Spiral Knights - Lockdown: Minor Issues

Lockdown: Minor Issues

17 replies [Last post]

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 12:40

Guyinshinyarmour

I've repurposed this thread, so skip responses up 'til the one I got all bolded and stuff.
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How often do you see people using recon in LD? Short of never? Maybe as a curiosity? Incredibly few use the class seriously. The death mark, while useful, just isn't a powerful enough incentive. Even then, most people don't bother with it, opting to just cloak and flank which only really works for opening a fight (you set your enemy off and send then into an attacking frenzy; hard to get close then).

So why not give the mark a little bit of a kick and encourage teamplay a bit. Make if effect class mods. Make the boost run out much faster or have the boost slow down a fair bit for striker. Give the cloak a second warmup or make it more like the chromalisk cloak at random times for recons. Have the shield weakened for guardians. This would make the mark even more powerful and might tempt more people into playing recon, if only to benefit the team and slow down pro strikers. That might be overstepping it's usefulness too, but who knows. Could have the death mark just remove defences, then make a third mark that screws with class mods.
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It seems that only guardians can shield cancel after their ability breaks. I thought the others could shield, it just did nothing. Apparently not, and this *is* a bit unfair.
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Note: None of this part concerns bombs. They are fine, since charging is their only form of attack.

After playing around a bit since the charge change, there's something that strikes me a bot off with them. The whole point of losing the charge on getting hit was to give it a disadvantage, I thought. What I would like to see is for you to walk at normal speed while charging, but then get a movement penalty once it hits charge (LD only; this includes allowing heavy swords to walk around at normal speed when charging). This would discourage people just running around with fully charged weapons and encourage strategic charging (i.e, you charge on the way to a point instead of charging in the locker room or something). It would also encourage people to time it right and release the instant the charge is complete to mitigate the penalty. While I can certainly deal with how it currently is, I think there's nothing wrong with forcing people to have a tactical mind when it comes to charges.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 13:46

Sodaaddict

I like the idea of the recon

I like the idea of the recon mark messing with the striker's boost. It'll force Strikers to play a little more carefully, instead of rushing in with toothpick spam.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 13:51

Iron-Volvametal

...

General Discussion->Suggestions

+1000

I want to see Strikers Complain about "Balance" in Lockdown.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 14:13

Xylka-Mkii

I did Iron, just I didnt rant

I did Iron, just I didnt rant forever on it.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 14:40

Tenkii

deathmark works on shield?

I didn't know the deathmark actually affected the shield's defense. Can anyone confirm? It takes me forever to take out guardian shields so I don't usually bother to attack the shield - just bait a mistimed counter.

Guardians are the only class that can shield-cancel attacks when their shield is 'broken'. You have your full offensive speed at your disposal if your 'invincibility' runs out. If we wanna go with your balancing suggestions, throw that in there too. Why should they be able to cancel their animations when they don't have shieldhealth?

The most interesting thing about this is that it's a semi-complaint about recons.

idk what kind of recons you're running into that they're even a problem.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 15:20

Gwenyvier

I was under the impression

I was under the impression that Death Mark does NOT effect the Guardian Shield. It takes me the same amount of hits to break their shield if they're marked or not. I rarely use a toothpick so I actually have no idea how many of those hits it takes to take down a shield, but for heavy swords its 2-3 hits depending on which of the hits connect with their shield.

~Gwen

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 15:25

Psychodestroyer

What she said, minus the field testing. I assumed the shields weren't affected. I'm pretty sure Nick said that too at some point.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 16:41

Shidara

You forgot one thing...

You never explained what made you write this rant about the death mark. Chances are you just ran into a max damage recon instead. Unless you can tell us exactly what happened that would make you write this out then there is no way we can confirm whether or not there was a slip or if you were simply just not paying attention.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 21:37

Blue-Flood

omg striker toothpick so

omg striker toothpick so under powered no one plays it u have no idea how much skill it takes to hit someone before it registers on their end giving them no chance to dodge it. omg u so noob.

In all honesty, anything to discourage the clone wars that we get to face whenever entering LD I am for. Recon mark can make freaken toothpicks explode for all I care, just something else to bring down the godlike advantage your average skolver striker has. Yes, average.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 22:11

Guyinshinyarmour

Great. The day I decide to make a thread is the day my internet decides to black out for 12 hours.
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@Ironskullkid
Thought Suggestions were for implementing new ideas, not for tweaking existing things. Also wanted to spark discussion on the power of the death mark. Thus, General Discussion. Whatever.

@Seiran
Is that so? Interesting. And it's not the recons that are an issue, it's when you're death marked and trying to fend off a striker or something. When you're fending off multiple targets, you want your shield to not explode so readily.

@Gwenyvier
Pretty sure my shield explodes easier when struck under a death mark. I'd like to think I've played with it enough to notice if it wasn't effected, but who knows. If anyone knows how the mark works, it's someone who actually uses recon a fair bit (i.e, you). Now I'm beginning to doubt myself. Great. -_-

@Shidara
Note: Tone as if I'm confident the shield is weakened
Oh, I can totally deal with the death mark. It's just always rubbed me the wrong way. Why is the guardians ability severely hampered while the others just lose their armour defences? I have no problem with losing inherent defence on my armour; makes the blows you're able to get through all the more devastating. But I cannot in good conscience abide by our shield being weakened too. Once more, it is the *sole* reason anyone goes guardian. As for when I decided to write it up, it was just when I was ruminating on LD while trying to get a mirrored lockbox from FSC. I didn't come here and rage post. I thought it out beforehand. Don't you think my post is a bit too level-headed to be made from rage/spur-of-the-moment action?

@Blueflood
...Which is why I rather like the idea of the mark effecting other classes over it doing nothing to the shield.
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Well, since general consensus is that it doesn't effect the shield, I now feel like more of an idiot than usual. I coulda sworn up down sideways my shield pops faster under the mark... Oh well. Whatever. I'd test it further, but I run guildless and getting death marked in randoms is so rare it's laughable. If anyone would like to confirm, I would appreciate it. Guess I'll turn the thread into a death mark retool thing and move it to suggestions once I get a confirmation.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 03:00

#10

Roarjr

General Balancing

I've come to understand two things about Lockdown: 1) it is severely unbalanced and 2) there is an extremely, extremely low chance that anything will be done to balance it.

As Ironskullkid remarked, the Striker is clearly the carry, the strongest, the fastest, and the best class in LD. Recon, on the other hand, is by far the weakest and underprivileged of the three (come on, the only class to have their power break at the slightest contact?).

As for putting this in the suggestion thread? It's likely to be noticed just as much here as it is there.

Face it, the goal of the three classes were to emphasize the strengths of the three different weapon types. But being that OOO has made it clear that swords will be - by a substantial margin - the strongest of the three weapon types, they will not bother balancing the classes in Lockdown.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 13:56

#11

Iron-Volvametal

...

"Great. The day I decide to make a thread is the day my internet decides to black out for 12 hours."

Yeah...

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 17:23

#12

Guyinshinyarmour

Yup. I'm full of crap. Seiran was nice enough to help me out on confirming. I still woulda swore blind that it did effect the shield. Oh well. For notice:

THREAD STARTS HERE
THREAD STARTS HERE
THREAD STARTS HERE
THREAD STARTS HERE

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 21:56

#13

Skold-The-Drac

EH?!

Recon marks becoming powerful? You joking?

In all honesty this would be somewhat balancing... concerning death mark. In my opinion it should be a lesser curse... eliminate a weapon from the arsenal of others (tooooooooothpiiiiiiick) it helps with the mindgame aspect. I'm actually in favor of the recon's shielded radius becoming a bit larger than it is. So you're actually out of reach of a toothpick's first swing. Instead of "OOOH I'M MARKED IMMA JUST HIT THE ATTACK AND REVEAL THE SWISS CHEESE".

Sat, 04/21/2012 - 08:03

#14

Doctorspacebar

Here's an idea. How about,

Here's an idea. How about, once the shield button's released, the Striker's dash instantly hits zero and has to recharge? (That was someone else's idea, I'm just repeating it.)

Also, please please please make the Striker health penalty percentage based, and the toothpick split Normal/Piercing!

Sat, 04/21/2012 - 10:27

#15

Serell

Real Story :

I was playing LD in a 8 vs 8 match. My whole team decided to go recon on there own free will, and the opposing team went all striker on there own free will. We beat the %^&# out of them.

But i do believe striker is OP, and recon could use a little love.

Sat, 04/21/2012 - 16:47

#16

Sincarnation

I like this

I like this I like it a lot. Make the curse mark slow strikers and nerf shields, but the death mark block use of dash, cloak, and shield.
Still won't balance things i would rather see set health totals by class. Striker may be fastest and strongest but if it dies from 2 hits from any sword/bomb it won't be anywhere near as powerful.

Sat, 04/21/2012 - 19:30

#17

Jemographic

the death mark?

So thats the red mark!
what does it even do???

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Lockdown: Minor Issues