Treasure Vaults Discussion
Sun, 07/14/2019 - 22:12
#52
So I think the payout is supposed to be in slime coins, which add maybe 1-2K onto the 1K crowns or so you get from playing it. This actually puts it up there with other "hard" areas like arena and danger rooms from clockwork tunnels.
This is likely why they aren't buffing the drop rate- because we "don't get it" which is fine and all, but-
A) Perception is literally all that exists to us. Science may as well be an extension of perception.
B) It's hard to get to the level, and that alone means it needs to give more. Consider a depth 25 treasure vault- that's like 30 minutes of SK for a 1/3 or 1/4 chance of it at best.
It needs to pay out a good 5-10K cr to be worthwhile, which is a ton, but with the payout in slime coins dropping is very doable. That way, it can compete with firestorm citadel. It certainly beats FSC in terms of difficulty.
Wed, 07/17/2019 - 14:33
#53
payout shouldn't be too high
The level's payout is pretty fair game (it's more than the old treasure vaults, for what it's worth), but I do agree that adding more slime coin potential scattered throughout the level would make its appeal go up. While I don't think the player needs more than 2k crowns per treasure vault, showering us with slime coins is a great tactic to make us seek our slime casinos when they roll back around so we can cash in on our slime coins.
Treasure vaults reward us with potential profit instead of guaranteed profit that most levels give. Giving us more guaranteed opportunities to earn the coins is a good idea.
However I did notice I got 4 slime coins from the boss the other day, when I usually get 3, and it makes me wonder if the slime coins are generated from the boss like a boss token normally would? If this is the case, some way to redeem slime coins for special rewards somewhere would be really cool so long as we also put a limit on how many you can purchase at a casino.
Wed, 07/17/2019 - 15:46
#54
*downvote*
Poorly designed for new players
This level introduces a really hard boss...
One that at depth 3 can take a massive portion of health from a Stone Tortoise shield
One that has tentacles pop up to soak up any ranged attacks
One that (at least from my Drakon) doesn't seem to be damageable with sprites
One that spawns in a room with mini enemies
One that creates a not so visible shockwave to deal damage (that can multi-hit your shield if you're in the wrong spot)
I tried this at depth 3 using 3 and 4 star gear and couldn't beat the boss.... do you really think that a new player with Cobalt or lower is going to be able to handle it?
________________________________
So.... what to change?
First... like the other "main bosses" a codex should be shown before the player fights it to give them an idea of how to fight it, much like how the Roarmulus codex hints at the pair being damaged from friendly fire
Second.... Scale back the difficulty a lot more for lower tiers.... there's no point in making a floor at depth 3 be so difficult.... as for mid to later game the higher difficulty is fine since players are more geared to deal with threats
Third.... the "new mechanics" of the level aren't shown anywhere else in the game atm.... in anything the mission "Faith in Armor" needs to be updated
Fourth.... I'd probably change the Shockwave to be more visible, slower, and able to only hit shields once.... perhaps upping the speed for higher levels
________________________________
I was happy to see new content but I'm not pleased with the execution atm
Thu, 07/18/2019 - 00:06
#55
You deserve everything that is coming to you GH
Now that I have experienced this abomination of an update I will say this:
-The payout at the vault in depth 26 seems fair, but as I have mentioned before, I would rather grind FSC than this clown show of a level. The juice isn't worth the squeeze.
-The minis, OMG, this experience truly justifies why I always skip compound when I could. There is nothing, and I mean NOTHING challenging about fighting minis, it is a chore fighting them. You don't feel satisfied when you beat them, you just felt that you wasted your time and effort. It is almost as if GH have forgotten how grindy their game is, the cognitive dissonance is real here.
-The monster garage, also known as the 'failed game design 101', I wish you can have a way to destroy them before they flood the room with minis that don't drop any loot, and this time GH can't use the 'infinite enemies could be farmed' excuse. Just let them drop something to worth my while.
-Speaking of failed game design, the echo block gave me a nasty surprise when my acheron took out more of my health than the minis. But again, they are tolerable since GH's tedious level design worked to my advantage as I can retreat and negate the blocks, though a warning codex would be nice.
-The razors weren't as atrocious as I expected, though they deal some ludicrous damage for what they are. They are passable if you are patient enough to learn the pattern, in the very least I don't feel cheated when I died to them.
-The boss is the true icing on this poorly thought out update. Unlike RT and snarby. This boss has no weakness that requires you to think so unlike some GH cheerleaders might want to sugar coat this update, this mimic is a step BACKward from their previous boss designs. This boss the epitome of cheesy, suicidal to be engaged in melee? CHECK, damage sponge? CHECK, nauseating numbers of minis to ruin your day? CHECK.
Really, this is the only boss in the game that you have to cheese in order to win. When you beat it, you don't feel like you accomplished something, you feel CHEATED by the game out of many of your hard earned SoL. You can flawlessly beat any boss in the game, but not the mimic. It is a boss that will always punish you regardless of your skill level.
SUMMARY:
This update is the proof that GH has a serious level of cognitive dissonance from their player base. So far removed from the players by their own self imposed isolation that they forgot what game genre they are trying to maintain.
This update is tone deaf, no one asked for it, NOONE, not a soul on cradle asked for this. Their game is still an unbalanced mess, gears and weapons like the sudaruska, plate armor and colbalt armor line are still noob traps and bombers are still severely neglected, the connection is garbage. But for some reason, GH thought what player need is a punishing level that has mediocre payout and a cheesy boss at the end... you certainly won't win over any new players since they will get butchered, you certainly won't win over any seasoned players since they would be too busy grinding FSC, you certainly won't win back any veterans like myself due all the points that I have mentioned. Seriously, WHO was this update made for?
Seriously GH, if you are reading this, please actually try and play your game as a normal knight for once and see for yourself if the level you designed is enjoyable. It is all fun and game when you have a crowbar and can walk through solid walls, but we are the ones who are keeping your game alive, no one is going to play your brand spanking new dungeon if your game is a grindfest exacerbated by the dying nature of your MMO, regardless of what your cheerleaders might say.
Mon, 07/29/2019 - 18:42
#56
Feedback
Listen you people are bottom feeding a bit too much...
The graphics are fine, and that's nice and all. I don't appreciate a raid boss as a treasure vault enemy. For the amount of time wasted in fighting this thing you aren't significantly increasing your wealth. I would rather play another 2 levels in the same amount of time.
The mechanics aren't simple and they take a couple of deaths to understand and you'll be assured that it isn't worth the effort for most players who are at the correct level regardless of weapon type.
The area leading up to this fight is also very punishing but you can get through that section without dying at least.
A boss who basically has an immunity illusion while there is no explanation of what's going on during the fight leads you to make all the assumptions in figuring it out. I do like a challenging BOSS fight but this is not a raid boss, and this is not raid loot.
Good graphic design bad gameplay design. I don't care if it looks cool it's not fun to play, and my friends agree.
Thu, 08/08/2019 - 04:36
#57
Are you sure that current SL
Are you sure that current SL is fair, we got scaled enemies, but not knights. It's like T2 equipment on T3. Even w/o it enemy's stats are growing faster that knight's. IMO it's enough to scale enemies health, not attack and defense.
Sounds like that you couldn't fix scaling for SL and called it feature, but it's definitely bug.
https://i.postimg.cc/DZqjVRdh/T3-at-D10.png Also treasure vault still have overscaled enemies. I got T3 glop drop at depth 10.
Sat, 08/10/2019 - 12:37
#58
If folks have trouble
If folks have trouble surviving they should play on Normal mode and save Elite difficulty for when they improve their playstyle
Nice to see new stuff being added to the clockworks. A suggestion for future updates: areas with a single enemy type will make armors that provide a damage bonus to those enemies more useful (The new gunner armors, Dragon Scale armor, Valkyrie Mail, Virulisk). Areas that have 2 status types would be helpful to make some of the weaker armor lines (Dragon Scale, Grey Owlite, Dread Skelly) more useful and nerf the power of the overused BK and Chaos armors.
Mon, 08/12/2019 - 10:35
#59
i hated the razors at first
but then i remembered that the cat aura can protect your entire team from them. i actually really like when the game forces you to change equipment. maybe add more levels that really want you to change from your usual BK/chaos sets in the future (like when c42 made dragon scale actually worth considering).
i dont really have a problem with the level aside from the aforementioned razors. yeah minis are a pain in the ass but i already knew that and am used to them. the payout was pretty bad too but maybe the purple boxes have something really good in them that i havent seen? cant say anything about the boss because i always carry an iron slug anyway and use it whenever i can (hey remember when it was a joke weapon? those were the days)
edit: nevermind about the cat aura it doesnt help as much as i thought. drakon's speed boost tho..
I was happy to find out that the game updated with something new. The tileset looks great, and I really dig the bank heist motif of it.
However, the "bank heist aesthetic" is purely that- aesthetic.
Discarding the frustration of having to reset the arcade multiple times due to not having luck to get it, it wasn't worth the time spent on it. Let's discuss the positives in my opinion:
As far as I know, this is the first time we see the Mortafire enemy out of the Seerus' missions- which is great. The gremlin family needs to appear more in the arcade, as all encounters with it have been with the Mender enemy and rarely the Thwacker.
The Mimic enemy is nifty, and I dig the idea of a treasure box attacking back. It's not powerful enough to kill an unsuspecting knight, but is enough to keep an eye out.
But the real positives end there.
The razors are just speedy shankles with more intricate patterns. Some have said that dashing over them negates damage, and I haven't tested this myself yet. Their layout could be interesting with the timing and positioning on the knight, but so far, I have seen more designs with cramped spaces coupled with floor hazards that will invariably get you hit- even if you dash, since you'll just fall face first into a floor hazard.
And what all my friends have been complaining about: The entire stage is a mix of the clockwork terminal with the compound style. And to add insult to injury, it's the worst type of compound enemy- the spiky slime that just walks forward and damages you, unlike dust bunnies that have a windup attack, or scarabs that are a lot easier to telegraph against- since they just go in a straight line. Add the incessant spam from the jellies- PLUS the new trap block that denies AREA damage, the only thing that is guaranteed to deal with a large amount of enemies, and you're in for a simply unfun time.
The miniboss, as many have stated, is either incredibly difficult or incredibly easy with what loadout you bring. I used the Combuster's charge attack over and over and OVER until the thing went down, and also using it to keep the minis at bay. And I can sum up the fight as boring and slow.
Melee users really get the short end of the stick, and gunners with weapons that don't pierce enemies are also in a bad spot since the tentacles regenerate so fast. However, the boss would be slightly bearable if there weren't a MILLION glop drops swarming you at all times. The only way to have a slightly better breathing room is to lure all the minis you can into the lower right, and trap them there with the gate. And even THEN, there are still a ton of glop drops waiting to debuff you. Or, you could just cheese everything with the brandish line and the magnus line, repeating the charge attack-hide pattern until you go numb.
I could even forgive how difficult/boring the setups are, if there was some reward for beating it- but no, you get a bunch of boxes that you can get elsewhere with not even a tenth of the frustration. You earn around 1-2k crowns from the level, something the "bad" outcome of the arcade roulette, the graveyard, also offers, without any of the annoying compound enemies swarming your corpse.
If you really have to put an exit right at the start because the floor itself is so bad to play in, that's a red flag right there- the floor shouldn't even be there. What are new players going to think when they get mauled by an army of spiky glop drops? I'm used to farm the white core floors, and even the trainwreck of the last arena is nowhere as boring or frustrating as the boss fight.
I'm aware the community is small and probably made of old, experienced players, with a couple hundred people online at most at any given time. And yes, challenge is fun. I'm not against difficult floors. FSC is an example of a balanced mission- there are challenging arenas, Trojans can maul you if you're caught off-guard, floor hazards galore, and the boss is tanky yet fair, and the rewards are nice. I feel the treasure vault has failed in most of these aspects. But, it's nothing that can't be adjusted.