So, has anyone read anywhere that the elevator pass will not be a one-time offer and it is here to stay? Or has the decision not been made yet? Or possibly should I ask, what do you think? Should it stay?
Is the Elevator Pass going to stay?
Fri, 11/25/2011 - 15:16
Fri, 11/25/2011 - 16:03
#2
I have not seen anywhere that
I have not seen anywhere that a ringer has said anything more about the elevator pass other than that it is currently temporary. I really doubt that any decision has been agreed upon by the ringers, Nick said that they were going to track *who* and *how* it is being used, and that need data. I suspect that they will try to keep an open mind until after not only the elevator pass has stopped being sold, but after they have all expired.
That said, my guess is that they wouldn't have added the elevator pass if they didn't think it was a good idea and that they really aren't completely open minded about it. Their bias will be that they will bring it back permanently, unless there is really really strong evidence that it is really really bad for the game, and what they really have left to decide is how much they should charge for it and if they should allow it to be bought with CE also.
Personally, I'm starting to lean toward the elevator pass being bad for the game. Not horrible, but not an improvement, especially if you can't buy it with CE.
There is already a play-style conflict between those that want to whack every bush and those that want to do the floors quickly. The elevator pass amplifies this conflict dramatically. People with elevator passes will often not only not want to stop to whack bushes, but if they are on an odd numbered stratum, there isn't much reason to "waste" time killing monsters either, just rush through as fast as you can, breaking treasure boxes if you see them. Just speed run down to basil to get recipes and to the levels where killing a monster drops more crowns. Danger rooms aren't worth it because if you can't defeat the monsters, you won't be able to make it to the elevator. Anything really high risk or "not fun" can be skipped, and yet since you have ME to waste on energy revives, dying and party wifpes aren't as bad. If you have run out of mist to revive and you die, no worries, it just costs a little time to speed run back to where you were. Players with elevator passes can play sloppy and leave those in the party without passes stuck in a bad situation.
The net result is that mixed parties where some player have elevator passes and some players don't are in conflict.
Elevator passes also promotes people crafting a lot on mist and reselling slot upgrades. Krogmo bribes can also be a way to spend ME, which can make selling mod calibrators easier.
All in all, I think the game would be better of the cr<->CE exchange rate was *much* lower, that would give most of the benefits of the elevator pass, without a lot of the negatives. That, however, would require fairly radical changes for OOO, such as replacing lots of the crafting energy costs with large crown costs, or make silver keys be (large) crown sinks, or make unbinding (large) crown sinks, or even make shadow keys very large crown sinks.
My prediction: Come January, there will be an elevator pass for maybe $7-$8.
Fri, 11/25/2011 - 18:17
#3
There is already a play-style
There is already a play-style conflict between those that want to whack every bush and those that want to do the floors quickly. ... The net result is that mixed parties where some player have elevator passes and some players don't are in conflict.
Have you seen many problems in your groups Algol?
Or possibly should I ask, what do you think? Should it stay?
That depends. It made the game more fun for me, but I'm just a person. If it's not good for Spiral Knights as a whole it should go. I'm in the "it should go" category because it encourages people to play much more than they should, and has the potential to destroy a lot of the ingame economies.
Fri, 11/25/2011 - 18:25
#4
Have you seen many problems
Have you seen many problems in your groups Algol?
Twice so far, but i'm not playing much anymore and when I do play, I'm in T1/T2 where there aren't as many hardcore players.
Again, i don't think elevator passes will be the end of the game, or anything close to it.
Fri, 11/25/2011 - 18:39
#5
As one who uses an Elevator pass...
As one who uses an Elevator pass, I'm still OCD about smashing every little thing possible for that one extra crown somewhere. I'll admit, sometimes I am not and skip over those random mail boxes or bushes, but I never leave a floor without at least obliterating every monster that had the nerve to stand within 100 yards of me. I can see some people speed-running, but I don't think it is limited to those who just use the elevator pass.
Fri, 11/25/2011 - 18:44
#6
I can see some people
I can see some people speed-running, but I don't think it is limited to those who just use the elevator pass.
You may be right. Both times I had it happen to me, I was in T1 and the person pushing the party quickly was a high-starred player who may well have just been trying to clear T1 fast.
I suspect a lot of changes, however, will take a while to set it. Again, Nick said they were trying to see who and how these passes are being used. It may take quite a while for people to get out of the habit of thinking in terms of crowns per CE and switch to crowns per minute.
Sat, 11/26/2011 - 00:41
#7
Elevator Pass Should Stay
I use an elevator pass,im still a new player with just a mix and match of t2+t3 equips.I think the pass must stay.Obviously some people would try to rush the stages,but for the most part,new players would buy the pass and play the game to their hearts content.Maybe OOO might change the party system,where people with elevator passes are group together,but there is no need to remove the pass.Without it,spending on crystal energy is really a waste of money.For example,spending $10 for 1k ce,which is quickly used up in 100 elevators.Then many players would be turned off by this,OOO might lose money.The pass if popular,would rise in price to about $7 to $10.CE will still remain for crafting.
Sat, 11/26/2011 - 01:02
#8
It's as close as we'll ever
It's as close as we'll ever get to a subscription fee (assuming it's only available by card).
A lot of people liked the idea.
Sat, 11/26/2011 - 02:42
#9
Keep It
I play in a mix of 4-5* and the pass has been a game changer for me.
I left the game just after the Snarbolax patch and have been looking in every now and again to see what's going on.
I logged in a couple of hours before the elevator pass patch, ran a few clockworks, then logged back in after the patch. As soon as I saw it I bought it immediately. This was what I was looking for.
I'm primarily a casual player, I work full time and have 3 children. They come first. As many of my friends on the game will attest I'm a bit of a nightmare to play with, as half way through a run I'll just stop, then "gtg sorry" and I'm gone as one of them has woken up or whatever.
However if everything's cool I'll play for hours.
With the energy system, that one "gtg" can, in some cases, cost me real money, as everytime you dive, it's an investment in time and energy. Energy that in some cases I've paid for. So if I've just used 60 CE to get to a level then can't do it, I'm not a happy bunny.
With the pass I can leave quite happily no longer worried about energy/crowns lost. I've seen more of the game in the last week than since my first week in the game, as I can afford to mess about in T1, jump in to help friends, randomly join groups just to see what happens, try to solo hard levels with different weapon combos. I've added about 40 new friends this week from doing random stuff, from 5* vana players to new proto players. I've added people to my tab who couldn't finish a run, revived when it's gone wrong, not having to worry about anything.
In short this's the game I wanted to play, doing levels for fun, not crown/CE ratios and going for the most profitable.
BTW, in the case of unlimited crowns, I've made a lot less than I would have if I'd been playing on mist/ce as I go for the fun option rather than the most profitable.
Sat, 11/26/2011 - 16:53
#10
I love the elevator pass.
I love the elevator pass. We'll see if it will stay or not.
Currently, it's pushed the energy market up to 7K crowns / 100 energy. The market has been that high before, so the model is sustainable. But, the real test will come when pay to play players (like myself) start to run out of CE. At that point we'll need to either buy CE, buy the elevator pass, or both. If too many of us just buy the pass, then the energy prices will soar and the elevator pass will be a thing of the past.
When I think of it, the elevator pass may be sustainable if OOO bundles it with high energy deals (example, get an elevator pass if you buy more than $20 usd worth of energy.) If players have both the energy pass plus a lot of energy then they won't be affecting the energy market much.
Sat, 11/26/2011 - 18:05
#11
@Twiddle I wouldn't buy it if
@Twiddle I wouldn't buy it if it were bundled with CE. I like the challenge of grinding for equipment by dungeoning, so I've avoided buying CE at all for that reason, but I did buy the elevator pass.
Sat, 11/26/2011 - 19:32
#12
hmm, that's something to
hmm, that's something to consider. I guess there are a lot of pieces of this puzzle.
But I hope it stays regardless. (:
Sat, 11/26/2011 - 19:41
#13
hmm.
I bought an elevator pass for the same reason(s) as N-K above me. Although I did buy CE once(paid 2.50 to unlock an alt account for separate Mist)
It has completely changed my playstyle as far as level selection, depth diving, amount of elevators run, etc.
The most positive thing I could say about the pass is that most of my in-game time is spent actually playing in the Clockworks instead of calculating energy efficiency, theorycrafting, and waiting for high revenue levels such as Arenas.
The most negative thing I could say about the pass is that it is arguably the most unbalancing item you could buy in one purchase at the Energy Depot.
(I have some data, but I will release it once the pass time is done so I have a complete set of numbers. Stay tuned in 20 days~)
Should it stay?
-from a balance standpoint, absolutely not, without significant changes.
-from an entertainment standpoint, absolutely. It makes the game much more enjoyable to play.
-from a marketing standpoint, most likely yes. It will make OOO plenty of money.
Overall? In my opinion, I would prefer it if it wasn't in, but since it's in, I have a feeling it is here to stay.
Sat, 11/26/2011 - 20:19
#14
"The most positive thing I
"The most positive thing I could say about the pass is that most of my in-game time is spent actually playing in the Clockworks instead of calculating energy efficiency, theorycrafting, and waiting for high revenue levels such as Arenas."
Well I'd sure hope OOO wanted this for their game :3 Unless by their design they actually meant they like economical games then I will be quite baffled. Well we can say that if this is actually a game meant to be played through the clockworks, then it will probably stay. Otherwise, If this is actually a game that has the purpose of providing a strict, mind-excercising economy where you are taken as far as your economical abilities will let you, then the pass would probably be removed, as that was what it was all about without the pass.
Anyways with myself, I bought the pass and finally got to learn Vanaduke better and kill him a few times today. Without a pass, I would search for a good group for a long time just so I wouldn't end up wasting CE. Then after that I stopped, because I did not feel like taking a big chunk of everything I just made and turning it into an elevator fee. I'd honestly rather just not play the game until the next day / other time I could do FSC again and benefit more based on how long I play. I am definately for the pass.
For free players, They can still play free "if they choose." What I really like is that it becomes more like a subscription-based game with the option of playing free. Other MMOs really haven't reached something like this (from what I have seen. If you really know one that is, I am deeply sorry feel free to correct me below... -.-)
When I made this thread, I might've been unaware that there were other threads like this and if there were I am sorry. But, I did not see any myself and thought OOO wasn't getting enough feedback about this whole pass thing. I am excluding the instant feedback that was very negative and some positive as that was way before people got time to see what happened or get used to it. Now that we have been given some time, post any feedback and if you agree/disagree with what I or anyone said above, please say so below.
Sat, 11/26/2011 - 21:29
#15
re: feedback
As someone who purchased an elevator pass, I disagree with the prospect of making SK a subscription-based game with the option of playing free.
The game is marketed as a F2P game. Even if it means I(as a player who supports the game financially, albeit not in large sums) enjoy the game a little less, I would prefer it if the game preserved as much content for F2P players as possible.
The elevator pass creates far too great a divide between paying and non-paying players, both in terms of freedom of playstyle and raw economic gain(which P2P players already have a significant advantage in by the ability to purchase CE directly from OOO).
Many other F2P games adopt certain 'pass-esque' models where a purchase of a particular item offers a considerable boost as a type of monthly subscription fee. I could think of specific examples, but I will not mention them here because I do not wish to advertise other games on this forum(mail me in-game if you really want to hear follow-up examples).
However, in most of those examples, F2P players are not excluded completely from being able to acquire said items. It is often at a heavy cost of in-game currency, but unlike the current model in SK where P2P players have -exclusive- access to the Elevator Pass, F2P players can at least acquire said items.
In any case, it stands to reason that a game company that wishes to turn a profit will seek to appease the players that support the game financially. Therefore, I see the Pass as something that will persist. I simply hope that its final implementation will be more balanced than its current implementation, with at least some gesture towards F2P players that allows them to compete somewhat with Pass-users without being absurdly rich to begin with, or abusive of game mechanics.
It is still available under the limited time-stamp, but it might return sometime in the future when it's over, should it live up to Three Rings' ideal.