Spiral Knights - The problem I find on MMORPGs

The problem I find on MMORPGs

9 replies [Last post]

Fri, 03/20/2015 - 18:51

Trats-Romra

It's not well thought, it's just my opinion. And I want to know yours.

A lot of MMORPGs have a problem to me: the Solo problem.
I find rather strange that you can solo a MMORPG. I mean, it's a MULTIPLAYER, right? So you need to play it multiplayer, not singleplayer. No, I don't have any problems with guys that are like gods because they beated bosses that are nearly impossible to be beaten alone. What I dislike is: Any player beating the entirely game alone. Purely solo. With no help.

It turn a MMO on a MSO: Multiplayer Solo Online. What are a full Chaos party on a regular level? It's 4 people playing alone, each one beating enemies separately. Why? Because all of them can easily solo the level without the party. The unique difference is that will be more fast. Just it.

My brother says that you can't make a MMO to be hard to solo players. You would be independable, but party being more rewarding.
I not see on the same way. To me, when you are playing on a level on a MMORPG, you would need the entirely party to play it. I don't mean that each attack need to combo with other, but when you divide to conquer, you are trying to crowd control by dividing the monsters on little groups to be more easy to each player defeat the enemies, because all of them on one player would be too hard.

Well, it's it. I hope that I'm being clear and not making any gramatical mistakes.

Fri, 03/20/2015 - 19:35

Fehzor

I think you're over estimating MMO players a bit here. The bulk of MMO players (myself being a prime example) are incredibly stupid and self centered, and play the game primarily so that they can feel accomplished and good about themselves when people stop and are like "Wow, that is a person that manipulated the auction house for several days on end or played the same high tier level non-stop for several weeks and bought something. If only I could do that." There are tons of examples of this- the high tiered gambling costumes that had to have been bought by someone, the number of new guilds created, the way people post on the forums.

Forcing these failed members of society to work together also happens to fails on the whole, an example being levels like Apocrea. You could plan a strategy and move around as a group... or one person could distract the harvester while the others separate out and process graves as quickly as possible. A similar situation being the bulk of levels and the amount of praise given to weapons like combuster- are they good? Yeah. Do they work well with themselves? Kind of. But people don't typically use them effectively in a way that benefits their damage and their team's damage. The do-it-yourself strategy works, because it's the strategy that everyone wants to be doing, because if they kill all the things then they are the elite vanguard supreme.

Fri, 03/20/2015 - 22:03

Trats-Romra

EDIT: Sorry. I overreacted writing this. I tend to be very headstrong a lot of times. But I will keep it. I hope that it makes more clear what I wanted to mean.

The do-it-yourself strategy works, because it's the strategy that everyone wants to be doing, because if they kill all the things then they are the elite vanguard supreme.

So, Fehzor, I will touch on your weak point. If any player can beat the game alone, it means that there's no people that are really special. There's not the more skillfully guy. The god-like player that beated the most hard boss ever alone. If everyone are equally strong, there's no space for the special ones.

Random Vanguard say "I did KoA with just proto set."
I say "But a bunch of people already did that."

Now, I will stop touching on weak point and go back to my opinion.

I think that MMORPG should reinforce the social aspect more. You should play together. You should need others to accomplish your desires. Why? Because everyone love each other and want to contribute? Not necessarily. Because everyone should simply need the others help. So you need to deal with people. On battle, on trading, on crafting (depending of situation).
If everyone can do everything of the game alone, it's not MMO, it's a MSO. A bunch of players playing singleplayer on a multiplayer server. And you can be "The guy" on single players and not deal with people. "Man, I beat Paladog on Hell Mode". "I'm the guy! I completed Megaman X8 using just Megaman and no-special suit".

I don't overstimate people. I just think that there's no sense on playing singlepayer on a multiplayer. See, if a level was hard to be played alone, everyone would search people to play on party. Why? Because they want to pass this level to progress.
If you want vanglory or admiration, there's space for it even on parties: "Wow! You have cool weapons" or "Wow! You are very powerful" or "See? I did more damage than everyone" or "See? I did the final blow". And if you want to have fame on haven, just prove that you are skillful by videos and people will admire you. Contri himself have his fame as the ultimate PvP player.

You could plan a strategy and move around as a group...
There's no need of strategy. Each player go beat part of the enemies. So, what happen? While you beat part of enemies, someone is covering you from behind, so you aren't smashed like a sandwich, you aren't surrounded by enemies. The level becomes more playable. And why are you playing together? Because you want to finish the game and be admired by new players. "See this guy? He use cool stuff".

I just want that MMO don't facilitate people to "play singleplayer on a multiplayer".

Fri, 03/20/2015 - 22:14

Midnight-Dj

So you are saying, that every MMO needs to be a MOBA like LoL and DOTA2? No, that is bull, a multi player experience should always comes secondary to the game play itself.

Of course, OOO can give some perk to those who play in a group, but that alienate a group of people, like me for example, I am a Soloist, and when I play a multi players game, I prefer having some level of autonomy.

I will give you an Example, SAS4: zombie assault was a game that I played recently, I first started as a medic, as you know, first rule to all healers in MMO, they are weaker than offensive classes but can heal him/her self and other players. During most games with others, I will try as much as I can to heal myself and others, but my well being will always come first and I find that not many people play as medic really care about the health of others as much as I do. I spec'ed my medic to produce good med kits and high energy regen to make sure I can produce med kits constantly to keep my team mates healthy.

But on my second character, who was a 'heavy' (<- yes, I am the heavy weapons guy...), I am not counting my my team mates keeping me alive because I knew from the get go to never count on anyone in a multi player game. Why you ask? Because me as a player should never suffer due the incompetence of others, hence why when I started as a heavy and got tough body, a passive ability that helps me negate damage from the stinking claws of the zombies and of course health regen to keep myself in the fight for longer. Heavy is also the only class in the game that doesn't have any forms of healing ability, only skills to negate them. And seeing how 'selfish' others play their medics, I knew a tough heavy was the only way I am going to survive against a horde of zombies, that and a lot of automatic fire power.

As you can see, even when we are playing multiplayers, we are all separate individuals who are doing their own things, so why multi players in the first place? And what about the players who play at a timezone where everyone on the SK north american server are sleeping? It seems to them the only way to enjoy this game is solo.

Fri, 03/20/2015 - 23:42

Alienf

i play most of SK by myself

i play most of SK by myself or with friends/guildies, thats the only way this game is still fun. now as to players being punished by others not working together, i agree with that to a point actually.. it would make some players have to grow up the way i see it and work together or never get anything done.
i personally like a challenge and lets be real, shadow lair vana is the only thing close to a little of a challenge nowadays..

Sat, 03/21/2015 - 09:13

Trats-Romra

@Everyone

I beginning to realize that it's more about preference than a problem. See, on past Maple Story, everything was hard. Leveling was hard, playing was hard, jumping the little spaces over stone golem was hard. But I had a lot of fun on these times, because when I was having difficult, random players appeared and made a party with me. When I was collecting leather from pigs, people joined me up and beating the pigs were a more easy job. Which one was before their own needs but everyone had the culture to play together, because it was more worthy and easy, because you can't get surrounded and etc. My cousin said that on past, when the pros were killing monsters and leaved a lot of items all over the floor, the more weak guys jumped on items to get it.

So, seeing that there are people like my brother, Midnight-Dj and Fehzor, I can see that is about of a preference, not a problem. Games that you depend more on others is more interesting to me, while other players have their own preferences.

Well, but I have to say that MMO are overdoing on solo aspect, because beating a boss alone shouldn't be easy , right? Or I'm wrong? Because, apparently, if you have the right gear, you can beat Vanaduke alone. Yes, you need a bit of skill, but it's nothing like beating Vanaduke with just Shard bombs, what Zeddy did. And, c'mon, the game already is reaching the limit when you let players play solo on a thing that is clearly called "Party Quest" (Very probably, my reason for being so furious with this).

@Fehzor
Sorry for replying on the way I replied.

Sun, 04/12/2015 - 09:11

Snakey-One

What I h8 about MMORPGs

SOCKETING FUCKING GEMS!

Mon, 04/13/2015 - 16:10

Saucce

Swearing man....

Tue, 04/14/2015 - 11:40

Krakob

My mum would never let me use a computer again if she found out there are uncensored profanities on sites I visit!!!

Thu, 04/16/2015 - 08:10

Holy-Nightmare

....

There are lots of games which make it impossible to win solo

TF2 Halloween boss fights is a good example, but they play to kill each other too so even if the boss doesn't show up they would still play.

On the other hand we have games like AQW. A huge portion of the game is easy to solo. However there are some monsters that are impossible to solo. Bosses like this are often never fought except on the day they get released and even then trying to get a party to join you in fighting the monster is nearly impossible. Even harder to try and get a group to work together to weaken the boss, support teammates, and deal damage. Most players only use classes that promote self preservation and damage output instead of support or tanking classes.

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The problem I find on MMORPGs