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Major Problems

7 replies [Last post]
Sun, 07/24/2016 - 15:17
Caylo-Orion

There are a few significant problems that I feel need to be addressed, problems that may have contributed to Spiral Knights' lack of popularity as of late.

1. NORMAL DEFENSE: The major problem I see with normal defense is that against pure elemental, shadow, or piercing damage, its as if you aren't wearing anything at all. I feel that it should defend against all kinds of damage, but maybe half as much as the more type-specific defenses. This would make armor like the plate sets more effective in the late game and lockdown. (I mean come on, the plate armor de-buffs you by slowing attack speed, and then gives you the most useless defense in the game. That just isn't right.)

2. LOCKDOWN BALANCES: Lockdown is just a mess right now. You shouldn't have to conform to a specific meta to be able to play well. Either the Striker needs to be nerfed, or the Guardian needs to be buffed. While I'm not sure how you would exactly nerf the striker, I have a few ideas for the Guardian. Immunity to being staggered by enemy attacks, and a larger health buff (dependant on tier). Moreover, I feel that the dlc weapons shouldn't be allowed, but this is less necessary than the buffs and nerfs.

3. FORCED GRINDING: This is the one I have no idea how to fix, but I feel like it was one of the things that drives new players away.

Now I may be slightly biased because I play the Guardian Class (Both the Plate armor class and the Lockdown class) but when you sacrifice speed and style and get almost nothing in return... its not easy.

Sun, 07/24/2016 - 16:12
#1
Ganzfeld-Effect's picture
Ganzfeld-Effect
blep

Normal defense is just a defense type like the others. If you have it, and get hit with an attack that is mostly something else, of course you're going to take a lot of damage. The same can be said for any of the others; I wouldn't expect Elemental to defend me from Shadow attacks. That's just the nature of the defense system: defend against what you're wearing protection for.

Plate armors already defend a decent amount more in the Normal department, but defense is very insignificant sometimes in general here. The difference isn't very tangible or noticeable in a way that would benefit the user.

Lockdown changes are an entirely different area and have been spoken of many times in the past. There are a lot of things that could be said and discussed, enough to where it could warrant its own topic rather than be combined in here.

That said, to build off of what you have, I would vote Strikers get at the very least a larger health penalty if nothing else. For Guardians, as I regularly run as one myself, I'd rather see the "no flinch" added to Plate lines instead when wearing the full set. Healing from the shield should scale depending on tier. Weapons are fine as-is to me.

As a side tangent that would benefit Guardians (and recons,) I'd also like to cast a vote for giving mist bombs "Moderate" status instead of "Minor." It makes immunity more difficult, but still possible.

For the grinding, that's the nature of pretty much any MMO. There needs to be something in place to slow progression way down and act as a barrier to both keep people from completing the game too quickly, as well as have that bit of incentive for people to buy energy to progress a bit faster. As I recall, the game throws you through the first few star levels fairly quickly before things start slowing down some.

Of course there are parts of this that are frustrating, and it may kill the experience for some, but that's just how it goes. It's different for everyone and people all have their own experiences with it.

Sun, 07/24/2016 - 16:56
#2
Caylo-Orion
Yeah I know...

I guess my problem with normal defense is that its pretty much useless late game, every enemy deals pure (Insert damage type here) with only Trojans really dealing normal defense. Its part of the reason the metas formed. That and Guardian is one of the 9 classes you find in the Hall of Heroes, for everything you sacrifice there just aren't enough benefits. It desperately needs some sort of buff. As for what I said about Lockdown most of it was general complaints but that no staggering thing definitely needs to happen. That and the health buffs and debuffs of all the clases are concrete no matter what tier they're in, and the increased/decreased health becomes less useful the higher up you go. For strikers the -2 health is insignificant in the higher tiers, and for guardians the +9 health gets shredded through too quick.

Mon, 07/25/2016 - 02:58
#3
Fangel's picture
Fangel
bit wrong there

For normal damage attacks, a fair number of enemies and attack deal split normal damage and specialized damage. Normal difficulty also alters this, as monster attacks that normally deal pure specialized damage instead deal split damage (if the wiki is correct).

On top of this, tier 1 of the clockworks have monsters that only deal normal damage.

Basically, normal damage is everywhere, which is why nearly every armor in the game has normal damage resistance. However, should a monster deal heavy specialized damage, it won't matter how much normal defense you have stacked up.

Now onto lockdown, yeah, quite a few imbalances there. Only nerf I would plant on a striker would be -2 to all statuses, but for guardian there's plenty of buffs - biggest one would be guardians not flinching when hit.
As it stands, lockdown favors those who hit fast. It doesn't matter how hard you hit if you hit your opponent faster than they hit you. As such, attack speed increases and lower ping players will always have a natural advantage. Creating safeguards for the higher pinged players is my own personal solution, as it wouldn't nerf anyone or give an unfair advantage anywhere else either. Something simply like longer mercy frames for higher pinged players would make such a huge difference.

Another thing to note is that strikers aren't necessarily OP in lockdown - their lack of health makes them very squishy. Until you put health trinkets on, in which case their health is comparable to a trinketless guardian. That is a huge fault of the trinket system, not the striker class. If strikers had a health cap put on their class (say, +6 health), then it wouldn't make health trinkets be unusable, but would prevent them from bypassing the recon class in terms of health.

---

Grinding is in every MMO. The only grind that is really terrible is the "radiant fire crystal" grind. It's so hard to find the blasted things, and even then you have to be playing on the hardest difficulty to even find a remotely fair number of them. Making rarity drops consistent across difficulty levels (with, say, a 4%-8% difference between them) would be the best way to go about that. I'd make sure to balance them around the current elite drops.

Tue, 07/26/2016 - 05:09
#4
Hypo-Valence's picture
Hypo-Valence
The final grind before endgame

The final grind before endgame to the full 5* gating is still pretty brutal though. FSC should have been made a Defender Elite mission so that knights can grind it to progress instead o having to resort to guild member piggybacking (unreliable), trudging from Emberlight (time-consuming) or asking for invites (both).

Tue, 07/26/2016 - 06:38
#5
Sir-Pandabear's picture
Sir-Pandabear

The normal defence thing is a common misconception. It's not helped by the explanation the game gives you, but the fact of the matter is that even late game every non-bullet attack deals about half normal damage.

The negative striker health is also a common misconception, also not helped by the gui lying to you. In truth, you have the same amount of health as a striker as when playing in the clockworks, so they have no penalty at all.

Tue, 07/26/2016 - 11:36
#6
Fangel's picture
Fangel
well

Isn't the -2 health only applied in tier 1 and tier 2 lockdown? Tier 3 has no health penalty due to attacks dealing such high damage in the first place. Makes dual health trinketed strikers have more health than a base guardian which is just unfair on all levels.

Tue, 07/26/2016 - 20:25
#7
Fehzors-Forum-Alt's picture
Fehzors-Forum-Alt

Normal is solved by the core, where almost every hit is either strong normal or half normal.

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