Vote on the next roleplay!
Mon, 04/22/2013 - 12:28
Hey everyone,
I would like to take a vote on what the next roleplaying game should be about. There are quite a few hovering around the Treasure Vault, including Return to Cradle, Finder's Keepers, Retribution, and Death from Above. Each of them was plagued with a problem that hampered their progress, and each had something good about them that made them work for as long as they did:
*Return to Cradle
Cons: lack of control, too much power playing
Pros: compelling storyline, interesting characters
*Return to Cradle Rebooted
Cons: lack of awesomeness, writer's block
Pros: based on its more successful predecessor
*Finder's Keepers
Cons: loss of interest (and possibly writer's block)
Pros: unique storyline, amazing authorship from its players, complex characters
*Retribution
Cons: moderator left
Pros: complex & interesting characters, superior fight sequences
*Death from Above
Cons: lack of interest in the playerbase
Pros: modded by a superior writer
I think that if we are going to create a successful roleplaying game, we need to decide on one that will be 1) interesting, 2) epic, and 3) well-controlled. These are the factors we need to decide upon:
1) Who will mod the RP
2) Structure of the RP (is it on the Wiki, Forums, separated into story thread & discussion thread?)
3) How combat is handled (recommendation is located here.)
4) Background & plot
5) Restrictions
Place your suggestions and votes below. Thanks!
Tue, 04/23/2013 - 09:17
#2
You lack discipline!
Just as the great samurai trained for days, holding their blades from their bodies for days without end, so must you-. Ahem. Sorry about that. Just remembered a great samurai film. Forgot its name. Still a great film though.
Anywhatsoever thingies. The main problem that I see with these sorts of text-based roleplaying games is that some major character always get wrapped up in some non-Spiral Knights problem. Be it work, be it a funeral, be it a zombie-vampire-werewolf apocalypse; it doesn't matter. What does matter is that you have to admit to yourself that some of your most integral players will eventually be lost to the ravages of time. And then you've got to have a contingency plan for when that happens.
But you don't want to know about my ideas for a RP, you want my response to your bulletpoint questions, right?
1) Who will mod the RP
The Mod must have a) The time to moderate the RP, b) Motivation to moderate the RP, c) Trustworthiness in the eyes of the players.
You might also want a secondary and tertiary Mod in case the Mods start dying off left and right.
2) Structure of the RP (is it on the Wiki, Forums, separated into story thread & discussion thread?)
My initial reaction is that we do the exact same thing we did before. Even if it failed horribly and many, many men died. So many grieving widows.
Maybe you should experiment around and see what works, instead of repeating the exact same thing over and over and over. That's how you go insane.
3) How combat is handled
I guess there are two parts to combat. PvE and PvP. PvE is easy since we all know that we are going to win (what with us controlling the entire affair), this would result in some exciting words, but in the end PvE isn't your biggest concern. PvP is! What you've got here are two people who both want to win, and since there are no parameters deciding who should win, you'll get collision of egos and out of the resulting gooey mess will be swears, frayed tempers and general douchbaginess.
I recommend that you devise a system where there quantifiable values in place rather than qualitative ones i.e. 10-inch thick armour that can only be penetrated by 5* Piercing-only weapons > really hard armor that can like only be broken by a thousand stabs.
Might be hard to give objective values though. Then again, you wouldn't start an RP unless you were willing to deal with all the problems that arose from it, right?
4) Background & plot
Flippity-floopity hell if I know! This is usually the part where you are supposed to let yourself run free! Free! Free as a bird! Free as a fish! Free as 1-! You get the idea.
But if I was forced to give an idea, maybe by a strange man with a strange knife dancing a strange dance on the ceiling (sort of like now), I would recommend that it be both definitive and open-ended at the same time. Sort of like a sandbox, really. Or a Dungeons & Dragon campaign. But more like a sandbox.
And like a sandbox the following rules apply: 1) you can do whatever you want in the sandbox, but 2) you have to move on when your mommy tells you to. And 3) don't pee on the other children. That is a very naughty thing to do. Do you want me to put in the time-out zone again? Do you?!
5) Restrictions
OP is overpowered! But he's not the OP. Oh dear.
If you don't impose restrictions... well, then you're just asking for it then. What's 'it'? You should know, you're the one who asked for 'it'.
Make sure your applicants are not over-powered nor do they have the capability to be over-powered. ("I'm just a simple Gremlin Ghostmane. Can I please join?" "Well, your application looks okay. Wait, what's this over here?" "Oh, that? Nothing." "You call a paragraph detailing how eating Dark Matter lets you nuke everyone in a 5Km radius nothing?" "Oops.")
If you feel the need you might want to get yourself checked. Or just have pre-made applications. Though I suspect that would lead to no-one joining. Just a hunch.
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In the end, it's up to you. How will you react to those being disruptive? How will you handle those who have to leave? What will you do when they come back and they've found you dropped a boulder on them? How will you handle player disputes? Why are you asking me all these questions? I don't know! Leave me alone!
Tue, 04/23/2013 - 10:44
#3
@Ghret (and RP mods)
I really appreciate your insight in this thread, and also for the RP community in general. I agree with Ghret's pointers mostly, but I believe he/she was acting a little too rough (sorry Ghret, I mean no offense). On my side, I'll give my personal feedback here.
First, I know I haven't been participating in any of the RPs, but I've been watching most of the RPs in the forum. I admit, it is hard to make a good RP, you have to satisfy everyone's needs and avoid getting someone upset and quit. Things are most likely because:
- When you're targeting at a wide audience.
- In turn, a player's ideals can easily clash with an opposing one from another player (or even the mod himself).
(If you don't think you are quite ready yet, do not try to please all the people in the forums at once, it's close to impossible. What I would do is to aim at a specific audience, with just the right range.)
I'm saying this based on my observation, so I might be wrong. But I believe a lot of RPs have been going on and off, which is a pity. The only way to maintain an RP right till the end is to stay focused, and recognise your audience. I shall repeat this: do NOT try to attract everyone in the forums to come all at once. Is it attention you want, or a dedicated success achieved through modding RPs?
Tue, 04/23/2013 - 12:06
#4
Replies
@Ghret: I can see you're trying to mimic Luguiru. :/
1) I was looking for specific names.
2) I've been doing that for the past few months. I was looking for specific suggestions.
3) It is true that PvP will be the greatest concern, but PvE has been shown to have importance as well. PvE is often used to showcase a character's skills, rather than offer the players a challenge. Both are useful, but are sometimes used inappropriately. Specific suggestions would have been helpful here, but your general advice is fine.
4) I want to create a roleplay that players can maintain interest in and won't get writer's block from. I need to know what kind of story you want to be told, so I can gauge what kind of roleplay to create. Again, specific suggestions please.
5) Again, I need specifics. What kinds of restrictions would you like to see on the game's characters?
@Snowdusk: I'm not trying to please a general audience so much as I am trying to create a reliable playerbase by making an RP that they can actually write stories from. Return to Cradle Rebooted failed in this respect, because the story was not conducive to story-writing, and so players quickly developed writer's block. I want to create a roleplay that avoids this problem.
I want dedicated success. It will be very hard to achieve with a boring roleplay background.
Tue, 04/23/2013 - 12:26
#5
@Thinslayer
I see you're very concerned about the story background of your RP. I acknowledge a good story generates interest, but that isn't the main reason why a RP goes stale. It's more about the core process on how you and the players facilitate everything.
For example: How far do the players influence the RP itself? Are they really engaging themselves, or are they merely reading from what the mod is writing out for them? Is the RP allowing the players to communicate with each other easily?
RP isn't just about the story/ore or setting, the core of it all is interaction. Try putting yourself in the players' position, and figure out how the RP will remain enjoyable to the players. And most importantly, have fun! It's okay to fool around a little, as long as everyone relishes it.
Feel free to discuss with us, most of us are glad to provide constructive criticisms and all sorts of help. All we want, including myself, is to let the forum to be a better place.
Tue, 04/23/2013 - 12:35
#6
Well, perhaps...
Mayhaps I can reboot Retribution, then you and I, Thin, can co-mod it? That might be a good idea, seeing as how RtC rebooted isn't as "awesome" and RtC original is too cluttered to even begin cleaning up... Besides, DfA isn't getting much attention, why should I continue to mod it? (By the way, thanks for the compliment "modded by a superior writer"! ^_^)
Just putting it out there...
Tue, 04/23/2013 - 12:36
#7
Damn my double posting...
Dont pay attention to this post...
Tue, 04/23/2013 - 14:20
#8
More replies
@Snowdusk: I see what you're saying. It may be that I fall into the trap of trying to get everyone to play out the story I had in mind. It may be more appropriate to generate a more sandbox-style RP, where the storyline is not very well-defined to allow the players more freedom to write what they want to write about.
@Kaijuhunter: You're welcome.
Regarding Retribution, I don't think a reboot is possible. Too much as already been invested in the original; I think we need an entirely different roleplay.
As Ghret has pointed out, we need a mod who is frequently online. One of us could start off the RP then hand over modding power to, say, Seatus (who I know is often online) for example.
I have a few ideas on how to settle combat:
PvE: The strength of the players' damage types determines how "awesome" they get to be in the battle. If you're using a Gran Faust against an army of fiends, you're not going to slaughter them "despite" the weakness of your sword against them. You do not have permission to be awesome; instead, you must show your character to be struggling hard to fight them off. If you're using a Final Flourish, you have permission to be awesome and massacre whole armies of them with a few amazing moves. If you're using only a Leviathan Blade, you may neither be awesome nor struggling.
PvP: This will get more complicated. I'll take this on piece by piece.
Armor
Full resistance to all the damage types in an attack means that the character may shrug off a successful hit on himself without taking any damage. Partial resistance means that he must take some damage, but it is neither crippling nor weak. No resistance means that the attack is devastating to him, and might defeat him in one or two strikes.
Suppose character A is wearing an Elemental Cloak and Hood. Character B is wearing a Scary Skelly Mask and Suit. Both are wielding a Fireburst Brandish. If A successfully hits B, then B must write something like "the attack struck his armor and drew blood." If B successfully hits A, then A must write something like "the strike barely scratched his cloak."
Now, if B was wearing, say, Silvermail, then an attack on B would look something like, "the attack tore through his armor and shattered it."
Abilities
Damage bonuses represent the character's skill with the weapon. A positive damage bonus means that the char can place precise, devastating attacks on his opponent. Lack of a bonus, or a damage penalty, means that the character sometimes misses, or fails to hit a critical location on the target.
Attack speed increases represent the character's agility while using his weapons. He can plausibly block and parry better, dodge better, and launch surprise attacks better.
Charge time reductions represent how often a character can utilize special moves with his weapon. If you want the character to spin, leap up into the air, and land with a devastating blow on an army of beasts using a Rigadoon, and then turn around and flip over an enemy character while battering him with strikes, he needs to have a pretty high charge time reduction in order to plausibly do that.
Movement speed increases now represent striker-boosting. A character given an MSI can dart and fly around the room.
Shields
Shields act just like armor, except that they have even more functions. A character may bash an opponent with his shield to push him away or render him vulnerable to attack, or use it to deflect & reflect attacks (not just absorb them). Shield-cancelling represents parry-&-riposte. Shield charging means that a character hides behind his shield while preparing to launch a special move.
Weapons
Fast weapons can be used to unleash flurries of attacks, perform amazing attack-stunts, and otherwise be acrobatically awesome at the expense of throwing other players around.
Medium weapons are neither really fast nor slow. A skilled character can move quickly with them, but he's not going to be doing any acrobatic stunts anytime soon, nor will he be hitting his opponents with crushing force or throw them around the room like ragdolls. He will, however, be able to knock them around a little bit, which may be useful in intense cliffhanger scenes.
Heavy weapons will throw characters around like ragdolls if their attacks connect, and they must OHKO any character not equipped with any defenses against them. They will still cause lots of blunt force trauma to characters who have a little defense against them, and will throw them around if they do not resist stun.
Statuses
Stun represents how well your character resists getting knocked unconscious or thrown around the room by medium and heavy weapons. It can also represent the character's resistance to flashes and surprises.
Fire represents lightsaber-style damage. A Flamberge, for instance, can cause irrepairable damage to a broken shield, and will cause permanent damage to any defenses that are not resistant to fire. Flame weapons can also cut through solid materials in some cases.
Shock renders a character incapable of action while he is influenced by it, just like in-game. Unlike the game, however, shock can be inflicted reliably, and can be transferred via contact with conductive weapons or shields.
Freeze completely encases a character in ice, kinda like temporary stasis. Rapid thawing (like engulfing it in flames) will cause extra damage to the character.
Poison can represent physical sickness, mental sickness, or corruption. It can also represent corrosion that can gradually eat through armor on contact.
Curse harms a character whenever he tries to do anything, including walking. This is a slight difference from its in-game representation.
Sleep does just that - it puts a character into a deep slumber (that cannot be awakened by having his love interest kiss him).
Do we need to be even more detailed? I can arrange for dice rolls if need be.
Tue, 04/23/2013 - 15:18
#9
Err...see here's the prob...
The problem is that there are people who aren't into roleplay that much and just sign on, not taking in that they have a responsibility to keep up with that certain story. Like Blessid-Bombardier on the RtC reboot, people just sign in with an app, and never go to that certain story again. Enthusiastic writers, whom really understand the need of stories, me, you, Kaiju, and maybe Gzilla, all write enough, but the less enthusiastic down the intensity of the story, until the enthusiastic writers are just left on the ground thinking, 'WHAT DID I DO WRONG?!' and another oleplay pops up, hoping to be a good one, but the cycle returns.
Yep. I have known the problem the whole time. Obviously, I care too much XD
Wed, 04/24/2013 - 15:09
#10
Meep?
Hmmm. . .
May I suggest an RP? ( vote- 1 and 2 - iii) Cradle's Fall: Redemtion (I'd probably make some pretty good first impressions with this title. . . )
Rome has fallen, deeper and deeper into a worse socie- Oh, wrong story.
Cradle is at it's worst, all life turned into a mere wasteland, no town is safe, no matter how strong their resistance is.
They will all fall from raiders and creatures of the core...
The Spiral Order has turned against all, Isorans and Strangers alike, all trying to escape the evil wrath that is the Spiral Order. . .
But unbeknownst to everyone, there is a far worse matter at hand, a god is trying to destroy the universe for his/her own greedy needs and wants, by using cradle's core as a lever. . . for the end to all intelligent life.
How about that?
Wed, 04/24/2013 - 16:13
#11
Address
I really like your idea Liminori, and think it might be a good idea for the next Roleplay.
Buuuuut I do have an addition for it.
The Glacius Desert ice caps have melted due to a global temperature increase, and have flooded the Clockworks and most of Cradle's valleys. Most of Cradle is now a massive ocean, which has also cause an increase in life, both plant and animal life, but unrest is common. Naval warfare and pirates are rampant. Even children have taken up arms. War ravages most islands, but some are safe.
As for Thinslayer's armor system, while it's been suggested before, it's a good extension of it, and goes a little more in-depth into it. It took me a bit to read it, but I think if everyone followed it, it would be perfect for any roleplay.
And one more thing: in general, we should try to keep the amount of roleplays in the Treasure Vault at a given time two or below. If it gets to be more than two, then I'm left juggling my writing time between writing my own fanfiction (the next chapter of which will be released by next week Monday, sorry) and making entries in roleplays. Just a suggestion though.
Also, I have a system for managing a roleplay that does away with a story and discussion thread completely. Whenever someone posts, the other roleplayers must voice any concerns, which the author must make amends to. Once all mistakes or errors have been corrected, the post is "Locked In". Once a post is locked in, it cannot be changed unless in special circumstances.
Wed, 04/24/2013 - 16:22
#12
Oh oh oh! ME ME ME!!!
*raises hand frantically and stands up to speak*
The fires from the FSC itself have escaped, attracted to the hate the Knights have for one another. Whole levels now burn in flames, creatures suffering for the misdeeds of the Knights.
Overgrowth has captured Haven, plants of the deadliest of kinds. Capable of own personal thought, the plants' buds are rock-like, appearing safe until they ultimately devour your skin and meat.
Thu, 04/25/2013 - 06:44
#13
I... I have an idea!
The Core had finally lost its power as the knights have found their way to acquire it, without wasting times the knight took their leave from the planet which slowly crumbles into emptiness. But many didn't escape. Those who didn't escape called for help, many had lost hope and waited for their end. After few days the "survivors' " distress message had been answered, explaining that they need only one more month to return to save them. But can they survive for that long? The hostile creatures will no longer be a threat as they no longer exist, what became a threat is their own selves.
Food isn't the problem. Solitude isn't the problem. Comfort isn't the problem.The problem is, can they Survive this together?
Will they be able to create trust amidst chaos? Will they be able to fight side-by-side? Or will they meet each other by the end of their blades?
Let's survive
and I am enthusiastic at writing, but I'm just limiting my post to one a day so I could wait for other post....
but yes, as what I have seen from the above posts, there should be a set of restrictions added when creating a character app. Because I have regretted myself creating the god of death, yeah, the god of death who died twice yet still lives.
But I basically agree with what Ghret had explained.
Sun, 04/28/2013 - 08:59
#14
Examining ideas
Bump! We need to use this thread.
Sun, 04/28/2013 - 09:37
#15
Idea: Zombie apocalypse. It
Idea: Zombie apocalypse. It had to be asked.
Sun, 04/28/2013 - 15:40
#16
Lol
^^Fanfic for that, hun.^^
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 06:12
#17
Vote!
I vote for Zombie apocalypse and Liminnori's one. Others, I just don't really get the whole plot and stuff. No offense to you guys! I'm just a not-that-intelligent kinda writer.
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 12:30
#18
Hmmm... This one sound good?
Does this idea sound good?
Story Idea- The Last Stand of Almire
The Story: Almire is finally becoming a powerful nation, rising from its humble beginnings as a village and establishing itself on the world's spotlight. They've caught the attention of the greatest empire in the world, a kingdom ruled by the tyrannical, self proclaimed "god-king" Xerxes. Xerxes sees Almire's potential to become an empire to rival, indeed, maybe even exceed his own, and decides to obliterate the threat. With his enormous army and elite fighting force dubbed "The Immortals", he plans to invade the backwater country of Almire and destroy everything. But he has underestimated them. He's underestimated the determination and strength of just and noble men. For when the courageous rise up for justice, rise up against tyranny, well...
Even gods can bleed.
Trivia: this story is loosely based on the 1st and 2nd Greco-Persian War, with some of the events based on pivotal battles such as the battles of Marathon (not the race) and Thermopylae Pass (if you don't know what that is, think 300). Since it is set in an alternate universe from Spiral Knight's version of Cradle, the storyline will deviate a bit from the Almirian myths. For example, in Almirian lore, there's two kingdoms that attack Almire, but in this story, there's only one.
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 12:38
#19
@Kaijuhunter
I think it would definitely be good fanfic material. Turning it into a roleplay could be considerably more complicated.
*What are their equipment choices?
*What is the character of the Almirians in general?
*What do Almirians look like?
*What does their world look like?
*Where is Almire located?
*Where exactly in the timeline does all this take place?
Cradle and the Clockworks are already familiar to us, so they do not need much description before they can be effectively utilized in the roleplay. Almire, however, is much more nebulous to the players. If you can pull off an effective description of the universe they live in, then maybe such a roleplay could work.
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 19:16
#20
Well...
If The Last Stand of Almire is to become a fanfic, what do you say we reboot RtC? I mean the OLD one; same characters, same setting, but hopefully a slightly, slightly different storyline and less powerplaying. Waddya say; RtC WAS the longest RP on the SK forums, why shouldn't we try and do it again?
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 19:38
#21
@Kaijuhunter
How do we keep it the same? I tried a reboot, complete with exactly the same intro, but you saw how that turned out. If we are to keep it the same, we'll have to take some additional measures.
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 19:48
#22
@Kaijuhunter
See The Pact of the Monocled Chromalisk, maybe your plot has some ground there.
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 22:11
#23
The best ones.
The roleplays that work best seem to be the ones that intimately involve the Core, and they all tend in that direction anyways. Do we want one the focuses on the mysteries of the Core, or should we try one that has nothing to do with it?
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 22:58
#24
I guess we shouldn't wander too far off until everything goes out of context of the SK world, but of course, we shouldn't limit ourselves solely around the Core.
Basically, don't focus on making an RP which is very plot-driven. A fixed story draws restrictions on itself which limits our creativity, and in turn, everybody loses interest in the RP. Simply start off with a general idea, then when everyone is ready, we just dive in and have fun.
The best thing to do for now is to do some research. Look back at the old RPs (e.g. Clockwork Renegades), see what made it so successful, figure out its flaws, and think about how we can build something better.
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 23:06
#25
@Snowdusk
I've already done a little examination, though it is by no means exhaustive.
*Return to Cradle
Defining features: overpowered characters, power-playing, gripping background & storyline, too lengthy to read through
*Finder's Keepers
Defining features: failed story-discussion-thread structure, superior writing, complex characters
*Retribution
Defining features: failed story-discussion-thread structure, character pictures, poetry
*Return to Cradle: Rebooted
Defining features: successful story-discussion-thread structure, writer's block
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 23:30
#26
I can see what's lacking in all of the above examples: matured and experienced roleplayers.
We need to have characters played by someone who knows what he/she is doing, and aware of how it can potentially build or break the RP. The good roleplayer constantly keeps track of the RP, and not busy showing off their character's strengths unless it is truly their moment to shine. This is what I observe exactly from most of the RPs: players who have no idea how to effectively play an RP.
This starts from the mods, where they should learn to be strict and reject bad applicants, although this will always reduce the number of players. But the important thing is, this way you can always ensure you have knowledgeable people participating and going forward as a group, as long as you monitor everything.
Now, I'm not saying we should call off anyone new who wishes to try out your RP for the first tme. They should at least have basic communication and writing skills, and a positive mindset. If you're really convinced they're not ready, it's ok if you reject their application, just ask them to write another application, or kindly tell them they're just not qualified. RP itself is a dedicated platform, and should never be taken lightly.
Tue, 04/30/2013 - 00:00
#27
@Snowdusk
That's...interesting advice. I'll have to look into that.
I have a few followup questions.
1) You mentioned that a good roleplayer keeps track of the RP. What does that look like? I'm imagining that it is simply "creating a coherent story," but I may be imagining it wrong.
2) Is there any way to influence the quality of the applicants? I was thinking that perhaps I should put more emphasis on the biography in order to gauge the player's writing skills, but there has to be more effective ways to influence player quality.
3) You noted that roleplays should never be taken lightly, by reason of dedication. How do you recommend I intersect seriousness with fun?
Tue, 04/30/2013 - 01:03
#28
Thank you for your time. I'm not regular RP writer/player myself, but I'll answer as accurately as I can.
1) To answer this, I'll mention the opposite: bad RP players go off-track. They only care to show what their character(s) do by their own, instead of showing what their character(s) would do (forced even) in reaction to the story's events or situations. Good RP players not only gain understanding of the current storyline, they can help facilitate it right till the end.
2) I'm afraid not, in any way you can't change a person's personality or skill. It's up to them to learn how to gain a specific knowledge on a field, all you can do is to look for the good ones out there. It is really hard nowadays to find good talent around, including writers. This sort of stuff can't be forced to change, everyone has to do their own part. If you really need a solution, I guess it's encouraging others to improve.
3) Think of RP as a hobby which requires skill. Good example? Fishing.
A hobby itself is already fun, but to get the most of it, you have to acquire the necessary skills. If you want to be able to fish, you need patience and time. In the end, the result is surely rewarding. In roleplaying, it's already possible to achieve its fun, as long as the players are both dedicated, skilful and creative.
Tue, 04/30/2013 - 18:40
#29
@Thin- Perhaps you could copy/paste everyone's ideas into the OP so the thread is a bit more organized? I see no voting here, only suggestion after suggestion.
~
Also, some of the problems mentioned with previous roleplays, such as Roleplayers quitting, could be easily overcome if all the Roleplayers agreed that in the event of not being able to continue their character, whether because of writer's block, school, life, they would "end" that character. This could be done in a number of ways, as I'm sure a writers like yall could imagine.
Tue, 04/30/2013 - 20:23
#30
@Immortuous
With my iPhone? I'm too lazy. xD
But I like your other idea.
Hello? Anyone there?