Spiral Knights - Stop misunderstanding the new Accessory System

Stop misunderstanding the new Accessory System

23 replies [Last post]

Thu, 10/06/2011 - 03:58

Zephyrgon

Recently, I have been reading a LOT of rants of how the accessories are so damn expensive, and how keys are also this way. I don't argue with you, but I want to shed some light on this matter. First and foremost, we have to identify the audience of this new System: the veteran players. Simple as that. People who have played SK for a while, who have grinded in FSC for hundreds of times, have now nothing else to do in game. My point is that OOO decided that they wanted to keep these players who think about quitting by allowing them the chance to accessorize. This means that OOO believes that by putting this system that these players would a)buy ce, since they already know the works of this game b) do some more heavy grinding. I also believe that they made the prices of acquiring keys so high because only veteran players can acquire lots of crowns through grinding, whereas newbies don't make as much. So, now you know a little bit more about the accessory system. I am only trying to shed some light in this matter, so feel free to agree or disagree with me.

I also want to point out something. If, and just if, the prices of keys went down, here's what might happen: 1) people will buy crap loads more ce
2) the price of ce will go up 3) people will complain. It's all about economics. The main argument about these keys is that its almost the price of getting a 5* item. I don't disagree with people that say this is way too high. However, I already pointed out what's going to happen if ce prices of keys went down. However, this also might happen: 1) people will buy more ce with real money 2) more ce in the market 3) prices of ce will go down. So I am totally unsure about this actually happening, but I'm just putting this idea out there.

So now, if you are a newbie and is ranting about this matter, please don't. The only input that will matter is from the people who are considered the veterans of this game.

Thu, 10/06/2011 - 04:37

Brazzyts

"First and foremost, we have

"First and foremost, we have to identify the audience of this new System: the veteran players. Simple as that."

It's not even close to as simple as that. You don't rework and entire equipment system for 20-30% of the players. The veteran players don't want cat ears, they want new levels, new stratum, new bosses. This is/should be for everybody and they made these keys a little tough to get.

"1) people will buy crap loads more ce
2) the price of ce will go up
3) people will complain. It's all about economics.
1) people will buy more ce with real money
2) more ce in the market
3) prices of ce will go down."

So which is it? Like you said, its all about economics. If you have people not able to get enough CE to spend on something they want, then there is no economy. Bring them down, If kids can get a couple accessories for their 2.50$ worth of CE they would be happier, more CE purchases, more flow of CE/Cr, more economy.

"So now, if you are a newbie and is ranting about this matter, please don't. The only input that will matter is from the people who are considered the veterans of this game."

No, no, no, a thousand times no. If your new and you don't to pay real money, and OOO puts out this awesome new update that you have little to no chance to participate in, then by all means, rant. Albeit, keep to to one thread, show your support for the change, but don't be quiet if something bothers you about the game. You're not in the minority. A lot of people agree that the keys should be cheaper (or drop in CW). And if, OP, if you ever start a business where you only listen to the input of your "veteran" customers, you will fail. This isn't a game for super elite gamers. This is a F2P MMO that everyone should be able to enjoy, and OOO put the keys out of grasp of the majority of their customers.

That my 3 cents.

Thu, 10/06/2011 - 04:52

Dirt

@Brazzyts

The veteran players don't want cat ears

Uhm, I don't know how long you've been playing or what veteran players you've been talking to... A lot of us have wanted customizable armor since LAST YEAR. Don't speak for a group that you have no right to represent. Granted new levels and bosses are great, this is something the "veteran" Knights have wanted for some time.

I think the OP is correct to an extent. It's a means to keep older players, such as myself, entertained and a good way to lure new players in with neat-looking items.

This isn't a game for super elite gamers. This is a F2P MMO that everyone should be able to enjoy, and OOO put the keys out of grasp of the majority of their customers.

If you're free then you aren't a customer.
cus·tom·er/ˈkəstəmər/
Noun:
A person or organization that buys goods or services from a store or other business.

Thu, 10/06/2011 - 04:59

Earnestevans

I'm a veteran and...

I think the price is way too high. Tier 3 runs don't really net that much profit, and excess crowns tend to be spent on additional armor sets and UVs. It would take several hours of Tier 3 to be able to afford a key on crowns alone, and most people will just spend a couple of dollars to save half a day instead. I have no doubt that the accessory system is a smart business move, but it employs too much luck and Skinner box tactics to get my approval. "Was your last key a bust? Well buy another, because your next shot could be a BIG WINNER!" It's just a dress up slot machine.

Thu, 10/06/2011 - 05:17

Brazzyts

"Uhm, I don't know how long

Yea, I know, I exaggerated a bit. My point was more that vet players want more than just that, and OP is making it out to say that this update is for vet players only, isolating and alienating free/new players.

I think the OP is correct to an extent. It's a means to keep older players, such as myself, entertained and a good way to lure new players in with neat-looking items"

Sure, but your not luring new players in when the thing that you luring them with is something that they have no chance of getting.

If you're free then you aren't a customer.
cus·tom·er/ˈkəstəmər/
Noun:
A person or organization that buys goods or services from a store or other business.

I was gonna give you a touche on this one, but If your going to make an argument, please don't make it on semantics, and if it is going to be on semantics, cite the whole definition.

cus·tom·er [kuhs-tuh-mer] Show IPA
noun
1.
a person who purchases goods or services from another; buyer; patron.
2.
Informal . a person one has to deal with: a tough customer; a cool customer.

Thu, 10/06/2011 - 05:38

Redmania

The entitlement generation

There are honestly so many people whining and crying about this update and most of these people are kids from the entitlement generation. The concept of earning your laurels is alien to these people. Even when playing a FREE TO PLAY game, people are somehow "entitled" to everything.

Be happy that SK is one of the few games where you can experience the ENTIRE game FREE.
You will get your accessories if you work for them, not buy crying and moaning.
And Brazzyts, Dirt is right. You are not a customer. Neither am I actually, so I have no right to complain either.

Thanks OOO for an awesome update!

Thu, 10/06/2011 - 05:55

Flash-Bang

I've only been playing a few

I've only been playing a few months, and I'm a free player at that. I think the accessory system is a good idea, as it allows you to customize. I do feel the price on keys is a bit much, and for that I just won't buy them. I won't accessorize. It's no big deal. It's not a game breaker for me. I can't see myself ever getting to the point of having enough left over CE to buy a key at this price either with all the different gear I'd like to get first.

I don't see how it could hurt to have keys as a prize from the wheel, at a much more rare chance than boxes, of course (like 10x harder to get a key than a box). Even a little nugget like that could make people happy, since theoretically they have a chance for a key, albeit a very small one.

But however OOO does it, I won't complain since after all I am a free player so far.

Thu, 10/06/2011 - 06:28

Brazzyts

And Brazzyts, Dirt is right.

And Brazzyts, Dirt is right. You are not a customer.

You saying the definition I pulled from Dictionary.com is wrong? Guess you should message them about that one...

And I think the prices for the keys are a little high, that's all, just a wee bit. (I'm thinking 400-500 would be more appropriate) .But my one way to combat this it make them rare drops in the CW or on the prize wheel. Give me one reason why that would hurt anything and i'll take it all back.

Thu, 10/06/2011 - 06:28

Richy

What Redmania said.

Thu, 10/06/2011 - 06:37

Khamsin

2.50$ isn't worth one little

2.50$ isn't worth one little piece of flair in my opinion. In Mass Effect 2, I could spend 2$ and get unique costumes for multiple characters that were completely bad ass.

I would spend my CE on flair if it was cheaper. It is just price theory, they believe that at the price they're selling them they can get more profit based on units sold * price per unit. Considering that most of the cost is in overhead and almost none of the cost is on a per unit basis, it seems to me that moving as many units as possible would be most profitable, but I suppose their analysts have something different to say.

I won't buy them and that's all I have to say about that. I don't feel entitled to receive them because I'm not paying for them. People who think they deserve flair ought to pull their heads out of their rears.

Thu, 10/06/2011 - 07:27

#10

No-Thanks

Zelda

"I've only been playing a few months, and I'm a free player at that. I think the accessory system is a good idea, as it allows you to customize. I do feel the price on keys is a bit much, and for that I just won't buy them. I won't accessorize. It's no big deal. It's not a game breaker for me. I can't see myself ever getting to the point of having enough left over CE to buy a key at this price either with all the different gear I'd like to get first.

But however OOO does it, I won't complain since after all I am a free player so far."

#6, #6, #6!

why dusnt every1 think like that

Thu, 10/06/2011 - 07:41

#11

Volebamus

I never understand how not

I never understand how not being able to access visual-only items for a cheap price is always a complaint whenever these type of updates come about.

Regalia, Bomb-Heads, Regalia again, then accessories. These type of things aren't even intended to be used by the majority of players.

This is like complaining that after you make a Vog Cub set, that you're entitled to not have to spend the same amount of CE for a Skolver set if all you're using it for is as a costume.

Thu, 10/06/2011 - 08:58

#12

Lepreal

Read Dirt's post. I WANT

Read Dirt's post.

I WANT THOSE EARS.

Then again, I still want THE SNIPE HAT.

OOO, THANK YOU!

Thu, 10/06/2011 - 09:16

#13

Realnight

Yeah the price isn't really

Yeah the price isn't really an issue - because it's more like a 4* item cost (if you include 2* 3* 4* crafting). What I find is an issue is that you have no way of knowing what your paying for before hand.

Thu, 10/06/2011 - 10:42

#14

Tanbon

I thought this thread would

I thought this thread would be about this. My bad.

Is 2.50 USD a little too much for an accessory you won't even know what's inside? Perhaps, I don't know. I think we should put this into perspective, and compare this with other F2P games.

I don't mind the addition of vanity items. Yeah, maybe cat ears aren't the most mature thing a cosmonaut stranded on an alien planet can wear, but they're cat ears, man.

Thu, 10/06/2011 - 10:45

#15

Halifix

Considering you don't even

Considering you don't even have to pay cash to buy these items, when other games make you shell out $20 for a costume set, AND if you don't get something you like, the accessory can be resold for a reasonable price... I don't see what the problem is.

Thu, 10/06/2011 - 10:47

#16

Debianlinux

TF2 Model

SK:

Silver Key = 750 CE.
750 CE = very close to $2.00

Key opens freely dropped lockboxes that yield a random item that may be the exact same thing you got the last 10 times.

TF2:

Crate Key = 2.49

Key opens freely dropped crates that yield a random item that may be the exact same thing you got the last 10 times.

SK is doing the same thing TF2 for cheaper. Boohoo.

Thu, 10/06/2011 - 10:57

#17

Brazzyts

SK: Silver Key = 750 CE. 750

SK:

Silver Key = 750 CE.
750 CE = very close to $2.00

Key opens freely dropped lockboxes that yield a random item that may be the exact same thing you got the last 10 times.

TF2:

Crate Key = 2.49

Key opens freely dropped crates that yield a random item that may be the exact same thing you got the last 10 times.

SK is doing the same thing TF2 for cheaper. Boohoo.

The difference here is that there is a chance to get what is in the TF2 crates without ever opening a crate. I've gotten guns, hats, swords, just by playing the game. Forcing you to spend the equivalent of 2.50 in energy to maybe, possibly get something that you will like out of hundreds of items it a little much.

Thu, 10/06/2011 - 11:31

#18

Thoranhippo

750CE=2$? Wow, in Euro with

750CE=2$?
Wow, in Euro with mobile phone transaction, it costs 3€ for not even 600CE, and 3€=4$. Sounds like the rate at which I pay my CE is quite a scam.

Thu, 10/06/2011 - 11:36

#19

Nievem

also you have more slots than

also you have more slots than in tf2 right? or do hats have multiple effect slots?

Thu, 10/06/2011 - 11:41

#20

Knightydood

"The difference here is that

"The difference here is that there is a chance to get what is in the TF2 crates without ever opening a crate. I've gotten guns, hats, swords, just by playing the game. Forcing you to spend the equivalent of 2.50 in energy to maybe, possibly get something that you will like out of hundreds of items it a little much."

@Brazzyts: You're a little bit off with this point. People don't open crates to get the same boring weapons that drop in the game. They open crates to get unusual hats, or barring that, hats. The fact that you're "maybe, possibly" getting something you like from an Ironbox is a lot different than spending $2.50 to get a useless weapon that could easily drop anyway.

SK keys are far superior to TF2 keys for two crucial reasons. 1. You can get the keys through playing the game, instead of being forced to buy them with real money. 2. You will always get an accessory by opening a box, instead of having overwhelming odds of getting junk from a TF2 crate.

Thu, 10/06/2011 - 14:40

#21

Cryoworld

Man, I love this.

The thing is, all the crates ever give are accessories. They don't give unique weapons, armor, or helmets, so your not missing on anything really useful, just a bunch of admittedly useless cosmetic items.

The nice thing about it all is that you can simply sell the lockboxes for a nice profit. You don't have to actually get any of these things, as they DON'T DO ANYTHING.

Then again, I'm the sort of fellow that cares more about usability than looks. So it simply doesn't affect me.

Or at least until I can actually see what I can get. Then there might be a reason to get something.

Oh, and it's often just better to do T2 JK runs, because for most people, T3 runs are out of their league, unless it's with a group. JK runs often net about 5k+ cr per run, which is quite nice when you have something to do in real life. I mean, this is a causual game, so it's not like you have to play it 24/7.

Silly elite gamers making every game into some hardcore journey and that any change to the original is OMG horrible. :3

Thu, 10/06/2011 - 14:44

#22

Eltia

I think the system is fine

In fact, I think O3 did the right thing to separate aesthetic from functions of equipment.

Consider this alternative. O3 will introduce more 5* equipment with aesthetic appeals that have similar or redundant functions of existing equipment. People would then complain about 1. redundancy; 2. lack of incentives to get new equipment; 3. people will complain, saying that "if I knew O3 will introduce such and such new, cuter equipment, I wouldn't spent CE crafting certain old, mediocre looking 5* equipment with the same functions..."

The strength of the current system is that it allows flexibility in customization your existing equipment *if* you choose to make them more pretty. So if you don't really care about the aesthetic factor, just stick with the existing equipment and focus on the functionality that you want. The weakness of the existing system is that you end up spending more resources on equipment *if* you choose to make them more pretty.

What we still need is a way to preview the accessories, so that people know what they are buying into. This way when people set their eyes on a certain combination of accessory and equipment, they can be assured that the resources they spent are getting what they wanted. (What you pay for is what you get.)

The silver key cost may need some adjustment but I think it's too early to say. I say revise the 700 CE cost in a month.

Thu, 10/06/2011 - 16:49

#23

Five-Hundred

-.-

1. You don't accessorize every piece of armor.
2. Accessories should only be used on armor costume, as that's the part you see
3. If you can't afford keys, you probably don't have a armor costume that you want

explained
1. You shouldn't be putting accessories on armor that you are trying out, or not sure you want to keep
2. You can only see your costume. No reason to put it on your non costume armor unless you are rich enough to show off in pvp (very low priority if that is your wish)
3. If you are like most people you want a costume that is 5 stars, looks good, shows that you are cool, and fits your tastes. This could take a while to pick out as you don't have all armors available to you at all time. Once you are rich enough to even thini about keys you probably had enough time to KNOW what you want your costume to be. This way you can use your hard earned money on accessories you KNOW you want.

New players have it the hardest. This game has a horrible end game. All RPG's have horrible end game. Most games add quests, additional skills, collectibles, other stuff that really doesn't add to the game at all, but just gives the players something to do. This game only has 2 goals. Level up 1 stat per item, and get more items. This is just adding to the get more items part of the game. The leveling up is where the fun is had, this is just filler to give everyone something else to do, nothing int he game has changed because of this, get over it

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Stop misunderstanding the new Accessory System