There has been discussion elsewhere about problems with players abusing the group joining system by looping arenas. They do this because arenas in particular offer far greater drops than other levels at the same depth.
There has likewise been discussion elsewhere about problems with griefers refusing to get on an elevator because they want to wait for an arena. They do this also because arenas offer far greater drops than other levels at the same depth.
See the common thread? The underlying problem is that arenas offer rewards way out of line with other maps. Looping arenas and people refusing to get onto elevators are problems that need to be addressed. But the underlying cause is that arenas drop too much loot.
Now, I realize that there is supposed to be a risk/reward proposition here. The problem is that even if you skip the risk and end the level after two arenas, you still get far greater rewards than all but a handful of other levels in the game.
The solution is to reduce arena maps from three arenas to two by deleting the second arena. That way, if you do one arena and then bail out, you still get drops roughly in line with other levels, or perhaps a little lighter. If you do both arenas, you'd still get huge drops for the level, about in line with a clockwork tunnels+danger room, and the highest in the game if you don't count boss tokens.
So why delete the second arena? Because it's the easiest one. The third arena needs to stay, as the justification for extra drops is the extra risk. If you wanted to delete the first arena instead of the second, I'd be fine with that, too.
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Conversely, Three Rings out to beef up the rewards in some levels that don't drop much. Concrete Jungle and Deconstruction Zone maps are probably the worst offenders here. You could fix Concrete Jungle maps by perhaps adding another wave to the arenas.
Deconstruction Zone maps are more awkward to tweak, as having 2/3 of the mobs in the entire zone chasing you at once can get hairy. I'd favor tweaking the random map generator to have keys and five locks rather than three. Two extra rooms with mobs would bring the level more in line with others.
"There has been discussion elsewhere about problems with players abusing the group joining system by looping arenas. They do this because arenas in particular offer far greater drops than other levels at the same depth."
That is because the arenas are a lot more challenging that other levels - especially the last arena. its a risk-reward strategy.
"There has likewise been discussion elsewhere about problems with griefers refusing to get on an elevator because they want to wait for an arena. They do this also because arenas offer far greater drops than other levels at the same depth."
they are not griefers, they are people who play the game wishing to get a higher risk/reward. which is fair enough, if you don't to follow, then GTFO, if they dont want to follow, kick them. In all my play I have yet to have a single problem with people looping arenas, because either this is what i want to do, or if i explain that i am in a rush and would like to go onto the next level fast, they say "ok" and leave to go solo.
"See the common thread? The underlying problem is that arenas offer rewards way out of line with other maps. Looping arenas and people refusing to get onto elevators are problems that need to be addressed. But the underlying cause is that arenas drop too much loot."
Because they are much more challenging than other maps. Look at it this way - the treasure vault is the easyest map in the game, and drops little loot, The graveyard drops higher amounts of loot because it is a lot harder in comparason.
"Now, I realize that there is supposed to be a risk/reward proposition here. The problem is that even if you skip the risk and end the level after two arenas, you still get far greater rewards than all but a handful of other levels in the game."
Yes, but you have to imagine it as a scale, the harder the level the more loot your gonna get, so of course there are gonna be levels in which you get less loot or more loot.
"The solution is to reduce arena maps from three arenas to two by deleting the second arena. That way, if you do one arena and then bail out, you still get drops roughly in line with other levels, or perhaps a little lighter. If you do both arenas, you'd still get huge drops for the level, about in line with a clockwork tunnels+danger room, and the highest in the game if you don't count boss tokens. So why delete the second arena? Because it's the easiest one. The third arena needs to stay, as the justification for extra drops is the extra risk. If you wanted to delete the first arena instead of the second, I'd be fine with that, too."
No. What if you don't want to do the 3rd arena? The difficulty curve between the second and the third arena is very steep, imagine how great it would be from the first to the 3rd? change the difficulty of the level and the system becomes even easier to farm. at least this way with the 3 zones there's still a high chance of failure. if anything I reckon they should increase the difficulty of the second zone. also, you know why its the highest dropping loot wise? because its the hardest. *facepalm* the arenas are fine. can all the 12 year old girly boys please stop complaining about it, there is NO problem, and you should just DEAL WITH IT yourself by going solo, or kicking the person.
Besides in there right mind, who doesn't want more loot?. if you don't want more loot, then don't go on the gate which is full of arenas. /solution to all your little problems.