Spiral Knights - Jigsaw Valley: All Constructs?!

Jigsaw Valley: All Constructs?!

28 replies [Last post]

Wed, 07/20/2011 - 23:14

ChaosZereul

Legacy Username

See topic. When I saw the update notes and saw the changes to Jigsaw, for a moment I thought "hey, awesome, not only was it in the Beast stratum for the gate that passed, but it's in the Beast Stratum for the current "new" gate, that must mean it's Beast!"

Nope. Constructs. Nothing but bloody Constructs.

What. The. Hell?? Did Constructs REALLY need their own "personal" zone?? Because didn't they just get their own boss stratum? And are they not in abundance in EVERY OTHER ZONE, IN EVERY OTHER STRATUM, IN EVERY OTHER GATE IN EXISTENCE???

Look, maybe I'm just being a tad selfish, but I have enough of every construct material - barring Sun Silver - to satiate my needs for well past the point when this game stops being interesting. You know what I am lacking? Bushy Tails. Warp Dusts. Primal Ore. You know what gets the least representation in most stratums that are NOT it's own Monster type?? Beasts!

Wed, 07/20/2011 - 23:26

Character-Name

If I may say, about Concrete Boulevard....

The cube jellies feel out of place there, their color doesn't fit the groove the place had going. All the wild and tall grass really was suggesting the occasional beasts it used to have.

Maybe I'm just too used to how it used to be, and now it IS simpler to me; but still feels like they're missing...

Wed, 07/20/2011 - 23:37

Ailea

@Kobayen

For a level that lists itself as "being home to slimes and constructs" it does seem *quite* a bit light on the slime-side.

Thu, 07/21/2011 - 05:46

Twiddle

My guess is that all the

My guess is that all the enemies that appear in Jigsaw valley (and other changed zones) will spawn according to a theme. It might be constructs now. The next time it will be slimes. Still another time and they will be beasts. This is different from how they used to be where everything was mixed.

Thu, 07/21/2011 - 06:49

GamerTB

Legacy Username

Why complain about Contructs

Why complain about Contructs being more present? That's actually a good thing, seeing as it'll mean more Blue Shards.

Thu, 07/21/2011 - 07:31

Schwarze

I'm bothered about Concrete

I'm bothered about Concrete Jungle. The Chromas and Wolvers were all removed to make place for more Drouhls and Jelly cubes.
The beasts in there gave the level more 'flavour', and the cubes, pink as they are, just stand out way too much in an otherwise dark-green/brown level.

Thu, 07/21/2011 - 09:09

Shisho

The only thing I'm unhappy

The only thing I'm unhappy about is this Jigsaw of monster types. With all the tweaks to monster types and damage types there doesn't seem to be any suitable gear types anymore for protection. This thing does truck loads of elemental, these do piercing, and for fun we'll throw in some shadow here.

I'm fine with a couple wild cards, but the each level now seems like it's a split or a reversal of damage types and vulnerabilities of the previous level.

I can understand certain combos, like undead + fiend for example. You put on shadow gear and maybe bring two weapon types. But a map with beast, jellies, constructs, and gremlins... :/

Thu, 07/21/2011 - 11:24

Rusvul

*clank*

I was surprised running some Jigsaw levels last night when instead of the usual jelly hordes I was getting annoying constructs with distance attacks... though the toasterbots instead of wolvers was an interesting change. They don't dodge like those furry little *#&*#@!s do...

Thu, 07/21/2011 - 13:36

Heimdallr

My guess is that all the

I don't think that's the case. I went through Emerald Axis II and Jade Tangle II of Jigsaw Valley in Coral Clover T2. They're in a Gremlin stratum, and I only saw 6 gremlins spawn in Axis II (2 spawns of 3); the rest were all constructs. In Tangle II I saw 8 gremlins in the last room before the elevator. Axis II on Depth 20 of the Emerald Queen gate also had the same spawns. It's in a Construct stratum.

EDIT: Did another Axis II run; this one is in a Beast stratum on Depth 16 of the Jade Rook gate. Same spawns again, no beasts at all.

Thu, 07/21/2011 - 21:44

Stadsport

Legacy Username

I can understand the idea

I can understand the idea that jellies don't make total sense in Jigsaw valley, but it's seriously ALL CONSTRUCTS now. I just did a couple of runs. I can assure you all that limping robots shooting laser beams from their faces are significantly more out of place than jellies were. Lumbers kind of fit--that's about it.

Fri, 07/22/2011 - 00:23

#10

Ufana

I don't understand the idea

I don't understand the idea at all. What's that supposed to be - robots in their natural habitat?

In my opinion:
- This change makes jigsaw incredibly ugly. The atmosphere just is wrong.
- It significantly reduces the clockwork diversity. Do we need a green mechanized mile that always looks the same?
- The contruct abilities don't really fit to the layout. Some parts of the map seem unfair now, most fun parts don't work any more.

Well... maybe it's gonna make more sense if those lvls start appearing only in contruct strata in the future. Still I think the neat lvl layout is sort of wasted with an all construct crew.

Fri, 07/22/2011 - 06:10

#11

Loki

Legacy Username

Constructs stand out horribly

Constructs stand out horribly in these maps now.

Some Lumbers makes sense, but Scuttlebots and Retrodes everywhere? Makes absolutely no sense.

Peaceful, tranquil, open meadow.
Suddenly...
Robots, everywhere.

These maps were in the Slime/Beast strata if I'm not mistaken, now they're pure Construct with a pinch of Gremlin.

Fri, 07/22/2011 - 07:12

#12

jooozek

Legacy Username

Scuttlebots and Retrodes

Scuttlebots and Retrodes didn't really have their "home", only times you could meet them were Mechanized Miles in the randomly generated Clockwork Tunnels and Arenas and now with the Roarmulus Twins, in the IMF also. Meanwhile Wolvers have had their Wolver Den's since ages, i don't see anything wrong giving the less loved ones a home, Jigsaw Valleys don't have bushes like Wolver Den's and they feature a lot of concrete walls, lots of gun puppies, respawning blocks. I've usually avoided Jigsaw Valleys because of how boring they were with all the chromalisks/wolvers because i've had already had enough of them from Wolver Dens/Wild Paths/Arenas/Danger Rooms.

Just because it has grass doesn't mean you can't put there robots.

Fri, 07/22/2011 - 07:27

#13

Dottor-Troione

What about changes in Dark

What about changes in Dark City?

Fri, 07/22/2011 - 13:01

#14

ChaosZereul

Legacy Username

Mechanized Miles, Arenas,

Mechanized Miles, Arenas, Roarmulus Twins

So, basically, we encountered them in A. one of the most commonly seen zone types next to Decon zones, B. Zones that every player dreams of encountering MORE of, and C. the current FOTM Boss stratum. And you say they needed a "home" where we fight nothing BUT them??

@Dr_Troione, I don't think we've had any Dark City stages yet, but since they were already pretty devilite heavy to begin with, they probably just removed all the Kats and put those big butterflies in instead.

@GamerTB, have you checked what Blue Shards are used for? Most of the recipes are either basic armor with Piercing Defense or gear that doesn't have a 5* version. The only relatively good item on the list, with the possible exception of Valiance if you REALLY want it, is the Storm Driver, which is currently trumped by the Polaris.

Fri, 07/22/2011 - 13:11

#15

Prisega

Dark City Sinful Steps 1 and

Dark City Sinful Steps 1 and 2 and Plazamonium are in the new Jelly King gate. I think its the Onyx Sun gate. I was planning to check it out later today so if I find anything worth noting, like a mass invasion of Chromalisks and Wolvers, I'll let you know.

Fri, 07/22/2011 - 13:20

#16

Gigafreak

Legacy Username

From the patch notes... -

So, yeah, please let us know what you find in there.

Fri, 07/22/2011 - 13:28

#17

jooozek

Legacy Username

"So, basically, we

"So, basically, we encountered them in A. one of the most commonly seen zone types next to Decon zones, B. Zones that every player dreams of encountering MORE of, and C. the current FOTM Boss stratum. And you say they needed a "home" where we fight nothing BUT them??"
A: Uh, no? Mechanied Miles have the same chance as other themes in the Clockwork Tunnels to appear B: Obviously this is same as A, you just happen to get into a lot of them, there is arena types for each monster group - you can meet Retrodes and Scuttlebots only in the Robo Arenas C: all cool but its a Tier 2 exclusive area so yeah no, debunked

Fri, 07/22/2011 - 13:32

#18

Trias

In Dark City|Palamonium, the

In Dark City|Palamonium, the lichen were replace by kats. Seems to make sense. I was always a bit surprised by the lichen in Dark city levels.

Fri, 07/22/2011 - 13:34

#19

Eruzei

I have to admit, I think

I have to admit, I think Jellies/Beasts work better in the Jigsaw levels than robots do. That's just my opinion.

Fri, 07/22/2011 - 13:39

#20

Browniebear

Maybe the jellies are on

Maybe the jellies are on strike. Think of how tired they must be from all of the cumulative Jelly King runs we've been doing. Energy inflation probably isn't helping either. They getting squeezed from both ends.

Browniebear

Fri, 07/22/2011 - 13:41

#21

Gigafreak

Legacy Username

Yeah, it's a

Yeah, it's a "wilderness-looking" stage, so maybe the monsters ought to be the ones that live in stages that contain Primal Sparks: Beasts and Slimes.

... ... ... Then again, until now there were far more stages full of Grim and Primal Sparks than Forge Sparks. Maybe that decision was made to ease this imbalance?

Fri, 07/22/2011 - 13:52

#22

Prisega

Well they could have fixed

Well they could have fixed that quite a bit if Roarmulus gave out Forge Sparks as often as Jelly King gave out Primal Sparks. I haven't gotten any Forge Sparks from the Roarmulus Twins battle before, but instead get 2-3 random materials (Critter Carapace, what?) I have the same amount of Forge Sparks as Grim Sparks though, are you sure there was an imbalance between those two?

Fri, 07/22/2011 - 14:03

#23

Gigafreak

Legacy Username

Forge Sparks can come

Forge Sparks can come from:
Fire Stages
Shock Stages
Construct Stages
Gremlin Stages
Deconstruction Zones?

Grim Sparks can come from:
Poison Stages
Undead Stages
Fiend Stages
Scarlet Fortress
Dark City
Concrete Jungle
Graveyards

Scarlet Fortress, Dark City and Concrete Jungle might count as mere subsets of Undead, Fiend and Poison stages-- buuuuut Graveyards can appear in any stratum whereas most players tend to avoid Deconstruction Zones, tipping the scales towards Grim.

Fri, 07/22/2011 - 15:18

#24

ChaosZereul

Legacy Username

@Jooozek, ok, maybe Mech

@Jooozek, ok, maybe Mech Miles aren't as frequent as I thought, but just about any Clockwork Tunnels, Wastworks, Blast Furnaces, etc., will typically yield at least some constructs. Arenas are also very construct-heavy, just maybe not Retrode and Scuttlebot heavy. HOWEVER, considering Retrodes and Scuttlebots don't give any different loot than their other construct family members, there really isn't a need to give them a place all their own.

Constructs are very common in this game. They are in almost every zone in the game in one shape or another, and they all drop the same exact loot. They DO NOT NEED their own area. As a matter of fact, we need MORE zones like the old Jigsaw Valley, where you fought a plethora of monster types. That's what makes things interesting. I know that it would make things harder if you had to fight a group of monsters that dealt all three damage types, but it's not like having all three damage types increases their chance of hitting a smart, agile player.

Fri, 07/22/2011 - 15:29

#25

jooozek

Legacy Username

Blasted Furnace = Cooling

Blasted Furnace = Cooling Chamber = Power Complex = Wasterworks = Clockworks Tunnels
Those all are Clockwork Tunnels with some set status theme that monsters deal inside them, inside of those you can have Mechanized Miles (Construct), Haunted Passages (Undead), Infernal Passage (Fiend), Slimeway (Slime), Wild Path (Beast) and the last but not least and generally differing a little from the other Deconstruction Zones (Gremlin). This same thing applies to arenas: Beastly Brawl (Beast), Cadaverous Clash (Undead), Fiendish Fray (Fiend),Slimey Showdown (Slime), Robo Rampage & Wrench Warfare (Construct & Gremlin interchangeably).

Fri, 07/22/2011 - 18:28

#26

zeddidragon

Legacy Username

Dark City | Sinful Steps

Dark City | Sinful Steps 2
Dark City | Plazamonium

So, yeah, please let us know what you find in there.

Lichens are replaced by ghosts.

That is all.

Sat, 07/23/2011 - 01:34

#27

Fallout

Blowing the bajeebus out of

Blowing the bajeebus out of retrodes isn't as fun as aeroplane jelly.

Sat, 07/23/2011 - 10:18

#28

Grittle

I think...

this is what the retrodes are feeling before the update

http://weknowmemes.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/forever-alone-meme.png

and this was after

http://cheezburger.com/Asset/View/?ciid=962474

see the difference?

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Jigsaw Valley: All Constructs?!