UVs: Seriously speaking, how much of a difference do they ACTUALLY make?
Tue, 06/14/2011 - 05:18
Well I remember seeing the figures of a Cold Iron Vanquisher fighting Undead versus other monsters.
You know how theres a "Damage Bonus against Undead: High" ? that sounds pretty awesome against zombies right?
well, i dont remember the actual figures... all i remember is that there was like somewhere around a puny 15%-ish increase damage against undead, which would still kill them in the same amount of attacks.
i may be mistaken, but whats everyone else's view on how good UVs actually are?
i'm having a hard time deciding between Skolver and Vog but i dont know if Skolver will actually help me kill any enemies with less hits at all :S
Tue, 06/14/2011 - 05:45
#2
I prefer attack speed, since
I prefer attack speed, since it's guaranteed that I can attack faster, even if it's only slightly. More damage might result in less hits, but often it doesn't and really only applies to enemies with tons of HP, like bosses, or to an extent, lumbers. But that goes back to attack speed; if you can attack faster, you're doing more damage and there are a host of other benefits that go along with it.
Get yourself a swiftstrike buckler and see how that "high" speed increase feels. You might not really notice it, but when you go back to using the weapon without that shield, you should feel the lack of speed. If you don't, then just go with more damage as you will at least feel some numbers are going to be higher.
You seem too concerned about this, rather than playing whatever feels good. Don't min-max everything. Just do whatever you enjoy most. I personally like more speed and for most weapons, that's a benefit.
On the topic of UVs, players have done some tests and shown that certain UVs are linear (e.g. CTR lessens charge time by 0.25 seconds per point). Then there are others, like status resistances, where the higher you go, the more diminishing returns you get (e.g. no curse resist causes me 40 seconds of curse, but medium curse resist UV gives me only 22 seconds. You can bet that another 3 points isn't going to make that curse 0 seconds).
On a similar note, and one people rarely talk about, consider status resists or defense that does NOT match your armor. The norm tends to be e.g. someone going for vog cub coat wants a fire UV to have the most fire protection. This sounds ok, but think about the diminishing returns I mentioned above. A low UV for status resist gives the absolute most protection for that 1 point. Sure, you want to make your armor as well suited to a stratum as possible, but let's say you're going for that vog cub coat. Instead of getting a fire UV, consider a shock or freeze UV, whatever your two pieces of armor is missing. For those instances that you run into those statuses, you aren't going to take the maximum damage.
Put it this way: Add 2 points to your already good fire protection to shave off 1 second of burn? Or have 2 points of shock protection that can bring 8 seconds of shock down to a mere 5 seconds? <--- numbers may not be accurate depending on the gear you have, but you should get the point
Tue, 06/14/2011 - 10:02
#3
Attack speed UVs grant about
Attack speed UVs grant about 4% per level (4% low 8% medium 12% high 16% vhigh 20% ultra 24% max)
Damage UVs grant about 6% per level (6%low 12% medium 18% high 24% vhigh 30% ultra 36% max)
Charge time reduction UVs grant about .25 seconds per level (.25 low .5 medium .75 high 1 vhigh 1.25 ultra 1.5 max)
The IAS and CTR UVs are fairly constant but the damage ones actually range from like 4%-7% per level based on depth, i think. Whether or not you kill a thing in less hits varies from monster to monster and depth to depth. Attack speed is generally the safer UV as it always lets you shield a little faster after an attack and remains constant but if you have a weapon that's purpose built to kill a certain enemy type a damage UV provides more flat damage than attacking faster does. Bombs almost always want CTR, as do weapons with specifically attractive charge attacks like the Divine Avenger.
Tue, 06/14/2011 - 19:49
#4
wow actinium you helped a
wow actinium you helped a LOT, thanks heaps!
Wed, 06/15/2011 - 04:55
#5
I've actually been wondering
I've actually been wondering about this same question. Thanks for all the info as well.
Although, the reason I became curious over this subject in the first place is, because I created a UV Flourish that has Damage Bonus vs. Construct: Medium. I'm not exactly sure if it's garbage or if it may be useful.
Wed, 06/15/2011 - 06:28
#6
Nah, damage bonuses vs.
Nah, damage bonuses vs. enemies that're resistant to your weapon... are still pretty bad. :( You'll be dealing 8 damage instead of 7. Just treat it as if the weapon didn't have a UV.
Wed, 06/15/2011 - 09:03
#7
Depends on the weapon and
Depends on the weapon and what UV it has on it. A Divine Avenger with UV CTR can spam the sword wave charge in half the time, meaning a safe distance, constant knockback DPS increase of 50%. The damage is pretty decent also, especially if u know how to time the initial charge swing to hit multiple enemies. CTR Caliburs are also great but they need a shivermist to do full damage, which requires another weapon slot, and it is a close ranged charge so you run the risk of getting damaged. Also the full damage load can only be applied to 1 mob. The mobs around u will be hit 2 times max. The full damage load of DA charge on the other hand can hit up to 3 and sometimes 4 mobs. All in all UVs make a significant difference if u can afford it.
Wed, 06/15/2011 - 13:15
#8
OK, a related question: How
OK, a related question: How good are UVs for extra damage against things the weapon is good with? For example, something that does piercing, and has a UV against fiends? I suspect that it is a very good thing to have since you get a percentage increase on a larger base damage amount....
Wed, 06/15/2011 - 13:31
#9
Yeah, weapons with UV damage
Yeah, weapons with UV damage bonuses on the enemies they're effective against... Are pretty highly desirable. Unless it's the Haze Bomb series, which which is designed for inflicting status effects rather than direct damage. But for everything else, it's useful stuff.
Wed, 06/15/2011 - 18:44
#10
Split vs Pure
If the weapon is a pure damage type then each level of UV for the weak creature is a little under 5%. So a Final Flourish (pure piercing) has about 15% boost against beasts if it has a UV Damage Bonus vs Beast: High. This is on top of the existing piercing bonus against beasts.
If the weapon is a split damage type (normal/special) then each level of UV for the weak creature varies from 5-7%. The amount increases based on depth. Also, for multiple hit weapons, the first hit will have a bonus closer to 7% whereas the charge attack would be closer to 5%. This is likely due to the weird way the damage of subsequent hits is calculated. So an Acheron (normal/shadow) has a 21% boost against slimes for the first hit in Tier 3 if it has a UV Damage Bonus vs Slimes: High. The charge attack for the same weapon in Tier 3 has a bonus of 16%.
The bonus might be calculated differently for weapons with two special damage types like Argent Peacemaker or Radiant Sun Shards. Haven't seen any damage data for these yet.
I'm assuming you're only talking about damage bonuses. It all depends on how much damage you're doing right now, how many hits it takes to kill without UV, and how much HP mobs have. It's obviously worthwhile if you can 2 shot a mob instead of 3 shot but without enemy HP it is kind of a shot in the dark.
Anyway here is a damage table for UV bonuses based on nitronome/leviathan:
http://forums.spiralknights.com/en/node/7342#comment-58498