Spiral Knights - Let's talk Sonic.

Let's talk Sonic.

2 replies [Last post]

Sat, 06/18/2016 - 09:34

Jessecho

So, who else is a former or very loyal holdout Sonic fan?

Before I put all my unpopular opinions about the series on the table, (or at least, unpopular to most remaining Sonic fans), let's talk about something more relevant to now.

I have a problem with the fact that we're halfway through Sonic's 25th anniversary and we haven't gotten so much as a confirmation that Sonic Team's making a game to celebrate. We'd known about Sonic Adventure 2 and Sonic '06 at least a year in advance, even Generations had some coverage by now if my memory's right. This is one of the most important milestones for the series, and we're being kept completely in the dark. They didn't show even the tiniest teaser or gameplay footage at E3, and all we get on their social media accounts are a never-ending flow of dank memes.

Unless Sonic Boom: Fire and Ice is the celebration game. Really? A low-budget 3DS game by a studio completely removed from Sonic Team, that's a sequel to two commercial failure games, part of a spinoff series that nobody cares about... that's what this was all building up to? I hope not, that would be an insult not just to fans, but also to Sonic himself.

Mon, 06/20/2016 - 17:19

Sonosuke

Anstyways

I mean, it's not all that unpopular an opinion. I may be a Sonic fan, but even I can tell when the Blue Blur is getting the Mega Man treatment. The company getting things that the fans don't want released for an anniversary and overall leaving us unable to tell whether they care or not.

But there's the other problem. The one fans seemingly fail to notice. Sega's devs could make an absolutely amazing game, like with Colors and Generations, and the fans would still b*tch about it because it's not what they want. That's the problem: we don't know what we want.

You can say we know exactly what we don't want (Edgy the Hedgy and Sonic 06, among others), but when it comes to what we do, I will argue that we are the most indecisive fan base in the history of ever. They'll always say they want gameplay like the Adventure games or Unleashed/Colors/Generations. Hell, some will even say they want the Classic style of games. Yet not only will they never agree on which is better, they never say what parts of those games they want specifically. It's mostly the problem of those styles of play having flaws that aren't seen through those nostalgia glasses everyone has, but they still say it's the greatest thing since sliced bread even when it's made obvious.

Wed, 09/27/2017 - 15:40

Bernston

Guys... (I know, long dormant post, bear with me)

I get that Sonic has had many rocky games that gave the series tough times, but there is one game that turned it all around, Sonic Mania.

That game was truly the Sonic game many Sonic fans desired, and I do mean this, pixel art goodness, 2D side-scrolling action, instant transitions in the Zones' Acts by clearing them, and the long-dormant formula from S3&K being active once again. Oh, I also forgot to mention the always requested & long awaited return of Super Badniks(those from S3&K as the Zones' Act 1 sub-bosses & from the Game Gear games being regular bosses instead of Dr. Robotnik). Yeah. Them. That's what I called them that.

Sonic Mania was the very surprise that gave the series lots of love once more, the kind of love hasn't been resurfaced since the end of Sonic the Hedgehog 3, Part Two(A.K.A., Sonic & Knuckles. Info, Sonic 3 & Sonic & Knuckles were Sonic 3's 2 halves. I called it Sonic 3 Part Two, 'cause it takes place where Part One left off), because it was made by fans turned developers, Taxman, Pagoda West, Headcannon, they were involved in it's creation. They have done their best to bring the Sonic game worth playing, under Sega's teachings through dev time, that is.

Well, Sonic Mania was great, though, there were some minor flaws, one of which was that there was no major boss before the final boss in Zone 12, not like how it was in Sonic 3 Part Two's Death Egg Zone & Sonic 2's Death Egg Zone, & certain parts in between & near the end feel a bit rushed(I know, commonplace in many games), but there's still room for improvement, even if the devs & Sega wouldn't opt to include maybe one new boss in one Zone or some unique tilesets & one or two new boss songs to the final sub-boss to replace the regular sub-boss theme & give it a more near dramatic feel & to the supposed final major boss(I'm talking about having a Final Sub-Boss theme & a Final Major Boss theme, here, for differentiating them from all previous bosses. 1st time for everything, Sega. Mm-hmm.) in patches & would prefer to reserve it all towards the next game set after the end of Mania's events.

My guess on the sound effects, I know numerous sounds from past Sonic games are used, even some that were unused, the new sounds, were they created through the sound chip that made the sound effects in Sonic games or a chiptune program that does it before doing editing & conversions to OGG., like, Deflemask? Just guessing.

Though, I gotta say, the animated intro & ending by Studio Yotta was amazing. They'd really ought to do more like those in later 2D Sonic games, & maybe a potential 6th Sonic TV show that should have the original designs of Sonic, Tails, Knuckles, Dr. Robotnik(yes, the true original design of him from the 2D Sonic games), Amy, Metal Sonic, & others from the 2D games involved. Don't want to go on too long.

I'm going to guess their animation programs used to make these were either Clip Studio Paint or some new proprietary animation program that does traditional cel hand drawn frame-by-frame animations(like, how it was from lots of past TV shows & theater movies before Flash Animation came in), instead of Flash Animation or Flash-based rigging animations(like, that kind seen in Toon Boom Harmony & such. gotta be honest, really takes away the natural feel & fluidity of animation in TV shows when used so many times, & only opts to show creators & animators the choice to recycle lots of old show assets to new episodes that takes away pure originality that makes the steam that was used in past seasons go away, not to mention make the episodes' flow a bit too-fast paced with some dialogue bits through production phases cut out to make conversations very short. Really take note when watching them. I know.).

Why can't many people that want that kind of fluidity in natural feeling in animation from past TV & movies to come back more often just make their own proprietary animation programs that only supports hand-drawn cel frame-by-frame animations(even through the use of modern graphic tablets to smooth their workflow, yes.) from the past shows & movies without rigging support, & make it far more affordable than Flash Animate's subscription model? That would easily bring that back & make it far more commonplace than ever.

Though, there is pixel animation that is kind of like traditional hand-drawn frame-by-frame animations. Maybe that should be a bit more commonplace in TV shows, too, even throughout whole episodes. Of course, it would require the creation of said new pixel animation program that does that to TV shows only, & there are hardly any programs that are ready to do that.

Still, it's very possible to do that, even if we can try.

Well, my thoughts on the next 2D Sonic game(preferably, I'm thinking Sonic the Hedgehog 4 Retold) are these(that is if someone could pass them on to the team that made Sonic Mania & decide to redo Sonic the Hedgehog 4 as a complete game)...

1. I like all of Sonic 4's Zones, but they should be revised to give them the fresh feeling they had. Splash Hill, Casino Street, Lost Labyrinth, Sylvania Castle, Oil Desert, Sky Fortress, all of them, & include new sub-bosses with new major bosses to replace many rehashes of past bosses from Sonic 1 & 2.

2. I'd really like to hear new themes exclusive to the final sub-boss & final major boss before the final boss played. Just thought these would be included to distinguish them from past bosses.

3. I know that may be a bit feasible, but, maybe we could have an equivalent to Capcom's Mega Man's Wily Castle Stages, with some differences that stand it out from how it was in them in the next 2D Sonic game's final zone, to increase the length & boss variety to later 2D Sonic games. Some games did opt to include the Wily Castle-like structure, but the one good thing is, there's no forced mandatory boss rush that pits players all bosses they've defeated before all over again, even with their health values halved or not, & that was what I liked(Well, Freedom Planet did, for one.). I think there should also be a new exclusive boss type to that final zone's end-of-act bosses in that zone called E.G. Units, robots created by Dr. Robotnik that are stronger than the Super Badniks & adapt to the players attacking their weak points through taking many more hits to defeat by switching to new attack patterns through the battle, serve to protect Dr. Robotnik's massive final base of operations, including a new boss before the final boss in the final Act. I think at minimum, 4 Acts(with each ending in a new boss, except in the final Act, 2 bosses, the 1st being the boss before the final boss, & the 2nd being the final boss) in the final Zone will do, not 3, nor 2. Well, I did say an equivalent to the Wily Castle & the Wily Castle bosses.

4. The E.G.G. Station Zone & Death Egg mk.II Zone should be better refined into the Zone before the final Zone, & the final Zone before the Extra Zone, respectively.

If anyone who has music creation programs are thinking about making that a reality in games, even in later 2D Sonic Games, please make original songs that have these following names & uploaded to YouTube to give game developers & composers, & those who want to be, the idea of what they should include in the near end of games before making the final boss, & fans something interesting to hear, which are as they follow...

1. Final Sub-Boss (original)

2. Final Major Boss (original)

3. Final Zone/Stage Boss (original)

If anyone's interested in thinking about how E.G. Units should make a potential debut in 2D Sonic games, be creative, conceptualize, use your art creation programs(like, Affinity Photo, for one) to think of them & show those E.G. Unit boss ideas to fans to generate interest, & don't forget, they should always have the E.G. insignia on them to signify them as the E.G. Units.

Of course, the game does have ties to another Sonic anniversary game called Sonic Forces(obviously because of a certain magenta ruby being involved in the creation of a certain apparently unstoppable monstrosity, FYI), & even though Forces has been set to be a standalone game, the gameplay still have the marks of a follow-up to Generations, though, I can guess the story takes place after Lost World's events.

Overall, Sonic's on his way to making a speedy recovery, & will likely continue on that path. I'd say, Sonic's ready to continue his great legacy.

Yes, this was a long post in a year long dormant forum subject, but someone in the forums should be kept up to date on Sonic's latest activities in the games.

What do you think of said thoughts on how 2D Sonic games can be improved to later installments? Be kind, but don't be too harsh.

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Let's talk Sonic.