Spiral Knights - Recon's death mark suggestion

Recon's death mark suggestion

14 replies [Last post]

Sun, 11/11/2012 - 13:37

Mentlegen

Okay, I was playing lockdown for the last couple of days, and, surprisingly, was having some good fun.
I'm not experienced or anything, so don't bash me hard.
So, I was using whb, and, for some reason, was doing better with it than most of my swords..mostly playing recon.
Okay, so here's a suggestion.

Make the death mark remove all the invincibility frames.

...The reason is because my whb wasn't hitting all of the strikes, and the potential damage was lost.
So yeah, tell me what you think and if it's worth changing just to improve a couple of weapon performances.
Thanks.

...and strikers are still annoying

Mon, 11/12/2012 - 10:33

Mentlegen

Come on people, at least a

Come on people, at least a simple yes/no

Mon, 11/12/2012 - 10:46

Burntsouls

Im writing now to make you

Im writing now to make you happy :3 Also it would be good, since recons are UP.(I bet this argument will cause a firestorm)

Mon, 11/12/2012 - 10:46

Zerokken

Maybe it could shorten the

Maybe it could shorten the invincibility frames by 3/4, not deleting them completely. But it sounds like an okay idea.

Mon, 11/12/2012 - 10:47

Darkbrady

Invinci frames were away for

Invinci frames were away for a weekend from a bug, and certain weapons, such as the Blitz and Hammer became OP out the ass.

I think removing status resistances/UV bonuses would be better suited, as it'd allow high hp classes (that won't be much affected by losing some of their low def) more vulnerable, especially when bombers are a threat, but without suddenly making hammer recons godmode.

Mon, 11/12/2012 - 14:21

Psychodestroyer

"certain weapons, such as the Blitz and Hammer became OP out the ass."

Take him seriously on that one, it was really bad.

Everybody whipped out their Blitz's and other Autogun Variants. You so much as got clipped by one, you were dead.

Oh so very dead.

I'm ok with shortening them tho.

Mon, 11/19/2012 - 00:40

Blandaxt

also

side not, how about removing the icon that comes up on other players to tell when a recon is close to player when not capturing the space area. i feel it reduces recon abilities too much as to stay unoticed. recons should just have the icon that shows there capturing the area, not the one that shows there near, just destroys the point of a suprise attack.

Mon, 11/19/2012 - 00:47

Forum-Brady

Removing it entirely would

Removing it entirely would make the deathmark OP, but giving recons the option to not "pulse" either the warning or the deathmark would be....mmmm...up for debate.
It could allow recons to sneak around and hide on CPs easier, but also make it a bit too easy to ninja-attack, as right now this incurs some healthy risk with the warning, forcing recons to be fast and time a quick attack; we don't want recons being able to just stand next to players indefinitely waiting for the ideal moment to strike.

I'd need to think on that, more~

Mon, 11/19/2012 - 00:56

Blandaxt

well

there suppose to be ninjas, and not that many players stay in one place the whole time. i want recons to have the ability to sneak away from their spawn point without being noticed. because when there a spam of pulsars blocking the way and that dam icon that notices a recon is passing next to them, then theres no way to sneak out. i sugest the icon be available when they are capturing points so they can have an easy escape when strikers come to see who is capturing there station or area.

Mon, 11/19/2012 - 01:16

Forum-Brady

Well you can see the pulses

Well you can see the pulses you create and fairly easily time your movements to pass other players so as to sneak up and ninja attack or just pass them by without creating a warning sign.

Balance is an issue, as the warning logo forces recons to be clever ninjas who care about timing and precision, whereas removing the mark altogether would make such things far too easy; recons would become incredibly destructive if they have all the time in the world to plan an attack. Eventually you'll see a player stop or regularly move in a pattern that you can take advantage of; the warning sign limits your options so that more skill is involved.
However I do agree that in some situations it simply becomes a hassle for the recon in question and makes their life harder without any benefit.

~
Although as for escaping the spawn point, Stadium is the only map where this should ever be a problem, if you have two bombers or three polarises spamming at your walls. Every other map in the game offers multiple escape options that people simply fail to take advantage of. It's easy to get drawn in by the spawncamping and want to go "to that" as you escape and get caught, but going to the far exits or keeping to walls as you sneak past players is actually very easy to do. Stadium is the only map where a spawn can be 100% blocked off, and even that almost requires bombers.

Another thing to remember is to cloak and wait briefly before you go through the gates. Not only can people see recons shortly after they cloak, but prediction is an element too; if you cloak and run straight out, players will be able to guess with accuracy where you are. If you wait a few seconds, cloaked, before heading out, no one will know where you are and won't be able find you quite so easily.

Mon, 11/19/2012 - 01:33

#10

Blandaxt

true

well, u make a good argument, just wanted a way for recons to get the same damage reach as strikers and be as annoying as them in terms of how they can circle you and continuously slash at you with their swords. very anoying.

Mon, 11/19/2012 - 11:46

#11

Mohandar

Recons are well-balanced.

Recons are well-balanced. The main tweak I would propose is that the recon cloak would short out for 2-3 seconds after a hit, but your special gauge would not deplete (or would only take damage, similar to guardian shield). The class only seems underpowered because Strikers are so overpowered.

And the main reason the Striker class is overpowered is due to heart pendants- the class is designed to be a glass cannon, not a wrecking ball on speed. I would much rather they fix the striker problem by capping their max health, rather than nerfing some other aspects. Strikers are supposed to hit hard and hit fast, just not have the staying power of a Guardian. Capping max health won't change the fact that if you are a skilled Striker, you can still wreck someone one-on-one.

And on that note, Guardians are fairly well-balanced as a class too- again they only seem underpowered because of the health discrepancy given to Strikers from pendants. The shield could be slightly stronger, with mechanics to prevent hits on allied players from double-counting though.

Mon, 11/19/2012 - 14:24

#12

Forum-Brady

same damage reach as

same damage reach as strikers

If you want damage, run a striker. Recons are not designed, by their very nature, to be a damage class. Strikers can hunt people down, circle and attack and cross the map to new targets quickly. They're for hitting people a lot and spreading pain. Recons are for assassinations and have a much higher focus on decapping and capping. Recons with lower damage than strikers is to be expected, and to compare your recon damage to striker damage is as separate a point as wondering why guardians can tank more than strikers (should be able to).

@Mohander:
Pretty much. I run my striker in Vog and can still get very high damage (and believe me, I'm not a great striker); losing heart pendants does little to nerf the class as a whole, as much as it does to just put a ceiling on their ability to dominate a map single-handedly.

As for recons, I feel that their cloak-breaking is simply what breaks their class, regardless of how UP/OP any other class is. It's far too easy for a recon to be made immediately defenceless by any other player in the game.

Guardians, I semi-agree. A 1v1 Guardian-Striker should be balanced - damage vs shield hp, but the heart pendants nerf that and give strikers all the advantage, however even if strikers had the hp they were supposed to, I would still feel guardians are UP. Their bonuses, for one, are incredibly underwhelming. They get a grand total of +2 while strikers get a very relevant +4 and a very irrelevant -4 (and even then, striker bombers don't take much to run effectively). It just doesn't balance. (I don't mention recons because although they get the most bonuses, they're spread across multiple weapons)

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 05:55

#13

Aizuh

Agreed with Blandaxt

it defeats the purpose of having a recon player on the team when that mark is there, plus other players spam the flourishes to find out where recons are sneaking off too. which gets annoying to a certain point. but i equipped myself with evading recons and being able to strike them as quickly as possible. the only worst part about recons are when they are bombers i'm still working on training against those and hammer recons. some hammer recons interrupt attacks with the bash + leap forward. highly irritating.

Tue, 11/20/2012 - 06:04

#14

Forum-Brady

it defeats the purpose of

it defeats the purpose of having a recon player on the team when that mark is there,

It'd be far too easy to get deathmarks on people without the warning sign. Your whole team could just be chillin' then BAM deathmarked and an offscreen Driver charge flies in, or a striker boosts in and swings his GF.

Everyone'd just die w/o a chance. The warning says "uh oh, recon about" and forces them to either try and find them or flee the scene. Sometimes the warning alone is enough to make people leave CPs.

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Recon's death mark suggestion