This looks familiar. Wonder where I've seen this before.

I actually agree overall, as I stated in a different thread, I really enjoy this game but the energy system is a massive turnoff. Some people work with it but (as I stated elsewhere) it relies on other people that DO pay and may or may not be subject to change depending on some aspects.

I don't know much of the PvP in this game, but as for the #5: Survival is a large aspect of playing this game, giving the idea that playing well will get you more bang for your buck (or just energy, providing you aren't paying) and your shield is a huge part of that, I have little to no confidence in my armor and it's tier 4 : /. 2-handed weapons or dual wielding sounds cool but it's simply too dangerous against some enemies and situations.

I'm not hating here, but I wish more of the comments I see would be actual responses to points and opinions and not people getting annoyed that someone is insulting a game they like.

---

BTW, of course WoW's P2P style can be compared to the partial-F2P style of this. They're both MMOs that expect to get paid to be played, they just function in different ways. WoW's is more traditional and has a much larger playerbase (also is quite a bit older, so playerbase is loyal and tolerant of mistakes made) so they can still survive with P2P, Spiral Knights would have a much smaller playerbase if it was initially marketed as P2P, but as it is people are coming in and giving it a try (like I did :D). The energy system isn't perfect (nothing is, I know) and there are probably many ways it could be improved, as it is it scares people off because they don't get much time playing and they think they can't play without paying so they quickly lose interest (the Mist Tanks do help here, good move, I haven't been at that point for some time but I hope they're very obvious so the new player can know they can continue by using it).

I hope Spiral Knights continues to flourish and become greater and better, but that will be difficult if people who play it regularly pretend it has no flaws.

F2P games have two options to make money

Option One (which is the one Spiral Knights uses) is to restrict playtime, but not content. A wise player can do anything they want under this system, without paying a dime at all.

Option Two (which most other F2P games use) restricts content, but not playtime. If Spiral Knights operated under this system, F2P players would never have access to Tier 2 and 3-star gear (or less even), unless they opened their wallets.

Which would you rather have?

"I started playing Spiral Knights recently"
This is where I lost hope. Do not review it then.

"it is not new player friendly, which is a HUGE red flag when making a game."
Yes that does mean that there will be less players.
But think, the new ones split in -Quitters (probably the majority)
-CE buyers
-Patient people
You need PATIENCE here. Spiral Knights is not a game meant to be played 24/7 but meant to be enjoyed. I've been playing for over one month, it gets a lot easier after you get better gear yes. But even when I didn't, I spent most of my time sitting in Haven. And talking to people. This is meant to be part of the game. You are not supposed to be in a dungeon all the time.

"Most dungeon running so far, you will be making negative crowns if you keep buying energy."

Of course, if you go in random gates and levels. You need to know the game in order to be good at it. Again, it will get better after you get better gear, but that won't be long. As soon as you can enter Tier 2 and survive there (which depends on skill more than gear, or well, equally) you will see it is possibly not to earn negtive crowns. Also, you don't have to buy CE everyday, you know?

"Right now, players kill the Jelly King to afford to buy energy for free. Okay, cool. As Sega gets more and more players attracted to Spiral Knights, more and more players will start to do this. The in-game currency price wil rise dramatically, as they see their revenue sales drop. Which is the exact reason, I don't think this game will be a success in the long run if they don't change this system."

Not everybody does that. Everyday. Maybe once in two days. Most players do that even less. You're seriously bashing the "crowns for CE" system because for some people JK is reliable? What. Are you serious.

"1) There's almost no objective, try to put CTF in there, or some other classic PvP games. Players feel better, when they are on a team, and work as a team. My suggestion for a brand new type of PvP game that would fit Spiral Knights perfectly: 2 Big Pots on the field, you must move your pot to the other side of the field before the other team does. All the while trying not to get killed. The pot is heavy, so it requires 2 players to carry it across the field."

Some people like to do it alone. And kill others not carry pots. But they should do both something liek that, and death match. Be it with teams or not.

"3) Why the NPCs? Do we really need more things annoying us than that player that is just slightly better than us that we can't manage to kill?"

You skipped 2.
That makes the PVP tougher and harder for people that.. don't know how to play. Separates the noobs in 5* from the pros in 5* .

"4) The hearts heal 1 health? Only 1 size of heart? Lame."
Oh yeah, it would be better if everybody could heal compeltely there, pfft, the match doesn't neeed to end.

"5) Just the classic sword/shield huh? Where's the 2-handers at? Where's the dual-wielding?"
I think you got the wrong game here.

"6) Why is it so easy to kill another player? 1-3 hits? Seriously? Where's the "skill" at?"
I have to partially agree here. It would be better if it was 5-7 hits. Either everybody's weapons would get weaker, or the armors stronger.
But the skill? Avoiding getting hit while managing to hit yourself. If you've ever been in Tier 3 which you haven't, you need that there. The monsters CAN kill you with 3 hits.

Yes I am bashing your "review" (which I think is the opinion of an unexperienced player) just as you chaed the game.
Making my own, from the point of view of someone who climbed all the way from the bottom to the top.

This game is by far complete, and utter...

...perfection.

Seriously, a game where they encourage players to take time off and go do something else, OR allow them to buy Game-Currency in two ways, a free way and an easy cheesey cheap way?

Of all the MMO's I've played, from Korea, to Japan, to the United Kingdom, to France, back to America... Spiral Knights is by far the best for me. I don't need to obsess about it too much, and I can play it when I want to. MODERATION. The game is like a perfectly made steak. I can have it whenever I want, but I don't need to have too much of it. And afterwards? I feel better about myself :3

Not only that, but this game is made by Three Rings, and they have a reputation towards listening to the community and players as a whole. I've played their other games in the past (Puzzle Pirates, Whirled...) and whenever issues or moderating was involved, they solved the problems swiftly and creatively. I once accidentally forgot to cancel a subscription to one of their games. When I emailed them about it, they refunded the money back to me immediately! Now what kind of game company does that anymore? Not to mention Three Rings has a habit of making updated content and events on their games more times than I can compare to the other MMOs out there!

We've got a golden gem (yes, a gem made of gold) of a game here, and it's only going to shine the more we love it.

Never mix ingame currency with real life currency.

Fail. TONS of games do that and guess what? Their hits! 500000 people playing daily if not more. How about I review you?

Cleverness-3/10
Humor-0/10
Failing-100/10
Overall- -10/100

You broke the scale! Good job!

EVE Online's been running a very similar system to Spiral Knights with their PLEX concept for years and it's been immensely successful for them. You can most certainly mix in-game currency with real life currency, IF you do it right. Spiral Knights does it right.

Actually there is a third option, one which has been proven to make money for OOO.....

Make certain items/costume pieces cost real money....

Just look at how much money they made with the rose regalia costume pieces.

Make it so you have to buy 5* recipes with real money (you can still play the whole game with 4* items)

Honestly people who think the current system is great and all happiness and rainbows, either cannot think of anything better, or just fan boy's.

I have spent 40$ on this game, which is around the full price of many other games, but I am still limited in play time unless I want to waste a lot of CR/CE to keep going......THAT'S A FLAW

Wasting time in town, and watching the auction house like a hawk is BS, if i wanted to do that, I would still play EVE, you play this game to run dungeons, plain and simple.

The fact that you HAVE to spend a LOT of CE to get to 5* items (1450CE total) would suggest that all CE should be saved for crafting, so again, limited to 1.5 hrs a day, fine for weekdays, horrible for weekend play.

"I have spent less than you and do not feel I have been limited in play time.
The flaw seems to be people getting confused over the micro transaction model and the concept that the company must make money to stay around."

Pure conjecture, and therefore meaningless......

I have played many games with micro transactions, and honestly I thought SK was a Japanese game at first, because the way SK wants you to pay seems more along the lines of a hourly billing rate....

DDO, Runes of magic, City of heroes/villains, WoW, cosmic break all have micro transactions, but NONE OF THEM force you to play in 2 hr intervals.

Yes in DDO you will reach a point where there's only one dungeon to do over and over again, but that's besides the point.

The main point of my post was NOT to say this is how it should be, it was to say that there are more than two approaches to a micro transaction system, say all you want about the company doing what it needs to do, but all I can say is that its a cheap system...

Why in the hell could this game not be a 40-50$ one-time buy???!!!

Everything in the game is instanced, a-la guild wars, which is a ONE TIME BUY *GASP*

Right now this game seems mostly just a cash-grab

Especially considering how much time/CE is required to reach "end-game" even though there really is no objective in this game other than to beat the bosses/get cool looking gear.

Guild wars adds new content in expansion packs, if they were to group content together like that and release it as a package, I would buy it.

"A new boss with three whole distinct levels. The imminent PVP system. An auction house. A new variety of weapons."

You mean like what has been in pretty much every action RPG since the 90's? no way :O

"I would also like to note that you can experience every part of the game without paying a single dollar. You can buy CE entirely with crowns, and you can get crowns just by playing the game. Free is very fair, and very affordable."

You are left with the one point of being limited to 1.5-2 hrs a day, so you are spending 1/3 of a year of daily grinding to get enough crowns to get to 5* gear.....

The game will only remain "free" as long as people keep giving money to OOO, and the exchange rate doesn't get out of whack, I would imagine it wont take too long for 100 CE to cost 10K crowns....

that justifies being limited to 1-2 hrs a day? the fact that it is a work in progress? that doesn't make any sense......

"You know, 1.5-2 hours a day is a pretty good amount of videogame's to play in one day. After that, go read a book, go for a swim, make a snowman, kiss someone. You'll like it more than you might think."

Personal opinion, and ad hominem?

So you have run out of valid points to argue then?

"i think that's enough time playing video games hurrr durrrr, so you must be a basement dweller"

Really?

.....asshat

Yes, for attacking my personal character without even knowing me, I do believe that that designation would fit nicely.....

1.5-2 hours IS enough time to play a video game. Any more than that than it is a bit more than a hobby. I play a lot right now... too much actually, but it's only temporary until they get the building i'll be working in completely built.

Everyone has their own opinions, some people want a completely free ride when they don't understand that these people that make these games need money too. They have to get it from somewhere it doesn't just grow on trees.

The servers, the programs, equipment, office space, their personal houses, food, salaries, insurance, health insurance... some of the employees have families. They need money to survive too. They have to do what they have to do. The fact that this is a game that you can even remotely play for free is thoughtful and good of them. Shows that they CARE about the people that play their games and support their company.

If you don't like the mechanics of the game (style of game play, graphics, etc.) then fine. But do NOT knock it because you can't get a free ride through life. Get over it. Move on. Everything is not free in life and some of you people are acting like children (maybe you actually are) when it comes to this stuff. Get over it. You're lucky you can even play the entire game for free instead of them cutting you off at a certain tier and not giving you access to ANYTHING.

So turn that frown upside down. Smile a little, and be happy that you have a computer and internet to play a free game on.

-J

Stan, i wasn't specifically talking to you. I was agreeing with the above post that 1.5-2 hours is enough for free players. If you're paying, then obviously you're paying to play longer. End of story. I was not referring or talking about you. There are people in these forums that seek a completely free ride from this game and I was referring to THOSE people. Don't take it personally.

From my personal experience the first week the game opened I just used my 100 mist to buy myself 2 star armor and advance to T2. Took about 5 days. After that I was pretty much free to play as much as I wanted. If you want to play all you want, that is why they have the pay to play aspect, and you can actually play all you want if you play free, ask lots of players because that is what they do.

If you want to play all you want and you think you should be able to for free, then OOO isn't going to make any money on this game, which is clearly not their goal to set up a charity for people who don't want to pay. We could make this game subscription based. Say nothing past T1 for people who don't pay and if you pay for subscription you can do anything without needing elevator fees or energy cost. Crafting only costs crowns. Personally as a free player I would much rather this game not be subscription based. We can make the game with no energy costs for free players, but they wouldn't be able to go past T1. So run T1 to your hearts content.

Lol Fix the economy of SK? What is wrong with it?

The problem is that no end products are ever consumed, lowering the value of everything over time. The addition of the UV roller made this even worse.

I don't quite understand what you mean when you say "no end products ever consumed"? Are you referring to people that completely pay for free and having problems getting 5* equipment? Can you clear this up for me?

Thrull brings up a good point. I can't even imagine the amount of playtime I could get if I laid out $50 to start, and then bought $15 worth of CE monthly. Levels cost 10e each, and if we use a stingy estimate of 10 min per level, an hour of play is but 60 energy. What I love is how flexible things are, and that with patience, one can achieve everything the game has to offer. I have more than half a dozen pieces of 5* gear, most with good UVs, and a couple thousand CE banked as a pure F2P player.

That said, SK is indeed very unfriendly to newbies, particularly because it bills itself as more casual. Many new players won't have the MMORPG mindset, and things that are second nature to MMO players (or veteran gamers) aren't obvious to them; to compound this, it is crucial to spend your energy wisely early on in order to get to the much more entertaining T2 content. Thus, a large segment of newbies just flounder around for a week and quit. If more in-depth tutorials and help were provided, I bet SK would retain more of these people.

You don't even need the economy to play this game, except for the CE market. I log on, go do my daily run/s, craft my own items that I get from buying recipes and using my own mats. I certainly don't think the economy could be a downfall to this game. The only time the economy of this game comes into play with me is when I dump 1k of my mats on some person because I don't want them, I don't really care what they are worth.