Spiral Knights - Question about Vana farming

Question about Vana farming

29 replies [Last post]

Sun, 06/12/2016 - 12:04

Exemped

I've had a question about Vana for a while. Usually a run takes about 30-40 minutes and gives you around 11k crowns (assuming each token is 1k). A couple weeks ago someone (who is high level with lots of experience) told me that he could get 20k+ in just an hour. After trying several strategies and failing every time, I've decided to come to the forums for help.

I'm looking for an in depth guide or at least some useful input on what rooms to avoid or skip, what areas I just clear out and finally ideal gear. I'm currently using:

-Full Chaos Set
-Voltedge
-Blitz
-Electron Vortex (if I have third weapon slot)
-Pentas
-Swiftstrike buckler
-Pet perk VS undead (gives me max damage)

Sun, 06/12/2016 - 12:38

Bopp

already have answer?

If your run takes 30 minutes and nets you 11,000 crowns, then you're already getting 22,000 crowns per hour, right? So what are you wondering about? You just want to know how to go faster?

Expert FSC parties can easily beat it in 30 minutes. Usually players combine vortex bombs with big charges, to clear those tedious zombie rooms quickly. In the second level, they skip some of the less lucrative rooms, such as the SSW one (left of the entry). On the smoldering steps, they skip unnecessary zombies. In the Vanaduke fight, they perfectly water the mask, which takes practice.

Your loadout looks pretty good to me. Consider trading out the health trinkets for something offensive. Remember that your pet perk doesn't help you against trojans. And not against Vanaduke, I think.

Sun, 06/12/2016 - 12:46

Exemped

Thanks for the help. And ya I

Thanks for the help. And ya I forgot to say that most of the time I solo so I don't go as fast. 30 minutes isn't really something I'm able to do.

Sun, 06/12/2016 - 13:14

Dats-Mah-Boi

You have the equipment, you

You have the equipment, you just need more skill (Bomb placement, weapon angles, not uselessly watering at Vana, etc.) You'll get there....just keep in mind that getting a real job at min wage is about 12x as efficient as farming vana.

Sun, 06/12/2016 - 14:18

Veridiandynamics

20 mins, not 30.

Expert FSC parties actually farm the 7 (8) kcr + everything else around 20 (24) minutes. There are also the beast-class parties, farming 7 kcr + ee around 17-18 minutes.

The major part of speed comes down to how fast can you kill trojans and vortex + massacre the zommiez.

A raw out of my *** guide:

D24: you can skip everything if you want until the last fight. You lose roughly 500 crs by doing so, but you also gain several minutes.

D25: only 6 rooms. Skip Rocket PPY room, and Wheels room ( if you are agressively quickrunning then the order is different, but i assume you want to farm the rest ). Those are the least efficient crs/time-wise.

D26: choose the right side, cuz its much faster even if you lose like 200 crs with it.

D27: skip the zommiez at the wheels part, just water some, and go as fast as possible. Those are the least worth zommiez in the whole mission.

D28: try to bring down Vana without killing the zommiez and guards. Try to water only once and then kill the Mask without a second water. Also do not water the floor unless someone is stuck.

Pet ultimates such as Backfire Barrier , Frenzied Firestorm , Disintegration Ray , Deadly Shadow Cloak are extremely helpful.
Other pet skills that are less important but still can help: , Angelic Aura , Caustic Quills .

Suggested inventory : pills and remedies of course. Poison Barrier is the best against Vana in the first phase and extremely helpful against the Mask in phase 2 and 4. Recon Ranger is also devastating against Vana if you can deathmark him. Poison Vials are actually not the best efficiency-wise, cuz it takes too much time to throw them (better just shoot), but you can do that if you really want.

Note: you probably wont finish around 20 minutes if you dont have at least +2 MSI , 3 weapons (brandish, blitz, vortex) and a maxed pet. Of course the optimal would be 2 trinkets, 4 weapons and +4 MSI.

The rest comes down to experience. You really need that in order to hit a good time at FSC. Most things and techniques you need to actually experience and make them yours to become a real good and fast FSC runner.

If i were you i would get sword and gun dmg instead of pentas, and swift steps with pet. Altho' if you are not used to it, you need to be more careful first with this setup.
In any case you should ditch your current Ghostbuster and get either Deadly Slash or True Shot with ze pet.

Sun, 06/12/2016 - 17:20

Abelisk

How fun is it to run Vana over and over again like a zombie...

Sun, 06/12/2016 - 18:18

Xtweeterx

@Bopp

What do you mean "less lucrative rooms"? In any FSC run, don't you want every lsat crown you can get?

Sun, 06/12/2016 - 18:39

Bopp

not if you care about time

What do you mean "less lucrative rooms"?

I mean, rooms that earn you less money than other rooms earn you.

In any FSC run, don't you want every lsat crown you can get?

Not if you're concerned with how much time it's taking you.

For example, in FSC depth 25 you need to complete six of the eight rooms. In the SSW room, you wind your way through a maze of fire, spikes, and wheel throwers. At the bottom of the room, you kill three zombies. Then you wind your way back. So this room involves a large amount of non-fighting time, which means non-earning time. So maybe it's worth skipping?

I'm not saying that it's definitely worth skipping. Maybe somebody is able to do it really quickly. Or maybe somebody values a few crowns more than the time it takes. I'm just saying that this time/earnings tradeoff is what this thread is about.

Sun, 06/12/2016 - 18:40

Dats-Mah-Boi

@Xtweeter If you want

@Xtweeter

If you want efficiency, you have to look at the crowns/minute ratio, not just crowns. Doing a full Vana run and getting 11k crowns in 45 minutes is not as good as getting 8k crowns in 30 minutes, for example.

Sun, 06/12/2016 - 21:16

Batabii

How fun is it to run Vana over and over again like a zombie...

soul-crushingly un-fun

I hope GH nerfs the payouts so it's better balanced. And maybe even buff arcades.

Mon, 06/13/2016 - 03:58

#10

Neometal

can't make the meem atm

Remember the time when the 2nd part of rank missions came out in 2012 and elite fsc gave 11-12k (without tokens)?

Pepperidge farm remembers.

So many gold coins.

Mon, 06/13/2016 - 09:40

#11

Veridiandynamics

Heh :)

9k is possible righ now. I dont think 10 is... maybe if you are super lucky.

Mon, 06/13/2016 - 11:17

#12

Vohtarak-Forum

if you run constantly

You can add another 3k to average profits from the tokens, as it takes 30 to get an ancient plate piece that you can sell for 30k
of course, if you dont need to run vana 10 times then this doesnt quite reflect actual profit

Mon, 06/13/2016 - 11:46

#13

Magnek-Le-Bomber

Pro technique

The way to make the most profit from vana is speed running. Average is 9k per run (thats including tokens) and each run takes around 16-20min. If u have an expert duo, a full speed run can be done in about 15min. I dont do vana cuz its not the best way to make money for me. Theres vids on utube on speed running FSC so those might be helpful to look at. Heres a link https://m.youtube.com/

Mon, 06/13/2016 - 11:41

#14

Bopp

right

You can add another 3k to average profits from the tokens

According to Lancer Knightz, which have 19 measurements of elite FSC, the average is
* 9,451 crowns from the mission itself
* 311 crowns from spark tokens
* 3,000 crowns from Almirian Seals
for a total of 12,762 crowns per run. But these data assume that you kill every monster on every level and that you take the western path. You'll lose some crowns if you skimp on those, although your time might be worth more than those crowns.

I dont do vana cuz its not the best way to make money for me.

You might want to practice, because that is the most lucrative level of all.

Mon, 06/13/2016 - 11:59

#15

Magnek-Le-Bomber

@bopp

Well i make a handsome amount of profit from recipe runs. About 100k an hour. Vana speed runs is about 27k-36k an hour. Still good money tho but it just aint nuff for me cuz i spend millions of crowns on stuff lol. I should try to save my money instead of spending it xD. Im hoping to be back up to 1mil crowns by the end of the week

Mon, 06/13/2016 - 12:35

#16

Veridiandynamics

Less than 15 mins

Yeah, you can do FSC less than 15 mins, my best time is 14 minutes, but i know guys who finished the whole stuff under 13 minutes.

In my opinion you can not constantly produce those times. These are just like 1 out of 10 runs or so, when you get lucky with totems and you made little to no mistake, plus the server did not lag at all (this last one is probably an impossible criteria nowadays) .

It is also not the most efficient crowns/time-wise. You get around +2 kcr with wasting like 3 more minutes in crowded places, which is worth it.

Mon, 06/13/2016 - 12:39

#17

Bopp

Magnek-Le-Bomber

I thought you meant that you do FSC, but not the Vanaduke part of FSC.

Yes, recipe runs can be even more lucrative. Cheers.

Mon, 06/13/2016 - 14:08

#18

Exemped

Recipe farming

So now that we are on the topic of farming in general, I'd like to ask how you get 100k in one hour of recipe farming. It takes 10-15 minutes to reach basil (assuming you go for the one at depth 23) and sometimes there aren't any valuable recipes. Also I would like to point out that usually you only get a 10-15k profit per 5 star recipe. This means that you need to get ten 5 star recipes to make 100k.
Is they any way of doing it with alternate accounts?

BTW: Thanks for all the help with Vana farming.

Mon, 06/13/2016 - 14:53

#19

Veridiandynamics

Well

Selling anything to another player has its benefits. It only depends on how thick is your skin, and also do you have the luck to find a patsy who pays 2,5x price for a recipe. Its the first step of becoming a merchant.
You also need more luck to find good recipes too :) It became a bit harder after the gunner update.

Mon, 06/13/2016 - 22:13

#20

Batabii

" that is the most lucrative level of all."

This is exactly why it needs a nerf. Not only does it pay the most, but for a disproportionate amount of work, apparently. And buff the arcade payouts in some way too. And the fact that people are dragging their under-ranked friends along is just making it worse. Why do we even have mission restrictions if people can ignore them easily?

Mon, 06/13/2016 - 23:23

#21

The-Worst-Knight

9k from crowns, 3k from

9k from crowns, 3k from tokens, 4k from materials= 16k per run.

Mon, 06/13/2016 - 23:24

#22

Corporal-Shade

I'm a Wizard

@Veridianddynamics - Do people really buy 4-Star recipes for the price of the recipe 1 star above them?

@Batabii - If it's not a very good restriction then you can call it a recommendation. To stay out of a place full of monsters more powerful than you. (Unless the noob is a leeching skrub then I don't have a response to that.)

Tue, 06/14/2016 - 03:37

#23

Veridiandynamics

Haha

Well i dont know about that. I can only hope they dont. But do some try to sell at that cost? Yes.

Also people need to understand, nerfing things is not the way you balance a game 90% of the time. Some very rare and extreme times you need it, yes.
But usually the sensible way to balance a game is to boost things.

Tue, 06/14/2016 - 04:58

#24

Dutch-Oven

Currently my average solo

Currently my average solo time is 25 minutes using a full gunner loadout. I don't play much PvE these days but when I do fsc now that's about what I get while still getting a 10kcr payout.

seerus
shadowsun (should really swap out for black kat)
ssb
2 alchemers (nova+magma are good for momentum, storm+hail for safety)
blitz
2 gun dmg mods
swiftsteps

I know for a fact that this loadout is slower than a hybrid brandish+EV+blitz+arcana, but it's my personal preference because I like using alchs.

Snaaple you able to upload a video of one of your average solo runs? I can record one myself if you think that would help?

Your gear looks ok but you don't say what UVs you have on your weapons or which sprites you have or use. You lack any movement speed which slows you down a fraction. If you want to do fast runs it can help a lot.

2 possible gear changes:

1: Drop the undead dmg perk for swift steps and swap out a penta for a sword dmg mod. Maybe both and get gun dmg as well but for soloing blitz has enough damage with just vh dmg so that's really just for killing Vanaduke quicker. The undead perk does nothing for you vs vana, trojans, gun puppies, slimes and silkwings.

2: IF you have ctr on your weapons then you can drop chaos in favour of black kat. This means you get vh move speed and max dmg. You could do a combination of chaos and bk depending on what ctr UVs and mods you want to use, but the goal is vh move speed and max ctr. You don't need full 5* black kat really. I have a BKC but only the 3* cloak and it's bearable.

There might be a lot of little things you are doing or not doing that are slowing you down. You might also have slow loading times (having a SSD will help this). My load screens take about 10 seconds but I knwo some people whose take over a minute so unless they change their setup they will never be fast runners.

Hope that helps. Let me know about the recording thing.

Tue, 06/14/2016 - 07:53

#25

Magnek-Le-Bomber

@Snaaple

My T3 recipe runs take about 7min per run. U dont get recipes everytime but i get them a lot. I sell the 4* recipes as well. Theres risk involved cuz it its merching so u might be better off farming FSC. Ive just been doing it for a while now so its good money for me

Tue, 06/14/2016 - 09:13

#26

Manava

Soloing vana solo in 30min is

Soloing vana solo in 30min is simple just lvl your gear to max. things like charge time asi dmg surely help but honestly they are not that much needed i guess MOV and swift step should help much more and save time also for me going solo in vana is boring af i dont get the point of soloing it but if its money then you better turn into something like event farm or do as Magnek says because honestly 30min for just 11k = 100 ce is BS atm

Tue, 06/14/2016 - 11:50

#27

Batabii

"Unless the noob is a leeching skrub"

That's the problem, the current system encourages lazy and bad players to get carried.

Also that's a strange way to define (and spell?) "scrub".

Wed, 06/15/2016 - 04:08

#28

Exemped

@Dutch-OvenI can't really

@Dutch-Oven

I can't really record a video on my computer, the Internet is pretty slow and my PC has glitchy moments quite often. I don't have any UVs on any gear (like period), probably because I never saw them as priorities. I'm currently saving up for a BKC because I've wanted one for a couple years but have never gotten a book. After I get BKC though, I will start rolling. BTW: love your gunner set, I also really enjoy gunning in PvE. Also, thanks for the help.

@Magnek

I actually am a merchant, I'm just trying to find something else instead of lockdown while I wait for items on the AH. Also is there any possible way you could tell me how you price your recipes? That would be helpful.

@Manava

Again, like I said to magnek, farming Vana isn't my main way of getting money, it's just something to do to get a few more crowns.

@Batabii

I am going to ask you to please stop ranting on this thread. If things bother you about the game, just quit playing or post you thoughts in suggestions.

Wed, 06/15/2016 - 07:59

#29

Dats-Mah-Boi

Wow....I am impressed with

Wow....I am impressed with that diplomatic reply to Bambii. Usually people (like me) just post bait back at them. Nice.

BKCs are cheapest they've ever been (if the 10k E per cowl price is still true), and it is most likely more efficient to buy UVs from someone else if you are aiming for high+, maybe even medium+. I would remind you that spending real money is the most efficient by far, but you already know that. I used to be a PvP gunner (Gotta Light-Em-Up, heh) so I know the draw of it. Good luck with your set man

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