Spiral Knights - Ramblings of a neurotic degenerate (lockdown and danger rooms)

Ramblings of a neurotic degenerate (lockdown and danger rooms)

27 replies [Last post]

Wed, 01/25/2012 - 20:47

Thimol

I hate Lockdown.

Did I mention that I hate Lockdown?

The last three days have been a strain on my faculties because I was on a Lockdown binge to get 250 tokens for the Blight Needle and Plague Needle recipes, and while I know that some of you might be thinking "OH HERE WE GO ANOTHER 'LD SUCKS' RANT", I have some slightly different complaints this time around:

1) Is it just me or does one team automatically win if it's full of strikers and at least one of them has a fkkin kebab skewer?
2) Why are people so irritable in Lockdown? I've had someone tell me to shut up for no reason. Okay, that's a bit of a lie. I'd been rambling a little about how the other team was full of Nazis and kept saying "screw you" to they one guy that kept killing me, and a teammate finally told me to shut up, but he wasn't even talking with anyone. I'd also been called "d--k rash" because one guy wanted to be killed by Chris instead of myself, and in fact he said that it was Chris's kill, and this really doesn't make sense because kills don't impinge team score, and they're certainly not counted, so I'm really inclined think that I'd been hounded by a fanboy, and I have to say that it isn't so horrible despite it being my first time, but it is still stupid being yelled at for what could only be called the stupidest reason ever conceivable to man.

Okay, so I just wanted to get that off my chest. I'll talk about something else.

I'd tried a T2 danger room without Ash of Angi today, and I ended up completing it without deaths quite easily. I didn't have much of a way in cheaply reducing my enemy to ashes since it was a Fire stratum, but I just rolled with it anyway, since I thought I could just Glacius spam.

So this ended up being the danger room with the Retrodes and Scuttlebots, with a few Gun Puppies and Mecha Knights. Usually, I'd just use the Ashes like I said, but that would always end in disaster for some reason. I was wondering if anyone else found certain danger rooms easier just attacking as normal instead of using some kind of status abuse.

P.S. Could we do something about those Phantoms? One spawned right behind me today and it scared the pewp out of me.

Wed, 01/25/2012 - 21:47

Traevelliath

[Insert something witty here]

Admittedly, most people don't talk too much in LD beyond issuing orders and warnings. However, if someone was calling the other team Nazis and spewing the occasional insult at their killer, I would be irritated.

A team has a really good chance of winning when they are filled with Skolver Strikers who know what they are doing (unless they are up against a similarly equipped team). Even then, a good Bomber Guardian with Voltaic Tempest or something can just screw them over. Just don't go face to face, stabby stick to stabby stick against Skolver Strikers because, if they know what they are doing, will come out on top.

I find several Danger Rooms far easier than others. The easiest one for me is one of the Jelly ones. The Wiki calls it Trap Bottleneck with no Crystals. If you got a shadow sword, its a cakewalk (although I haven't tried it with Faust, I have easily beaten it with Acheron charge spam) My favorite one is the Undead one, which the Wiki calls Figure-Eight. That room makes it fun as hell to spam Polaris because each shot hits like 4 Zombies at once. As long as you know how to use the Polaris (Which most people don't, hence giving the weapon a bad name...), then its satisfying. I hate the Cross-Spike ones though... Those just pwn me.

Wed, 01/25/2012 - 22:04

Lan-The-Wizard

Rant time?

Holy hell-o kitty do I hate the gun puppy room.

Who though more bullet spam = difficulty. Well they are right when lag is involved.
I got so peeved that me and my friend both went full rage mode and swept a row of gun puppies under the effects of revival.
Then scuttlebots are easy when there is room. but when they gang up on you they eat you while the gun puppies are blasting you.

Don't get me started on the rockets.

And in LD it does feel like the team with striker-skolver-pokey-fun-time wins.

Whenever the enemy team is as coordinated as the military, my team has the coordination of a 6th grade dodgeball team.

Wed, 01/25/2012 - 22:29

Psychodestroyer

"Admittedly, most people

"Admittedly, most people don't talk too much in LD beyond issuing orders and warnings."

True. When I play LD, especially T3, I'm pretty much the only one using chat.

When I DO use chat, it's probably because I've assigned myself as team Tactical advisor. I try and keep the team within some form of organization, instead of of them just trying to one-man everything and be grateful for backup.

Problem is, not many of them listen to me. I call for the team to switch to recon to bypass the enemy camping us, more often than not, I see my whole team as guardians or strikers trying to muscle their way back into the map.

Other than strategies, I tell the team of oncoming enemy threats and the size of them and to which point (as far as I can guess anyway), sometimes a recommended counterattack plan (Guardian and striker team to CP[#]. 2 targets are stationed there.), which CPs to check out for danger, when I've secured a CP, and I also ask the team to report back the situations at their respective CPs.

Unfortunately, more often than not, I don't get a reply or my advice is ignored completely. Sometimes I get a few people to listen, but not much other than that.

Wed, 01/25/2012 - 22:40

Nechrome

Yes, I hate LD too. I wonder

Yes, I hate LD too. I wonder why people play LD when they know it's so unbalanced... and no one plays BN anymore.. ;_;

"True. When I play LD, especially T3, I'm pretty much the only one using chat."

I've learned not to use the chat in T2 LD... Several times I've been told to shut up, been called an idiot, and been threatened with being reported all because I just said "Stay together" once in the beginning of the match... they called that "excessive spamming."

Heck, there was this one guy, lets call him bob. I was on his team, and throughout the game I said "stay together" 2 times. At the end, he told me to shut up and that I was a stupid *insert vulgar word here*, and I told him that I was trying to organize the team, and that at least I was trying to organize urselves, unlike him. He then proceeded to insult me some more, and said "LoN will be the first to die next match cause he sucks so much." Next match, he was on the other team. I don't htink that I died first, but I did die pretty early in the match XP. At the end, he proceeded to insult me some more, and the such like. So after taing some pictures, I reported him.

Wed, 01/25/2012 - 22:44

Psychodestroyer

That sucks.

When I was in T2, I never got THAT bad. I still offered my tactical services, but people were more likely to follow them.

Once, a player even gave the credit of your win to me because I 'lead' the team. I just said I was giving advice; I'm no leader.

But even then, with all the talking I was doing, I don't think I was ever told to shut up.

Wed, 01/25/2012 - 23:11

Orngeblu

lol

I don't really have a problem with Lockdown, I LOVE it when it comes to PvP, but there are a few things I hate when I encounter them. I've seen some people that all they do is spam their FF, or BTB, and I try to fight them legit, but if it doesn't work out, I counter their strategy by luring them to do their 3rd attack, then I attack them. ASI + Auto-Aim + 3rd attack is DEADLY if you suck at dodging. The only way to do it is to side-step at the right time, or to wait for an opening, THEN attack. I have met someone today...I won't mention the name, and all I saw was attack, attack, attack, (and maybe side-step). I used to counter this by just attacking, because the second attack doesn't hurt you because of the stagger animation, giving you an opening, but if people have a good amount of ASI, I can't counter using that strategy, so I gave up completely on that strategy. (Maybe if I had ASI too I could?)

I also have performance problems sometimes. It may be due to polaris, bomb, and striker animation? I usually lag at the beginning of Lockdown match. Sometime it makes me shoot 3 shots with my Polaris, when I mean to shoot 2 so I don't have to go through the reload animation. I even ran into fire on the Furnace map because I lagged, and I also miss my enemies when I go too far if I lag for a small second, AND it can mess up my timing when trying to side-step or attack. (I even once tried to use my 3rd attack with my FF, and I lagged for a moment, next thing I know, I do the 1st attack animation again)

Frosbite is THE WORST. The snow animation makes it lag, they need to make it so people with Low Quality don't see the snow animation. I lag worse on Frostbite than any other map.

It's also kind of annoying when you find someone with 4* weapon, and 2* armor on you're team.

Do you guys think Polaris should be reduced to a 2-shot weapon? (You can only shoot two bullets)

Edit: :3 Wow, I didn't expect to right something so long.

Wed, 01/25/2012 - 23:23

Traevelliath

Polaris haters...

I really hate the amount of... well the amount of hate Polaris users get in Lockdown. People constantly complain about it because it's one of the most effective ways of denying a large amount of area. Strikers rely heavily on area to move, and when you blanket said area in Zap-Zap-Elemental-Pain, then Strikers encounter some problems.

At the same time, Polaris is more bark than bite, with the blast radius being slightly smaller than the animation, allowing good strikers to simply weave through into that range before the shot expands.

IMO, Polaris is the Gunslinger equivalent of the FF and BTB, yet people yell at Polaris users more than FF and BTB users...

So no, don't reduce the Polaris to 2 shots. I hate 2-shot weapons. There are only a handful of Guns that don't fire two shots and are still useful.

Wed, 01/25/2012 - 23:24

Nicoya-Kitty

I usually go into RAEG DPS

I usually go into RAEG DPS mode when I'm doing a danger room. Don't really fuss much with statuses and all those fancy city-boy tactics. Just start swinging my sword and don't stop 'till the gate drops.

Wed, 01/25/2012 - 23:43

Orngeblu

lol

@Traevelliath:

I use a Polaris. I can get passed it sometimes if I hug the wall, but if more than one are using it, it's impossible without getting hit. You could always go around anyways...

I was just asking for an opinion on whether it should be reduced to two shots, or stay at three shots. I don't think it's fair to reduce it to two shots, but it can be kind of annoying when people create a barrier with it.

Watch Polaris get nerfed in the next update. I'm not sure if it's fair to nerf it or not. The shots are slow, and if you are having trouble with the person using the Polaris, go kill them and move on. I always attack gunners first.

Wed, 01/25/2012 - 23:50

#10

Fehzor

Nicoya isn't lying....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eMANR-SaqLE

Thu, 01/26/2012 - 00:10

#11

Blanky

The only problem I have with

The only problem I have with LD is the ridiculous range of the swords/hitboxes.

I'm 6 feet away, yet they still manage to hit me. ._.

Thu, 01/26/2012 - 00:26

#12

Myllakka

---

My strategy regarding danger rooms and PvP? Run the other way as fast as my legs can take me. I lag a lot in danger rooms, even more so than FSC, so it's really annoying when there's a lot of enemies in close quarters. PvP really just bores me, and I don't do well under pressure, so basically I fail at PvP. I don't feel too bad failing at PvE (unless it's really easy monsters like zombies or jellies), but in PvP I feel like I'm letting so many people down.

Thu, 01/26/2012 - 01:16

#13

Psychodestroyer

@Blanky

"The only problem I have with LD is the ridiculous range of the swords/hitboxes."

Actually, that's latency again. You THINK you're further ahead, but really you're not. Proven by things like using vials and getting hit by shock. That snap back effect? That you getting snapped back to where the server registers you being, instead of where your computer SAYS you are.

Thu, 01/26/2012 - 08:15

#14

Nordlead

Eh, I've played recon and

Eh, I've played recon and destroyed a team of strikers. Granted, they weren't the best strikers I've played and i got extremely lucky. So no, a group of strikers with toothpicks does not mean they will win. My favorite thing to do is team up with a good guardian and slay strikers as they swoop in to try and kill the guardian. If we're doing good we can cap every control point and continue steamrolling the stage.

Thu, 01/26/2012 - 08:54

#15

Alice-In-Pyroland

1) Is it just me or does one

1) Is it just me or does one team automatically win if it's full of strikers and at least one of them has a fkkin kebab skewer?

Nope. A team of Strikers is actually pretty bad generally speaking, you'll be completely curb-stomped by a co-ordinated group of Guardians or worse still a mix of all three classes.

Thu, 01/26/2012 - 09:44

#16

Tengu

@traevliath

...or however you spell your name...

The secret's out on VT Guardians. I was one. I racked up a lot of kills with VT+BTB to complete, now everyone in T3 has invested in Shock resist. That was basically my only trick with my latency issues and my general lack of speed and ability, so now I have to invest in KCs and recon around and hope not to get killed until I can stop playing it again.

I'm tempted to just heat up an ancient plate set and HP up. That'll make it only half a strike harder to kill, I know...

Thu, 01/26/2012 - 10:18

#17

Eltia

Response to OP's 2nd point

I believe one reason why LD is so irritating is because some people (like myself) was forced to play LD out of our own will. Why? Because of the recipes that are given out at prizes are bound and so one of the few ways (and arguably the most economical) is to just grind LD.

Want an Electron Vortex? You can either buy one off other player (maybe for 5-6k ce?), you can grind LD or you just keep opening treasure boxes and hope for random item drop. Suppose you take the LD grinding path and you buy Electron Charge from AH, you still need 250 = 100 + 150 coins. You could use Krogmo Coin Booster but each booster only gives you one more coin as bonus. Krogmo Coin Booster has several pitfalls: they aren't cheap (300 CE), short duration (24 hours) and give a negligible bonus (1 coin) unless you stack them. Most importantly, even if you use Krogmo Coin Booster, you are forced to grind LD for a fixed period of time.

I can understand why the Devs decided to make these recipes bound when LD was first released. The intention maybe that to make certain weapons more exclusive and to create motivation for people to play LD. That's all fine at the beginning. But LD has been out for a while now, I think it's time to relax the constraints. People will still play LD because once these recipes can be traded, a new market would be created.

As I told my LD opponents yesterday (who ranted about my over-preparation on gears, such as Love Pendants), I'll be honest I don't even want to be in LD. But of the 3 ways that I could get the items I want (that I can do within a reasonable amount of time and cost), grinding LD is the most predictable and economical. So I did the math and my conclusion is that I rather went through the over-preparation and some may call "abuse" the equipment advantage, than to prolong the suffering in LD grinding. The equipment you bought for LD can be reused (to a certain extend) for other purpose later on. So I can still preserve the value in the time and effort I invested.

Thu, 01/26/2012 - 11:11

#18

Manta

Wannabe Lockdown Fan

I am not a fan Lockdown, but I'd like to be.

I either find myself on a super confident team that obliterates the other team, or I'm on that other team, where people go afk, die repeatedly or just plain leave.

The few times I've given it a shot (for example, in December, to earn the Krogmo coins to get the Santy Hat), I haven't really learned any more than I did reading "Lockdown for Dummies". I think it just takes lots of practise.

I'd like it if there was a way to set up the parameters of Lockdown to play with a few friends, where you can learn to play better with some FRIENDLY competition.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I don't really have a problem with Danger Rooms (except in cases where the half dead Knight in the group absolutely MUST open a gate for the rest of the group and then you are faced with the decision of whether or not to revive said Knight a dozen times)

Thu, 01/26/2012 - 12:55

#19

Bekjan

I improved PvE since I

I improved PvE since I started doing PvP. You begin to fully understand the mechanics of some weapons like when to use the second strike or when to dodge also I began to appreciate the ASI UV on swords. So I advice PvE unless you have a 2 bar connection. (if you dont have 5* equipment I advice you to play t1 or t2 LD)
As for danger rooms your gears and weapons are important. Gremlins/slimes/beasts are easier than other monster types. Also I advice you to always have polaris if you are soloing a danger room.

Thu, 01/26/2012 - 17:21

#20

Nechrome

Didn't have time to write

Didn't have time to write this yesterday.

For danger rooms, just swod spam. and bomb spam. it works almost every time.

I also have a semi-embarassing incident in a T! danger room. I only had half a healh bar left, and only a gremlin thwacker and wolver left to kill. I was in T2 gear. I was way to scared to go melee because I might have died, so I resorted to spamming fiery vaporizers everywhere. took me 10 minutes to finally kill them. -_-

Thu, 01/26/2012 - 19:10

#21

Otaia

Play Blast Network, you don't

Play Blast Network, you don't have to get geared for it, it's more fun and balanced and there aren't elitists thinking they're pro just because they're beating down a bunch of people who can't play/lag heavily/have bad gear. And you can still beat down the people who can't play.

We need more Blast Network players!

Thu, 01/26/2012 - 19:15

#22

Neodasus

I agree with otaia just play

I agree with otaia

just play blast network, and leave me alone

Thu, 01/26/2012 - 21:35

#23

Blaze-Breaker

A few notes. 1) From what I

A few notes.
1) From what I understand, the Plague Needle is not really worth it.
Poison is not really a status I'd care about, and from what I understand
the Callahan is more mobile (and that's saying something) and capable of
knocking down fiends quickly. Needle guns are perfectly good at killing Trojans,
ofc, if you manage to get a good charge off the Plague Needle and manage to poison
the trojan, chances are it's dead/nearly dead. Ofc you could be getting this for other reasons,
but the Needle series strikes me as a gun useful for zombies (Who aren't in a rush to kill you.)
Trojans (Already dead when you charge them) and Vana (are you really going to do however
many hours of lockdown just to get a weapon for one boss?) Don't get me wrong. I've hit a
bunch of enemies with a Blitz Needle, but it always struck me as more efficient and less exposing
to poke them to death or watch a buddy of mine repeatedly Callahan one down.

2) PvP is never pretty in a game. Ever. Tell me of a game in which dying to another human feels good.
I can't think of a game in which the generic PvP focused person is a very nice person. Not saying that there
aren't nice LDers, its just that they don't come to mind when I think of the average person that goes to those games.

3) I employ my normal strategy for most things that aren't separated by an uncrossable gap. It consists of this.
a) Laying down Vortex
b) Charge brandish while bomb explodes
c) Releasing charge
Really, if you had to get an item from lockdown, I'd really recommend an Electron Vortex with a good CTR UV.
It does a good job of disabling things that aren't fiends,kats or T3 wolvers by keeping them in a neat pile for you to
Glacius charge. The electron also inflicts shock, giving a nice DoT and a way to keep monsters from sproding all over the place
like with a Graviton Vortex, but the latter is not much of an issue with enough firepower/coordinated teams.
It's also a lot of fun in parties.

Fri, 01/27/2012 - 10:30

#24

Tom-Awsm

@Blaze-Breaker (not OP)

1: Needles and Callahan are too situationally different to compare to each other. The argument you should have used is that Plague Needle sacrifices too much damage for the occasional poison status compared to the Blitz Needle. It might be worth using at vanaduke in a party with 2 other Blitzers (the 4th being a shiverbomber), but that is way too specialized for it to be worth the LD grind. Also to comment on the trojans, even a Blitz doesn't one-shot a trojan in a party of 4 without Elite Trueshot trinkets, so I doubt a Plague Needle would be any better.

2: This tells me you have never played any Multiplayer FPS games. In a close match where both teams are fairly evenly matched, the competetiveness is really exhilarating! As a pokey-Skolver, I really enjoy playing with people who are around the same skill level as me. I can see that "dying to another human" argument of yours if it's Chris or some Finesse member doing the killing, but otherwise it's just the fun of competing against each other.

Fri, 01/27/2012 - 11:39

#25

Thimol

-----

Plague Needle sacrifices too much damage for the occasional poison status

I know this wasn't addressed to me, but I have to stop you right there. I definitely wouldn't call the frequency with which plague needle inflicts poison "occasional". In fact, so far, out of every two or three times I've attacked with a plague needle, I would inflict poison at least once, and this is a hell of a lot more than what I can say for dread venom striker.

As for the reduced damage it deals, I can't say anything on that matter, but it's an exchange I'd be willing to make to crap on Vanaduke's attack power.

Plus, I got a serendipitous ASI Md UV on it. :D

Fri, 01/27/2012 - 12:00

#26

Aiolya

Don't get Plague Needle. It

Don't get Plague Needle. It sucks. Problem solved.

Fri, 01/27/2012 - 15:39

#27

Blaze-Breaker

@Tom-Awsm 1. I understand

@Tom-Awsm
1. I understand they're rather different from each other. If it sounded like I was making an argument towards the Callahan, I wasn't.
I apologize. Oh, and my bad about the Trojan vs. Blitz thing too. I went through FSC alone when I was using the Blitz on Trojans,
and that probably had a bit of an affect on their health.

2. You're right. I really don't. All the computers I've owned have never really had the capacity for a game like that, and I end up playing
on a WiFi connection a lot of the time. All in all I haven't had the means to play them for most of my life, that, and I end up hearing about
FPSes a lot at school. Call of Duty in particular, and hearing about it daily in school turned me off to the idea of playing it. Should be my first desktop in ten years some time around this week though. I might play TF2.

Oh and congrats on the ASI boost on your gun. I'd love to have one of those on my blitz.

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Ramblings of a neurotic degenerate (lockdown and danger rooms)