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Petition to save the game from being reduced to one single mission - please interact so devs can see this

42 replies [Last post]
Thu, 02/05/2026 - 06:32
Reydann's picture
Reydann

Devs, you have a gem of a game on your hands, and I believe you can get a huge influx of returning (and in turn, also new players) if you simply change the game revolving ONE GODDAMN MISSION.

We, the players, are simple minded creatures, and given the chance, we will ALWAYS optimise the fun out of a game.
The problem is that FSC (firestorm citadel mission) is by far the most efficient content to run in the game at the moment, and people WILL lose their goddamn minds if they keep farming it.
Nothing is interesting after you have done it 100 times and people WILL get tired and quit.

Here is an alternative: the arcade (specifically, launching clockwork expeditions from the gates) is brilliant, fun, and very replayable. You need to either buff the arcade runs so people get a similar amount of currency in a similar amount of time as a FSC run - simply put, currency / unit of time. Even more simply put, I want to be able to dedicate 2 hours to arcade runs and I want to get rewarded a similar amount of currency as running FSC for 2 hours.

OR (a more lazy solution) (please don't take this one lol) nerf FSC (and potentially all the missions) in order to bring it in line with the arcade runs. This is because missions can be spammed and they are inherently not balanced in their current state. Instantly teleporting to a more valuable depth with more resources brings us to players optimising the fun out of the game and just spamming the same thing over and over again.

Here's a simple idea that should fix things :
Make a system so that if a player enters an arcade run and goes all the way to the lowest depth, he gets a flat bonus of currency (crowns or orbs or crystals or all 3) as a reward at the final elevator before returning to haven.

If you want to take this even further, you can implement these checkpoints at various depths of your choosing and give smaller bonuses on the way so that people can choose to leave at earlier depths and still get rewarded a smaller amount of stuff.
Oh, and you could also steal OSRS's system of asking the players what changes should be done to the game and what content should be addded.

If you agree please leave a comment so we increase visibility on this.
If you don't, please let me know why and maybe we work on an improved solution.

~Rey

Sun, 02/08/2026 - 12:49
#1
Sweet-Hope's picture
Sweet-Hope

i do agree, honestly when i saw they would add missions i thought i would be like a random NPC spawning in arcade giving you the quest and thus opening the path were you would must do the quest... but when i saw they were teleport missions and repeatable i knew this would happen.

i recall Nick said he wanted to overhaul arcade, like make missions only for the lore and arcade for looting and profit, for me this was the best, but sadly this was before he left the company. its saddens me everytime i want to play Spiral Knight a good arcade run im always alone, because people dont want to run anything that isnt FSC due the profit, the predictable pattern and speed running it. and everything that party finder is FSC runs.

for me i wouldnt mind if they nerf missions like they did with the gauntlet, i remember that one was a tier 3 arena like arcade but later was changed to it custom design that have now.

there have been many suggestions on how to make it, but sadly all these wouldnt work until missions get nerfed. because nothing cant beat a vana speed run, you still get a good profit even if you dont kill all plus the 3 tokens.

Sun, 02/08/2026 - 20:50
#2
Hatn's picture
Hatn

What would nerfing missions do? It'd just make the game even worse for non-whales. Let's improve upon the trash, not grow it.

Mon, 02/09/2026 - 16:28
#3
Kim-Jung-Oink
NO NERFS

I agree that the loot should definitely, 100%, be increased in the arcade. I spend like an hour running tier 3 arcade and I only get, on average, like 4k crowns? And I love to take my time in the arcade because it's fun. FSC gives you like 8k in 20 minutes or so, so yeah, that's kinda messed up. How much of an increase, I don't know, that is up to the devs to figure out. I don't know about the simple idea you have there, just increase the loot, that's it. But I am completely against nerfing the loot (or any nerf for that matter; the last thing this game needs are nerfs) for missions. As Hatn said, it will make the game worse for normal players, and even new players.

Mon, 02/09/2026 - 15:14
#4
Leidran
Agree with buffs, disagree with nerfs

There's already so many unsatisfying elements in Spiral Knights that nerfing popular choices (or choice, rather) in terms of missions to farm crowns would just make everyone unhappy.

Buffs would allow for players to experience a higher variety of levels, so buffing arcade itself in one way or an other, buff other level types so they include better rewards in later depths or even just allowing for people to access depth 28 levels quicker would go a long way.

Spiral Knights has a lot of content that barely gets visited heavily by most players because usually the extrinsic reward is simply far too unsatisfying, so I think doing something to make literally anything that isn't FSC more appealing would be appreciated.

Tue, 02/10/2026 - 00:57
#5
Zeddy's picture
Zeddy

I'd give a one-time bonus for clearing each stratum of a gate. The first time you reach the end of a stratum, you'd get all your pickups doubled, possibly tripled, or doubled + a flat bonus.

- Encourages running every new gate once from start to finish
- ...while exhaustively looting everything rather than speedrunning
- ...and returning to the game when there's a new gate, regular check-ins like Mist used to make us do.

This would give a great yield of reward for your playtime should you only be getting on and running new stratums, coaxing you towards a healthy 2-3 hours a few times in a week.

Tue, 02/10/2026 - 04:42
#6
Reydann's picture
Reydann
Thank you for your thoughts

@Sweet-Hope I wouldn't mind nerfs either but im sure 99% of the community would riot, so devs if you're reading this, please don't take the lazy way out xD

@Hatn Definitely agree, an arcade buff / rework would be 1000 times better.

@Kim-Jung-Oink Agreed with everything, also yeah my idea is probably not the best solution, I'm sure others have proposed way better ones that are burried in the forums, but it is a lazy and quick fix and I thought I would offer one to the devs since after all these years ANY change would help.

@Leidran Hard agree with everything, we need something done, anything, it's a shame to have unused content when we are not even getting any new one.

@Zeddy Another excellent idea, anything that makes me run all gates at least once is a great change already imo! Altough I would love being able to play arcade non stop (like FSC) and be rewarded nicely from it, if for some reason the devs want to implement this as some sort of "dailies" it's still a positive change and I would gladly take it!

Tue, 02/10/2026 - 06:14
#7
Retrofit's picture
Retrofit
owo uwu owo

Just make Shadow Lairs free to run so endgame players have something else to farm and run with their bleeding edge gear. Charging people 5 USD for a single attempt at a single endgame dungeon is ludicrous and insane, especially in this gaming market where you can go buy and play an entirely different game for that price. Seriously. I can buy four keys or I can just go buy and play Helldivers LOL. What do you really think people are going to choose? LOL. I dunno who they're trying to fool with that.

Tue, 02/10/2026 - 07:14
#8
Epsilium
Some though

Buffing the Arcade via a flat bonus or doubling the loot is interesting, but it need a way to not happen if you do the boss via the arcade. Otherwise, people are just going to farm the arcade gate leading to FSC.

I like the idea of tweaking the price of SL, setting it so that the overall gain of SL loot minus gate price match or is slightly higher than the one of a FSC run would be a good way of doing it.

I would really like to have a Tier 4 arcade set of run, having the elevator going down into the core. This could not need extra level gear (no need for 6star), but with just higher difficulty and loot, maybe higher radiant looting rate in tier 4 (into the core), or no longer cr looting, but E looting on the ground. And over there, no way to one shot a trojan horse. An other idea would be to move the SL over there, rotating every week or day or something the one available for free.

But overall, no nerf, just adding some extra ways of making CR/E at a similar rate than the FSC (20-30kcr/hours for a newly made 5* in a crew)

Tue, 02/10/2026 - 08:34
#9
Jcyrano's picture
Jcyrano
"...but with just higher

"...but with just higher difficulty and loot, maybe higher radiant looting rate in tier 4 (into the core)..."
Lets remove the Forge... gameplay-wise Is an horrendous 2010 consumer-exploiting mechanic, that being said, make the SL a good place to level up Your gear could be awesome!

What if? there is Vanguard level besides Elite on the bosses on the Arcade, so the Vanguard difficulty rewards 5* orbs and good heat and crowns, no need to change any layout of those levels, Just the amount per boxes, so Vanaduke Twins, Jelly and Snarbolax give roughtly the same amount of rewards on Vanguard difficulty.

Now You are equally rewarded for wanting to go to any boss, not Just one, the dificulty is a bit hard (You can't 1 shot everything) and the rewards are good compared to (time <-> dificulty)=reward equation. Does that works?

Wed, 02/11/2026 - 05:20
#10
Ultraflo's picture
Ultraflo
I'd agree on buffing the

I'd agree on buffing the payout for a full run of the clockworks. I've only just restarted playing SK, and stopped around 2018 and it was already hard enough making crowns without going insane from farming the Duke. I'd rather run through all 28 layers with its variety than run one single mission ad infinitum.

I also agree with Retrofit on shadow lairs, they're just not worth doing.

Fri, 02/13/2026 - 08:02
#11
Reydann's picture
Reydann
Agree with the Shadow Lairs

Agree with the Shadow Lairs comment, its another piece of unused content as they are simply not worth, which is a shame.

Also, what if a mechanic would be implemented so that the flat bonus you get at the elevator would scale with the number of enemies killed in the whole arcade run? It would discourage rush tactics in case Vana is at the end of it, and it would also encourage full exploration of the levels so that people get to see all the hidden corners and rooms, kill all the enemies, and have all the fun?!

Fri, 02/13/2026 - 11:24
#12
Jcyrano's picture
Jcyrano
But what if

And if I want to Shivermist Bust and Topor Tantum all the levels while I explore every switch and room? Why Should I get less crowns for not going Murder-Hobo? if I explored everything... I get Your point, The mobs on the map Shouldn't be the only thing we need to search for... and shouldn't be a speed-bump. The game should feel good, for different play styles, Not enforcing play styles give them space!

Sat, 02/14/2026 - 10:12
#13
Reydann's picture
Reydann
Well, I get what you are

Well, I get what you are saying Jcyrano, but that playstyle would fall into the category of speedrunning / rushing the levels, and it would be especially promoting the playstyle of rushing elevators for the currency bonus or just trying to get down to Vanaduke as soon as possible. We could be creating another min-maxing situation, another unfun meta.

Sat, 02/14/2026 - 15:37
#14
Kim-Jung-Oink
I respect your opinion, Reydann, but...

I don't want to derail the main topic, so I'll eventually focus back on the main topic at hand, but I firmly believe that the speedrunning playstyle, or any metagaming playstyle, should be here to stay; in Spiral Knights, and in all videogames. It's a playstyle that sits very well with others, and I'm sure by mere uneducated speculation that many gamers love to mix up their playstyles. To condemn speedrunning or a meta playstyle is just not right, and even impossible. I'd argue that there is literally a meta in every single game known to man (is there a meta playstyle in Tetris?); it's just inevitable, and speedrunning is one of them. I like my good mix of casual and hardcore gaming, meta or not. I personally find metagaming to be fun. But I don't want to argue about this, it will derail the main topic, those were just my two cents regarding the mechanics you suggested, that is if they implement them. In my very humble opinion, I believe the most easiest thing for all of us, for the community and the developers of Spiral Knights, is to first, simply increase that loot drop from monsters and treasure boxes in the Arcade, which I personally view as a foundation for more mechanics suggested by the community to be implemented into Spiral Knights. /salute

Sat, 02/14/2026 - 20:00
#15
Reydann's picture
Reydann
Indeed, Kim

Indeed, that would be a completely separate discussion in itself. The only thing I will say is that an enemy kill count, counting towards elevator bonuses would not eliminate speedrunning at all, it would probably just eliminate completely cheese strategies.

But yeah, we don't even know if our discussion will ever be taken into considration in the first place, we would be lucky to get a simple increase in overall arcade drops ^^

Sat, 02/14/2026 - 22:37
#16
Kim-Jung-Oink
+1

"The only thing I will say is that an enemy kill count, counting towards elevator bonuses would not eliminate speedrunning at all, it would probably just eliminate completely cheese strategies."
Ah I see. If that's the case, then all is good. Not a bad suggestion at all, if I say so myself.

Wed, 02/18/2026 - 14:16
#17
Darklordskull's picture
Darklordskull
I agree

The Clockworks / arcade is the most interesting part of the game. It's very replayable and fun. But FSC is so much moire rewarding. Of course, its a difficult boss, so it should be rewarding, but the difference right now is just too much. I'd be fine with nerfing the loot in FSC if it meant the arcade is more rewarding. The Clockworks should really be the end game grind.

Thu, 02/19/2026 - 00:18
#18
Corinthmaxwell's picture
Corinthmaxwell
Input from an old (and returning) veteran. (edited)

@Reydann: FSC is lauded for its "efficiency" because you get crowns, materials, exclusive tokens that you can exchange for gear that you can sell off for even more crowns, and (obviously) Radiant Fire Crystals. If I'm on a Tier 3 Arcade run, I'm lucky if I manage to get a minimum of 3 Radiants each time, and right now, that is the problem that many active players are dealing with.

Quite frankly, if the GMs were to alter the appearance rate/frequency of which Fire Crystals appear by stratum (6 types, 6 stratums......should be simple, right?), people would have much more incentive to run Arcade gates than they would have to run Missions over & over. As it stands now, with how many Radiants I have left to collect, there's not really any incentive for me to not farm & grind FSC, specifically because of how infrequently Radiant Fire Crystals will drop in any Tier 3 run.

@Kim-Jung-Oink: If you're only getting an average of around 4K crowns from Tier 3 runs, then you aren't playing on Elite difficulty. I average a minimum of at least 8K crowns, and that's if there aren't any floors with an Arena, or if I decide that certain Danger Rooms aren't worth the hassle. :/

EDIT: Given the low and/or near-abysmal frequency of Radiant drops in Depths 25-28, entering any Danger Room or unlocking any Energy Gate above at least Depth 26, is an absolute no-no for me.

Wed, 02/18/2026 - 20:20
#19
Jcyrano's picture
Jcyrano
Also Input from an old (and returning) veteran.

the Fire cristal need to Go along with the Forge, where? HELL... and never return! So don't drop a "If where more cristal..." as a solution because that is THE Problem, there are... when there Shouldn't be at All!

Wed, 02/18/2026 - 21:18
#20
Corinthmaxwell's picture
Corinthmaxwell
Umm.......no. >_>

Annoying as the implementations of the Forge and the newer Alchemy systems may have been for some players, things were somewhat worse when you had to spend Energy to use Elevators. Taking away something that the player base back then considered "bad" had to be balanced by putting something else in its place.

Wed, 02/18/2026 - 23:56
#21
Ultraflo's picture
Ultraflo
@Corinthmaxwell You're right,

@Corinthmaxwell
You're right, that was bad back then and it was the reason I didn't play much at the time. You only had 100 energy or day and spent 10 per elevator use iirc.
So yes, the forge is better but it's still flawed. I genuinely think if they removed the ability to fail gear leveling by using less crystals, more people would be inclined to come back. I'm not opposed to using more crystals, I just don't think it's fair to lose all your mats if you fail an 80% forge. That's just stupid and vile. Maybe if you got back the same percentage of mats and only lost a bit, it'd be a fairer solution while still pushing people to use up more crystals.

Also yes more radiants at 24-28 on any gate, only FSC gives me about 15-21 rads, whereas other gates give me 3-6.

Thu, 02/19/2026 - 09:57
#22
Jcyrano's picture
Jcyrano
Do NOT put words

Did I say put back payed elevators? NO, Cuting someone legs to give the crutches doesn't make You a Saint, nor a Doctor. Makes You a Butcher.

"...had to be balanced by putting something else in its place."

How About NO! You don't need tu put crap, because those were 2010 predatory design archetypes... TODAY we don't pay elevator, we WON'T pay Elevator WE DON'T WANT FORGE, why? Player progresion and retention. And DON'T even try to Justify anything. The Forge HAS to GO! Stop fixing crap with more or less smell that is still CRAP, remove the it Once and for all.

Thu, 02/19/2026 - 14:00
#23
Zosu's picture
Zosu
I disagree

I disagree, because FSC farmers are the worst players and I don't want them in my Arcade.
I enjoy them going insane repeating the same mission over and over. It's like their own personal hell they cast themselves into by being greedy and overoptimizing for profit per time and then hanging four hours in haven to reduce their profit per time to near zero again.

Fri, 02/20/2026 - 14:26
#24
Kim-Jung-Oink
@Corinthmaxell

Yup, I average that, too. I exaggerated a bit too much, apologies.

But to be completely real @Jcyrano, I believe that the arcade loot will be buffed long before the forge system gets removed (if even at all, to be honest). So in the mean time, buff the drop rate of those radiants, too I guess... even though I personally want the system removed.

And yeah, who says that once the forge system gets removed from the game, the mist energy system will be re-implemented? I don't think the forge system was a good way to balance the game at all, really. It was pointless then, considering the abundance of crystals (if memory serves me right), especially radiants, one was able to earn then; might as well just use the heat system only to level up your gear and that's it, classic xp level up. But then eventually the drop rate was nerfed, so now it's just a bad and unfun way to retain players. A whole different discussion overall, though so back to the issue at hand...

Fri, 02/20/2026 - 15:59
#25
Hatn's picture
Hatn

@Zosu
Just treat every FSC player who joins your lobby as a Pulsar user and remove them from your party. Assumed problematic individuals hasn't stopped you from playing arcade in the past, so I don't understand the point in disagreeing. Also, please be careful labeling others as "greedy" when you have tried selling a Shadow Slimed Aura for a Mixer in the past. Hypocrisy isn't the most attractive thing to some

Fri, 02/20/2026 - 19:47
#26
Zosu's picture
Zosu
Aww, did I strike a nerve

You think I'm not doing that already, lol.
And about trading this for that. I don't believe in prices. The price is whatever two ppl can agree on when trading. Sometimes I have new rare things and offer to trade them for whatever other rare thing comes to mind. All prices are made up. It's all just a few bits on a server somewhere. Wake up sheeple.

Mon, 02/23/2026 - 08:09
#27
Reydann's picture
Reydann
Anyways back to the

Anyways back to the topic,

Today I logged on and I am faced with the fact that I need A LOT of radiant fire crystals to level up like 3 weapons, and the only real solution is doing FSC over and over again.
This just feels extremely bad for the players, and there are no alternatives.
And no, arcade (in it's current state) is not realistic to grind in this situation because its going to take an ungodly amount of time to get enough radiants for even ONE weapon.
I get it that you want people to either grind or swipe and buy them from the supply depot, but the more realistic outcome is that people will opt for grinding FSC, burn out, and quit the game instead, which equals no profit for you.
Just let me grind in arcade instead of FSC, that's all we ask for.

Devs, please, do the math on the drops if you don't believe me, we need some changes.

Mon, 02/23/2026 - 12:03
#28
Hatn's picture
Hatn
Huh? What?

@Reydann
All F2P options to amass radiants is going to take time, even FSC. How accessible do you want radiants to be? Technically Dreams and Nightmares is a better radiant farm compared to FSC, it just lacks a good chunk of crowns to boat. Also, can you help me understand how a FSC grinder quitting the game equals no profit? A FSC grinder doesn't provide profit to begin with because they're farming FSC instead of afking in haven awaiting their month spending limit to reset

@zosu
I didn't know holding up a mirror could spark such a reaction. On the other hand, you not believing in prices explains so much lmao

Mon, 02/23/2026 - 14:57
#29
Spark-Of-Kill
What Hatn said

^^^^^^

We have alternatives. It's just that most of them aren't as good as FSC.

I'd like to note that Apocrea is also a crazy good radiant crystal farm. Unfortunately it only shows up once a year for some reason. (As opposed to it's previous biannual rotation)

That being said; Gentlemen, I feel that all of our problems would disappear if the Irontech Destroyer were to receive a buff. So that it would, as the name implies, destroy. Thank you for reading.

Mon, 02/23/2026 - 15:55
#30
Reydann's picture
Reydann
Being a FSC farmer does not

@Hatn Being a FSC farmer does not disqualify you from spending money on the game, that's not how logic works.
Quitting the game on the other hand means you are spending 0$ tho.

But sure, let's asume that all FSC farmers are not spending a dime. We still want to keep them from quitting, they are still needed because the whales want an active population. Without an active population there is no one to admire all the stuff they spent money on.

Tue, 02/24/2026 - 01:49
#31
Corinthmaxwell's picture
Corinthmaxwell
A-hem. >_>

@Jcyrano: First of all, no one is "putting words in your mouth". Second, yelling & ranting isn't an endearing trait, nor will it make others more likely to take anything you have to say into consideration.

That being said....I don't particularly like the Forge either, ESPECIALLY since you have to spend the "maximum amount" of Fire Crystals to ensure that your Heating doesn't have a chance of "failing". Then again, I wouldn't like any kind of system like that in any game, particularly because I absolutely hate "gambling" of any kind. I only barely tolerate it as-is here.

@Zosu: To be honest, if I had the time (and the patience), I would be soloing FSC at least once a week, if not every few days. Sadly, I don't have that kind of free time in my life right now, and I quite frankly don't care very much for players who insist that "you're doing it wrong if you aren't farming FSC their way".

@Kim-Jung-Oink: As I stated before (numerous times in numerous topics), the drop rate for all six types of Fire Crystals should be adjusted per Stratum, rather than having a flat and/or fixed drop rate that only barely increases as you go further down into the Clockworks. There's a bit too much random chance as to whether or not you'll actually find any on floors where they should appear on a semi-regular basis.

@Reydann: It's not so much "burnout", as it is "redundancy-inflicted boredom". Farming FSC gets very irritating after a while, especially when every member of the party has to schedule enough free time in advance to clear the run, and when everyone has to make sure that they have a variety of gear to help clear the mission.

Consider yourself fortunate.....I calculated the average amount of Crowns that I would need in order to buy the exact number of Radiants I would need for all of my gear, a little over 10 years ago. The amount has fluctuated rather wildly during that time, and I am quite glad that it has dropped to a somewhat reasonable value as of late, especially considering that it's based on the average price of CE in the Energy Market.

FSC is the most appealing option for people trying to farm Radiants, because it is also unfortunately the quickest path to farming in Depths 26-28 without having to go through all of Tier 3 beforehand. At this point, unless you're also attempting to pick up a few high-value recipes from Basil to re-sell in the Auction House, farming FSC is more of a necessity than anything that I would consider a "solution".

A potential alternative that I would propose is that all of the later Rank 9 & Rank 10 Missions, as well as all of the daily Prestige Missions and Danger Missions, have their locations adjusted to Depths 26/27/28, so as to not only give players a better challenge, but to also break up the monotony of feeling like farming FSC is the "only way" to obtain high-level loot and/or Radiants.

@Hatn: We just want Radiants to be as "accessible" as they were when they were first introduced, plain & simple. Buying them from the Supply Depot (or from others who have also bought them from the Supply Depot) is, was, and always should have been nothing more than a "last resort".

@Reydann: There are plenty of things I've been wanting to spend money on and/or for in this game, as far back as 2014. Unfortunately, an illogical decision back then basically killed off whatever motivation I had to throw what little "disposable income" I had toward this game. Same thing goes for the Supply Depot -- I don't know about anyone else, but having to spend 6,300+ CE just to fully level one 5-star item, is most decidedly NOT my idea of "fun", especially when you are no longer guaranteed to get a bonus amount of CE with every Prize Box that you buy.

Tue, 02/24/2026 - 07:48
#32
Jcyrano's picture
Jcyrano
Hatn - How accessible do you

Hatn - How accessible do you want radiants to be?
Completely un-reacheable... because I don't want them in-game at ALL. Gone with the forge to HELL.

Corinthmaxwell -Second, yelling & ranting isn't an endearing trait, nor will it make others more likely to take anything you have to say into consideration.
Darling, I'm not yelling, this crappy-overaged-forum web format doesn't underline, the principal function of underline is to emphasice importance I would be Underlining the: ::underline:: I do not accept any change to crystal drop because I want the slog-grinding-predatory-crappy-overaged systems Out of the game... ::undeline:: endearing enough? and I will rant all I can for I will never tolerate predatory and underhanded behaviour, you can play as Stoic as You wish... I'm not going to hide the fact that I will haunt those that try to take advantage of predatory systems, keep it cool if You wish, I wont.let.anyone.exploit.others. I wont be cool with that.

And spending money on a game should be for "I want to look cute" not I need to pay to progress... (Don't even try to refute this last argument).

Fri, 02/27/2026 - 21:23
#33
Isoranguard's picture
Isoranguard
"Don't even try to refute this last argument"

Forever and always the last gasp of someone who never wants to be proven wrong. Where, exactly, do you think the money for this game's "continued development" comes from? The Grey Havens staff isn't sitting on an infinite cash flow, and no one anywhere is just giving away free bandwidth for online activities of any kind.

First of all, having Fire Crystals of any kind in the game, much less the Radiant Fire Crystals themselves, isn't "predatory". In fact, with all of the price gouging in the user-run Energy Market and Auction House that took place over the past decade, the horrible, terrible, no good, very bad task of having to collect rarities for heating gear that you describe, is the LEAST "predatory" thing going on in this game. Second, no one is forcing you to obtain and/or use them, at all. You are perfectly & completely free to play through the game without heating a single piece of gear, and deal with all of the consequences that come of that particular decision.

What you will or won't "accept" is irrelevant. The Forge is not going away. Fire Crystals are not going away. If you have a problem with that, then I strenuously advise you to come up with a better solution, because the only thing you've been doing so far is complaining. And by the way......"pay to win" mechanics have been around much longer than this game has existed. If someone else chooses to "pay to progress" in a game, but you don't want to, then how they choose to play through the game is not only not your concern, but it is also not interfering with your own ability to play.

Sat, 02/28/2026 - 05:10
#34
Spark-Of-Kill
It's a video game

@Isoranguard preach

Yeah I was thinking about commenting something along the lines of "god forbid somebody has to play the video game in order to progress." In response to some of Jcyrano's replies (it's not just within this post either). But something tells me they're not the kind of person to listen to reason (I'm not saying that to me mean. It's just the way they express their ideas and how they respond to criticism)

Sat, 02/28/2026 - 06:42
#35
Jcyrano's picture
Jcyrano
I have nothing in playing the game in order to progress

I need to pay to progress... {This Is NOT Acceptable] this is the part that is not for contend, is it clear that PAY to PROGRESS is wrong? did I made clear the PAY to Progress is not ok? and I will not accept excuses about it... it is clear now? perhaps I wasn't clear enought that pay to progress is wrong.

There is no reason for predatory or nor parasitic designs... crystals are not ok, they where a "tool" for the game designers to extrend the playtime required by players to level up equipment since mist was gone... It wasn't on players best interest, It was a tool for monetization of advancement, I'm against the monetization of advancement...
now please try to prove me Wrong about how monetizing advance is always done in the best interest of the players, please read carefully:
"spending money on a game should be for "I want to look cute" not I need to pay to progress..." "not I need to pay to progress..."

"god forbid somebody read to understand" that I will not accept excuses about: pay to advance...
IS it clear now?

honestly I love to see that we agree on Play to advance... and that You didn't even care to read that...

Sat, 02/28/2026 - 08:41
#36
Pepperoucheau's picture
Pepperoucheau
And so, the thread to prevent

And so, the thread to prevent the game from becoming stale and outdated is hijacked to become the thread about keeping the game stale and outdated.

This game already lost so many players from myst, and forcing people to use premium currency to craft items (orb drop rates are abysmal if you try to get them without energy) looks ugly too, so its puzzling to see people argue that the current energy shenanigans are fine... No, maybe that's exactly why its happening? All the players that don't like P2W left, and the people that remained are fine with it, not realizing the aggressive monetization turns people off.

Sat, 02/28/2026 - 09:53
#37
Spark-Of-Kill
Simply untrue

@Jcyrano There is, quite literally, no point in Spiral Knights where the player is forced to pay to progress. This is coming from someone who went from recruit to vanguard, crafted nearly every single weapon in the game, and even obtained my own Black Kat set without spending a dime on anything progression related. (I did buy prize boxes in that time, but that's firstly besides the point, and secondly not required in any way shape or form)

Spiral Knights is an MMO. MMOs are notorious for being very grindy at times. Whatever stage of the game you're currently in, I can tell you for a fact that you are not forced to "pay to progress"

Edit: You can Pepperoucheau seem to be completely overlooking the fact that energy can be obtained with crowns via Supply Depot. Not only is the use of energy not required to progress (albeit it is the fastest way to get alchemy orbs) but even if it was, which I agree would be wrong, you still able to amass large amounts of energy even as a free to play player.

Sat, 02/28/2026 - 10:57
#38
Pepperoucheau's picture
Pepperoucheau
I'm not "overlooking" it. Its

I'm not "overlooking" it. Its still true that energy gain (and thus game progression) is still locked into SOMEONE paying. The price of energy could easily spike again if more players joined and threw the system into chaos- The energy prices you're seeing now are because of the low amount of new players.

You're also "overlooking" that progressing without buying energy is painfully slow and would make most people quit.

EDIT: And to repeat what I said... Having to progress the game by using premium currency looks ugly. What I mean by this is that when people see those kinds of systems in a game they often turn around and quit.

Sat, 02/28/2026 - 12:57
#39
Spark-Of-Kill
My Two Cents

I dunno, I feel like you two are just looking at it the wrong way. If a video game forces a player to purchase something in order to progress, yeah I can understand why that would be a problem. But im telling you Spiral Knights isn't one such case.

"Painfully slow" is a but subjective. Even back when energy conversation was ~8kcr per 100, getting a full set of 3-star gear wasn't that bad. Once again, this is an MMO.

The jump from 3 to 4-star gear is when it starts to get a bit unreasonable. The cost of Alchemy Orbs is doubled, Ranked missions reward the player with less, and the price of recipes jump considerably. It costs a Defender Elite 50kcr for a full set of 4-star recipes. (40k of they only want one 4-star weapon) And all of that happens while there's basically no increase in crown income. You're still in Tier 2, and RT is generally a worse crown farm than Jelly King.

The presence of premium currency isn't inherently a bad thing. Especially in SK's case, where I would consider it to be extremely generous. I want to reiterate, there is no point in the game where the player is forced into a situation where the only way forward is to cough up a credit card number. (Almost) Every single item in the game is obtainable for a F2P player. Spiral Knights is, in essence, a free to play game.

MMOs traditionally get excessively grindy at times. And to an extent, rightfully so. You wouldn't want a new player to reach Vanguard rank in less than a week. Slow progression isn't the issue, it's how enjoyable that progression is. Outright removing the forge system doesn't fix anything.

The entire point of this post was to suggest the idea of buffing alternatives to farming FSC. Most notably, the Arcade. Since it's accessable throughout every stage of the game.

Im starting to feel bad for whichever GM has to read through all of this. Half of these replies have absolutely nothing to do with the issues Reydann was trying to address.

Sat, 02/28/2026 - 13:27
#40
Pepperoucheau's picture
Pepperoucheau
Most MMOs are dead.

Most MMOs are dead. A majority of people don't want to grind a singleplayer game to get with the rest of the playerbase which is only doing level cap content.
... Hm, interesting.

Sun, 03/01/2026 - 01:34
#41
Grandish's picture
Grandish
Forge is a product of passage of time.

Personally, I feel like option 1 and option 2 should be deleted from forge altogether since no one uses them anyway.
As a compensation, option 3 could get a slightly reduced fire crystal cost to counterbalance the loss of cheaper options.

Sun, 03/01/2026 - 08:27
#42
Spark-Of-Kill
You must love using that word

@Jcyrano. Care to explain what exactly you mean by "predatory"? I've seen you voice the same opinion like 15 different times, yet you've failed to elaborate on it at all. The idea of "you have to collect an item in order to level up your gear" isn't "predatory", far from it.

Don't get me wrong, I don't exactly love the current forge system either. Although the 2nd option is technically more efficient, since you end up saving more crystals then you lose and it's generally cheaper. (Source: math and years of experience crafting and heating gear) Losing twice or even three times in a row feels devastating. And the 1st option is a complete waste of space. There's literally no reason to ever try it.

There are many things that can be improved with the current forge system, but as I've said, outright removing it from the game fixes literally none of SKs progression issues.

As @Isoranguard stated, you're better off coming up with an actual solution instead of complaining.

(As a side note) In my humble opinion, the "ideal" forge system would be something along the lines of:

  • 1st option: significantly cheaper, but with a chance to fail (I'd say no more than 33%)
  • 2nd option: fairly priced and consistent
  • 3rd option: expensive, but with a much higher chance of extra bonuses (double level ups, forge boxes)

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