Hail knights! A new feature has been announced here:
http://forums.spiralknights.com/en/node/79568
Please discuss!
Dash and Shield Bash discussion thread (upcoming feature)
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 17:10
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 17:14
#2
You are experiencing a PICNIC ERROR!
Wow. This is awesome. I can't wait. I'm not kidding. This will finally give recons the buff they need and open up many options, particularly for weapons which seem useless right now.
I do have a questions: Shield bash power will vary from shield to shield, right? If I shield bash with a swiftstrike in T3, it will do almost nothing at all, right? If I bash with an Ancient Plate shield, it will do much more than an Owlite shield. Am I assuming correct? Or is it too early for an answer?
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 17:14
#3
HA
And they said there was no reason to change the UI. It seems OOO always has a plan...
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 17:23
#4
YES!
I saw these as keybinding options a while back on the test server and I've been excited ever since. Hope they lead to faster and more exciting gameplay, and give Skolver clones something to worry about :D
Also gives a solution to bombers/heavy swords taking forever to break minerals. :)
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 17:23
#5
I'm excited about these. Several folks noticed when the key bindings showed up on the preview server a while ago, but of course we couldn't talk about it. I like the idea of more options for strategic gameplay, but as I always say: I just hope that there will also be new content to make the new features make sense (i.e., baddies that have to be bashed before you can kill them, etc). Looking forward to it!
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 17:25
#6
@Narfle
Adding on to Narfle's thoughts, wouldn't it be cool to have more traps that required you to dash through them and strategically time your dashes so you don't get hurt?
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 17:27
#7
Now THIS I like.
I am actually excited for this. 8D
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 17:32
#8
FALCON PUNCH!
So that's why the shield bars were put in, although I don't get why they messed up party member health...it was fine before.
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 17:34
#9
Laundry List has Appeared. It's a Killer. Do Not Die.
Just on this teaser, I can say I truly would not like there to be invulnerable dashing. Period. What human reason would there be than as a means of further cheesing enemy attacks and level hazards. Also, would dashing be unavailable to the Stunned knight? It will be interrupted by shock, correct? I only envision the dash, unless with terribly long cool down, being exploitable (in fact, the wonder switch-spike sections of the Compounds may very-well be able to be skipped through dashing or some form of dash-canceling or further shield-canceling)
Speaking of Shields... Shield Bashing would be a minor attack on top of shield bumping to enemies in front of your knight, aye? In performing the attack the knight loses shield health as well? I can only hope this is triggered by a button or such, for accidentally hurting your own shield would be hazardous in most any situation.
Also, as AutoFire has mentioned, shield-bash-strength being dependent on the shield and not a flat value like shield-health would be best. (This is more UI-Chat, but that lengthy blue bar is not pretty and the fact all shields have the same health is... eh I just don't like it. It'd be more interesting if shields had varied health at the 5* level).
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 17:39
#10
They're nice and all, but...
I hate to be "that guy" but, can we get any word on sprites? I think the last time you guys said anything about them was when you were clarifying scarabs were NOT sprites.
Anyway, can't wait to see how these'll work out when added to the game.
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 17:36
#11
Any chance of shields or armors that provide bonuses to power or cooldown of those abilities? I feel those would be nice benefits for the Plate Mail and Mercurial sets.
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 17:44
#12
@Orbwanter
THIS, THIS SO VERY MUCH!
It would really boost the plate series quite nicely.
----
There's one thing that bothers me about these abilities (thou I think they are really darn cool!): will monsters get a tweak to compensate for these abilities? With this and the Battle Sprites, wouldnt knight become a bit too strong for the normal clockwork levels? I can see these working great for the danger missions and shadow lairs but kinda overkill for normal missions and clockwork runs.
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 17:59
#13
A way to interrupt greavers if I'm only carrying bombs?
I'm Zeddy and I approve of this announcement.
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 18:00
#14
You are experiencing a PICNIC ERROR!
@Burq
I agree. While this provides new mechanics, we also need a blanketed monster buff, probably AI or speed-wise, to compensate. If a noob says it's too hard after that, he is probably just forgetting to shield bash'n'dash.
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 18:04
#15
As I said in another thread....
We have no idea what their plans are for anything, and all we get are teasers =)
I am thinking they are adding new content/levels for all these things coming out. They wouldn't make us overly powerful (i would hope) without new content to balance it out
I am very excited to see what new things are coming because of the dash. I think there will be times when you need the dash to complete a section (like a long stretch of spikes/fire/etc).
Keep up the good work OOO I knew you had something up your sleeve =)
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 18:25
#16
Really this is great!!! Can't
Really this is great!!! Can't wait! :D
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 18:38
#17
This is great news!
I wonder though, will the striker dash be slightly extended because of an extra "dash"?
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 18:41
#18
Node 53120 is credit to team
I like this idea a lot! Bonking Greavers as a Bomber will be very very nice.
Maybe certain swords and guns can get different combos if used after a Shield Bash or Dash? For example, running as you fire an Autogun shot. Heck, maybe bombs can be thrown if the charge is released during a dash...
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 18:42
#19
^
YESH. Throwing. bombs.
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 18:42
#20
~
Interesting new gameplay options! As others have said, should open up lots of interesting possibilities with weapons that seem weak right now.
Will these features appear in Lockdown? Could be hard to balance, and might just make Striker stronger.
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 18:46
#21
Sounds interesting...
Sounds interesting...
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 18:50
#22
+1 to throwing bombs. that is all.
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 18:55
#23
This is interesting, but why
This is interesting, but why wait so long? Is there CONTENT in which we'll actually need invincibility frames? I'm intrigued now.
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 18:59
#24
firstly will these mechanics
firstly will these mechanics be allowed in lock down and secondly will the dash/shield bash allow attack interruption. if this is allowed in ld then i foresee total annihilation of newbs (including myself) by the better players. and as for the attack interruption part that was to counter the use of this in ld (if it ends up being allowed) meaning if the player is being combo-ed to death can he push the shield bash attack to interrupt it. but yeah this sounds awesome and will create some interesting game play.
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 19:06
#25
Looks cool, but..
It sounds cool, but as others have said, there better be new content to use it on.
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 19:12
#26
You are experiencing a PICNIC ERROR!
My guesses, atleast in relation to LD:
Striker gets changed so instead you get 3 bursts of the dash. Each dash works like outside of LD, with the exception of using shield energy instead. The shield now recharges gradually.
Guardians get shield bash. This allows them to attack while shielding, at the cost of weakening their shield.
Recons stay the same.
That's what I hope for.
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 19:14
#27
So basically...
Chargin' Targe?
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 19:17
#28
I think it sounds
I think it sounds interesting, too. I think different shields should be more effective at Shield Bashing, though. And I think it'll help with those swarming monsters...
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 19:21
#29
don't forget
There's still battle Sprites! But yea my guess for new content to use these new techniques on are the tortodrome (don't think I spelled it right).
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 19:24
#30
About this dash... it looks like a striker, basically we are going to have turbo wolvers everywhere instead of LD-only? THE HORROR. D:
At least the shield bash seems interesting.
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 19:23
#31
Dash unnecessary
I really like the idea of the shiled bash, but not the dash. As comments before have mentioned, I imagine the dash as a shortened version of the striker boost. I guess the dash would be useful to gunners, seeing they wouldn't want to get up close and shield bash anyways, but it is unnessecary with the implementation (is that a word) of the bash.
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 19:32
#32
I like how everyone
I like how everyone immediately thinks of Lockdown before anything else. This just proves Lockdown would make more money as a standalone game.
Personally I find it hard to imagine Lockdown using these mechanics, but if it did then the metagame will change somewhat. Invincibility frames change everything, but if the dash is anything like the hammer then it can be easily telegraphed. Shield bash is nice, I don't see myself using it with what we have to play right now, maybe in the future?
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 19:38
#33
As with all content, I shall have to wait to judge.
I'd love to hear more about how it would work, but I'm sure it will be out soon enough.
Please don't disappoint me.
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 19:38
#34
So Knights are given brand new abilities and movement assets.
If by any means it is a sign that monsters will be buffed to the way they were previously (tracking players while attacking, faster reaction times), then I am already brimming with anticipation.
We are on our way to becoming a lot more dangerous than we used to be, it's only fair if our enemies are going to.
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 19:57
#35
Yay, something new!
Yay, something new!
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 20:14
#36
Heres hoping that they don't
Heres hoping that they don't remove the current shield bumping mechanics.
Tbh, I would rather they focused on other things that desperately need fixing *COUGH, BOMBER GEAR, COUGH*, as opposed to adding thing which don't need adding at all.
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 20:26
#37
Well, this certainly seems very interesting. I'm suppose that the dash will be like a half-second's worth of the striker dash. Shield bashing seems to pretty much be a more offensive way to shield bump.
'providing a burst of speed and limited invulnerability'
Limited invulnerability? Won't that mean you can just dash across traps and not take any damage? Meh.
'doing a small amount of damage, knocking them back and stunning them for a limited time'
So shield bash is basically throwing a stun vial. OK.
This really can end up unlocking a bunch of new stuff for everyone to do. I'm personally wondering how long it'll take after this stuff is released for someone to start a contest to see who can kill vanaduke using only their shield bash.
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 20:36
#38
LOL, good point lordofnecromancers
i just realized that. shield bash is just infinite stun vials i hope they distinguish that enough to make stun vials keep there usefulness
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 21:10
#39
Node 53120 is credit to team
@Blaknt: Stun Vials probably will stun longer, can be thrown, destroy Rocket Puppy projectiles like other Vials, and have a metric crap-ton of knockback. (Like, you can compare it to a BAB, and NOTHING ELSE.) They will still be used, no worries.
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 21:16
#40
Sounds like fun, an update that makes me play PvE at last.
(Im also still waiting for a PvP update)
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 21:36
#41
"after performing a shield bash, your shield is drained of some of its power"
If by power, he means a star-dependant percentage of health is removed, then all shields are treated equally (lower star shields have more of their health taken)
If by power, he means a set amount of normal damage is inflicted on the shield, then melee shields will have an advantage over bullet shields (Aegis takes less than Royal Jelly, Heater takes less than Grey Owlite, CoA takes less than Skelly, and Plate and Omega are the most superior of them all)
If by power, he means a set amount of health is removed regardless of shield defenses, then all 4 and 5 star shields will be equal in how much health is taken, except for the Stone Tortoise and Omega shell which will be far superior.
I can imagine the shield bash could possibly be implemented into Lockdown as a Guardian ability only (seeing as they're the only ones with shields)
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 21:39
#42
As a gamepad player, I'd like
As a gamepad player, I'd like to be the first to say...I'm running out of buttons! Taking into account the Battle Sprites + these attacks(hopefully the dash is just a double tap and the shield bash is shield+double tap)...maybe I'll map the quickslots by analog direction, give the shoulder buttons a rest.
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 21:47
#43
...
Dashing reminds me of when I suggested rolling here.
Pretty much everyone hated on it... am I missing something?
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 22:00
#44
WOOO!!
I am not usually an emotional person, but...
WOOO!! THIS IS AWESOME!!
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 22:02
#45
Oh lord...
Lockdown bombing is gonna be a pain in the butt XD
By the way, will this effect how Sprites operate in any manner?
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 22:21
#46
Considering the battle
Considering the battle sprite's skills and these dash and shield bashing and a unique key for all 4 weapons slots and vials. I foresee not enough buttons for the future. Can we trigger shield bashing with double shield and dash with double direction button?
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 22:29
#47
@Rogue-Wolf
That doesn't look like hate, the idea just seemed "moderately disagreed with".
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 22:38
#48
@Misten
That's an intriguing idea, but some important techniques require rapid use of the shield (including shield-canceling and switch-shooting, to name a couple). Double-direction button-pressing is useful in provoking Trojans to attack in order to create an opening; whether dashing messes with that remains to be seen.
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 22:46
#49
@ThinslayerYes in that case
@Thinslayer
Yes in that case the interval between the double click need to be very short.
Or has to make sure there is only 1 shield per shield-canceling and switch-shooting and not spamming. For baiting Trojans, i don't have a problem because i usually stop to bait and move in opposite direction.
Of course the most preferred way is still to ensure that the double click interval is short(rapid).
Mon, 04/29/2013 - 23:00
#50
You are experiencing a PICNIC ERROR!
Just to add my two cents, which I forgot to add before...
When I read "dash" I instantly thought of how gremlins jump around. Not strikers. When I said that strikers would get 3 dashes, that meant three gremlin-like jumps. It could also be something like this.
In other words, they stay speedy but at the same time become five times harder to control.
EDIT: My hopes on how these skills will be used:
- Bash: Attack while defending.
- Dash: New key bind.
- Dash (option): Double tap a direction to dash.
If it's like this, you only need one more key bind, but you wouldn't have to do this if you didn't want to.
Also, semi-invulnerability might be invulnerability to certain enemy attacks, while other ones, like Lumber smashes, and traps would still hurt you. If you stayed invulnerable to traps, I can tell you right now that a whole lot of spikes could be skipped with this!
Great ideas! I'm glad to see this game get a little more depth and hope we can get these changes reasonably soon.