Would you use it if...
So, 08/05/2012 - 06:04
1...Royal jelly/armor shield had twice as much piercing defense and half as much normal defense, with a touch more health?
2...Dread skelly/armor shield had twice as much shadow defense and half as much normal defense, with a touch more health?
3...Plate armor had no negative attributes to weapons/movement?
4...Sudaruska/Triglav did equivalant damage on neutral targets when compared to to gran faust/divine avenger, and swung just as fast?
5...Barbarous thorn shield was stripped of its piercing resistance?
6...Divine avenger's charge attack did not stick to walls?
7...Gran faust's charge attack did not stick to walls+took the same amount of time to charge as faust?
8...Big Angry Bomb had a larger radius, and a chance to deal stun?
9...If the stun that stagger storm dealt was "fixed" to not make things attack twice?
10...There was a haze bomb that dealt sleep?
11...There was a point damage bomb similar in charge and detonation to radiant sun shards with a very small radius that dealt about 500ish normal damage?
12...There was a curse haze bomb that only cursed things for 1/2 a second, so that they had to be in the radius to be cursed?
13...Cautery sword had life steal?
14...There was an upgrade to swiftstrike buckler that halved its health and defenses for one more level of ASI?
15...Dark Briar Barrage did not flinch beasts as easily?
I'm also interested if you already use these (provided they exist), and what you think of them.
Notes:
10: Keep in mind that poison+sleep = no movement+not healing, and not no movement + constant damage from sleep.
12: The 'curse status' would wear off in 1/2 of a second, meaning that players in lockdown could effectively fly through it and continue to attacking as if nothing had happened. On top of that, they would still retain their ability to attack when cursed but at the cost of their own health.
13: The "life steal" mechanic on the cautery sword is made so that it forces enemies to drop extra hearts when they are killed the first time, and only if a fair portion of the damage done to it is dealt with the cautery sword.... lets say a lumber has a "cautery value" (based on the number of drops it is likely to give) of 1 big red heart- if you deal 1/4 - 1/2 the damage to it will drop 1/2 of a big red heart.
This means that no revived gremlins/zombies will drop hearts, and damaging the enemy with another weapon+finishing him is not going to get you any more hearts- you'd actually have to use the sword.
So, 08/05/2012 - 06:25
#2
There are people that use these already, but I'm wondering if these issues would be make or break to many people for the itemes they apply to. I am aware that many people use DA/GF as they are.
So, 08/05/2012 - 08:52
#3
Herp herp
12 is, contrary to what you may think, not as much as a nerf as you may believe. The cursed items of a target is randomized. Someone with 4 weapons slots can safely use two of his non-cursed weapons (or more if he has curse resistance). By being cursed for half a second at a time the 'safe' weapon he's using could suddenly end up not being so, making it even more effective for as long as the player is within the haze.
It would easily surpass VT and SS as the only bombs worth using in Lockdown.
It would also be pretty powerful in PvE, so a definite yes.
Yes to 9 and 10.
As for 15: Yes, as long as it'll still flinch gremlins.
Edit:
8: Yes, but it would need a radius even bigger than Nitro.
11: It sounds kind of useless. RSS isn't powerful because of any one aspect of it. It's powerful because of all of them.
So, 08/05/2012 - 06:51
#4
:D
Royal jelly: Might be worth using in Lockdown against the toothpicks, but I probably wouldn't. Plus it would make every other weapon more effective against you
Dread Skelly: (Making it now) I suppose, but my issue with stripping normal defense down is that everything does at least some normal damage, so it may be less effective in the end
Plate Armor: Eh. I think in the end the damage bonus of skolver would win me over
Sudaruska: I use it anyway, but YES. PLEASE YES
Barbarous: Ya. i use it in FSC and there isnt much piercing damage anyway. (besides spike traps and the few slimes)
Divine Avenger: Would be more inclined to, but im a fan of how brandish is faster. in regular attacks and releasing the charge
Gran Faust: I dont ever use the charge anyway. too much risk for me. however i do like Gran Faust more then Acheron for some reason :P
Big Angry Bomb: Not really a bomber. but if i was it would definitely make me consider it a bit more
Stagger Storm: Yup.
Sleepy Haze Bomb: Would be REALLY overpowered imo. So ya I would xD
Point Damage Bomb: maybe. would take some skill/getting used to, but I could see it being pretty useful against slower enemies
Curse Haze Bomb: Maybe. It would be over powered if it had the same charge and fuse time as the normal haze bombs. If it had a longer charge time I could see it being reasonable.
Cautery Sword: It would be interesting to be sure. but its only 3* so it damage would be pitiful in t3, and there are swords that would be better just because you could kill things before you need lifesteal
4* Swiftstrike: Sure would
Dark Briar Barrage: Dont really use it anyway. But it would take away the main reason i used to use it. If it didnt flinch everything so easily, you would get overwhelmed far to quickly for the bomb to be viable.
Well thats my 2 cents :P
So, 08/05/2012 - 07:32
#5
Royal jelly: NO
Dread Skelly: NO
Plate Armor: NO
Sudaruska: NO
Barbarous: YES
Divine Avenger: YES
Gran Faust: YES
Big Angry Bomb: NO
Stagger Storm: YES
Sleepy Haze Bomb: NO
Point Damage Bomb: NO
Curse Haze Bomb: NO
Cautery Sword: YES
4* Swiftstrike: YES
Dark Briar Barrage: YES
So, 08/05/2012 - 09:15
#6
Here are my answers.
Royal jelly: NO (I'd still use Wolver lines)
Dread Skelly: NO (ditto)
Plate Armor: NO (ditto)
Sudaruska: YES (I'd use the Suda if I could afford to make one... /sad)
Barbarous: Mebbe... OK, then YES (Seeing as the Swifty has no 5* variant, this is best for sword buffs)
Divine Avenger: YES (I'd use it anyway)
Gran Faust: YES (ditto, even without the charge buff)
Big Angry Bomb: I don't know. Probably NO (I'd use the Nitro for more mobility)
Stagger Storm: NO (It's stun! Stun does no damage!)
Sleepy Haze Bomb: NO (freeze is better)
Point Damage Bomb: NO (I can't kite that well!)
Curse Haze Bomb: YES (You are goin' DOWN, Mr. Royal Jelly Sir)
Cautery Sword: YES (Oh man, I'd love to see a healing item...)
4* Swiftstrike: YES!!!!!! (I love the Swifty, if you hadn't already noticed)
Dark Briar Barrage: I wouldn't use the DBB anyway, but if so... YES (If it didn't flinch devilites, I'd be in some serious trouble - beasts aren't really a problem)
That help?
So, 08/05/2012 - 09:29
#7
how is freeze better then
how is freeze better then sleep? Freeze they can still attack, while asleep they cant do anything at all.
So, 08/05/2012 - 09:30
#8
1 and 2. Enemies still do plenty of normal. How good would it truly be?
3. I still prefer armors with bonuses. More defense is worthless here. Ancient might be interesting
4.I dont use nromal damage weapons
5. Probably yes. But please dont...
6.I already use it as it is so....
7.YES
8.Maybe
9.YES
10.I'm happy with shiver. But on LD..... *evil laugh*
11.What?
12.Constant spamming breaks it again.
13.Healers and totems = farm health
14. SSB already breaks easily, less defense should not be a problem.
So, 08/05/2012 - 16:37
#9
Sleep heals them while they are frozen. I'm pretty sure they heal based on a percentage of their health, ruining its use for boss fights.
So, 08/05/2012 - 18:19
#10
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1. Nope.
2. Nope.
3. Nope.
4. Yep. I sort of use them already though. I was in love with the then-Khorovod's charge attack (surrounding rocks) and still see its potential for charge. I'd be more than happy to see at least a speed boost.
5. Yes and no- I'd use it for its sword attack, but at the same time, I'd probably still prefer swiftstrike over that now.
6. Yes - I use it already though - the first hit is fine. Also, I use it with vortex, so walls aren't usually an issue.
7. YES. Gran Faust was my first 5* sword (since Khorovod was its max), and I even built Valkyrie as my first set in preparation for curse spamming. Imagine the disappointment. I basically stopped using it.
8. Maybe - not much of a bomber, but that sounds interesting.
9. Yes. I already use it as a play-around bomb though. Stun is actually pretty fun when it works.
10. Yeah, lol.
11. Maybe - not much of a bomber though.
12. Yes. Cool. I'd totally use it with vortex. Also, it'd probably be absolutely broken for people with curse resist and 4 weapons. Every re-curse would curse a different set of weapons >:/
13. Never made one. Not really interested in 3 hits swords.
14. Yes.
15. Nope, not interested in 3 hit swords.
So, 08/05/2012 - 18:06
#11
Let us see...
1...Maybe I would use it, though as an hybrid I would choose Skolver... I am missing a piercing armor yet, C42 is making me think of making one.
2...Nah, I use Crest of Almire, it is enough to me.
3...I use Ancient Armor Set for "normal type" or fun. To run, I use elemental sets usually... I don't "like" plate mail, so no anyway.
4...Most likely I would finish that Troika I have lost over there, as I may want some normal type weapons other than my Nitronome.
5...NO, and please don't touch it, it is my piercing shield, ideal as hybrid too as it increases my performance with swords.
6...Nah, I use Polaris, I prefer Gran Faust too.
7...I would use it even more, yes.
8...Isn't that change coming? I prefer the new Irontech Destroyer too, which I have one due to a "christmas present" in a Treasure Vault.
9...Nah, the "new Radiant Sun Shards", which I hope DOESN'T substitute it rather than just add it has Stun, and I would prefer as said befor IDestroyer.
10...Yes, though I would prefer even more so a damage bomb that did Sleep : )
11...Mines? Yes, please. NOW.
12...Most likely yes, only though when in a team. Curse+Shiver= Striped enemies.
13...Why of course, but wouldn't it be OP? As a survival tool it would be a must have, I would most likely even buy a weapon slot to always carry it.
14...Of course, I have one and it is really useful, though you have to know how to act with it.
15...I wouldn't want such a nerf, but yes, why not? I use it to deal damage to groups of beasts/fiends/etc and it works wonders, flinching or not. Just make circles...
And that is it XP
So, 08/05/2012 - 18:57
#12
Added a few notes to the OP. These are not aimed at changing opinions, they are aimed at correcting a few misconceptions that I've seen in people's responses.
So, 08/05/2012 - 19:03
#13
No to the first four, because
No to the first four, because when I craft new armors, it's going to be for bonuses or status resists. Also, I have other priorities over crafting a 4th heavy sword. Yes to everything else. I like bombs, and already use half of them. What's holding me back is finding more good ctr bombs.
Mo, 08/06/2012 - 11:29
#14
Hmmm
1. No. If it retained it's normal defense, I would use it.
2. No. See 1.
3. No. Normal defense bonus does not outweigh offensive bonus on offense armors.
4. No. If haze bombs did not exist I would use them.
5. No. Rather use swiftstrike and benefit everything.
6. No. I have other things for powerful charge attacks.
7. No. Don't like curse.
8. Yes. Would be a "Get off of me" bomb.
9. Yes. Imagine everything moving in slow motion.
10. Would be used in every loadout for both arcade and Lockdown. Trolololol.
11. No. I mainly use bombs for area control.
12. Yes for Lockdown, no for arcade. Can kill things faster by spamming AoA + VT.
13. Depends. If you take down a mobs health to almost dead and then deal the final blow with the Cautery, will they still drop hearts?
14. Yes. ASI > a small amount of shield health from an already small value.
15. Yes. It's good for more than just beasts.
Mo, 08/06/2012 - 12:45
#15
~
1... Maybe a helm. When playing the gunner role, I typically stack Shadowsun with a piercing helm just so I'm not completely without piercing defence.
2... This would be tempting for the fiend specific levels.
3... Not really. Even ignoring the penalties, I don't see any real significant benefits over other armour sets.
4... No. If a gunner I'll typically pair up my firearms with one of the specialised damage swords. This really only leaves me at risk for Danger Rooms but that's fine by me.
5... Maybe when running as a swordie. I already use it in elemental damage themed levels despite only having a low Element UV. I'd certainly miss the piercing blocking power but I might still be too fond of the damage bonus.
6... I already use DA so yeah. Right now I just have to be careful not to be too close to a wall.
7... I use GF too. I don't use the charge that much but I do fire it off sometimes into a large crowd. I might use the charge a bit more and risk the self curse if it had a better charge time and had the bug fix.
8... Not really a bomber, but might depend on the frequency and strength of stun.
9... If only I didn't have to play PvP for it. ;_; If it weren't for that I might be making one now.
10... Probably, yeah. Stack it with someone dropping VV around the place.
11... I have no idea.
12... For PvE this seems largely useless when fire and shock would deal damage easier and for longer. So no, I probably wouldn't.
13... No. My health would fare better if I can kill enemies faster and/or more safely rather than using a weaker sword that can make more hearts drop.
14... I don't use the existing SSB because I don't like the idea of the weaker defences. So no.
15... Probably. Hopefully it would still knock down gremlins though.
Mo, 08/13/2012 - 06:59
#16
1) No. I use
1) No. I use wolver/gunslinger/demo armour for the offensive bonuses
2) see 1
3) see 1
4) Yes,I'd probably make one eventually anyway, this would just give me more reason to do so
5) Yes, I only use it for the damage bonus really
6) Yes, I use it anyway
7) see 6
8) Yes, I use it anyway and absolutely love it. Haven't touched Nitro since I made it
9) Only for LD but it was useful there anyway. Would never use it in PvE
10) Maybe, it would certainly be interesting. Would pair great with a VV
11) No, I never particularly enjoyed the old RSS (which seems to be main influence of this bomb) even though I used it
12) Yes, purely for the sake of interest. Would be deadly in LD I imagine
13) No, I'd rather use the weapon slot on something more useful
14) Yes, it has crap defense anyway, the extra ASI would be worth it
15) Yes, would still be awesome even if it didn't flinch as often.
As has already been explained to you in a couple of threads, many people use Divine Avenger and Gran Faust as it is. In particular, the sticking-to-walls behavior, that seems to bewilder you so thoroughly, is not really much of an issue.
But it's true that I rarely use Gran Faust's charge attack, because it's so slow. If it were faster (say, as fast as DA's), then I would use it more.