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Which Alchemer is the Best?

18 replies [Last post]
Thu, 11/03/2011 - 20:11
Hargbeast's picture
Hargbeast

Which alchemer one works the best, when upgraded to five star, in general? Please keep in mind the amount of damage and status effect it creates.

Thu, 11/03/2011 - 22:09
#1
Somenubcake's picture
Somenubcake
here's a bit about the nova

here's a bit about the nova vs magma vs storm line (30th post is good, you should read that. go to the 32nd post with the calculations for the damage values):
http://forums.spiralknights.com/en/node/30707

there are some people who LOVE their cryo but it's not my cup of tea.

the umbra driver is just like a shadow nova driver

Fri, 11/04/2011 - 03:24
#2
Memento's picture
Memento
Depends on what you want.

Your aim is damage? Go Nova driver / umbra driver. These two offers no side-effects, but the damage of each bullet is comparable to a full-extended polarish shot. EVERY LITTLE BULLET. Mind that with a well placed shot, a single target might get hit by every bullet that ricochets!

Your aim is control? Go Cryo driver / Storm driver.
Puppies and howlizers are a problem of yours? Freeze them or shock them, it will prevent them from attacking. Your life will be easier. Your team will be thankful. You will be awesome.

Your aim is.. uh.. I don't know? Get a magma driver and.. uuh.. regret it

Fri, 11/04/2011 - 03:56
#3
Master-Of's picture
Master-Of
It depends on what you wanna do with it.

It depends on what you wanna do with it.

However, IMO Storm Driver is most useful, because it works nice against Howlitzers, Kats, Gun Puppies and other shooting Enemies. Unlike Freeze the Shock is not cured by shooting it again. Unlike Fire the Shock can damage nearby enemies and can interrupt the enemies movement. The only big weakness are Quicksilvers, which like to be shocked; fortunately their super powerful shocked state wears off very quick.

Nova is second useful, because it doesn't have the Quicksilver problem. However, it won't slow enemies down, due to no Shock.

Umbra Driver is third, because it's better vs. Polyps and Lichen Colonies. Unfortunately it's really bad vs. Howlitzers and Kats.

Hail Driver is useful when solo. It's useless in most parties, because players are somehow magically attracted to attack frozen enemies first, thus unfreezing them. I don't know why this happens, but it may be related to some sort of instinct to attack and get rid of visibly weakened enemies first. However, AFAIK it can cool down Oilers, though not fast enough (Shivermist Buster is fast enough).

Magma Driver is too dangerous vs. Oilers and can therefore easily kill entire parties, since Fire does not wear off Oilers by itself and lights up nearby Oilers. It should be forbidden to wield it without a license, IMO.

Fri, 11/04/2011 - 06:25
#4
Bindi-Badgi's picture
Bindi-Badgi
^^

You shouldn't be firing an elemental weapon at quicksilvers or oilers (or icecubes) anyway - they are slimes, use a shadow weapon!

(In fact Umbra shouldn't even be in the same list as it has a completely different set of targets to the elemental alchemers)

Of the Elemental Alchemers my order of preference is:

Nova - pure damage, kill mobs quicker - the absence of a status effect is redundant if they are dead lol
Storm - less damage but shock is a very useful status, adds damage, interupts mobs attacks & spreads for some nice crowd control
Cryo - Solo (and when not teamed up with idiots) this is a very useful gun, freeze the dangerous/fast mobs in place and deal with the little ones first
Magma - fire status does nothing for crowd control and the extra damage it causes doesn't match the pure damage of Nova so, meh

Of the Shadow Alchemers my order of preference is:

Umbra - coz it's the only one...derp...

Fri, 11/04/2011 - 07:27
#5
Master-Of's picture
Master-Of
Bindi-Badgi wrote: "You

Bindi-Badgi wrote:
"You shouldn't be firing an elemental weapon at quicksilvers or oilers (or icecubes) anyway - they are slimes, use a shadow weapon!"

While it is true, that a Shadow weapon would cause more damage, because they are weak to it, Elemental still does normal damage. This also means, Storm, Nova, Cryo and Magma will do acceptable amounts of damage vs. Polyps and Lichen Colonies (i.e. Slimes with long range attacks), too. So you don't have to carry and extra Shadow gun just for Slimes. Instead, you should pick a Shadow sword, because it works fine against Slimes and Gremlins, since Gremlins tend to dodge gunshots more often than sword swings.

Anyways, the danger of accidentally firing at Quicksilvers or Oilers (or Icecubes) is what I actually meant in my previous post. The Drivers shots ricochet and split a lot and thus can accidentally light Oilers or shock Quicksilvers.

Unfortunately, in my last tier 2 expedition, I had a noob gunner in my party, who shot Quicksilvers with his Voltech Alchemer and his Kilowatt Pulsar on purpose. I was able to shield and retreat in time, but the rest didn't make it :( I think he had no other weapons equipped, because he continued doing it after I had them revived. Also, I think he didn't speak English XD

PS: Storm Driver is still less dangerous than Polaris line, because Polaris also moves enemies, which makes it even more dangerous vs. Quicksilvers and the expanding shots may still accidentally touch things they shouldn't.

Fri, 11/04/2011 - 08:08
#6
Bindi-Badgi's picture
Bindi-Badgi
True...

I was speaking from a gunner perspective to be honest, but you have point regarding ricochets :-/

Talking about 'derp' moments; I was once in a pug party with a guy in full fire themed gear - vog set, fang of vog and ash of Agni - in a t2 danger room full of fire pits & oilers...I watched with horror as he proceeded to set fire to everything getting the rest of us killed and then just kited the arena with ash refusing to rev us...derp

Fri, 11/04/2011 - 12:30
#7
Regalya's picture
Regalya
If you want PVP Oritented

If you want PVP Oritented shadow gun then go for Umbra (Biohazard prove alot better dps and usage in pve)
If you want decent damageoutput with no status effect go Nova
If you want pure DPS gun go for magma (Highest dps alchemer as long as there's proc(The mobs in FSC doesn't get ignited tho)
If you want avrage dps along with little crowdcontrol then go for Storm/Cryo

Fri, 11/04/2011 - 22:36
#8
Somenubcake's picture
Somenubcake
an idea from me

get them all

I am in the process of getting the magma, storm and nova (currently i got firo driver, volt driver, prismatech mk2). I like the option of swapping alchemers for different strata and different teammates. for example, if i know a teammate is using some electric bomb, i'd pick the firo, etc. etc. It's also fun to swap alchemers just for the heck of it.

Tue, 01/29/2013 - 21:42
#9
Lettuce-Sauce's picture
Lettuce-Sauce
Magma Driver does more damage than other drivers.

And I'm not talking about FSC. Magma driver is typically my favorite since it does arguably the greatest amount of DPS. I heard Cryo is useless because the ricochet can most likely break the ice of frozen enemies. Storm is replaced by Polaris nowadays, but Voltedge is better than both combined. I'd prefer a load out with one brandish, one Alchemer, and one haze bomb. (for me it's, Voltedge, Magma Driver, and Shivermist Buster)

Memento, those who will regret using rare weapons clearly suck at using it.

Tue, 01/29/2013 - 23:30
#10
Fradow's picture
Fradow
Necromancer alert!

Don't revive dead thread. Especially to state your uninformed opinion.

Wed, 01/30/2013 - 05:49
#11
Quakeman's picture
Quakeman
storm driver

storm driver

Wed, 01/30/2013 - 06:55
#12
The-Rawrcake's picture
The-Rawrcake
CRYO / HAIL ftw. Best

CRYO / HAIL ftw. Best devilite killing gun in my opinion - split bullet clipping, freeze = they can't track you with their projectiles / dodge your bullets, and leading with bullets makes them dodge into the bullet.

Yeah you can do this with any elemental alchemer, but the freeze is just priceless on devilites.

And, yes, it is useful on everything else - no, freeze will never hinder you, it helps you, despite what people who have never used the gun will tell you for no reason at all.

Wed, 01/30/2013 - 07:15
#13
Bopp's picture
Bopp
The-Rawrcake, Entyre

On these forums I frequently point out that freeze can hinder you, and I frequently criticize Hail Driver, so The-Rarwcake may be thinking of me.

Sometimes freeze is very useful. Devilities are a great example. But sometimes freeze hinders you, because it prevents shield bumping, knockback, and kiting, all of which are crucial tools in the expert player's toolkit. The hindrance affects some players more than others --- for example, heavy sworders (such as Fradow) who rely on knockback to set up their hits correctly. In many FSC parties I have seen players ask other players to stop spamming Shivermist Buster everywhere. So I am not alone in my viewpoint.

I have owned a Hail Driver for at least 18 months, so I have certainly used the gun. Its fundamental problem is that attacking a frozen monster breaks its freeze. So, if you spam Hail Driver shots everywhere, you sometimes freeze monsters, but your freeze is often immediately broken by your ricochets or other shots. To use Hail Driver well, you must be disciplined rather than spammy. Thus the gun has a higher learning curve than other alchemers.

I'd prefer a load out with one brandish, one Alchemer, and one haze bomb. (for me it's, Voltedge, Magma Driver, and Shivermist Buster)

Entyre, your favorite loadout is all elemental weapons? That surprises me.

Wed, 01/30/2013 - 07:22
#14
Fleet-Miss-Gun's picture
Fleet-Miss-Gun
Hail Driver is the best IMO.

Hail Driver is the best IMO. The freeze give you a good time to charge your gun and blast those enemies.

Wed, 01/30/2013 - 08:17
#15
Little-Juances's picture
Little-Juances

Shock does a similar job interrupting the enemy, adding a little DPS and doesnt accidentally break.
As if enemies (besides devilites) were that hard to need a complete freeze.

Now in LD it does become more intersting.

Wed, 01/30/2013 - 08:21
#16
Fleet-Miss-Gun's picture
Fleet-Miss-Gun
But Devillites are the

But Devillites are the hardest enemy D:.

All other enemies are joke.

Wed, 01/30/2013 - 08:50
#17
Spicegirls's picture
Spicegirls

"Voltedge is better than both combined"

Clearly what he needs is a Voltedge, a Combuster, and a Glacius.

Wed, 01/30/2013 - 11:50
#18
Daimyojoe's picture
Daimyojoe
Alchemer switching

If your looking to alch switch in ld then for the most damage you'd want the umbra and nova drivers.

Saying that shock can be very handy so a combination of one of the ones above and a storm driver is deadly. It just depends on whether you're looking to spread status' or deal damage.

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