Spiral Knights - Plague needle or Blitz needle?

Plague needle or Blitz needle?

7 replies [Last post]

Mon, 10/17/2011 - 04:54

#1651

Bopp

many threads on this

Please search the forums. There have been many threads on this. In a party, the poison definitely helps. When solo, it helps less, so pure damage may be preferable.

You cannot trust the statistic bars in comparing weapon damage or speed.

Mon, 10/17/2011 - 19:39

#1652

Sparkplug

Blitz Needle - by far.

Just edited the wiki to put in the stratum 6 damage for both guns on Undead which are neutral to pierce (slag walkers for Vanaduke levels 23 and 28). Blitz Needle does more damage. I did not include the poisoned numbers in the wiki, but after poisoning the Plague needle does not reach the unpoisoned numbers of Blitz. Fully heated, no UVs for both.

Plague Needle @d23 vs undead (per shot):
uncharged: 41 before poisoning, 44 after
charged: 72 before poisoning, 81 after

Blitz Needle @23 vs undead (per shot):
uncharged: 57 per shot
charged: 115

Blitz Needle @23 vs undead AFTER poisoning zombie by Plague Needle (per shot):
uncharged: 62 per shot
charged: 137

So if you have a group of with one of each gun AND the mob is poisoned AND if both users fire simultaneously:
44 + 62 = 106 uncharged
81 + 137 = 218 charged

Two Blitz no poison:
57 * 2 = 114 uncharged
115 * 2 = 230 charged

With 3 users the uncharged the 1 Plague + 2 Blitz + Poisoned targets comes in 3 points less than 3 Blitz users (168 vs 171).

HOWEVER: Charged 1 Plague + 2 Blitz + Poisoned Target = 355; charged 3 * Blitz = 345. Poisoned Target wins by 10 charged per shot (@depth 23). Only if you keep the poison up on the target (if you are charge firing constantly you can).

For a main gun: Blitz; especially if you solo. For a 3rd Needle gun on Vanaduke: Plague Needle... maybe. Since I was the only gunner with Blitz and Plague Needle in the group I stuck with Blitz for my fight.

Vanaduke actually takes more damage Needle guns than the Zombies. Charged Blitz Needle does 143 per shot on Vanaduke, 121 on Vanaduke's Zombies (@d28 in other words).

Mon, 10/17/2011 - 19:41

#1653

Sparkplug

All numbers are per bullet

All numbers are per bullet. Multiply by 6 for uncharged shooting, by 15 for charged shooting.

Tue, 10/18/2011 - 04:16

#1654

Abathur

Not again D: -> Blitz Needle

Not again D: -> Blitz Needle by far ...

Sun, 10/23/2011 - 02:18

#1655

Memento

Many thanks

Thanks everyone for your opinions. Expecially Sparkplug fo the damage table. The damage handicap is a really considerable con.
I've been goin down the Plague needle route until now, and party-wise, is awesome.
As a gunner I like being supportive to my sword friends on the frontline, and the % of poisoning of the PN is a good pro.

I'll eventually get a BN too and try it out. Thanks again for the hints.

Sun, 10/23/2011 - 14:38

#1656

Icee

Kill them with healing

Don't forget that poisoned targets are hurt when "healed" and do about 50% less damage if they hit you. That makes poison hugely helpful in arenas, deconstruction zones, and other places where you're likely to encounter several enemies plus menders or silkwings. In those places, plague needle will be noticeably better. Elsewhere, either gun will probably be acceptable, with the poison being more useful in larger groups and the extra damage better for soloing as others have already said.

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 02:04

#1657

Pawn

IMO

Blitz needle is far better for overall, and for solo'ing/duo'ing.

THe plague needle truly hits it's stride in parties of 3 or 4, when you have 3 or 4 people available to take adv of enemies weakened defenses.
Another note: blitz is still prolly better vs everything but bosses (and then only JK and Vana)...and who uses guns on JK.

So Blitz is better is the simple answer. More complex answer is NO ONE is gonna complain about you keeping vana poisoned the whole fight!!!!!!!! (IMO better vs vana in party of 4--maybe 3).

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Plague needle or Blitz needle?