Spiral Knights - Be careful Knights.

Be careful Knights.

22 replies [Last post]

Sun, 04/22/2012 - 05:51

Aplauses

Be careful! There was a stealer out there in Spiral Knight games. They will use this 2 method.

1) For a newbie knight. You need to know that ALL shield will resist full/max status effect. If you doesn't know about it, This will give an advantage for thief to troll you. Well Let say it like this.

Bad Guy: Want to Sell owlite shield Resist Fire MAX for 6000 crown.

Knights: What! It max?! I want to buy it!

Me : Don't get fooled knight. The shield was already MAX.

Bad Guy: Crap!

2) Ok this is a famous one(maybe). Since the recipe symbol is just same, this will give an advantage to thief to troll you with your carelessness. Let say it like this.

The thief: Selling Gran Faust recipe for 25000 crown.

Knights: Wow! It's cheap. I want to buy it!

~Trade scenes~

The thief give you a recipe while the knights give 25000 crown.

Knights: Ok! Cool! ~press confi...

Me: STOP! Don't be lazy Knights! Please check that's the recipe is the original one, not a 1 star recipe.

The thief: You!! #$%@

Ok! That's all i want to shared with you guys. Hope it help and enjoy play the Spiral Knights game with peace. ;)

Sun, 04/22/2012 - 06:08

Tom-Awsm

...

1. This is really just common sense.

2. This should be moved to "New recruits".

3. I still haven't seen anyone actually prove that item X is "already MAX", ie would not benefit from any UV.

EDIT: I should still commend you for trying to help people out, my posts tend to get quite cynical.

Sun, 04/22/2012 - 06:10

Coatl

Too many times have I bought

Too many times have I bought a grey owlite shield with the trader promising me max fire res.
It seems true enough. Racked up 3 so far.

Sun, 04/22/2012 - 06:16

Bopp

is it true?

I haven't seen a shield with this UV, so it hasn't affected me one way or the other, but is it true? I mean, damage and status resistances on armor/helmet can stack beyond Maximum! (see wiki page "Abilities"). Is there any detailed explanation of how damage and status resistances stack on shields? I haven't seen this explained at "Shield" or "Shieldbearer Guide".

Sun, 04/22/2012 - 06:36

Aplauses

Bopp.. It's not the abilities but the resistance. You can see here. http://wiki.spiralknights.com/Shield You can see all shield has Max resistance of Fire/Ice/Shock/Curse/Sleep/Stun/Poison.

Sun, 04/22/2012 - 07:10

Thimol

-----

...stealer...

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Sun, 04/22/2012 - 07:34

Derpules

FYI

6kcr for a Fire Max Owlite *is* a bargain.

1) Collectors will pay at least a few hundred CE for it, even knowing that it's useless.
2) Put it up on the AH and someone else will buy it, whether because of reason 1 or out of ignorance/uncertainty.

Sun, 04/22/2012 - 07:47

Bopp

still don't get it

"Bopp.. It's not the abilities but the resistance. You can see here. http://wiki.spiralknights.com/Shield You can see all shield has Max resistance of Fire/Ice/Shock/Curse/Sleep/Stun/Poison."

When you say "Max", you mean that the bar is as full as possible? That proves nothing. On armors, and on your character's overall protection as displayed in the character window, defenses can extend beyond the bar and still have a measurable effect. Also, defense abilities can stack beyond Maximum!. They are quite different from offensive abilities in this way.

I still see no evidence that a Grey Owlite Shield with no UVs withstands fire attack just as well as a Grey Owlite Shield with a Max! fire UV. But I would be happy to see such evidence.

Sun, 04/22/2012 - 07:55

Juances

meh, maybe a max wll benefit the shield after all techncially. But would it give any considerable improvement in practice?

Sun, 04/22/2012 - 10:17

Tom-Awsm

...

Basically what Bopp said. Bars are by no means an accurate measure of whether something has maximum defence/resistance.

I would research this if I could, but I have no shields with a max status UV except for a circuit breaker shield. Since UV's gain more effect on higher star gear, this should preferably be done with a 5* shield.

Sun, 04/22/2012 - 10:31

#10

Trying

I tested my VPS with low fire in the ATH and it resisted the full duration of the fire grate but was left at the reddish orange color. Anyone with a clean VPS have any results I can compare to?

Sun, 04/22/2012 - 16:23

#11

Qwao

But I still don't understand one thing...

Exactly WHAT goes past all your shield defenses and require the status resist to defend against, or how does status resists work ON shields?

P.S I myself would actually want that fire max owlite shield. :V

Sun, 04/22/2012 - 17:10

#12

Eldibs

Fire Max on an Owlite Shield

Fire Max on an Owlite Shield is not helpful, at least in FSC. A Volcanic Plate Shield will not be able to last any longer than an Ironmight Plate Shield (no Fire resist) when bumping up against those lovely Shadow Fire tiles. A Grey Owlite Shield will outlast them both by a wide margin, because of its Elemental defence. The same is true for Fire Grates and Red Rovers, however, I haven't gotten to test it thoroughly on Vanaduke's "fire snakes." The UV you want on it is Elemental Max, or Shadow Max, depending on how concerned you are about the Slag Walkers. Elemental Max should give you more time on the Fire Grate or up against the Shadow Fire before breaking.

Sun, 04/22/2012 - 18:26

#13

Nexassassin

I always thought that status

I always thought that status resists on shields take place if it breaks because of an attack that causes said status effect, e.g. Slag Walker (that's fire zombie just so you know =P) hits you, shield breaks, you catch fire; fire duration decreased by fire resist on Owlite (?)

Anywho, back on topic, I do think that the biggest danger are trades that don't end in a single trade box (I give you 25k, you give me that Polaris recipe Basil has; Give me X energy and Y crowns so I can craft you Z sword; etc.). I remember a guy who lost what little ce and crowns he had so Mr.X could craft him a Divine Avenger. Poor guy =c

Recommendation, avoid trades like those unless you have full confidence in the other party or willing to lose whatever you trade away (this should be a rule of thumb for ANY kind if trading with other knights, other MMORPG's, the internet, other people IRL, heck even with npc's)

Sun, 04/22/2012 - 18:52

#14

Shue-Donnym

Now I see the world through Diamond Eyes!

eeegggooo

Sun, 04/22/2012 - 18:57

#15

Bopp

responses

Eldlibs makes some assertions, that are probably true and valuable, about how damage arrives at the same time as fire status. But his/her remarks don't answer what I consider to be the fundamental question: Can a GOS with Max! fire resistance resist more fire status than one without?

Nexassassin, you might want to read the wiki articles "Shield" and "Shieldbearer Guide". An activated shield blocks all incoming damage and status from the user, until it breaks. When it's broken or inactive, it blocks nothing from the user at all. How long the shield lasts before breaking is determined by its health, and its damage resistances, and its status resistances, and the incoming damage and status. Not just damage withstood, but also status withstood, lower the shield's health.

Sun, 04/22/2012 - 21:46

#16

Eldibs

It's "his," by the way, Bopp.

My initial data were tests on Grey Owlite, Crest of Almire, Volcanic Plate Shield, and Ironmight Plate Shield.

Crest of Almire, Volcanic Plate Shield, and Ironmight Plate Shield all lasted for the same amount of damage ticks (it was three, if memory serves me correctly), and broke on the last tick. Grey Owlite lasted roughly twice as long. Since, in my experience, Grey Owlite, Crest of Almire, and Volcanic Plate Shield all resist both Vanaduke's "fire snakes" and a Slag Walkers fire breath by the same amount, we can assume the bars are correct in this case and they all have the same Fire resistance. Now, we know that Ironmight Plate Shield has zero Fire resist, but lasts the same amount of time as Crest of Almire and Volcanic Plate Shield under fire sources (excluding attacks which strictly cause Fire and do no actual damage, which seems to be a special case) like Shadow Fire tiles, we can assume that those sources ignore Fire resist, and do strictly elemental damage, and they just occasionally cause Fire as a side effect of the damage.

Now, given that information it would seem that the only cases where Fire Max would be of any use is if you happen to be shielding inside a Slag Walkers fire breath a lot. However, even then, its usability is questionable, as shields with Fire resist usually tend to outlast the breath attack. On the "fire snakes," it's pointless, as they already effectively do no damage to a shield with sufficient Fire resistance, and on Shadow Fire tiles and Fire Grates, it has no effect that I was able to notice. Therefore, for maximum benefit, you would want an Elemental defense UV, unless Slag Walker attacks are a bigger problem for you than the Fire Grates and Shadow Fire tiles, in which case you'd want either a Shadow or Normal defense UV (since they appear to deal split Shadow/Normal damage, even in T3).

However, with that said, my testing was far from thorough, and I would love to see further data. Perhaps tomorrow afternoon, I'll drag my shields back into FSC again, and write down more detailed information, probably in a new topic, to keep from derailing this one further.

Sun, 04/22/2012 - 22:00

#17

Bopp

great

Thanks, Eldlibs, dude (not dudette). I like seeing concrete information. The summary is: Against fire traps, the limiting factor is the elemental protection. Against slag walker breath, no extra fire protection is required, to outlast the attack. Therefore, it may be that extra fire protection confers some benefit in some special situation, but in the common situations tested it does not confer any concrete benefit. So the original poster is essentially right.

Sun, 04/22/2012 - 22:05

#18

Traevelliath

...

You forgot the, "I'll buy that ASI Med Flourish from you for 15k crowns!"

Mon, 04/23/2012 - 08:50

#19

Tom-Awsm

@Bopp: Just because there are

@Bopp: Just because there are very few attacks/hazards that cause only fire status, doesn't mean OP is right. Slag walker breath was mentioned, but ruby greavers was forgotten. Their mist should be similar to the breath attack, and they usually travel in packs, which leads us to my next point.

"Against slag walker breath, no extra fire protection is required, to outlast the attack."

This is only correct when there is only one slag walker breathing on you, which isn't always the case. And in my experience, the breath attack sometimes seems to last abnormally long.

Yes, I know this is nitpicking at a high level, but I like to have all the facts straight.

Mon, 04/23/2012 - 10:33

#20

Bopp

good point

Good points as always, Tom-Awsm. So it would be nice to test GOS without fire UVs, against GOS with fire UVs, while under attack from multiple zombie fire breathers, or multiple fire greavers. But I think we agree that, even if we did find a difference, it would be a pretty special case, not worth shopping for.

Mon, 04/23/2012 - 10:36

#21

Fallconn

FALCON PUNCH!

Volcanic Plate Shield is the best for anything, 'nuff said

Mon, 04/23/2012 - 11:03

#22

Trollin-You

What about the heater shield?
Everyone always forget about the heater shield :,(

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Be careful Knights.