Spiral Knights - PvP upgrades o-O

PvP upgrades o-O

7 replies [Last post]

Tue, 11/01/2011 - 05:43

Zinqf

- An optional setting is enabled to show health bars of bosses, at the moment the bar will not show numbers.

There have been several changes regarding Player vs Player combat in Spiral Knights

- Spiral Trophies
- A new currency is added to the cache of King Krogmo, The Spiral Trophies!
- This new currency can only be obtained by Winning a Guild PvP match with a Trophy Booster active or the New Bribery Methods in Guild PvP matches.
- Spiral Trophies are used to buy strong PvP centric items which start out at One Star (Armor/Weapons) or Three Star (Trinkets) and have Five Star Versions.
- Special Items which apply PvP centric Unique Variants to items are also purchasable with a combination of Krogmo Coins and this Currency. Adding a Unique Variant will erase any others you have on the item already! A confirmation box will remind you before making your decision.

- Prize Rewards
- The base reward of a match has changed. Wins now give 2 base Krogmo Coins; Losses give 0 base Krogmo Coins.
- There are now two meters in the pregame room for Krogmo to offer additional prizes. The first is "Convince Krogmo" this meter only needs 12 Community CE and offers a small additional prize. "Bribe Krogmo" is available after filling the previous bar although this requires an additional 25 total CE from participating players.
- The first bar prizes are "+1 coin for everyone, +2 coins for everyone, +1 coin for the winner, +2 coins for the winner"
- The second bar prizes are added to the first bar and include "Double winnings, A rare chance at a bombhead mask (Blast Network) or a rare chance at a lockdown class mask (Lockdown)"
- Costume helmets available through bribing Krogmo will now only appear in the respective game. (Ex. Bombhead Masks only appear in Blast Network)

- PvP Boosters
- Krogmo Coin Booster effects no longer last for 24 hours but instead last for 30 games.
- A new Coin Booster has been added: The Trophy Booster.
- The Trophy Booster increases the amount of Spiral Trophies earned in a Guild PvP Match Win by 1. Losses are not boosted.
- The Trophy Booster cannot stack and is active for 20 Guild PvP Matches (Win or Loss)
- There is a new Double Bribery Bar in Guild PvP matches. One 60 CE bar for each team. The first side to fill it (if any side does) will have an additional prize only available to them. The prizes are "1 Trophy for Winning", "2 Trophies for Winning", or a rare chance at an Accessory only obtainable through this process.

- New Items from Krogmo's Cache
- 3 Different Chest Armors, 3 Different Helms, 3 Weapons and 6 Trinkets have been added and placed on another vendor near the original vendor.
- 6 New PvP Centric Unique Variants have been added, these items allow you to add a Unique Variant on an item at the cost of removing any Unique Variants already on the item. Each of these will cost 10 Spiral Trophies and 50 Krogmo Coins.
- Trophy Boosters are purchasable using 400 CE or 200 Krogmo Coins.
- A material called the "Calibrator Mod" will be available, these items are required in the upgrade recipes. Be sure not to confuse this with the "Mod Calibrator".
- Chest Armors and Helms start at 10 Spiral Trophies, Weapons start at 15 Spiral Trophies, and Trinkets start at 20 Spiral Trophies.
- Items bought this way are 1 star items (Tier 1 PvP Matches), and these can be upgraded with recipes buyable from the vendor.
- Trinkets Start at 3 star items and can be upgraded the same way as other krogmo trinkets are activated. The 4 star version will require the 3 star trinket.
- The scale (Krogmo Coins / Spiral Trophies) for upgrades to 2*-5* recipes are as follows.
- Chest/Helm - 2* (20/3), 3* (40/4), 4* (60/5), 5* (80/8)
- Weapons - 2* (30/4), 3* (50/8), 4* (80/12), 5* (120/16)

- PvP Unique Variants
- New Unique Variants only available through the use of Krogmo Coins and Spiral Trophies will be available. The following can still work outside of PvP and "Knights" only include other players.
- The Following Unique Variants are all Medium.
- Reduced Damage Taken From Knights (Helm / Chestpiece)
- Increased Movement Speed (Helm / Chestpiece)
- Increased Capture Speed (Helm / Chestpiece)
- Decreased Class Bar Charge Time (Helm / Chestpiece)
- Chance to Inflict Strong Frost on Knights (Sword or Gun) - Only affects that item
- Chance to Inflict Strong Fire on Knights (Bomb) - Only affects that bomb

- New Trinket Effects
- 6 New Trinkets have been added. The effects are low for the 3* trinket, the 4* trinket has a bonus of additional damage to knights low with the low effect, and the 5* trinket has a medium effect to go with the low additional damage to knights.
- Iron Will: Reduced Damage Taken From Knights
- Spiral Cutter: Increased Damage to Knights (This makes 3* Low, 4* Medium, and 5* High)
- Quantum Cube: Increased Movement Speed
- Orb of Domination: Increased Capture Speed
- Icon of Mastery: Decreased Class Bar Charge Time
- Banner of Reinforcement: Decreased Respawn Timer

- New Tracking System
- Leaderboards now show the Wins and Losses of players and guilds on the leaderboard, these values are reset when rank points reset.
- Healing Done, and "Favorite Weapon" are now tracked in the Lockdown Scoreboard.
- An optional setting will allow you to see colors at a knight's feet giving you an idea of their health levels. The colors will be similar of a shield when it is weakened.

- Balance Fixes

- Striker
- Striker Health is now +3, instead of -3.
- The Class Shield now has: Increased Damage to Knights: Medium and no longer has other damage modifications.
- The Class Shield no longer has a penalty on the Charged Time Reduction of Bombs.
- The Striker Booster has 25% less duration.
- The Striker Booster particle effect has been modified similiar to the glow from a charged weapon.

- Recon
- The Class Shield now has: Increased Capture Speed: Medium
- Recon Stealth bar duration has been reduced by 40%.
- Being hit while invisible reduces the duration of the effect by 25% of its' remaining amount instead of 100%.
- The Skull effect no longer removes all defenses.
- The Skull effect now cuts defenses in half and reduces the victim's damage dealt by half.

- Guardian
- The class shield now has: Reduced Damage From Knights: Medium
- The class bar regenerates 200% slower once the bar begins restoring itself.
- While the guardian's shield is "Broken", the knight will lose the damage reduction on their class shield and will have a "Broken Shield" icon over their head until the shield starts regenerating again.
- Base Healing Increased by 100% (One bar instead of One-Half).

- General Fixes
- Weapons no longer benefit from the effects of Autoaim when used in Lockdown. (This does not toggle the option on or off).
- Duration of harmful status effects are capped at 5 seconds on Knights in Lockdown. Curse does not follow this rule.
- Weaknesses and Resistances to status effects can increase or decrease the base duration of a status effect.
- The Fire Status Effect will do 200% increased damage in Lockdown.
- The Stun Status Effect lasts 100% longer (is still capped at 5 seconds in Lockdown).
- Movement in Blast Network now corrects your characters' position to the center of the closest square when not moving for 0.2 seconds.
- Respawn timers in Blast Network and Lockdown now have a fixed respawn timer of 10 seconds.

Tue, 11/01/2011 - 06:23

Starlinvf

1. The PUG PvP community is

1. The PUG PvP community is gonna be livid over the trophies.
2. I'm little leery on the Striker's HP bonus, even in relation to the other changes. With players heavily favoring Swd ASI trinkets, it may not make much a of a difference in that respect.
3. The 2nd & 3rd changes on the Guardian heavily nerf them without a shield capacity boost or a slight def increase. The ability defines the entire class, and the shield isn't that durable to being with. Ear marking them when they have no defenses is insult to injury.
3b. Alternatively, what if the personal defense shield took additional damage when hit, and the recharge rate reduced by 25%. I'm assuming its to stop 2 Guardians from tanking a point.

actually.... doesn't 200% slower mean its negative?

Tue, 11/01/2011 - 08:58

Knight-Solaire

I more or less liked these

I more or less liked these suggestions until I saw that you wanted to buff Striker and nerf Recon and Guardian. With Striker being the most-played class, shouldn't it go the other way around?

Striker gets +3 health as oppposed to -3 (adding 6 bars to what Striker has now):
The idea behind the Striker class is that you trade defense for offense. You lose health but move and attack faster. By giving additional health instead of taking it there's nothing to balance the increased attacking ability.

Recon gets 40% less stealth:
Cloaking is the lifeblood of the Recon class. It's really just enough to go point to point as it is, given that you usually have to take the long way around the main battlefield. In a different game mode I might agree, but for LD it should stay where it is.

Guardian shield regen is 200% slower (I take this to mean 1/2 the current rate?):
This one's a tough call, but I'm gonna have to say no. As a mainly Guardian player, I can say the down time is plenty enough. You have to keep in mind that the Guardian's shield isn't just for one knight, but an entire team. Once the shield is down, you more or less leave your teammates hanging out to dry until it regens; markign a shield-broken knight would be about like puttting a dunce cap on him and saying "hey, this guy can't help his team".

Dont get me wrong, there are ideas of yours I do like. The changes to the recon mark would counter Strikers well, and the removal of autoaim and capping status time sound wonderful.

Tue, 11/01/2011 - 09:21

Kentard

Quite a few problems, but love some ideas.

Generally I'm fine, save for a few things. Won't repeat what has already been said:

- Iron Will: Reduced Damage Taken From Knights
- Spiral Cutter: Increased Damage to Knights (This makes 3* Low, 4* Medium, and 5* High)
These trinkets don't have much use given that we already have defense trinkets and damage bonus/ASI trinkets.
I'm also not too open to the idea of trinkets used only for Lockdown; maybe class bonuses as you proposed would be more favorable.

The base reward of a match has changed. Wins now give 2 base Krogmo Coins; Losses give 0 base Krogmo Coins.
Hmm, even with your system of Convincing Krogmo it might only benefit the Winning Team. Giving 0 base coins just disincentivizes bad players to get better so as to get more coins.
Though, if you are adamant on staying with 0 base coins, may I suggest a system where coins are rewarded based on player performance for the losing team? Say, the top capturer, defender or damager?

- A material called the "Calibrator Mod" will be available, these items are required in the upgrade recipes. Be sure not to confuse this with the "Mod Calibrator".
I see what you did there. ;) Witty.

Weapons no longer benefit from the effects of Autoaim when used in Lockdown. (This does not toggle the option on or off).
Definitely would make the Flourish much more useless. And probably compensates for Piercing dealing more damage to Knights too... catch is it would make Strikers pretty useless as well having to rely on the other fast weapons.

- Duration of harmful status effects are capped at 5 seconds on Knights in Lockdown. Curse does not follow this rule.
That's effectively nerfing the elemental Bombers in-game.

- The Fire Status Effect will do 200% increased damage in Lockdown.
Fire's painful enough as it is, from my experience. And otherwise we'd have loads of Pepperbox/Combuster guys running around.

- The Stun Status Effect lasts 100% longer (is still capped at 5 seconds in Lockdown).
At the moment, the current duration is sufficient to turn anyone into a sitting duck for an experienced Striker.

- Respawn timers in Blast Network and Lockdown now have a fixed respawn timer of 10 seconds.
For Guardians and Recons, probably. Strikers respawning too fast probably isn't a good thing though.

Wed, 11/02/2011 - 00:50

Zinqf

Back from work xD

@ Starlinvf Your Quote "3. The 2nd & 3rd changes on the Guardian heavily nerf them without a shield capacity boost or a slight def increase."

You didn't read - The class shield now has: Reduced Damage From Knights: Medium

Keep in mind the ability "Reduced Damage From Knights: Medium" reduces ALL damage taken from players by 14%. (Each UV level is 7% effectiveness). Taking reduced damage means that knights deal less damage to your shield, creating AMAZING synergy.

Your Quote "3b. Alternatively, what if the personal defense shield took additional damage when hit, and the recharge rate reduced by 25%. I'm assuming its to stop 2 Guardians from tanking a point."

Guardians will have a VERY tough time losing their shield in lockdown with the new "Reduced Damage to Knights" and stacking the ability with Trinkets or Armor pieces will mean you'll have a shield that will literally take 3 times as many hits to take out. I keep these things in mind when I carefully thought out the class balances.

@ Kentard The Spiral Cutter increases damage done to knights. It does not increase just sword damage, just gun damage, just bomb damage. Its an increase to everything. This mainly supports hybrid weapon users, not specifically sword users.

Kentard Quote to the 5 second cap on harmful status effects "That's effectively nerfing the elemental bombers in-game"
These harmful effects can still refresh themselves infinitely as long as you are within a bombs' radius, so its not as bad as you think. There is no diminishing returns yet...and those are the two words you want to not see when you are talking about nerfing elemental bombers.

The buff to fire and stun effects along with the fire UV effect on bombs allow fire bombs to be incredibly effective, maybe too effective...While you are worried about the pepperbox/combuster guys maybe you should worry about the guy with the Voltaic Tempest or Stagger Storm using the Bomb-Only Fire UV.

@ Tiachii The health change on the striker still keeps it below the recon and far below the guardian. Between the new recon debuff and the guardians' vastly improved shield synergy...being able to take one more hit isn't exactly gamebreaking.

As for the recon changes, I main the recon...some may tell me how gamebreaking these changes are. First of all the recon stealth duration is actually VERY long when its' used mostly in combat instead of traveling from node to node. Reducing the duration by 40% may sound like a nerf but thats still about 16-18 seconds of continuous stealth.

Here's where I'm talking about this. "Getting hit while invisible now reduces the remaining bar energy by 25% instead of 100%" This means you are still invisible if you are hit and you aren't a sitting duck if someone wildly attacks everywhere and gets lucky. At the same time, the player isn't able to sit in stealth for large portions of the game, although even with the duration reduction this is still not a problem. Decreased class bar charge time is also another strong method for obtaining fairly strong stealth uptime.

The changes to the skull debuff actually makes the opponent afraid. 50% reduced damage output is a very strong effect to place on damage dealers along with 50% reduced defenses. Its actually strong enough to justify the reduced stealth time attached to recons. Although regenerating the bar can now become faster with item effects.

As for guardian, I mained guardian for awhile too. If you gave all Knights 42% damage reduction, its obvious that the Guardian's Shield would be vastly overpowered compared to the synergy of anything else in the game. Causing the class bar to take 3 times longer to regenerate (+200%) and employing the "broken" status are the best ideas to implement without drawing the AMAZING tradability and defensive capability of the guardian. Also in addition to the passive damage reduction against knights, the shield itself heals double while its' up causing amazing amounts of durability behind an extremely powerful shield that WILL be taking literally two to three times as many hits to remove if a guardian is running double Iron Will.

TLDR: Some changes would seem vastly powerful if they were implemented alone, but implemented together...there is balance.

Wed, 11/02/2011 - 06:58

Kentard

Then There's Problem(s) No. 2.

"These harmful effects can still refresh themselves infinitely as long as you are within a bombs' radius."
I honestly doubt that someone would continuously walk into a bomb every 5 seconds.

"This mainly supports hybrid weapon users, not specifically sword users."
As hybrid weapon users they are already taking a big sacrifice in maximum damage by going for more versatility. I do agree that this would encourage more users to play hybrids, but this means that we'd just have guys, like I mentioned, running around with Pepperboxes and whatnot.
Also, wouldn't 5* High damage to Knights per trinket seem a wee bit too much? After all specialized damage trinkets only add a medium bonus damage to Knights, and piercing already does additional damage.

"While you are worried about the pepperbox/combuster guys maybe you should worry about the guy with the Voltaic Tempest or Stagger Storm using the Bomb-Only Fire UV."
i.e. making the bombers OP? As of now their main goal is to area cancel. Frankly if I was a bomber I won't be too concerned about my damage so long as I defend a point.

"TLDR: Some changes would seem vastly powerful if they were implemented alone, but implemented together...there is balance."
Balance is only achieved after a period of disequilibrium. Inevitably, some aspects of major changes will be imbalanced in a certain way, so even if these are implemented, some aspects may be nerfed eventually.

The main issue I have with these changes are that they effectively ease out the difficulty slope of Lockdown, and allow you to be on par with players that have practiced special techniques such as playing a Striker effectively simply by getting a fire weapon. Perhaps you might want to just nerf those a little, especially the fire damage and the sword/bomb elemental UV.

Wed, 11/02/2011 - 11:20

Nicoya-Kitty

@Kentard I honestly doubt

@Kentard I honestly doubt that someone would continuously walk into a bomb every 5 seconds. Speaking as a bomber in lockdown: you'd be surprised.

Wed, 11/02/2011 - 14:17

Warriorrogue

I agree-and what about the

I agree-and what about the freeze ones. you're stuck in it. and the recon stuff is there for a reason.
the length is so you can escape, and the 100% reduction is there so you can't just sit there, on a CP, taking it, and have people dashing around with flourish.also, the "all defences removed" will annoy the h*** out of people, with the "assassin" potential remover.Also, the lock-on is useful for those who have lag spikes, but want the krogmo coins

and 0 coins for the losing team?!?!?!?
no money, but you get 1 coin as compensation. now you want to take that away! You're insane!
Through that entire thing, the ONLY thing i agree with, is the class helms. but that should be costume armours.
striker + 3 hp, then with HP boosting armour, and 2 true love pendants, you would be INVINCIBLE. try killing them.
>->)|___|(best table flip i can do).
but seriously, think this through. then still ignore this.

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PvP upgrades o-O