Spiral Knights - Blasters

Blasters - Worthwhile?

28 replies [Last post]

Sat, 04/16/2011 - 00:05

Xaeldn

Legacy Username

Heya, just wanted to ask everyone's opinion on something.

I keep hearing that blasters aren't really preferred. However, I seem to be finding mine (currently using a 3* Super Blaster) to be useful in kiting, and I get to avoid worrying about resistances and such. Is this the case?
Towards the endgame, I was thinking of using an Argent Peacemaker and something else, perhaps a blaster or Hail Driver.

Cheers!

EDIT: Should also mention I'm usually using my sword, a Tempered Calibur, and plan on picking up an Avenger down the line.

Sat, 04/16/2011 - 01:16

Pupu

Legacy Username

Knowledge

When something is mediocre and excels at nothing, people call it useless instead of balanced.

I think alchemers are the best personally, since they deal good damage and inflict status effects, and only deal reduced damage to beasts (which are easier to sword) and gremlins.

Sat, 04/16/2011 - 02:22

Merethif

I find it very useful so far

I'm doing kiting most of the time and actually I find my Super Blaster very useful. During preview I used Master Blaster and it worked good for me too.
My second weapon is Magnus that is good against wolvers - not only it deal Piercing damage but also pin them down in place so they can't dodge.
I've been playing with Alchemer a bit but I have found that Blaster/Magnus combo suits me more. Even though I'm going to upgrade my Alchemer to Hail Driver and get Antigue at some point (3 tokens so far) I suppose Valiance will find a place in my arsenal.

Sat, 04/16/2011 - 06:48

LordHiccup

Legacy Username

I run mainly with Swords, I

I run mainly with Swords, I like the Blaster line, having a balanced gun that I can backpedal and shoot in an emergency is nice.

Sat, 04/16/2011 - 07:10

Feynt

Legacy Username

The blasters do normal

The blasters do normal damage, and that's their only quality. 3 shots (more on the highest level I believe), normal damage, decent power, decent range. They have nothing that sets them apart from other weapons though.

The alchemers for the most part will do something else however which makes them more useful usually. First, being elemental, they do more damage to constructs (shadowtech alchemer aside). Firo, volt, and cryotech alchemers all apply some kind of useful status effect (or, sometimes, not so useful. Oil slimes + firotech = bad) which gives them an overall useful aspect as status damage bypasses resistances (firotech alchemers do less damage to wolvers for example, but burning is burning).

Autoguns have massive damage output possible per shot, and a very strange charge attack that actually draws things in to you (making it easier to land all of those shots). Depending on the path you take, you could set several enemies on fire with one burst (pepperbox), or shoot further and faster (needle shot, seems to have "instant" travel bullets).

Haven't used the Magnus or Antigua variants, but they offer greater range and power or higher clip sizes (respectively) statistically, so they distinguish themselves from blasters as well. Blasters are "generic" basically.

Sat, 04/16/2011 - 09:10

Merethif

Generic?

@Feynt: Likewise Leviathan Blade and Nitronome are "generic" basically, that do normal damage, and that's their only quality and they have nothing that sets them apart from other weapons.

All recipes sold by Kozma may seems less "fancy" but that doesn't mean they are not worthy.

Sat, 04/16/2011 - 10:54

Magnus

Legacy Username

I'm Commander Magnus, and

I'm Commander Magnus, and these are my second favorite guns in the Citadel.

Sat, 04/16/2011 - 10:58

Feynt

Legacy Username

Leviathan Blade is actually a

Leviathan Blade is actually a bit stronger than the Cold Iron Vanquisher, but marginally so it would seem. I'm not familiar with it though to know whether it does anything but damage. The Nitronome however has a good chunk of damage over a large area, and it's the easiest bomb recipe to make, so it's hard to argue with it.

Both being available from every major way station (Haven, Moorcroft Manor, and Emberlight), that would be why they're "less awesome."

Sat, 04/16/2011 - 11:05

takewithfood

Legacy Username

I solo and I use a blaster;

I solo and I use a blaster; switching from 2* to 3* is my next priority. I find them superior to alchemers, but I don't think they measure up as well as some other options at 4* or 5*. That's a loooong way away for me, though, and I'll likely ride the Blaster series all the way to 4*.

Sat, 04/16/2011 - 11:09

Chris

I'm commander Chris and these

I'm commander Chris and these are my second favorite guns in the Citadel.

Sat, 04/16/2011 - 11:15

#10

Feynt

Legacy Username

Don't get me wrong, I've got

Don't get me wrong, I've got a Master Blaster myself, all the way up to level 10. But this is why they're "not preferred" in my opinion.

Given that at close range my 2 star autogun can closely match damage with the 4 star master blaster though, I'm probably pretty close to right if I'm wrong.

Sat, 04/16/2011 - 18:00

#11

dukelexon

Legacy Username

I purchased an extra weapon

I purchased an extra weapon slot, and I run with one sword, one gun, and one bomb. So far, it's been working out nicely for me.

It's not that blasters are "useless," per se .... only that they're functional without really specializing in anything. I use a cryotech alchemer because (like you) I use the gun almost exclusively to kite. The freeze status effect chance synergizes very well with that purpose. I'll also pull the gun out against the stupid puppy heads (hate them), as it allows me to be mobile and dodge bullets, and they seem to take extra damage vs. elemental, even when they share the ice elemental with the gun.

But, any gun will allow you to kite, which is its primary purpose.

The sword is for close-quarters 1v1 - 1v3 fighting, and the bomb is for large AoE clears (or sometimes kiting of something big that hits hard, like a fully merged lichen). I feel like I've got the best of all worlds there. I use a blast bomb and a cutter, but I'd really like to swap to a fiery vaporizer for my bomb when I get a chance.

Sat, 04/16/2011 - 14:14

#12

Magnus

Legacy Username

You're pretty off, Fey. And

You're pretty off, Fey.

And autogun limits mobility for bursts of damage. So it's far and away from being as good as a Blaster.

Sat, 04/16/2011 - 14:18

#13

Feynt

Legacy Username

Autoguns can do more damage,

Autoguns can do more damage, and proper positioning behind others or at a good distance covers the mobility factor. I've soloed arenas with an autogun. It's all about positioning.

Sat, 04/16/2011 - 14:26

#14

dukelexon

Legacy Username

And yet, if you need to kite

And yet, if you need to kite something that's fairly fast-moving (say, a graveyard phantom ... try standing still through a full autogun barrage with THAT) down a long, narrow corridor, Feynt, you're S.O.L. with an autogun. There's just no getting around a lack of mobility in some circumstances. I'm not saying autoguns "suck." Merely saying that blasters have their place.

There is no "best" option. Only situational ones. Balance is a real concept.

Sat, 04/16/2011 - 14:54

#15

Feynt

Legacy Username

Agreed. Though I wait for

Agreed. Though I wait for the phantoms to start swinging, dodge, and shoot. It's all about positioning. >D

Sat, 04/16/2011 - 15:36

#16

Magnus

Legacy Username

But you just said you wait.

But you just said you wait. Positioning and waiting are separate factors! How can it be all about positioning if you say you have to wait some, too? D:<

Sat, 04/16/2011 - 15:51

#17

aeolianmode

Legacy Username

Valiance

I have been using the Valiance for a while and I disagree with the nay sayers. It is an excellent weapon that deals decent damage to everything. It is just very plain, and isn't special in anyway... for that reason alone I switched to a silversix, which I have yet to upgrade.

Sat, 04/16/2011 - 16:04

#18

Xaeldn

Legacy Username

Wahey!

Awesome, all your replies are very appreciated =p
I think I might end up grabbing an Antigua/Silversix as planned for general damage dealing, and pick up something Cryotech for kiting, since at the end of the day my guns are secondary weapons and this combination seems to cover all I need them to. :3 (i.e. ranged damage and kiting that covers all enemy types. Yes, I sometimes shoot wolvers and gremlins. =p)

Sat, 04/16/2011 - 17:13

#19

Chris

Valiance is definately the

Valiance is definately the best all-around gun in the game. The knock-back is absolutely killer (especially with 2 or more in a party).
I've cleared all content in this game so far with ease and I can very confidently say that valiance is much more well rounded than achemers and argent peacemaker.
Lightning Alchemers are probably the best as prismatic have nothing to compensate for their lack of effect (like they should) but alchemers are somewhat lacking in damage per second in comparison to valiance and argent peacemaker.
Argent Peacemaker is almost 100% useless outside of firestorm.
Valiance is great versus ANYTHING.

Autoguns are absolute garbage, end of story.

Sat, 04/16/2011 - 17:49

#20

Dilmun

Legacy Username

Valiance

If you roll a decent UV on Valiance it's honestly one of the best guns in the game. I have Damage Bonus vs Construct: Very High on mine and it's easily the most used gun in my arsenal.

Also, Valiance knockback is a godsend for the space invader parts of Firestorm.

Sat, 04/16/2011 - 18:02

#21

Wallach

Legacy Username

I tell people regularly that

I tell people regularly that this line of guns is underrated. For someone only looking to dedicate 1 slot to a sidearm, it is a good choice. It is one of the most mobile guns in the game, but does not suffer in terms of damage per shot like the Antigua or Autogun lines do. It is one of the best kiting gun lines in the game. Don't ignore it.

As for Autoguns, as a pure gunner I still carry a Fiery Pepperbox at times (have not yet tried Volcanic) and I think those are a bit underrated too. They have bar none the most damaging charge shot of any gun line in the game against a single target (including multi-hit 5* Antigua line), and the mobility hit is not the biggest concern in larger parties. Plus you get standard effectiveness against all 6 monster types as well as the Fire status effect all from one slot. Just don't bother trying to shoot T3 Wolvers with it and you'll find it useful. And don't bother firing both shots in the clip unless you are in a group where nothing is tracking you, because you are rooted three times as long firing two shots + reload as you are one shot then moving. Don't bother with this line until you're comfortable with enemy movement and attack timings, but once you are it is not a hard gun to use at all in any tier.

Fri, 06/24/2011 - 00:40

#22

obsothoth

Legacy Username

autoguns

I won't say you have to be really good to use the autogun, but there's a trick to it.

This is moving after firing a single shot, and then firing a single shot again, then moving, and so on. I find that you are able to keep most of your mobility and most of your firepower if you never ever activate reload by firing two shots. Each autogun shot has as much firepower as two or more shots from guns in the same tier, with the option of going x4 if you sacrifice your mobility.

How fast can you fire again after moving? About a second. Sometimes I wonder if its any slower then firing two shots and then reloading.

In short, the trick is to manage your reloads. If you never use the second shot, you still retain a high amount of mobility.

I really came here to find out about blasters though. Based on the comments, I suppose I'll build one.

Fri, 06/24/2011 - 01:06

#23

Kaybol

Legacy Username

my personal opinion (I don't like autoguns, clearly)

Try shield-canceling after the first round of shots from your autogun, it's even faster than moving after the first round. Shield-canceling is pushing your shield button down while your attack animation is still going, so that it cuts off as soon as possible (and with most weapons sooner than you'd normally be able to regain movement).

It still leaves autoguns as inferior to lots (if not all) of other guns though. The lack of movement just cripples your ability to dodge. This means that in situations where you can apply it succesfully, you could probably apply swords just as succesfully, with more mobility and damage to boot.

It looks awesome in the Advanced Training Hall. It just doesn't work that well in practise.

Fri, 06/24/2011 - 01:25

#24

Twiddle

Blaster vs. alchermers and antigua

The main advantage of the blaster is that it damages everything. This is in comparison with the Antiguas and the Alchemers which are very useful against some enemies but very weak against others. The blaster also shoots 3 bullets at a time, but that doesn't mean much beyond Tier 1 because enemies start to dodge by tier 2.

Since you are a sword/gun hybrid I recommend you keep your blaster and not deal with the other weapons. There's no point in going hybrid gunner/swordsman if your ranged attack is useless in a pinch.

For pure gunners I recommend skipping the blaster and taking an antigua/alchemer or an alchemer/shadow alchemer combo. That way you do much more damage then taking a blaster.

Fri, 06/24/2011 - 09:26

#25

Loest

I've got an ASI Medium

I've got an ASI Medium Valiance. It's basically great.

Fri, 06/24/2011 - 10:11

#26

Tenkii

knockback..?

I made an Undead:High blaster as my very first craft ever.

I never really did anything with it (because in graveyard, it only pushed my damage up by like 6-8 and didn't know that UV's passed down in upgrades).
But I run around with 3 swords most of the time, and I'm between either upgrading it to a Valiance, or making a Callahan.

What's this about Valiance and knockback? O.o

Sat, 06/25/2011 - 00:46

#27

Twiddle

What's this about Valiance

What's this about Valiance and knockback? O.o

I don't know. I don't have a valiance yet. When I do get one I'll find out. d=

Sat, 06/25/2011 - 01:16

#28

Zingman

I love Valence, outside of

I love Valence, outside of Firestorm Citadel, its my preferred gun. But then I'm mostly a swordsman and are usually carrying one gun at a time, mostly to kite the occasional strong enemy and hit switches.

Why do I love Valence?

Its the only gun that does knockback on its uncharged attack, and its charged attack pushes everything back (a long way too --- you can send lumbers flying)
The "bullets" have a large AOE (in comparison to the Argent Peacemaker)
It does normal damage (and a good amount too), so nothing is resistant to it
You can move while "reloading" (Argent Peacemaker locks you in place momentarilly while you reload)

Also, and this may not apply to you, I find that the argent peacemaker tends to miss switches and other inanimate objects at close range unless I use the mouse to target (I usually use a gamepad to play).

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Blasters - Worthwhile?