This is a joke right? Whoever is sitting on their Valestones stop it right now and fix all this stupid.
Sapphire Rook Gate
Is it confirmed that a strata tends to yield the corresponding non-strata minerals? I feel like there is a disproportionate amount of purple being dumped- in most of the gates I have seen, purple leads in every strata.
Found it!
http://wiki.spiralknights.com/Release_Notes_2011-04-04
"Increased the chance of a random mineral type spawning in place of a given level's associated mineral types."
So a Valestone or Luminite in Royal Jelly Palace... will have a chance to be re-rolled to a different mineral on spawn.
This explains everything except the part where Dark Matter has -additional- prevalence over other mineral types.
People avoid Shock Stratums, which makes Shock Stratums more prevalent. Also Dark Matter is prettier.
GMs will mix it up when it's released anyway, it's highly unlikely they'll leave any gate pure -anything-.
Shock is always the sole type of every gate made these days, and yet when they're released you don't see all that Shock anymore. If GMs left it as is then there would be less variety in the game since players would be seeing almost no other monsters except Shock types.
Well that's no fair because JK is a forced gate! I don't understand why it can't stay regular for all minerals?
Ah, thanks for that reference, Gigafreak. That one little note answers a lot.
The new system is clearly far worse than the old one. I hope this gate gets reworked now that it's opened in an incredibly stupid fashion and that the gate construction system gets a more reasonable overhaul.
This is dumb it's almost awesome.
lol wow.
So much for GM intervention. On the bright side my wolver coat with high shock resist just increased in value!
Either gate system would have this problem, because it isn't the gate system. It's the mineral distribution in levels. All this system does is make it blatantly obvious. Either boss strata need to have all colors able to spawn or we need a reason to play a t2 that isn't Royal Jelly Palace.
I don't really understand why strata don't spawn their own colors still. Those strata were spawned but have no bearing on the next set of strata. The JK incident here is just a result as someone said, of what sounds like a larger problem. Limiting the minerals, especially with auto-selling, just pushes strata construction in one way or another.
I thought all the new gates are by default all shock because they got rid of the question marks. Remember how a new gate looked like all question marks until that stratum was set? Well, now that they've made it more fluid, I thought that every stratum starts as shock until people put enough minerals into it to change it to something else.
I could be mistaken, though.
No one is forcing you to run thru the shock gates. There is always 4 gates available. And most ppl will go for the JK gate or more profitable t3 gates anyways
No, this is a problem with the gate system. The previous system was either neutral (gold values were equal across all minerals on a stratum) or beneficial (if you boosted) to players trying to craft a gate. The current system actively works against anyone trying to affect the outcome of a gate, directing autosold minerals counter to what's currently highest in a given stratum, bringing the gate to an equilibrium that is, apparently, shock.
Yea I've avoided the shock gate entirely but if that's going to keep being the way the system works I think that should be fixed pretty quickly.
The problem with avoiding shock levels is that under a system where the minerals to make shock levels (and fiend) are more common on other types, everyone avoiding these levels will just create more of them until we have all shock and fiend with the 3 boss strata. The only way to make other types of strata form is to man up and play the shock and fiend levels to get the other minerals. However, with the jelly run being so popular, this isn't going to happen, as more shock and fiend levels just push more people towards it because at the end of the day it's a game and I personally don't find it fun getting smacked down by 4200 chairs in 2 seconds or getting shocked once and dying due to it stopping me moving and cancelling my shield.
people can also stop picking up purple and going for more greens
I'm pretty sure this gate system is temporary and the only reason they changed it was because boosting wasn't working as intended. I think Nick said that they were working on a new system. At least that's what I picked up from the release notes when the old system was removed.
It's not that the new gate system pushes the gates towards shock, it's that it pushes them towards uniformity. If the distribution of collected minerals were uniform, the gates would tend towards equal amounts of all minerals, making it relatively easy for players to affect the outcomes. But because the collected minerals are not uniformly distributed, apparently due largely to the relative lack of valestone and luminite in the jelly palace, all gates are biased towards shock and fiend, and it takes quite a bit of valestone or luminite to make a difference. Removing the mineral distribution bias, at least from boss strata, should make the current gate construction system a lot more responsive to player control. Meanwhile, valestone and luminite are worth 50% more than the other minerals in nearly all strata at the moment, so get 'em while they're hot! You'll be helping your pocketbook as well as balancing the gates.
(Edit: The guy before me just finished saying the stuff I just cut out. /derp. My bad. Moving on...)
If you see a (friendly, open-minded) new player, be sure to let them know that the purple ones are "common and cheap" whereas green and gold are "uncommon and more valuable." For one thing, they won't want to take the purple ones, and for another-- it's the truth anyway! (Yes, maybe it'll even help if you refer to Luminite as "gold" colored instead of just yellow.)
In the meantime, though, I wonder if maybe stratum mineral payouts ought to be determined by the neighbouring strata's mineral counts instead of the stratum's own mineral counts. Though right off the bat there's a problem with this suggestion: it's a bit counterintuitive for new players, and tricky to explain.
"In the meantime, though, I wonder if maybe stratum mineral payouts ought to be determined by the neighbouring strata's mineral counts instead of the stratum's own mineral counts."
This would mean there would be variation from week to week, but with mineral distributions apparently being dominated by the current jelly run, you'd still see a lot of a particular bias from the time between the opening of one jelly palace gate and the next. Removing that bias altogether seems preferable.
Ehh, yeah, the idea was to get the purple minerals all concentrated to the same stratum so that other minerals can become dominant on other strata.
Adding purple minerals into stratum 2 would reduce autosell value on purple for the strata 1 and 3, but NOT stratum 2. Therefore Autosell will concentrate all the purples into the stratum 2, meaning we only have to put up with one or two Shock strata per gate.
New issue: this is a feedback loop (Adding purple into a stratum makes people add MORE purple into that stratum!), and those almost never end well. I'm sure I can probably come up with at least three ways this can go horribly awry, if I thought about it long enough.
I don;'t know much about minerals but my characters color is green and I like to pick up green minerals. I usually do, but I don't pass up a large purple if I see it.
I've been playing JK about 3 times during the time it took me to collect ~1k of each mineral. Also I tried to avoid shock levels. If I have to choice between green, red & other minerals, I tend to pick them in that order and half of the ppl I'm playing with do the same. Despite that, the minerals ratio in my inventory looks about the same as the one in the shock gate.
I've been stock-piling(!!) moonstones but that's just an amusement rather than any sort of initiative.
Anyway, I hope this gets resolved. There's a lot more shock coming.
Monty Python's Spiral Knights:
A Play in One Act
-------------------------------------------------------
Opening Scene: A small cafe. FALSETTO VOICE and REASSURING VOICE are seated at a round table, with a laptop between them.
-------------------------------------------------------
Falsetto voice: (Looks at Sapphire Rook on the laptop) I don't loik SHOCK
Reassuring voice: Have you seen the upcoming Golden Clover gate? It's got Slime, Shock, Shock, Shock, Shock, and Fire. That's not too much shock, issenent?
Falsetto voice: I don't want ANY shock!
Reassuring voice: How about waiting for Diamond Falcon. That's got Shock, Beast, Shock, Fiend, Shock, Shock.
Falsetto voice: I don't want shock and I shan't play it.
Reassuring voice: Well, the upcoming Coral Queen is just for you. It's Poison, Shock, Construct, Slime, Fire, and Freeze.
Falsetto voice: That's...that's...actually not that bad!
Reassuring voice: Oh, good, good, because after that, we have Shock, Poison, Shock, Shock, Shock, and Shock.
Falsetto voice: AAAaaaaAAaaaaaAaaaaaAaaaaaAaaaaa!
Inexplicable chorus: Shock, Shock, Shock, Shock, Shock, Shock, Shock, Shock...
Falsetto voice: AAaaaAaaaaaAaaEEEEEEaaaAAAaaaa!
Inexplicable chorus: Shock, Shock, Shock, Shock, Shock, Shock, Shock, Shock...
FALSETTO VOICE makes a dash for exit stage left; INEXPLICABLE CHORUS gives immediate chase. Because this game is an AMERICAN PRODUCTION and the JOKE has been RUN INTO THE GROUND, the entire lot is inexplicably crushed by FALLING GIANT BASEBALLS.
Drop Curtain.
There aren't enough Valestones in circulation because minerals spawn less frequently in stages that are made of that mineral.
By far, the most frequently farmed stages are the Royal Jelly Palace stages.
That's a slime stratum.
Slime strata are made of Valestone and Luminite.
Therefore: the most-farmed stage is dropping less Valestone and Luminite than the other three.
All-Shock nonstop is a byproduct of people farming Royal Jelly Palace for Crowns and tokens.