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Pepperbox line needs a buff.

20 replies [Last post]
Thu, 03/08/2012 - 09:47
Beans's picture
Beans

It's been stated a lot since the bugfix, but I didn't see a proper thread in this section for it, so here we go; Pepperbox needs a buff.

It's been underused forever, even when it was bugged. Low damage, low range, a negligible status effect, and of course, it's an autogun which makes it inherently clunky and often dangerous to use. It pretty much got the short end of the stick in all ways.

The only things that could be considered worthwhile about it were:

1. The neutral damage typing, meaning you did equal damage to all enemies. Unfortunately its damage is too low for this to even matter, since it's going to be outclassed by just about anything else.

2. The vacuum effect bug, which I probably don't have to go into. Simply put, it made the low damage of the pepperbox almost bearable, by dragging enemies towards the gun, resulting in higher chance of bullets hitting their target. This bug has since been fixed.

Even while #2 was still in play, the gun was underused and considered mediocre, if not terrible. Even I only made it because it was unique. (That is, I only got it because no one else ever used the damn thing, since it wasn't worth its cost.) With the bug fixed, and Pepperbox's charge now pushing enemies away, it's even worse than it was before, which was something I didn't think could even happen.

I had already been pushing for a buff before the patch, and now to see it nerfed is just absolutely bizarre to me. You would figure since the devs had been changing things, they would have considered that there would be adverse effects to removing the suction effect, or just that the Pepperbox was underpowered in general, but instead, all we got was a "nerf", which pushed the weapon even further into "lol why would you even make that?" territory.

So, obviously, I'm of the opinion something needs to change to make the weapon worth using again, and I'm looking for other people's thoughts on Pepperbox's current standing and what could be done to put it on equal footing with other weapons.

Personally, I think a straight damage buff would be the most preferable option. Keep the gun as-is, but give it the stopping power it needs. Considering the difference in damage between the Pepperbox and Blitz, this will probably have to be a pretty big increase.

Note that currently, if all bullets of a charge hit, Volcanic Pepperbox does about 1200 to enemies, while Blitz does 1800 to "neutral" enemies, and up to 3200 to enemies it has an advantage against. That is an absurd difference. You would have to buff Pepperbox's damage by +50% just to put it on par with Blitz's damage to neutral enemies, not to mention the Blitz Needle apparently has longer range.

Splitting Pepperbox's damage between normal/elemental might also work, but we have plenty of elemental guns already and the versatility of the Pepperbox is one of the most appealing features, imo, so I'm not really for this idea.

Changing the status effect to anything other than fire would be silly, and I don't think buffing fire's damage or proc-rate would raise the damage output by enough to "fix" the gun.

That's about all I got.

Thoughts? Signs? Disagreements? (Preferably from people who have actually used the pepperbox.)

Also, a pre-emptive note:

I know a handful of people are of the mindset "Stop complaining and just wait for the devs to fix it", but that's actually counter-productive. The devs listen for input from players so they know what needs changing; If you don't "complain", nothing will get fixed. The devs are not omniscient; they need to hear opinions before they can make any changes. So, speak!

Thu, 03/08/2012 - 09:53
#1
Derpules's picture
Derpules
Shake things up.

"Changing the status effect to anything other than fire would be silly, and I don't think buffing fire's damage or proc-rate would raise the damage output by enough to "fix" the gun."

Make it proc all the time, and be a lot more damaging. Create a weapon that actually kills through its DoT. *That* would be interesting in its own way.

Thu, 03/08/2012 - 10:16
#2
Iron-Volvametal's picture
Iron-Volvametal
*Reads Title*

Really?

Thu, 03/08/2012 - 15:12
#3
Verodius's picture
Verodius
+1

This gun struggled to be ok even when it was "bugged" (read: mildly useful) but now it's just crap and it's kind of a blow to those of us who've put a lot of effort into them.

Ideally it should be buffed to at least Blitz-level damage (maybe a bit lower) and have the Vacuum effect added back to it.

Thu, 03/08/2012 - 15:14
#4
Severage's picture
Severage
@Verodius:

They'll never put a bug back in the game, the Vacuum was a bug-fix.

Whether or not they actually buff it is different.

HOWEVER, they'll never buff a Normal damage weapon to a Pure-Piercing weapon's damage.

~Sev

Thu, 03/08/2012 - 15:14
#5
Severage's picture
Severage
@Verodius:

OMG 2 Double-posts in one day.

What's the world coming to?

~Sev

Thu, 03/08/2012 - 15:39
#6
Grittle's picture
Grittle
+1

i being a pepperbox gun user, think the gun needs way than a buff, a new makeover

1. do extra damage, mabey split elemental and normal, but elemental is too overused

2. longer range, i mean it should have a advantage over the blitz in one or two ways, one being the fire Dot, the other should be tighter spread and longer range?

Thu, 03/08/2012 - 17:34
#7
Knightcaptain's picture
Knightcaptain
Thinking outside the box here

What if the damage was buffed a teeny bit BUT more shots are fired per clip with a faster firing speed as well with the ability to aim around while firing. So instead of being a regular damaging gun like everything else this can be more of a crowd controller, peppering enemies with fire and making sure they don't swarm your comrades. I mean isn't that what automatic weapons are good for? Cover fire and all that?

Fri, 03/09/2012 - 11:10
#8
Beans's picture
Beans
~

"Make it proc all the time, and be a lot more damaging. Create a weapon that actually kills through its DoT. *That* would be interesting in its own way."

That does sound pretty cool, but I'm doubtful they'd pull it off decently. I'm certainly not against the idea though.

\ \

I was also thinking they could make the Pepperbox a normal/elemental split type [or pure elemental, whichever] and introduce a 4th Autogun that does normal damage without a status effect.

The normal Pepperbox already seemed like it was taking that path anyway. [ Does this look like a fire weapon to you? http://media.spiralknights.com/wiki-images/e/ec/Pepperbox_ani.gif ]

Sat, 03/10/2012 - 10:20
#9
Aryll's picture
Aryll
!

I think the Pepperbox is fine the way it is. It was meant to be a hipster weapon and it serves that purpose.
To make it useful would just ruin the idea of the gun. :\

No support.

Sun, 03/11/2012 - 16:50
#10
Tapproot's picture
Tapproot
+blank (it's over 9000!!)

"I think the Pepperbox is fine the way it is. It was meant to be a hipster weapon and it serves that purpose.
To make it useful would just ruin the idea of the gun".

Wow... Really? Hipster?? What would be the point of it if it was just to show off... That's just a waste of crowns and ce and would make a noob waste his time making a pitiful weapon?(meh... That was me...) I for one, agree with a buff. Make the gun shadow? I mean you could make it like shadow fire when your facing Vana. And maybe just take away the push back and add a bigger range?
Boost the damage since it's shadow to blitz needle damage and it would be a formidable weapon against gremlins and gremlin healers and powerful against the Royal Jelly like Acheron or Gran Faust...

A hipster weapon...

Sun, 03/11/2012 - 13:33
#11
Beans's picture
Beans
~

Up.

I find it a little hard to believe only 6 people think the Pepperbox needs a buff.

Or at least, disappointing.

Sun, 03/11/2012 - 14:31
#12
Severage's picture
Severage
lol

I find it hard to believe there's only a "Buff Pepperbox" thread every few days and you're saying that. xD

All Normal weapons need a buff imo though...I can't imagine how low Pepperbox's damage must be, being both normal AND having a status effect.

~Sev

Sun, 03/11/2012 - 16:49
#13
Tapproot's picture
Tapproot
Hah! Nitronome with a buff!

Hah! Nitronome with a buff! Bomber would be the most powerful class for that! Don't think you would like LD overrun with the blue screen of death! Anyway, any love for Hellfire? (thought of a name for the shadow-fire pepperbox :D)

Sun, 03/11/2012 - 17:06
#14
Mirrorminx's picture
Mirrorminx
***

Making it an AOE dps gun would be cool. Rather than bumping up the damage, it could have 1.5 times as may shots, and widen the spread further. Then, rather than being a less useful blitz needle (which is what would happen if you just bumped the damage up and made the spread less wide), it would have a superpowered close-range feel, and a wide-spread longrange feel.

Increasing the fire proc would help too. In fact, boosting the chance of status effects on all status weapons would be great. As it is now, they're underpowered, and the status effect isn't reliable enough to justify using them.

Sun, 03/11/2012 - 17:43
#15
Zenpai's picture
Zenpai
Just buff the normal damage

Just buff the normal damage it does. Also: if you get this gun to have CTR max, you will have a fantastic gun for vana's mask. I tried it today. It was a hilarious weapon to use, but it does like 1600 damage per charge to the mask.

Sun, 03/11/2012 - 18:34
#16
Severage's picture
Severage
@Mals:

*cough* Except that Blitz comes from the same line and deals more damage *cough*

~Sev

Sun, 03/11/2012 - 18:38
#17
Tapproot's picture
Tapproot
No Support?

Rly.. no coments about it being shadow? None? No support? I thought it was cool... now just boosting the normal damage is still not going to be as cool as shooting a jelly to the death with shadow fire...

Sun, 03/11/2012 - 22:22
#18
Trollingyou's picture
Trollingyou
Make the bullets pierce through mobs?

If the bullets pierced through mobs it would have more chances of setting things on fire and make it better for crowds. It would also feel like a flamethrower, which seems to be the gun's theme.

I don't agree with making it shadow, sure it'd do more to gremlins and jellies but I don't think it would solve the issue. The blitz needle will still vastly out damage it even if it were shadow.

Sun, 03/11/2012 - 23:40
#19
Severage's picture
Severage
@Zasher:

Sure, it might make it a useful T2 weapon...

But it'd be terrible for FSC.

~Sev

Mon, 03/12/2012 - 06:18
#20
Hexzyle's picture
Hexzyle
@Trollingyou

YES! Make the bullets pierce enemies. That would be so totally awesome!

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