Basically I have a setup that lets me get my ASI to Very High with no UVs (max if I use my swiftstrike, and if I do I use demo armor) and it's working out well. But I've decided to work on building a Barbarous Thorn Shield, and I'm wondering if I should go all the way and work on getting damage maxxed out.
Should I lower my overall ASI to build on sword damage, or should I stay with what I have and continue working on a BTS?
I'll assume you're referring solely to swords at this point. The answer to your question is dependent on your skill as a player. In terms of raw damage per second DB provides a greater increase than an equivalent bonus in ASI. However ASI carries with it the inherent bonus of faster shield canceling which is a huge boost defensively. Some players do maintain that a good offence is a good defence, but in practice ASI is safer. Most players prefer going for an even balance of ASI and DB, hence the prevalence of skolver+vog cub mixed loadouts before the advent of krogmo trinkets.
Note that this line of thought only holds true for swords. DB for guns is much more preferable to ASI. The comparison for bombs is irrelevant for obvious reasons.
I agree with Angelonmy. See the Abilities article on the wiki, for the percentage increases. I would add that ASI amounts to one UV on each of your swords, while damage bonus amounts to many UVs on each of your swords (six monster UVs, bonus against specials such as Vanaduke, bonus in PvP).
From a personal viewpoint, ASI : med at least is a must-have, and Very High is good to have. But maxxing it doesn't make a big difference.
On the other hand, you are going to see every single DB up until Max. That's the reason why I often run DB : Max and ASI : Very High (full wolver armor + 2 trinkets according which wolver I wear + BTS). Then, you can compliment that with ASI : Med on your swords if you are rich enough.
Angelonmy has it spot on. To give some damage results...
With DMG max I can take 6 swings to hit a little over 2.5k dmg against a d24 zombie (~how much damage needs to be done to kill a zombie in a party of 4). With ASI max it takes 9 swings to reach that same point.
based on lancer knightz data:
It takes 3.87 seconds to execute 6 swings with no ASI ((60sec / (31cpm * 3)) * 6)
It takes 4.62 seconds to execute 9 swings with ASI max ((60sec / (39cpm * 3) * 9)
Also, keep in mind that ASI doesn't affect charge attacks, while damage bonus does. If you are carrying a sword with a spammable charge, then damage bonus provides even more incentive.
Typically, I run with DMG max + ASI med.
i used to be an ASI fanboy, then i learned how to shield cancel.
100% situational as to which is better depending on the gear used, the weapons used, the monsters to fight, the user, and the number of players in the party.
Like most people have said, it depends. If you solely use Wolver line gear, it makes this a lot easier. If you want Max on both, get yourself ASI Med UVs on all of your swords and make 2 Elite Slash Modules along with 2 Elite Quickstrike Modules. If you go in Skolver, equip your Quickstrikes. If you go in Vog, equip your Slash modules.
You'll get used to either ASI or +Dam. Whatever you like better is the one to go with. Arguing one is better than the other involves getting some REALLY precise data, which in the end doesn't influence gameplay enough to care about.
1 thing to note is you can get a pure asi UV. ASI (low-very high). THere is however no pure damage UV, they are split per monster class. This means ASI UV==ASI bonuses from shield an armor. Damage UVs =/= Damage bonus from skolver/snarby. Thus as you eventually get better UV's you can supplement ur asi adequately with UV's, but u can never Supplement Damage with UV's.
Same thing for CTR UV and CTR trinkets. U can supplement 1 with the other. Universal Damage bonus can only be found on as innate equipment buffs and trinkets however.
P.S. I prefer ASI over DMG increase if i had to pick one or the other. Swiftstrike Buckler+Skolver/snarb set+1 dmg trinket+1 asi trinket maxes them both i believe or maybe its dmg max+asi ultra. Too lazy to do the exact math right now.
For the reasons Pawn mentions (despite his own preference), and also because the tough monsters are typically the ones you don't want to full combo against anyway. That means you only need enough ASI for safe shield cancelling; any more is nice to have, but not a big deal.
If you want to rush through easy content, you also want ASI to be able to place a full combo before the mob(s) hit you, so it either attack cancel or knock them back too far away so you don't get hit.
Sorry to bring this up again, but what about CTR?
For some people, kiting while charging is huge, but what would be the advantages and disadvantages of very high CTR to very high DB/ASI?
If you only charge, the answer is obvious, the gain from ASI is small, and a faster charge time will end up dealing more DPS than slow charges with damage bonuses.
Ctr is generally safer than using asi to smack into a crowd of enemies. Most weapons have a higher dps using autoattacks, unless its a almost charge specialized weapon like autogun, alchemer, and maybe a few I've missed.
Usually ASI