So OOO, how has the data collection on Shadow Keys gone? Is your game mechanic operating as intended?
And by intended I mean this:
http://forums.spiralknights.com/en/node/30972
So that we can do this:
http://forums.spiralknights.com/en/node/30989
Pretty awesome.
I will play the lairs either when the market dies, OOO changes the mechanic, or I get invited to one.
So I predict around June.
As someone who has quite a bit of disposable income on Spiral Knights, I am not interested in buying the gear. I was probably one of the only people who hated when they introduced unbinding. If you have the money to spend that much on those stupid items then why not spend it on actually obtaining it yourself?
Because thats hard work, and we can't be bothered with such non-sense like playing the game. :P
i don't get it, all i see are some people taking advantage of the current bubble
and one trying to be funny, with mixed results
@Dirt I don't mind unbinding as much. Tax the rich, why not. I can still get the good stuff the "real" way.
The shadow keys? No. I'm not even going if someone invites me; I'm not gonna risk having a bad run and ruining the team's chances given the price keys are going for. If the keys could be recharged, like how I proposed in my suggestion thread? Yeah, I'd do it then. Hell, I'd even buy a set of keys then.
I really hope OOO fixes this soon so we can all put this mess behind us.
I was just thinking about their "collecting of data" well at least we have another reason why the opinions of such top payers matter more than the average player who has wanted decent endgame content for more than half a year.
I hope they don't change the shadow keys system, it is funny seeing everyone get their panties in a huge bunch.
I wanna know how many of the 'end game' players that this content was aimed at have to quit the game in disgust at the blatant gambling that we are expected to participate in to even gain access to it 'once', before OOO takes notice...oh that's right none. Because a happy paying community is less important than exploiting addiction in kids for $$$...
Not only has the whole wheel/keys/lockbox made this game into a giant casino dressed up in cutesy graphics, unlike regular online gambling we aren't even told the odds of winning...
Drop rate of keys, unknown
Drop rate of sought after accessories, unknown
All accessories even released into game, unknown and unannounced
The last one in particular is pretty shameful - there are people opening lockboxes trying to find auras, wings & halos and we aren't even certain that they exist! This is like selling scratch cards without printing a jackpot winning one, very shady.
You can argue that you don't have to gamble, you can just buy the keys/armours from other players, but someone, at some point is gambling so that argument is irrelevant - OOO is still exploiting people's (mostly teenagers too I bet) addiction, and that is just sick in what advertises itself as a cute f2p game.
I am deeply saddened by the lack of response by devs at this community outcry - I love this game, I have invested $$$ in this game in the past, and now all I see is greed by sega/OOO resulting in many good, paying players, several from my guild, several who contributed many videos etc to the commuity - now leaving the game. This can't be good for business no matter how you try and argue it.
Funnily enough a similar thing happened in eve online (a game i quit this year after 3 years of play) when devs didn't listen to the community and introduced vanity items/forced unwelcome mechanics into the game - the CEO of CCP recently publicly apologised for those actions and admitted they were wrong...
Disappointed.
/end rant
Some people are really out of tune with Capitalism.
I understand capitalism perfectly, although i am pretty sure that capitolism for all its flaws and questionable moral directives does not encourage or condone the exploitation of addiction. Regardless, as a member of a capitalist society I will vote with the only thing that counts - my wallet.
Do I expect OOO to change anything? No. But they won't get a penny more from me.
If I somehow obtain a key without having to pay $$$ for it then I will probably run the content, and I will make damn sure I profit from it like a good little capitalist monkey...
Here's the thing though, regarding your rant.
You just said you're more than willing to play in the content to profit off of it as much as possible if there's a way for you to play the content without having to pay at all. Seeing as how the keys can only be obtained one of two ways - either through a random giveaway (gambling for free) or through a lockbox (gambling with in-game currency), someone still gambled for that key. By playing the content, aren't you in turn reinforcing OOO's philosophy that the gamble is worth it?
Yes, in a purely capitalist society, voting with your wallet is the main way of getting your point across. However, Spiral Knights is not a purely capitalist society. While it's influenced by the market and sale rates of items, there's no way you can assert that playing the content without paying maintains your level of disapproval for the entire process. If anything, you're saying the ends in fact justify the means since you're trying to find an alternative way to play the content, even if it means you (or someone in your party) reinforces the gambling spirit of the keys by paying for some portion of it.
You can dress it up how you want and call OOO "sick" for "exploiting the gambling nature of teenagers and young adults", but in the grand scheme of things, no one can really point their fingers at OOO without blaming the community for not only buying into it, but reinforcing the gambling idea by buying into it repeatedly, either through using their own CE for lockboxes or buying Shadow Keys off of those unwilling to play the content themselves.
tl;dr - the winning move here isn't to not buy CE, but rather it's not to play at all. The moment people realize that is the moment their opinion will actually matter.
"encourage or condone the exploitation of addiction. "
Yes it does. Heck yes it does. Capitalism is feeding off the addiction of others. It is all about profiting of things that people believe they cannot have without. I hate what capitalism does to otherwise good people, but sometimes you just have to play the game.
"tl;dr - the winning move here isn't to not buy CE, but rather it's not to play at all. The moment people realize that is the moment their opinion will actually matter."
Indeed. Sadly, after playing the content repeatedly now... the gamble is worth it.
Oh, I'm sure it is worth it, and I'd eventually even like to go on a run myself. I was just stating that for everyone still complaining about the keys and the method of obtaining them, that was their only -actual- option if they were serious about it.
Up until now I have contented myself with playing the other content and hoping that OOO would realise thier mistake and change the method of obtaining the keys which would allow me to play the new content.
If I accept that OOO will not change anything, and if I feel strongly about the exploitation of people's addiction then realistically I will never be able to play it withou doing what everyone else is doing and buying in to the system and validating OOO's business model, something which I really don't feel comfortable doing.
Seems the only way to maintain the moral high ground and make a real statement is to follow the example of my guildmates quit the game completely. You are quite correct. Not that me quitting will make any difference other than making me feel better.
Thanks.
/ I quit, gonna go play bf3 instead.
My intent wasn't to make you quit, but I suppose you'll do what you feel you need to either way. If everyone were to follow that mindset instead of just saying one thing and then doing another, I'm sure a lot more progress would've been made.
Anyway, lemme know how BF3 is, I'm considering getting it for my birthday in a few weeks.
Are you guys crazy? I love the Shadow Keys! They are so awesome! Why I can't find a better way to spend $60 rolling on lockboxes with a 3% chance to get the item I want! We need more systems like this! I have an idea for ULTIMATE LAIRS.
How about the shadow key, in addition to giving access to shadow lairs, helps unlocks a shadow lockbox that only drops from a mob that has a 5% chance to appear when fighting vanaduke. In this lockbox, there is a ticket in which you can use to give to a lottery wheel. In this lottery wheel, there is a 5% chance to get 3 different coins (red, blue, white) which we can deposit in a lottery box to get prizes. Each of these boxes of the corresponding colour have a 5% chance to get a key part of the corresponding colour. We then have to get the 3 parts of the key (red, blue, white), giving us an ULTIMATE KEY, which will allow a one time access to ONE floor of the four floors of the ULTIMATE LAIR. The boss on the 4th floor has an ability that increases the CE revive cost by 50 every 5 seconds it is alive. As incentive, there will be a crafting machine allowing us to craft re-skinned version of our current gear and has a 50% chance to malfunction and not give you anything in return for your crafting costs. After leaving Sanctuary, there is a 50% that the elevator that will bring you back to Haven malfunctions and you need to "energize" the elevator using energy, otherwise you will be stuck in Sanctuary, even if you log off or quit. It only makes sense right?
Does anyone else like this idea? I think it is in a similar line of thinking of our current shadow keys.
The thing that's a real kick in pants is that the current system doesn't reward players who have been loyal and persistent on SK, a max lvl *5 player who has been playing SK since the day it entered beta could dig through 40 lockboxes and still not get a key, while some guy who started yesterday could open a single box and get lucky on his first try.
There would be a lot less anger towards this if their was an alternate way that rewarded time spent playing instead of just blind luck or a bottomless wallet.
They really should have implemented a 'tokens for keys' system at least for silver keys IMO. The beauty of the token system is that it rewards players who spend time and effort in SK with the eventual guarantee of 'free' stuff, while players who want their stuff 'now' could pay for the crowns to buy it.
If a player wants a pulsar they could just sell CE to get enough crowns to buy it on the AH, or they could work their way up to 3*+ gear, beat the crap out of the Twins 7-8 times and be rewarded with a pulsar for their efforts, probably spending money on CE at some point in between. The fact that OOO neglected to add such a system for keys is really short-sighted on their part IMO.
For that matter, who would support a move to make Silver Keys a token item also? Doing so would still mean Shadow Keys would remain a rare and very valuable item, but it would mean that even F2P players would have a chance every so often to get one by using tokens to get a silver key. It might take them a lot longer to find a key then someone who pays for a dozen silver keys, but he would still have a shot to eventually get a key provided he keeps playing the game.
@RedMania, No. Just no.
What about this; You just let the game handle the situation, either enjoy the content they have to offer, or go play some other game.
You must not have come equipped with the T-11 standard internet sarcasm detector upgrade, huh?
thats cold......