Spiral Knights - Is Grey Havens Hiring? (also the GH website doesn't work)

Is Grey Havens Hiring? (also the GH website doesn't work)

18 replies [Last post]

Wed, 04/25/2018 - 03:37

Profezzional

So I know after the initial transfer from OOO that GH said they weren't hiring, but I'm wondering if that's still the case. I'd contact GH directly, but their website seems to be offline (I know that should probably go in the technical issues thread, but I threw it in while I'm here), and I figured it's not really a valid question for Support, so here I am.

I'll be graduating from college next spring with a software engineering degree and 2 years of web development and database management experience, and I'm really interested in helping out with the development of SK. I think there's a lot of potential for new features and new content (beyond just new prize boxes), as well as trying to fix some performance issues and other existing bugs.

That being said, I have no idea what GH is planning as far as future SK development, but I think it'd be really cool if they're considering hiring people.

Wed, 04/25/2018 - 06:01

Crazee-Pi-Forum

Remember, don't shoot food.

I'm pretty sure people have offered to work for OOO in the past to no avail and I doubt GH would be much different.

Sorry.

Wed, 04/25/2018 - 08:59

Bopp

two issues

Disclaimer: I don't have any insider knowledge of Grey Havens, and I certainly don't speak for them.

The first issue is money. It's not clear that Grey Havens has any money to spend on new employees.

So what if you're willing to work for free? That brings up the second issue. I wouldn't want just anyone mucking about in my code base. They would have to demonstrate competence, good will, etc. How will you demonstrate this? Do you have a portfolio? How's your Java experience? Have you ever done any 3D modeling work, texture design, etc.?

Wed, 04/25/2018 - 11:04

Profezzional

Fair enough

Those are all good points:

I'd be willing to work for free, if nothing else just for the sake of helping the game
I think my account history will go a long way toward demonstrating goodwill
I do have a portfolio of the applications I've written for my current job (part-time at a small startup database management company); they're mostly internal tools/systems, though, so I'd demonstrate those during a meeting of some sort.
As far as demonstrating competence, outside of my portfolio and technical skills, I'd be willing to do any coding challenges GH would give me
I've taken a couple semesters in Java, but I've been mostly working in C# and JavaScript for the past 4 years. I feel confident, though, that I could do fine with Java.
In fall 2016, I led a small international development team working on making a browser-based FPS in Unity. The project eventually fell through, but I dabbled a bit there in doing some 3D modeling, and I'd consider myself a pretty proficient Gimp/Photoshop user. I'm not very artistic, though, so I'd "apply" as just a programmer for the most part.

Wed, 04/25/2018 - 11:44

Bernston

Hmm...

I don't have any idea what GH's working on, too, but, I would think GH may need some help. If you say their website is down, then it's clear they may need some web programmers to fix it up. I'm not too versed on that, but I know problems when I read & hear them.

@Profezzional

Yeah, but, you know we have alternatives to Photoshop, like Affinity Photo? It's got many features of it, but with no subscription pricing model. Affinity Designer is really the alternative to Adobe Illustrator, too. Many people have been using them for their game development projects, so I've looked & read, & they are loving these programs. They're no doubt qualified to be considered industry-standard.

Nevertheless, if you're up to it one day, try Affinity Photo & Affinity Designer.

Just a more technical question. What computer and the hardware should be strong enough & recommended to be a creator? This includes...

1. 2D frame-by-frame hand-drawn animation(not the motion tweening & rigging animations like those from Flash Animation & other programs that do these) to Clip Studio Paint users(can do hand-drawn animation up to 60fps in EX version, BTW)
2. Storyboarding(crucially important, never skip it)
3. 3D modeling & animating
4. Coding
5. Programming
6. Art creation(including those who have Photoshop & alternatives, like Affinity Photo & Designer)
7. Texture making
8. Voice recording
9. Pixel art & animation
10. Music composing
11. Sound design
12. Editing
13. Remote working
14. Compositing

& so on. Hope I covered all this.

Asking this question to those who want to do multi-tasking on those programs to be game & content creators.

We're seeing more stronger hardware coming out, so that's making it even more possible for more people to do these at once.

Wed, 04/25/2018 - 15:21

Umbra-Lunatis

tbh

i've mailed them about this too, no response whatsoever.

The biggest role I could play would be small artistic quality-of-life tack-ons like more guildhall furniture, maybe some weapon modifications and new Clockworks rooms, etc etc. Then there's sound design; if I could get my hands on the SK soundfont i'd do so many things with it.

I think the best bet is to give examples of your abilities within the email you send, as you're not likely to get a "well, what can you offer us?" response. Least, that's what I did.

Thu, 04/26/2018 - 12:21

Profezzional

It depends; makes sense

@Bernston
Yeah when I try to go to www.greyhavens.co (which is what the GH logo on the bottom right of this site links to), the connection times out, so I assume their server is offline.

I haven't heard of the two programs you mentioned, but they sound cool. I don't really plan on doing much work with art, but if I end up doing something, I'll check them out.

As far as what kind of specs you need on a computer for game development, I don't know that there are really any minimum requirements. My PC at work just has an i3, but it has 16GB of RAM (since I usually have a lot of things open at once), a fairly nice 256GB SSD, and a secondary 1TB HDD. Since I'm running 5 monitors (3 27" and 2 19"), I put a GTX 710 in it to run those. I really only use it for programming, though.

If you're primarily doing high-resolution graphics-related work like 3D modeling, drawing, and/or something that requires a lot of rendering, then you may want a decent graphics card. Or if you're involved in every aspect of the development of a game that needs a gaming computer to play, it would probably be helpful to develop on a gaming PC, so you can test it while you make it.

---

@Umbra-Lunatis
What email address did you send to, and how long ago was it?

I would send them a resumé and all that, but I'm not sure where I'd send it to. The only ways I know of contacting GH would be either emailing Support (which I don't think is really the right place to send an inquiry like that) and the forums.

Fri, 04/27/2018 - 22:01

Bernston

Well, nice to know.

@Profezzional

Well, GH should look into that problem really soon. Can't be staying the dark all day and night.

I think you'll like 'em. A lotta people have been using them since they came out not long ago, and they've done work through them, such as photo editing, texture making, artwork, the like, and even better, free updates to these programs for life. If you've seen people do these in Photoshop and other Adobe programs, the process through these are exactly the same, except there's no subscribing needed.

Ok. Now, I have these computer hardware & their capabilities' comparison questions in mind...

In terms of what computers could do in doing development work, they differ by processor brand and type, like if said computer has the i3 processor, what would it really do? I can only presume quite a bit. I also presume a computer with a Pentium processor does less, yes? Just asking.

Now, if it would be an i5 or i7 processor instead, or an AMD equivalent, like a Ryzen processor, the development process & capabilities would be better. I've done some CPU benchmark observations, so you know. So, what would a computer with an i5, i7 or Ryzen processor really do?

BTW, to anyone, some new 2nd gen Ryzen processors came out. They're really amazing.

By decent in graphics cards, I'll presume the range is towards a bit below or around RX 580 or GTX 1080, yes? Heard they're quite tough to buy, 'cause, heightened prices.

Good to know these things to get a better idea on what to get to some people soon.

Sat, 04/28/2018 - 13:41

Fangel

probably not

Disclaimer: I am not affiliated with Grey Havens at all, but I just have a knack for having people tell me stuff.

I've had the honor of speaking with members of the support team in a more casual fashion on occasion (both in-game and on social media, email, etc.), and actually have also been able to talk to some folks who have since moved on from OOO/GH and learned a bit more about the game (did you know that Operation: Crimson Hammer was essentially created over a holiday break by pretty much one designer? I found that really impressive). Being involved with various parts of the community has its perks.

One conversation that I had around the time of the Grey Havens change over pretty much confirmed to me that Grey Havens is not currently looking to hire new team members at that time. However, it was implied that they may start looking into more team members for each individual game should the game start receiving a larger and stable playerbase.

Essentially, before Grey Havens will start hiring for the Spiral Knights team (yes, there are two separate teams working on Puzzle Pirates and Spiral Knights. The support team just crosses over) they are needing to see an increase in people actively playing. Since word-of-mouth is their preferred method of advertisement, this basically boils down to "tell your friends to play the game, see if you can bring people back into the game, if you can create do content that will draw others into the game", and from there we may see spots in their team open up and need filling.

Hopefully that helps. For any job in the gaming industry though, a portfolio of what you've done that's available online is a must now-a-days, so keep that in mind for not just possibly Grey Havens in the future, but any gaming company.

Sun, 04/29/2018 - 10:49

Bernston

:O!

Crimson Hammer was made by one designer through the holiday break? Wow! Mind-blown!

So, you're saying SK's player base needs to be more larger & more stable before they can start bringing in more people to work on it? I don't know what SK's player base's state is, but I'm guessing... a stalemate or slightly going up, maybe?

Well, there are people doing their best to make it so, but we'll always keep on trying to bring more in, even if we may have to make & bring out a blitzkrieg of Spiral Knights ads to do it... but I wouldn't go too crazy on that. We'll do the best we can to make that player base large and stable it can be.

To have a portfolio, we need to make our own? Strongly noted. Finding something to start one may be challenging, differing on what equipment we have & being involved projects in or creating our own, but... worth it. People have been doing it on their own time, & still do today, so, no rush on that.

Mon, 04/30/2018 - 02:42

#10

Qever

They dont look for the time

Here is the question and answer in the state of Haven
@profezzional
Q: Can we volunteer to help out Grey Havens?
A: While we appreciate people's interest, we are not currently hiring or looking for volunteers. If/when we do need additional help we will post on the forums letting folks know. With that being said, you're welcome to contact us via email if you'd like to indicate your interest to help with art or development at some point in the future.
In my knowledge they didnt have post something in the forums about it so they dont look to hire or even volunteers.
The company is small I dont know if they can do something else than keeping the game.

Updating is an investment and they might not have the money to risk them.

@Fangel
Bringing people back it will probably help,but the old players like me even if they return with no new content they ll get bored fast again and they ll quit the game again.They need to find new players and advertise.They could make a shop and sell t-shirts,hoodies,cups,posters,low price things in not big quantites to see how it ll go,i think its a low risk investment and something that will probably bring them money.Even if someone have quitted the game he might want a shirt or a cup to remember the fun times he spent in the game(the nostalgia)

I dont know if the SK can ever return,it needs funds to risk it,they tried to find investors in the past and they did it with Sega and we all saw how it went...This game We know it has potentional to be great,I dont feel its old and with update it could go being amazing for some few years more but finding money and risk em its not easy.

Mon, 04/30/2018 - 07:09

#11

Paintool

If anyone of us ever became

If anyone of us ever became hired by GH, I almost feel with certainty that individual would disappear off the face of the planet.

From the outside looking in, it looks like a nice project to contribute to. The art and assets, and maybe even stage building is already there.
But looking at the employment history, the original team leader and vision behind SK (Nick bless his soul), decided to move on.
If you become one of the asset creation staff, you'll be under legal obligation to talk with nobody outside the group (Unless your Cronus and even he only responds with a robotic narrow answers)
You might even be expected or asked not to work at all, because to do so outside of the company's time and budget to devote to SK would be legal trouble.
(working overtime with no pay)

Then we start running into the issue of the why the game is still LOOT BOX CONTENT: THE GAME. You'll be working with the same people who under OOO and Sega think this is the right way to run the game, just because it produces the numbers to keep it up. If you think you can just walk in there and produce new content, that's a risk nobody has been willing to bet on for years.

Mon, 04/30/2018 - 13:29

#12

Klipik-Forum

Hi I exist sometimes

@Qever, making and shipping merchandise isn't that cheap. It can make money, sure, but it's not free money by any means.

@Paintool: GH doesn't have the money, and OOO didn't have the affordances from SEGA necessary to actually actively work on the game. That's the obvious reason there are still loot boxes, and Nick left because he wasn't allowed to continue development. They probably flat out won't accept new developer applications because there would be no money to pay them, and nothing to pay them to do.

Wed, 05/02/2018 - 02:19

#13

Qever

@Kilpik I never said its free

@Kilpik I never said its free and its good not to paraphrase what others say,you can say you dont like the idea though not biggie.Now as I said they could limit it in not expensive merchanise.GH themselves said somewhere in a thread that they ll look into it but not in plushies and other merchanise that is expensive.Any business move has its risks.I dont risk my money to tell them what to do,just throwing ideas that it could help.If they think promo is better for them and the game then ok.

Thu, 05/03/2018 - 05:31

#14

Profezzional

Meh...idk

@Qever
I saw the sticky, but the reason I'm asking is because that was posted almost a year and a half ago, and we've heard pretty much nothing since then.
To your other point of advertising, I agree with both you and Fangel, that for the game to become popular again, everything would be good, including more new players, more content, more merchandise, etc. For what would be the best thing to do first, that's a different question that I don't have an answer to.

@Klipik-Forum
As far as whether they'll accept applications, and whether they have money to pay people, I have no idea. But I think I'd have to respectfully disagree about there being nothing to pay developers to do. Apart from developing new content, there are still lots of bugs that have been around for years that could be fixed, extra little UI enhancements that could be made, some memory leaks to address; the list goes on.

Thu, 05/03/2018 - 16:03

#15

Autofire

You are experiencing a PICNIC ERROR!

They won't hire unless the game grows, eh?

...interesting...

I wonder how they would feel about some kind of licensed game...made by another group...ya know, to...well, raise awareness?

Never mind. If one of my fan projects ever gets anywhere, SK will probably be dead by then. :'(

I would be happy to get the word out...if only it wasn't such a grind to get Radiants at the end game.

Fri, 05/04/2018 - 13:12

#16

Bernston

@Autofire

Your idea's nice, but why not do an animation video about the game? Anyone could do it. May attract people, too.

If it's going for the animation that matches those of 2D hand-drawn, frame-by-frame TV shows & movies that have their natural animated fluidity, I'd suggest going with Clip Studio Paint, Pro or EX. That program's got great workflow & features that delivers it all. Great to those who want to make animation videos.

http://www.clipstudio.net/en

One thing needed to make it really neat is a compositing program, & I may have a recommendation. HitFilm Express, & Pro, does the job. Got the essentials needed to make any project look good, even animated videos, 2D &/or 3D. People use it. No subscription needed at all to those thinking of doing it with Adobe Premiere Pro & AE.

https://hitfilm.com/#jump-to-hitfilm-studio

Spread the word in the SK community to give it a try if you want. Experiment, visualize, & create whatever SK videos you can come up with. Just takes effort & practice. I know we all can keep trying to keep this game growing no matter what.

Fri, 05/04/2018 - 19:34

#17

Fangel

gonna get a reply in to qever

It's not money that is stopping them from hiring. While both Spiral Knights and Puzzle Pirates have different teams, they both are on the same payroll (I would assume at least, doesn't make sense not to), and with Puzzle Pirates having a bright future of content updates right now I don't see why Spiral Knights' money would be the issue. That being said, the Puzzle Pirates Dark Seas is Steam exclusive, and Spiral Knights' playerbase on steam alone averages higher numbers - it makes zero business sense to drop Spiral Knights.

Putting it brief, they are not looking to hire because they want to see a higher amount of players actively playing. That's where we as a community come in - running community events, hosting livestreams, creating videos and art, and in general pushing community engagement is the key to seeing more of what we want. This sort of community interaction is huge as it brings even long-term veterans back to the game to engage, and keeps them around. Fun guild members is what most veterans look back on, not farming FSC.

Ultimastrike has been running livestreams using our Unofficial Spiral Knights Discord server (http://discord.me/spiralknights) as an anchor. I've been joining in with these on Saturdays and in general we invite the community to join in and talk with us and just have some fun! At one point Helios showed up on stream and started throwing snowballs at us too... 😒

You can't bring everyone back for the game, but time and time again I've seen people come back for the community, for the art, for the music, etc. Even if you don't enjoy playing the game alone at this point, instead of looking at "all the POTENTIAL" the game has (believe me, as a collective community, we know about this), push the limits for what it already does!

Spiral Knights does a lot of things right, but like any MMO, its strongest point is its community. Try not to get sour over everything when the base game that you fell in love with is still there, along with a great amount of community members who are excited to see the game thrive further.

Sat, 05/05/2018 - 00:49

#18

Tipiak

Couldn't agree more with Fangel

> Spiral Knights does a lot of things right, but like any MMO, its strongest point is its community. Try not to get sour over everything when the base game that you fell in love with is still there, along with a great amount of community members who are excited to see the game thrive further.

That's precisely why I came back to the game after more than 6 years away. I was looking for a game to play with my son (11yo) and needed both the universe and the community to be as nice as possible. To me the choice was obvious: SK !!!

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Is Grey Havens Hiring? (also the GH website doesn't work)