I posted after the two stealth patches.
Uh...CE market and why the spike of the cr
Sat, 11/05/2011 - 09:54
#52
I posted after the two
Sat, 11/05/2011 - 10:35
#53
ok
then
Sat, 11/05/2011 - 13:59
#54
didn't want to give anyone ideas
but now that it has been patched out and TRIPLE O is presumably banning people, i sincerely hope they "follow the money trail" with this round of bans for cheaters. When they find people who abused the glitch, they should follow where that money went. Did they by a bunch of stuff off the AH and send it over to alts (or exploit with an alt and pass over to their main)? Did they purchase a large amount of ce and mail ce or crowns to another character playing on teh same IP address?
It would be too easy for someone to get infinite crowns (or a huge number) by up a ton of great gear (better than anything they already own) send all this great 5* gear to a "new character" equip what they want and then AH off the rest of it for a ton of CE. Old character gets banned. New characters has great gear, great gear to sell, lots of CE and crowns. Pure profit.
So to that extent, i definitely hope OOO digs as deep into this cheatery as possible to keep any criminal genuises (lol) from avoiding punishment.
Sat, 11/05/2011 - 14:18
#55
Uh, so everyone's fine with
Uh, so everyone's fine with the price rising to 6200-6300 cr as the buying price and the selling price seeming nearer to 7k, while the average price of mats stays the same?
Sat, 11/05/2011 - 15:58
#56
Now that the glitch is
Now that the glitch is patched, can i know how the heck it happened? Just random crowns popping from nowhere?
Sat, 11/05/2011 - 16:07
#57
@Eeyup
You go into flamelash arena in JellyKing's gate.
After the first round, money goes haywire giving you about 100 a second give or take.
It capped at 120k crowns for me. I never spent it, thinking there would be a server rollback regardless.
Then I get temp-banned. This isn't the type of thing I test out for details.
Sat, 11/05/2011 - 16:16
#58
Alrighty, even though that
Alrighty, even though that price doesn't reflect or is based on production, just artificial bidding, whatever. I was ranging from 5990cr-6050cr before the crowns went haywire. Think even down to 5900 or 5899 once. One was scared about the rate going to 6500cr, I guess cause of the short time frame, but we are close to that in the long term, could be even a week or so by now that we could get there instead of 6200 cr. Ones putting up bids in bulk can afford the losses too. Ones that do that, typically doesn't like doing boss runs or dungeon runs, but I do to get some budget of some kind along with tokens.
Sat, 11/05/2011 - 19:36
#59
Goddamn man, I just forgot to
Goddamn man, I just forgot to accept another one of my auctions that sold, and I realized I'm 8k short and more because of the higher prices. Jesus, owing more to myself to replenish energy. Stop buying in bulk when the price is going down on purpose and putting 50 more cr as the top buying bid. I want to at least replenish exactly what I missed and hope and pray that gear prices go up along with ce prices. That's just how it's suppose to be(even though operating at a loss is not really good business sense) proponents.
I have to wait to energy to recharge and fund my characters more and still not have enough, what a lethargic world.
Sat, 11/05/2011 - 20:48
#60
Ranzoh, people craft using
Ranzoh, people craft using mist energy, thats why the prices look like they're operating at a loss. If you want to compete with current market prices you need to craft using your mist energy.
Sat, 11/05/2011 - 21:03
#61
They are operating on a loss
They are operating on a loss on the sale of non-UV gear.
I would say the majority of two star stuff hitting the market are ragecrafters who are just looking to make a little back though, it isn't done with the expectation of making profit off the non-UV gear.
Tue, 11/08/2011 - 03:19
#62
Guess glitch abusers are
Guess glitch abusers are still around, and were not punished as they should. Few days ago (after fix) i saw on CE market offer posted out of nowhere to buy ~460 x100 CE pack. It appeared instantly so no chance for coencidence that multiple people posted it on same price and same moment....
Tue, 11/08/2011 - 09:32
#63
That's is not indicative of
That's is not indicative of glitch abuse. 46k CE (under 3M crowns) is a significant sum, but very much within the reach of the wealthiest players in the game.
Incidentally, I have seen a ~460x100 CE pack for sale yesterday. It *could* be someone trying to manipulate the market, but I wonder if it is lucrative enough to do so (it's not risk free with the transaction costs). A more likely reason, I reckon, would be someone suddenly needing large amount of crowns or CE to buy something very expensive (crown is the common currency in the AH, whereas CE is the common currency for trades between players).
It is plausible that someone did escape unscathed after benefiting from the glitch, but would they do something that would draw so much attention to their ill gained fortune?
Tue, 11/08/2011 - 09:43
#64
@Business-Lady
It is plausible that someone did escape unscathed after benefiting from the glitch, but would they do something that would draw so much attention to their ill gained fortune?
Yes. Do not underestimate how far people would go to pursue fame and power. People who took advantage of the glitch have the motivation to show off their "works" and how they evaded the system.
I'm surprised that OOO only issued a 2 days temporary ban to the offending users. My guess would be due to potential conflict of interest.
Tue, 11/08/2011 - 10:16
#65
They may or they may not I
They may or they may not I suppose. But so much for "fame" when most of us probably have no idea who placed those bids. And so much for power if they get banned. And unless you have information beyond what has been posted so far, we only know that -one- player here got temp-banned after allegedly reporting the bug.
Tue, 11/08/2011 - 10:23
#66
@Business-Lady
There is only one thing I agreed with your previous post, which is that none of us have information beyond what have been posted so far.
That means, your guess is as good as mine (and others).
That also means, people are free to speculate just like you and I did.
Do not underestimate how far people will go to pursue fame and power. That's the message to take away from my post.
Tue, 11/08/2011 - 11:35
#67
Let's just say that I find it
Let's just say that I find it highly unlikely. Yes, some people who commits crimes may do so to seek attention so it is not impossible, but most do not and have to be caught. And I'd expect a little more bragging and for all of us to have heard about it for now (be it a screenshot or similar) - otherwise it's a pretty big fail on the fame side of things.
Though what I am mostly I am disputing is that someone placing 460 bids is any indication that the crown is ill gained or this ordeal has not been dealt with properly. Do not underestimate how much crowns/CE some players have would be the message to take away from my post.
Tue, 11/08/2011 - 15:28
#68
Yeah, I think people are
Yeah, I think people are still trying to make money off the market. I guess they are trying to bid the crown price of CE up to 7k, cause psychologically that is making a lot of money selling their old CE for them until the next CE event(which won't come anytime soon) brings it down I guess. Or it extends the gap of the top 5 buying and selling bids. Frankly the top buying and selling bids gap tend to meet close together to the average of 150-200cr I think, so I'm not sure what's to be gained from higher crown prices of CE. Right now the top 5 buying bids are close to 6400cr, and I don't know why it's going up at a faster rate now especially after the glitch now. Those with more crowns has more power to influence the market for everyone it seems.
Tue, 11/08/2011 - 15:52
#69
the glitch could still be
the glitch could still be active just no one is talking about it :P
Tue, 11/08/2011 - 16:55
#70
It'll probably take a little
It'll probably take a little while for the excess crowns to get burned off.
Tue, 11/08/2011 - 17:45
#71
Just as in arbitrage, if you
Just as in arbitrage, if you invest in a few hundred dollars in the foreign currency exchange market it would've been nothing. But a million dollars means a lot of returns. Think they've had regulation on that. Right now, I've calculated maybe say a 200 cr per 100 ce buying and selling gap. With bid quantities appearing at 460 as a marker, selling them at the top selling price that 200 cr apart from the top buying price would net probably 5 figures of profit with a relatively stable gap if they plan on selling a quantity amount of energy at the same time while also buying "low". But I guess you would need a lot of spare energy for that. Of course there's the 2% selling fee, but that is negligible when compared to the AH 10% price and the 5 figures profit.
Tue, 11/08/2011 - 20:32
#72
The energy market is pretty
The energy market is pretty liquid, but it's not the FOREX level of liquidity; putting up an offer even at the market price doesn't mean it'll be filled instantly. Plus with volatility there's no guarantee your submitted bid gets filled without constant babysitting, and IME even for fairly modest amounts of CE you'd have to make minute adjustments if you want to get the best price (as you would need to do with arbitrage) since the market fills the orders in 100CE lots at a time.
Without automation or a way to move large bulk orders in a single transaction, there are no economies of scale to exploit here. Someone with millions of crowns of energy trying to engage arbitrage has to do it 100 CE at a time -- at that point doing multiple T3 runs would be a more profitable use of time.
Wed, 11/09/2011 - 17:39
#73
I can't help but feel that
I can't help but feel that 6400 cr/100 ce was suppose to be 6200 cr/100 ce without the bug happening, and also the rate is suspiciously going up too fast still because of the bug if we compare time frames between 6050 before the bug and now and the shadow key events.
Wed, 11/09/2011 - 17:54
#74
CE tends to become more expensive...
Crystal energy rises well past 6400 crowns on its own as time goes on. It drops again when new content is released or the game receives a large influx of new players. I've seen it hit 6.7k (pre-steam) and it will continue that seemingly inexorable climb until there is an update.
Did it rise artificially fast because of the bug/exploit? Maybe. Too many variables to know for sure, I think.
Wed, 11/09/2011 - 19:32
#75
well i think it's also part
well i think it's also part to blame on some people trying to jack up the price... i put in a bid for 100CE (just needed some extra ce for something doesn't matter what haha) and then i see some random "insert your favorit word for this kind of player" putting up bids 200 crown ABOVE the highest bid... (so it went from let's say 6200 to 6400) ok that people put on bids upping it with 10 crown because they need it NOW i don't mind but why in gods name would you up it 200crown? (and not 1 but 25 offers at once)
Thu, 11/10/2011 - 06:25
#76
Yea, they put price up like
Yea, they put price up like idiots, instead of use those "SELL" offers that are ready to take. They should use them if they need CE NOW or wait patiently.
And those people who still put big bulks of "buy" offers and they hope it will be filled. Seriously, its silly, its hard for me to buy 1x100 CE becouse moment i put it it got spammed away by higher offers, so what are thinking people who put "buy" offers for 40+ x 100CE ?
Thu, 11/10/2011 - 08:26
#77
There's a wall of over 100
There's a wall of over 100 buy orders at 6300, forcing anyone desperate to buy CE to put up even higher orders.
There's only one way to fight these dirty tricks - don't buy any CE. They will have to cancel their orders sooner or later, or they eat the CE trade fee. Let them keep putting and cancelling their orders until they're bored.
Keep farming crowns with mist, play LD or other games in the mean time.
Thu, 11/10/2011 - 08:55
#78
To mention, orders at a
To mention, orders at a seemingly rounded price are likely not intended to be malicious, or even the same person.
They're just speculators that all put a buy price at the nearest hundred to account for if the prices ever reach that low. The problem is since of course they place the order at a price they couldn't see, many at once place it at an evenly-rounded number.
Thu, 11/10/2011 - 09:22
#79
Those orders are malicious
Those orders are malicious since they appeared in an instant.
Thu, 11/10/2011 - 10:00
#80
I've seen instances where I
I've seen instances where I want to buy CE over the person/people who put 100-400 offers of one price, only to see them jump up and post obscenely large amounts of offers of an even higher price soon after, forcing it higher. Therefore I do not bother trading at all at the moment.
Thu, 11/10/2011 - 11:43
#81
And if all that we described
And if all that we described here wasnt enough, now we have here at forum a guide "How to manipulate market". Now we will get even more of this market scam.
Thu, 11/10/2011 - 15:34
#82
yeah and this all happens
yeah and this all happens right after the "infinite" crowns glitch, yeah they temp banned the guy who reported it and probably took away all his crowns, but what about all the other people who got millions from it?? i really doub they did anything to them... before the glitch CE prices were quite stable and now it just wont stop going up.
OOO please deal with the repercussions from that glitch, reset CE offers, track down the exploiters, but please do something.
Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:44
#83
@Jay-Dee Some people have
@Jay-Dee Some people have been perma-banned following the infinite crowns glitch.
Fri, 11/11/2011 - 05:25
#84
Yea, but damage they did to
Yea, but damage they did to market remains. What was caused by exploit should be bring back to normal as exploid was removed. As long as we wont unite against it and let OOO hear our voice they will just sit and laugh at us struggling under CE prices rising and OOO will silently thank those exploit abusers for doing so.
At any normal game where devs really care about game or players, situation like this would be fallowed by immediately FIX, revert the game data to the state where it was not affected by exploid (aka server rollback) and then tracking all exploit abusers. Of course they fixed it, some say they banned some ppl but well, they didnt do a server rollback (its obviously too late for it now).
Fri, 11/11/2011 - 15:14
#85
Re:
@#90: "ok that people put on bids upping it with 10 crown because they need it NOW i don't mind but why in gods name would you up it 200crown? (and not 1 but 25 offers at once)"
Sometime the "spread" between the Top Offer to Buy, and Top Offer to Sell is greater than 200 crowns, so it is still cheaper for the buyer to put a bid 200 higher to entice sellers to go down to at least that much. And the truth is, 25 offers is 2500CE. A huge number for those still working their way up to 5*, but not even enough to unbind a 5* item, let alone something with a top tier UV.
@#82: I have never done any buying/selling for profit. However, earlier this week, for the first time, I have placed a block of 100x bid. I can assure you that it was -not- done with malicious intent. If I could do without buying any CE right now, I would do exactly that. But if you are looking to buy items with popular top end UVs, you can expect to pay anywhere from around 10 to 30k CE. Some items costs even more. Just like any of you, I do not want to pay more than I have to. That means that if it can be helped, I would rather place bids rather than just go straight for the Top Offer to Sell. As noted earlier though, any bid lower than the Top Offer to Sell represents a saving (personally, I avoid raising too much since I do want to buy my CE as cheaply as possible). In the past, I would spread my bids in the hope of paying less, but if you need a lot of CE in a few hours, then spreading bids and waiting for CE price to drop is not really an option.
I'm guessing you got dealt with harshly because you basically told anyone with less moral fiber than you how to take advantage of the exploit.