ooh, creativity at its best! (/lol)
This seems pretty cool - but what about the arena that this would be played in? Would it be like an actual arena, or would it have some other theme (would there be places to actually hide? (im guessing yes)).
Hoping this gets some notice from GMs - keeping fingers crossed!

Fri, 01/13/2012 - 20:46

Darkbrady

-2 minute round time, to kill

-2 minute round time, to kill 15 people? lol. Gotta up that considerably, unless the map is very, very small, in which case then it's basically just a groupgank and the hunter won't stand a chance.

-Giving the hunter a flinch would make them absolutely useless; all it would take is two alternating people to completely lock down the hunter and flatten him, without lettin' him get an attack off. Remove that and you're golden.

-I don't think the other classes would need to be nerfed at all, I just think the hunter needs some bigger boosts to compensate, and obviously have generic boosts, rather than specific weapon type ones. Also, what would the hunters "shield" ability be?

-Would the other players be considered in a team, or could they attack each other? I reckon that'd add the extra flavour to the match, than forcing them to completely work co-operatively, otherwise you'll get the 15 people simply standing next to each other and the hunter will never stand a chance. If the hunter is strong enough to quickly kill any single person, then people could soften down other players to bait the hunter (for example, shivering one player to the spot and recon-invisibling to wait for the hunter). There'd obviously be no points or scores directly to killing others or it would become a FFA match, but there's certainly ways you could allow friendly fire that would liven up the match, and discourage "right lads, everyone stick together!"

Fri, 01/13/2012 - 22:41

Blue-Phaze

@Darkbrady

- Ok, I was just giving the idea a start; maybe 3 minutes? I guess that's enough...

- You're right. I thought I'd add a kind of flinch, so the "preys" would have a type of defense against the Hunter; since he's faster than anybody else it's quite hard to escape once you're spotted. Maybe a non-damaging shield bump would work better?

- You got a nice eye for balancing; I agree with that too. About a shield ability for the Hunter, I couldn't come up with anything more interesting than something pointing to the nearest enemy or something resembling an X-ray vision for easier spotting.

- I think not alowing friendly fire would be the best way to keep trolls away from matches or noobs who have no idea what they're doing (they might confuse it with a Deathmatch). Even worse; alliances. Imagine two or more friends entering a match; whenever one of them becomes the Hunter, the friends start helping him kill everybody. I guess a penalty on points would prevent the game from that kind of players though.

The point system may be a bit unbalanced, but we can change that. I just wanted to have something to start of.

Fri, 01/13/2012 - 22:56

Severage

Even more time.

3 minutes? That leaves you 12 seconds to kill each person. Unless you got some real skillz or there aren't many hiding spots...you're kinda screwed. I'd start with like 6 minutes if you plan on finding people to be a little easy, and 8 minutes if you want about half a minute per person. I still don't know how easy it will be to hide or how hard it will be to find people, so I'm taking a shot in the dark.

Also, I agree with Darkbrady in the fact that the team will all decide "Hey, why hide when if we stay all together he's screwed?" whenever they can. There must be a way to ensure that's not possible, even if it's not making Team-Attack available.

~Sev

Fri, 01/13/2012 - 23:25

Darkbrady

Survival points. Surviving

Survival points. Surviving longer = more points/score/money etc. Incentive to betray your teammates in some way or another, and worry about yourself (even if directly attacking them isn't an option). Grouping together won't be as beneficial if you're worried that everyone else is just gunna stop behind you and let you die first, when the Hunter finds you.
S'not as direct, but it will high discourage people just grouping together, with needing to worry about straight up assassins.

It will enter the possibilities of people in cahoots ("if I get Hunter, i'll leave you till last, buddy!") however that issue will be hard to workaround no matter what the solution is, I think.

Fri, 01/13/2012 - 23:28

Severage

SP..Hmm.

I do like the idea of Survival points. Forgive me if that was said prior and I missed it. SP would definitely be a great addition to the game...but how would it work, exactly? As in with association with the pointing system mentioned in the OP.

~Sev

Fri, 01/13/2012 - 23:33

Blue-Phaze

@Severage

Yeah, I don't want to have a enormous stadium as an arena or I'd have to give lots of time for each round.
Quick rounds = Less waiting time if you're killed and faster paced gameplay.
Small arenas = Less hiding spots, what would give the game a more thrilling atmosphere since Hunters may spot you at any moment.
Maybe I should lower that to 11 players instead (one being the Hunter)... in 3 minutes, that gives 18 seconds to find each player. I guess that's fair enough.

Oh and about teamplay. Look at Lockdown. Do you see any teamplay? No, and they are supposed to be a team, huh.
In a game where no real team play is intended, I believe many would rather hide, than running risks fighting the Hunter.
If they actually "join forces" the Hunter would probably be killed but would take down a significant number of players with him.
So, no real "unfailable" plan here.

Fri, 01/13/2012 - 23:40

Darkbrady

Wasn't said before, I just

Wasn't said before, I just thought of it and threw it out there to help with the flawed mechanic.

I imagine they'd work on a time based mechanic; I'm not sure how exactly they rate points currently, but a matter of "damage dealt:time spent alive" equation would result in the points, so staying alive the whole match, but becasue you sat in a corner, will only net you as much as someone who dealt the most damage but died first. Being forced to need to run outwards and get some action, but also surviving will turn the "team aspect" into more of a race/competition, and break up the inherent desire to work together JUST to kill the hunter, without completely destroying the concept that you are all, to some degree, on the same team, or at the very least working towards the same goal: surviving.

EDIT:
There's no teamplay in LD becasue it requires distinct co-ordination to do that properly, and in random teams with no assigned leader and no time to strategise, no one ever works as a team. Go into Guild LD and you'll see proper teamwork and strategies in action.
However, in a single goal match like that, everyone will instinctively think "why should I be alone and auto-die against this guy?" everyone will flock to the crowds for safety, just as a second nature thought.

Sat, 01/14/2012 - 00:15

#10

Blue-Phaze

I don't really like the idea

I don't really like the idea of rewarding players for time spent alive, since it's completely random which players the Hunter spots first. You might get high points just because the Hunter was busy chasing someone actually much more skilled than yourself. That sounds quite unfair to me. And in case of friendly fire, getting betrayed because of survival points can be frustrating.
But I LOVE that "damage dealt/time spent alive" equation. Sounds encouraging enough to go towards the Hunter than actually sitting your ass in a corner.
@Darbrady
Nope, I don't believe everyone will think like that. The Hunter will always go towards where there are more players to kill. Therefore, some players might want to get away from the flock to avoid the risk of taking damage in order to survive. I doubt people would join forces, when they know they have much higher risks of dying than if they were hiding, and making more points at the end of each round.

Sat, 01/14/2012 - 00:15

#11

Darkbrady

It really depends what kind

It really depends what kind of damage force the Hunter gets given. If he's capable of freely/easily killing any single player (or two), but can be taken down by groups, then he'll actively avoid large groups and hunt down stragglers: divide and conquer.
This way, people will want to stay in large groups (and generally, behind someone else!) to increase their chances of survival. If they try and hide and stay alone, they won't stand a chance if they're caught.
If he's capable of taking down huge groups on his own then it'll absolutely make staying alone not worth it, knowing that if you get found, you will instantly die w/o a hope in hell. Staying in groups at least increases the odds that he'll kill someone else before you.

However, if he has a moderate amount of trouble killing any single player, then he'll be avoiding groups at all costs and making an effort to find stragglers.

I can't think of any situation where being in a group would not be entirely beneficial to defend yourself, short of being the guy at the front of the group.

And as for being found first, that's easily solved by either putting everyone together in the same spawn, or having everyone spawn equal distances away from the Hunter spawn. There's always going to be someone who gets found first, and if you're unlucky enough to be the one found first, that's just tough nuts; it's an equal chance for everyone, based entirely on which route the hunter decides to take, versus which route you decided.
I also think it'd be better to have everyone spawn separately, making group building an active effort rather than encouraging it from the start.

Sure, some people won't want to be in a group, but enough people certainly will want to group up that it'll make the Hunters job incredibly difficult if he's not able to kill 5 people without dying.

Sat, 01/14/2012 - 00:38

#12

Blue-Phaze

I'm assuming a medium skilled

I'm assuming a medium skilled Hunter would be able to take out 6 or 7 players if he faced a flock of 10.
I'll give the hunter 1 point for each kill; Then people will think twice before staying in a group. They would go:
"Hide and probably survive to get 10 points, or stay in the flock, having a 60/70% chance of dying and give the Hunter 1 point in that case?"
Or even 25, if he manages to kill everybody.
Personally, I'd rather shoot him from a safer distance, then run like hell when i get my 2 points.

Sat, 01/14/2012 - 00:41

#13

Darkbrady

Well if you'd wanna make the

Well if you'd wanna make the Hunter strong enough that he can literally kill most of the group while they're bundled together w/o really worryin' about dyin' then...

Well, guess it solves the group issue, but then kinda introduces a "Hunter is OP like hell" issue on it's own. How are people ever gunna be able to kill him, if he can kill the whole group as a team?

Sat, 01/14/2012 - 00:42

#14

Holonimbus

Idea!

I have an idea! What if the hunter has a death mark thing (without having to have the recon class) that has far superior range than the Recon one in LD? It could also act like radar - which makes sense, to me at least.

And/or you could have something where all the prey have something similar - if they are too close together, then they will regularly inflict small damage to each other, meaning that hey wouldn't want to stay all clumped together (maybe in a T3 match, you get 50 damage per tick, 1 tick every 5 seconds for each other prey within the range of your radar thingy).

Idk, just some thoughts off the top of my head.

Sat, 01/14/2012 - 01:16

#15

Blue-Phaze

To kill a hunter it wouldn't

To kill a hunter it wouldn't be nescessary to make an army and march together towards him.
The best strategy would be to "surprise attack" him every now and then, from different sides.
That may seem a bit hard to balance...
What about a smaller screen for the Hunter? Similar to blind cells from Spore:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FI06QKoeJuo
That little sight would make surprise attacks easier, but wouldn't abandon the frightening, powerful feeling of when a Hunter is right next to you.
He would have an advantage though. A radar. Thanks Holonimbus.
A radar could give him a better notion of where he should aim to.

It's quite fun imagining how beastial the Hunter has become. Fast like a leopard, powerful as a lion, short sighted but frightening and with an incredible radar just like bats and sharks. More like a Predator than a Hunter.

Sat, 01/14/2012 - 01:48

#16

Darkbrady

There's already an effect

There's already an effect similar to your description in game, around the Graveyard and Candlestick levels. All they'd need to do is darken that substantially and you're golden.
If the Pray team get scores based on a damage dealt:survival time ratio and no respawns, then they should be suitably inclined to head out and actively seek him out to attack him, while also being concerned about their safety, encouraging quick sneaky hit'n'run attacks, as opposed to heavy full out assaults.
Denying the Predator any form of healing ability, heart respawns, pills or anythin' will allow them to use sneaky attacks from the side to get at him, but in this instance the "flinch" effect absolutely has to be dropped.
If his baseline bonuses keep him strong enough to be takin' down any single player without hassle then he should be able to keep it going at a fast rate, before he gets hit with too many surprise attacks.

I like the radar idea, too. If they could rig that so that the radar points the Predator to the biggest group of people then you've got all your problems solved right there; stay in a group for added security and safety, but at the double-edge of him finding your group before he finds stragglers.
Stay on your own and be less likely to be found, but have no backup whatsoever.
Good balance for deciding how you want to play as the Pray, while letting the Predator keep the kills coming in fast enough to match the time scoreboard; since he'll be directed to the biggest group first, and being capable of killing them, he'll be able to knock out a hefty number of players quickly, then spend the rest of the match hunting down soloers.

Sat, 01/14/2012 - 09:21

#17

Blue-Phaze

Cool, I didn't know there was

Cool, I didn't know there was a similar effect on those levels (I play on low settings cause my PC sucks D:). That helps a lot.
Yup, no respawns or healing. Players respawn only at the start of a round. If you get killed, you have to wait in spectator mode; that's why I want quick rounds or things could get boring (Hunters would be spectable too). Healing would make stuff even harder for preys, so, no healing (not even guardians can heal).
I've already changed the Flinch to a non-damaging Shield Bump ability instead; Strikers can only use shield bumps if they shield at the same time they're attacked (lag might influence in this but with a bit of practice it's easily predictable); Guardians and Recons would have normal shield bump.

Sat, 01/14/2012 - 10:45

#18

Playerman

Hmm

Would you have gotten this idea from "The Hidden"? It's rather similar to what you've described here.

Sat, 01/14/2012 - 12:10

#19

Aroxian

so basically juggernaut?

Sat, 01/14/2012 - 20:52

#20

Blue-Phaze

@Playerman The Hidden? I

@Playerman
The Hidden? I didn't know this game until now. I actually came up with this thinking about and All on 1 mode.
I just did some research. are you talking about a half life mod? Yes, that's quite similar. I'm not surprised though. This concept is not that hard to come up with.
@Aroxian
Yep, basically a juggernaut mode with classes and powers.
speaking of powers, I just finished painting an example of what the Hunter Vision would look like. I'll add to the OP shortly.

Mon, 01/16/2012 - 07:28

#21

Blue-Phaze

So, guys, I've been editing

So, guys, I've been editing the OP, giving a bit more details, etc...
I need your help though, any thoughts or suggestions? '-'

Mon, 01/16/2012 - 15:22

#22

Aemicus

Maybe the Hunter could have a passive shield that recharged gradually over time, and a tiny bit less health. It would help hold back the desire to sprint around swinging at everything in site, and make them be a more cunning Hunter.
I like the idea otherwise +1

Mon, 01/16/2012 - 15:47

#23

Imperialstriker

Uhh...

The hunter's lack of vision makes me think strikers will just spam gunslinger weapons from outside the hunter's view and then just speed gently into the distance before the hunter notices.

Mon, 01/16/2012 - 19:52

#24

Blue-Phaze

You're actually right,

You're actually right, Imperial, I guess that lack of vision would just be exploited by strikers.
I can think of a fix...
A temporary arrow similar to those arrows pointing to bases in LD, which would last about 5 seconds, could help Hunters keep track of those who attack him. Whenever they are hit, an arrow would point to whoever did that.
What do you think? '-'

Mon, 01/16/2012 - 20:18

#25

Aemicus

You would still have to make

You would still have to make the hunter a lot faster than the strikers, otherwise they might be able to stay ahead for the 5 seconds, then disappear quietly.

How about the hunter has clear vision is a small area around him, then a "smell" feature all around the screen, which would show a blurry line going to a small splotch showing where the player is on screen (it wouldn't go offscreen), allowing the hunter to know someone was there, but not what class or weapon they had.

Tue, 01/17/2012 - 09:54

#26

Blue-Phaze

Yep, I did say Hunters are

Yep, I did say Hunters are faster than Strikers in the OP.
So, you're proposing a "Hunter Flair" instead of a "Hunter Vision".
You mean, Hunters would still be short sighted, and would have a permanent but downgraded version of the Hunter Vision (instead of periodic but accurate).
I guess that could work a little better. thanks for suggesting =)
Adding to OP.

Tue, 01/17/2012 - 14:55

#27

King-Tinkinzar

cough juggernaut cough

Tue, 01/17/2012 - 16:11

#28

Blue-Phaze

cough aroxian#19 cough btw

cough aroxian#19 cough

btw what's so bad about juggernaut? Lockdown isn't the most uber awesome creative game I've ever seen in existence, I've seen lots of other games with very similar game modes, yet it's still cool (disregarding its insane unbalance) and has a decent player base.

I appreciate constructive criticism, you know... that kind which shows reasons for the dislikes or even try to improve the idea.

Tue, 01/17/2012 - 17:56

#29

Aemicus

Eh, I guess the outlines are

Eh, I guess the outlines are ok, but I was more thinking about just a blur, not even a blurred outline. And I still think the predominant class in this would be strikers with guns. Shoot, move, shoot, move, shoot, move. And would the Hunter be immune to stun, ice, and shock? Because I could see a shivermist buster, or other slowing statuses, just ending the game right away.

Wed, 01/18/2012 - 09:31

#30

Blue-Phaze

Not really. consider that

Not really. consider that hunters are faster than strikers and that gunners' speed significantly reduce when shooting, strikers with guns wouldn't have THAT much advantage over other classes.
And yes, they would have immunity to any status. Thanks for pointing that out.

Wed, 01/18/2012 - 18:29

#31

Aemicus

So the hunter is faster than

So the hunter is faster than a speeding striker? Or is that their ability? I'm a little confused.

Wed, 01/18/2012 - 18:52

#32

Blue-Phaze

They are actually faster than

They are actually faster than a speeding striker. That may sound a bit odd but that's the point; they are running like hell to catch every player before the time runs out. That's why if you're a striker you shouldn't only speed away from the hunter, you should outwit them, exploiting their short sight for obstacles within the arena or else you'll get caught.
i just noticed that "maze" defines the place better than "arena", since it's supposed to have many obstacles.

Wed, 01/18/2012 - 20:48

#33

Aemicus

That's an interesting idea...

That's an interesting idea... it might be a little unfair for recons and guardians though, as the hunter could just speed around slashing random areas whenever they saw a recon warning, and guardians wouldn't be able to catch a wounded Hunter. To help with this, maybe the hunter should be made to move a little bit slower than the striker at the moment, and strikers boost could be like wearing armor that gave them walking speed increased med. Idk, just an idea.

Also, in this passage: "Strikers wouldn't be faster than Hunters but they'd have a hard time catching Strikers."
Under the current rules, you might want to change it to " Strikers wouldn't be faster than Hunters, even while boosted, but Hunters would still have a hard time catching them." It's just a little bit clearer.

Wed, 01/18/2012 - 20:55

#34

Aemicus

Sorry, I just realized that I

Sorry, I just realized that I am trying to change your idea a ton. It *is* yours, so maybe I should back off :D

Thu, 01/19/2012 - 12:54

#35

Blue-Phaze

haha, no problem, the more

haha, no problem, the more feedback the better.
Actually, I prefer to leave the Hunter faster than Strikers or else they'd be overpowered.
I want to make the game as balanced as possible. Each class with their advantages.
Strikers will be hard to catch.
Guardians will be hard to kill.
Recons will be hard to find.
And since Hunters have to face all of them, they are:
A bit faster than Strikers.
Stronger than Guardians.
Perceptive for Recons.
I still need help improving or adding more stuff though. I feel like this game still has a lot of potential to explore.
Any ideas are welcome.

Thu, 01/19/2012 - 14:41

#36

Aemicus

"maybe the hunter should be

"maybe the hunter should be made to move a little bit slower than the striker at the moment, and strikers boost could be like wearing armor that gave them walking speed increased med. Idk, just an idea."

By that, I meant that the normal hunter walking speed could be a little slower than the striker boost atm, while the striker boost in game would be even slower than that, but still faster than normal walking speed. I just think that making hunters move faster than a boosted striker could really hurt people with bad latency.

Thu, 01/19/2012 - 18:50

#37

Johnnjlee

The prey have more striker

The prey have more striker boost than the hunter so the hunter has to rely on sneak attacks. You could have a lighting system so that prey can't see a hunter that's around the corner but can choose a class that you can see the hunter through walls, replacing the recon. The "recon" will be able to place a marker on him alerting his presance to everyone but no cloak. When he does this he get points guardians become medics that get points for healing prey that get away. Strikers are just runners that can only get the fuel for their pack at a central enery depot. The hunter can stay here after chacing some and the strikers get a debuff that makes them slow even before using their speed boost

Thu, 01/19/2012 - 19:50

#38

Aemicus

The point of the hunter isn't

The point of the hunter isn't to lurk around waiting for a sneak attack, there's a time limit. You have to sprint out and get them.

Sat, 01/21/2012 - 00:23

#39

Aemicus

This can't be lost... bumps

This can't be lost... bumps for Hunter.

Mon, 01/23/2012 - 12:24

#40

Blue-Phaze

I went off for the weekend...

@Aemicus
I got it, you mean this:
Striker Walking Speed < Hunter Speed < Striker Boosting Speed
Well, strikers would run out of "fuel" and get caught either way.
I believe making SBS faster than HS would only make people choose the Striker class over the others and mindlessly boosting away without trying to actually outwit the Hunter, which is the fun part.
I don't know if making HS faster than SBS could hurt people with bad latency, but under that possibility, why not making both speeds the same?
Hunter Speed = Striker Boosting Speed
ha, I guess that solves it. We should've thought of that sooner.
What do you think?

@Johnnjlee
Wow, take it easy. You're trying to change too much '-' About hunters being sneaky, that's basically what Aemicus said.
About the rest, it would remove all the thrilling feel of being next to a Hunter since escaping and surviving would become a lot easier.

Mon, 01/23/2012 - 16:18

#41

Skold-The-Drac

Let me get the rules straight

Hunter is fast as striker on boost
Hunter has ASI med., Damage bonus Med., CTR med. (?)
Hunter has limited clear vision within the radius of a 2* maybe 3* bomb radius, however can get a blur/outline of prey for rest of screen
Hunter has a shield function that allows them to see recon (but provides nothing else?)
Hunter gets a standard +10 to health and perhaps a minor resistance to everything damage or status(?)
Hunter arenas will include either obstacle courses (many things to hide behind), labyrinths (maze style, paths that dead end), and open forums (few obstacles) (?)

Hunter is only one set class. (Why not give the "Hunter" three class systems to choose from?)

Is this all right? I'm trying to get a condensed sense of this Hunter.

Mon, 01/23/2012 - 16:50

#42

Blue-Phaze

Hunter has ASI med., Damage

Hunter has ASI med., Damage bonus Med., CTR med. (?)
No ASI neither CTR, just low damage bonus, medium movement speed bonus and high health bonus, maybe +20 to health (considering he has no additional defense, +20 HP isn't as overpowered as it seems).

Hunter has a shield function that allows them to see recon (but provides nothing else?)
They don't really have any shield function since the Hunter Flair is permanent. They only have a normal shield.
Hunters can only see recons outside of their clear sight.

Hunter gets a standard +10 to health and perhaps a minor resistance to everything damage or status(?)
+20 HP, and no additional defenses (only way to resist status inflicting hits is by raising your shield).

include either obstacle courses, labyrinths (maze style, paths that dead end), and open forums (few obstacles) (?)
No dead ends, just obstacle courses. Dead ends may kill all the fun in outwiting a Hunter since you will be trapped and killed whenever you reach a dead end. Open forums might become boring and way too easy for the Hunter to follow its Preys.

Despite that, you got all right. ^^ Thanks for pointing all that out, I'll try to make stuff clearer in the OP later.

Mon, 01/23/2012 - 17:01

#43

Aemicus

@Bluephaze I actually meant

@Bluephaze

I actually meant something more like this:

1 is low, 10 is high

Stunned shielded walking speed (Guardian, Recon): 1
Shielded walking speed (Guardian, Recon): 3
Normal walking speed: 5
Striker walking speed: 6
SBS: 9 (But make the SBS lower than lockdown currently.)
Hunter walking speed: 10

But your idea works.

Mon, 01/23/2012 - 17:02

#44

Aemicus

Oh, and I like the name

Oh, and I like the name "Survival" better. Huntdown sounds too much like lockdown.

Mon, 01/23/2012 - 17:03

#45

Skold-The-Drac

Just trying to get the rules

I also wondered if the offering of three different hunter types would be preferable/helpful.

Hunter 1: All of the above
Hunter 2: Focus more on damage and speed, lessen health buff
Hunter 3: Recon-ish grouping?

Mon, 01/23/2012 - 17:16

#46

Blue-Phaze

@Aemicus A scale sounds good

@Aemicus
A scale sounds good too. Both ways work.
Yup, I thought of Huntdown thinking of LD, actually. "Survival" is more original though, I like that.
@Skold
Classes for hunters sound interesting, but that would involve much more work on balancing etc...
I built the Hunter gameplay to be equally balanced to the three normal classes.
But I like the idea, I'll try thinking about something similar, maybe choosing your favorite status (speed, health etc) to be boosted, I dunno, these ideas just pop in my head all the time.

Mon, 01/23/2012 - 18:28

#47

Skold-The-Drac

Just trying to keep things interesting

I mean if a player just gets one straight setup for hunter eventually they could tire of it... so I'm thinking if the hunter is allowed variation the game can still have a "wild card" dynamic rather than a straight setup. That "wild card" dynamic is where LD and BN maintain their userbase, at least that's the way I see it.
Edit:I just thought, wouldn't this feel a bit like the "Hunger Games"?

Mon, 01/23/2012 - 22:17

#48

Aemicus

@Skold-The-Drac OH MY GOD A

@Skold-The-Drac

OH MY GOD A HUNGER GAMES PVP GAME! YOU ARE A GOD.
Someone needs to make this. Each time you spawn could be with a random weapon (evil giggle)

Mon, 01/23/2012 - 22:23

#49

Arkate

you missed something

this is pretty much classic juggernaut, which actually once you have played enough, gets overly repetive, if you are the juggy, and hit bam you kill, if you are juggy and miss some guy shoots you or slices you. trust me, it gets really boring, really fast

Mon, 01/23/2012 - 23:37

#50

Blue-Phaze

"if you are the juggy, and

"if you are the juggy, and hit bam you kill"
I didn't get what you meant with that.
Yes, I know this is similar to juggernaut, but I've adapted pretty much all of it's gameplay to fit SK.
I don't think you've ever seen a juggernaut match in which Juggy isn't an insanely overpowered or completely unkillable player and other players can choose distinct classes to play the way they prefer.
Hunter is something that could be actually fun and completely possible to win at any of the playing sides.
How can you even be so sure It'll get boring if you've only played similar game modes on other games?
AND considering most games with a Juggernaut mode are First Person Shooters, I believe Hunter would reveal itself quite innovative.
You can't tell you don't like something until you try it.

Search

Hunter vs the World - Survival PvP game, complete with Classes, Skills, Maps and Pursuing Gameplay!!