Spiral Knights - Unbind option inside the trade window

Unbind option inside the trade window

19 replies [Last post]

Fri, 08/19/2011 - 04:57

Bekjan

I really want this feature although I don't know how hard it will be to implement.

Suppose you want to sell your 5* item that is already bound to you and you don't have enough CE to unbind( Not everyone have 4k CE on them ).
You either have to save up(it can take a lot), offer collaterals or borrow it from friends. It is really bothersome.
What I offer is just to put an unbind option.
Example: In the trade window. you put your BOUND 5* item ( only 1 bound item maybe put in 1 transaction ). The potential buyer then have to give AT LEAST 4k CE for the trade to be valid. Then after both sides press OK. The item is unbound and is in possession of the buyer and 4kCE will be used up as an unbind fee.

What do you think?

PS: Potential side effects can be, that the prices of items can drop by a lot. Since selling items will become much easier.

Fri, 08/19/2011 - 11:58

Jontlemen

Legacy Username

Sounds like a reasonable

Sounds like a reasonable concept.

Fri, 08/19/2011 - 13:35

Madadder

the purpose of the 4k CE cost

the purpose of the 4k CE cost was meant to deter players from actually using the service this idea undermines the whole concept

Fri, 08/19/2011 - 16:25

Jontlemen

Legacy Username

How so? The 4k CE still

How so? The 4k CE still needs to be payed by someone, this just helps lessen the scam-ability.

Fri, 08/19/2011 - 16:48

Madadder

the issue isnt that someone

the issue isnt that someone needs to pay its to deter people from using the service. 4k is a lot and a lot of people dont have that kind of resources on hand. they dont want to make it easy to unbind something, like it was before 5/17

Fri, 08/19/2011 - 20:03

Bekjan

Who doesn't want. To me the

Who doesn't want. To me the OOO will earn a lot more CE by enabling this feature( more CE will be used up by players ) The whole idea is not that different from original unbind idea, it just extends it and reduces scam issues.

Fri, 08/19/2011 - 20:33

Jellosjello

great idea

I like this idea. It takes away the 'trust' issue from strangers.

To people disagreeing: I'm not sure you're following his idea. The player selling the item does not get the 4k CE, the game automatically removes it.

ie: I'm selling a vog cub coat for 6k CE and it's bound to me.

We initiate a trade; I put up the bound vog cub coat into the trade while the other player puts up the 6k CE. After we finalize the trade, the seller now gains 2k CE and the buyer has spent 6k CE and receives the vog cub coat.

I think this should be implemented. Removes fears of scamming. If you do understand the concept I'm not sure why you think it's a bad idea.

Fri, 08/19/2011 - 23:36

Madadder

u guys arent getting it why

u guys arent getting it why would OOO make the price for unbinding 5* items 4k ce when its only 800 ce to craft it yourself (which is about 1400 CE 2*-5*)

they want you to spend time gathering the energy to overcome that hurdle to unbind. by the time u get that amount they would have had enough time to make the new update (ideally). this idea would make it almost the same as b4 5/17. the current pricing deters players from using it.

Sat, 08/20/2011 - 01:24

Quasirandom

Monkey, I think you're

Monkey, I think you're missing the point.

Let's suppose for the sake of example that I have a divine avenger that I don't like much and want to get rid of. I ask around for a while and find someone willing to pay 7k CE to buy it from me. So I pay the 4k CE unbind fee to unbind it. But then when I go to trade it, the buyer backs out and won't pay. I'm still out the 4k CE, and only spent it because I thought I could get 7k CE for it. A buyer getting cold feet or having a misunderstanding isn't necessarily a scam, but it's not hard to imagine someone intentionally causing trouble by offering to buy random things for 10k CE, and then backing out after the person pays the unbind fee.

Under Bekjan's proposal, I pay the 4k CE fee in the process of the trade. Thus, if I make the deal to sell the divine avenger and the other person follows through, then I get his 7k, but use 4k of it for the unbind fee, and am left with 3k CE net. That works exactly the same as it does now.

However, if the other person backs out, then because the trade never takes place, the unbinding also never takes place. I still have my original 4k CE, still have the divine avenger, and it is still bound to me. Rather than wasting 4k CE on nothing, all I've wasted is some time in trying to negotiate a deal that failed.

Sat, 08/20/2011 - 23:39

Jontlemen

Legacy Username

bumping a decent suggestion

bumping a decent suggestion over all the awful ones

Sun, 08/21/2011 - 00:16

#10

Madadder

Quzzical

lets go with your example

a crafter makes a divine avenger (lets add an UV to the mix) and under this proposal gets someone to trade off 4k CE+4k for unbinding.the a crafter now has 4k CE profit

the crafter then uses that CE to make 5 more divine avengers with either cheap UVs or none at all selling at 2kCE each + unbinding at trade

5X2K CE profit from each DA sold= 10k CE
now continue the trend...

yes, once someone gets 4k CE by themselves this could happen anyway, but just getting over that first hurdle stop a sizable portion of the player base cold.

Sun, 08/21/2011 - 11:22

#11

Bekjan

So you are saying it is bad

So you are saying it is bad for some people to make profit and for some not?
What will happen at most is, that the prices of some items will drop that is all. And as I mentioned it is just some extention of the original idea. Just changed the mechanics that is all. If devs really didn't want the unbind option, then they would have prohibited unbind option altogether, but what they did is they allowed it.

Sun, 08/21/2011 - 11:26

#12

Madadder

no what they did is allowed

no what they did is allowed it with heavy restrictions to prevent abuse

Sun, 08/21/2011 - 14:14

#13

Orangeo

My freind told me to look

My freind told me to look here, so I am. They claimed monkeyman was making a bad argument, but I just have to dissagree. (sorry I guess)
"So you are saying it is bad for some people to make profit and for some not?"
How is he saying that? His point is that the seller get's too make allot of money while draining the buyers and the intire world of CE. This is why I think unbinding is dumb as it is.

"What will happen at most is, that the prices of some items will drop that is all."
Not true. CE will slowly rise, becuase of the fact that sellers can sell bound items much faster. Normaly they would have to save up and get that CE, but they could sell it immediately to anyone who could unbind it themselves. With that quickly earned money, they can craft more products. It becomes a cycle, and CE is burnned imensely.

The best point bekjan has going for him is that we should have a more user freindly system to prevent borrowing that evolves into scamming. Beyond that though, I'm mostly on monkeymans side.

Sun, 08/21/2011 - 14:35

#14

Madadder

*sigh* yes yes i make bad

*sigh* yes yes i make bad arguments, things never change. terribly sorry if i cant articulate things in a way appropriate for the situation at hand, i guess i'm just too dumb. oh well c'est la vie

i do appreciate that someone is on my side though

Sun, 08/21/2011 - 14:40

#15

Orangeo

This being said, since

This being said, since unbinding Is in the game, it should be made user freindly in some way.

Sun, 08/21/2011 - 20:57

#16

Bekjan

Yeah, I understood your point

Yeah, I understood your point DrLequack, more people will earn more money so inflation rate will increase( prices will reach the new equilibrium point though ). At worst, devs will think of a new ways to sink crowns, so I don't find it so dramatic.
This feature also supports hard working players, since they are willing to play more, get more heat, upgrade items and sell cheaper.
I find the following situation ridiculous.
Suppose that 2 people want to trade. One has the item, the other has the CE to pay( unbind ce IS included ) . Just because the buyer can't trust the seller, the deal is off.

PS: What about putting extra fee of, say 100 ce, for this feature then. Less people would want to use it.

Sun, 08/21/2011 - 21:00

#17

Bigfootm

What Dark Ritual?

Simple problem solved.

-Price/*Seller:Buyer (All costs are in energy)
-----------------------

1* 100 S-50 B-50
2* 200 S-100 B-100
3* 600 S-300 B-300
4* 1800 S-900 B-900
5* 4000 S-2000 B-2000
---------------------------

Theory

Players split costs so in end nobody loses money. The Players split the cost, then buyer pays rest.
The seller can also give a certain item (5* Helm... Weapon... Very High USEFUL ITEM/UV... Etc.) if buyer requires all CE before hand.

Sun, 08/21/2011 - 21:04

#18

Bekjan

Lol, I think it will just

Lol, I think it will just make it more complicated. The sole purpose of the feature was to remove initial unbind cost that the seller had to gather.
Let the buyer pay all the cost, like 7k ce for the item, from which 4k ce goes to unbind automatically.

Sun, 08/21/2011 - 21:08

#19

Bigfootm

What Dark Ritual?

Well after thinking a little more, the seller could still run off with the unbound item.

+1800STEAMER

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Unbind option inside the trade window