Spiral Knights - Leeching players in the Clockworks.

Leeching players in the Clockworks.

47 Réponses [Dernière contribution]

jeu, 11/29/2012 - 02:59

Pawsmack

Hello fellow knights! (I'm new to the forums so please don't bash this thread.)

I searched the forums and found nothing on this subject. The idea emerged in my mind earlier while I was down in the Clockworks and I decided to offer one of my friends to join me on an F.S.C. run. They declined and said "I'm too lazy to do a run right now.", so I thought of a new idea that was probably never introduced to the community. Leeching players.

Example: John wants to do a Jelly King run and get a few extra crowns out of it and his friend Peter wants to join but he's about to miss a 15 minute show on T.V. So John decides to tell him he can join and leech off of him doing the run as long as he pays 1k Crowns in return. So Peter agrees and comes with John. Peters dies then watches his show on T.V. Once the commercial comes up Peter checks on the run and suddenly John is on the elevator. He goes down and lets himself die again. John continues and does the rest of the run. Peter pays John the 1k Crowns and both are now content with the gain. John gets 3.7k Crowns and Peter gets 1.7k Crowns.

What I mean by "Leeching players.", is if a person doesn't feel like putting much effort into a run but they still want the reward. They could just join the run and let them self/themselves die while the other person does the work (Only if the person who dies and lets the other person do the work wants Crowns, Materials, and Tokens from the run, as it will provide little heat.). While they're dead they can go do something else meantime and estimate the amount of time the person will get it done. Depending on how much time they say they will take or how much time they take you pay them a certain currency (C.E./Crowns). You can pay them before the run or after. Up to you or the other person.

Just make sure they're trustworthy and aren't going to scam you.

And that concludes my idea for now! I'll be back to proof read, edit, and etc.

jeu, 11/29/2012 - 03:53

Zaffy-Laffy

Why would you let other

Why would you let other people leech, they are going to take advantage of you while you carry them around on a run. Monsters will get harder, you will get less materials and your friend will earn crowns by doing nothing.

It is the same as going solo but at a higher difficulty and lower material output.

jeu, 11/29/2012 - 03:55

Flowchart

People just do that with their alt(s) anyway and get all the money.

jeu, 11/29/2012 - 04:52

Forum-Brady

Called "corpse-dragging"

Called "corpse-dragging" typically.

Also, on an off-topic note, why do people feel that "new forummers" shouldn't be "bashed"? If your thread is bash-worthy, it shouldn't matter whether it's your first or hundredth...

jeu, 11/29/2012 - 10:32

Pawsmack

Responses.

@Sdkfzafk

I don't think you read everything I posted. I said that they would pay you before or after the run. I also said do it with someone you trust.

@Flowchart

You have to have two accounts for that and you also have to be willing to do a bit more work than just a solo or party. I said some people are too lazy .

@Forum-Brady

Instead of bashing someone new to the forums you should give constructive criticism. As they have little to no experience compared to other people who have been at it for quite a bit.

jeu, 11/29/2012 - 09:03

Little-Juances

If you're dead at the end of a level, you'll revie with 3 pips of health on the next. If you don't move at all, you'll get auto-kicked from server.
Corpses still need some attention, you can't leave them forever.

"you also have to be willing to do a bit more work than just a solo or party. "
What extra work? input the password? xD

But leaving all of that aside, this is morally wrong. No kind of leeching is good. If people are lazy ok, let them rot in a corner, don't promote more lazyness.

jeu, 11/29/2012 - 22:57

Pawsmack

Response.

@Little-Juances

"If you're dead at the end of a level, you'll revie with 3 pips of health on the next. If you don't move at all, you'll get auto-kicked from server.
Corpses still need some attention, you can't leave them forever."

I made an example for things like that. I also said "estimate".

"What extra work? input the password? xD"

Typical question. But I guess I may as well answer. They have to be willing to make two accounts. Not everyone has a steam account or a regular Spiral Knights website account. You also still have to actually work with your alternate characters to get them through certain mechanics and aspects of the game.

"But leaving all of that aside, this is morally wrong. No kind of leeching is good. If people are lazy ok, let them rot in a corner, don't promote more lazyness."

Yes, but which is better? Corpse-dragging an alternate character and getting double the Crowns in no time, or corpse-dragging a friend that will pay you a certain amount of Crowns back? You tell me.

jeu, 11/29/2012 - 09:46

Forum-Brady

I said "bash worthy". Plenty

I said "bash worthy". Plenty of "new forummers" make posts that are plainly and obviously stupid; I don't think that being your first post forgives something like that or merits you special treatment, especially if they're based around laziness, bad attitudes, idiocy etc. It happens, and I see no reason for sugar-coating it.

Not saying your post is like that; you're talking about an idea that people do, and didn't know was used alreayd. Fair enough, you get the answers you want. But you also don't need to tell people not to "Bash" you because of that. Explaining taht you're new so not to be mean won't change anything, is all I mean. You've either posted something stupid and will get railed, or you've posted something "nooby" and will be informed as such, get any relevant information, get gaps filled in etc; people won't likely bash threads like that, so telling them not to won't change it.
And the people who do bash threads like that will ignore you telling them not to, because they're trolls. S'all they do anyways.

Not to go on a total tangent there , just thought I'd ponder on that..publicly.

Anyhoo! On-topic:

Corpse-dragging has been stated that it's not against any rules or the ToS to do so, but the GMs/Devs would rather players not do it because it is ethically and morally abusive, and "kills the spirit of the game". You don't get punished for it but they'd rather you not do it and just play the game regularly. As for allowing other players to be corpse-dragged it's really up to you, because you're doing extra work to benefit them etc. Although some people pay for things like this. For example, they want the cr, they give you the heat (or vice versa) or just want the boss tokens etc and give you the remainder. That's more up for discussion because it's less about laziness and more about them "buying your services" as it were~

jeu, 11/29/2012 - 10:33

Pawsmack

You know.

I didn't ever say it wasn't bash worthy, I was just pleading that you don't. Constructive criticism is much more productive. Anyway I do agree with you on the half part about the taking the fun out of the game. But isn't that exactly the same when you purchase CE? Isn't the game completely driven by CE? Either way it was just an idea that came to me, and nothing more.

Look at this to think of it all in a much more positive way,

John wants to do a Jelly King run and get a few extra crowns out of it and his friend Peter wants to join but he's about to miss a 15 minute show on T.V. So John decides to tell him he can join and leech off of him doing the run as long as he pays 1k Crowns in return. So Peter agrees and comes with John. Peters dies then watches his show on T.V. Once the commercial comes up Peter checks on the run and suddenly John is on the elevator. He goes down and lets himself die again. John continues and does the rest of the run. Peter pays John the 1k Crowns and both are now content with the gain. John gets 3.7k Crowns and Peter gets 1.7k Crowns.

jeu, 11/29/2012 - 10:38

Forum-Brady

Well I did say that I see a

Well I did say that I see a difference when the corpse/leecher is paying for your services. If not then it's out of sheer laziness.

The only time the "moral" situation occurs is when you corpse-drag an alt, as you're doing essentially the same amount of work for double the cr, which is kinda iffy, ethically~

jeu, 11/29/2012 - 10:44

#10

Pawsmack

Response.

@Forum-Brady

I'm not going to deny, I did use the words "I'm new to the forums", to make an excuse so people wouldn't bash it. But I figured "Hey maybe some of these guys will give advice to me instead of bashing.", so I had to go about saying that in a certain way. I was venting at that time and didn't get to proofread. So now I can't edit that since someone decided to comment on it before I even had time to fix it. I don't want to make you look like a fool so I'll just leave it there.

EDIT: Also just noticed another comment from you. Exactly, this isn't anywhere as bad as the people who farm for double the Crowns by bringing an alt to a run.

jeu, 11/29/2012 - 10:47

#11

Forum-Brady

Maybe I wasn't clear; I was

Maybe I wasn't clear; I was just commenting that I don't get why people "plead that we don't" as it will or won't happen regardless of whether you ask, for the reasons I gave.
I don't think your thread is worthy of "bashing", as it is something people do and discuss often enough~

jeu, 11/29/2012 - 10:50

#12

Pawsmack

Response.

See? You were venting just now also. That's exactly why your comments weren't clear. Seems like everything just comes to equal ground eventually.

jeu, 11/29/2012 - 10:51

#13

Canine-Vladmir

HEY!

i used to do that!

jeu, 11/29/2012 - 10:57

#14

Forum-Brady

Oh aye I totally was; I have

Oh aye I totally was; I have a habit of doin' that. Derailin' stuff a lot lately, actually c.c....

jeu, 11/29/2012 - 13:19

#15

Imorri

Think I might try this with

Think I might try this with some friends. :3

jeu, 11/29/2012 - 22:46

#16

Pawsmack

Thanks for the posts guys.

ven, 11/30/2012 - 01:37

#17

Meomap

If the host is not his

If the host is not his friend, he can kick the AFK player. So his friend has to be the host. But then when he AFK but not dead (so lucky I guess), then the team cannot move on, so the host has to kick him anyway.

ven, 11/30/2012 - 01:45

#18

Msaad

Welcome to the forums

You're the guy who owned me in LD.. xD
It's a good idea +1 But please move it to suggestions

ven, 11/30/2012 - 05:53

#19

Imorri

Hm.

Actually what about the person who is leeching their friend? Won't they have to sacrifice precious materials in the process? What if an important Material drops and goes to the dead person who's leeching and the amount that the dead person pays their buddy isn't worth as much as the material?

ven, 11/30/2012 - 05:54

#20

Pawsmack

Responses.

@Meomap

If the person who is being leeched is already dead (Which they should be.) they automatically move to a pad that activates the mechanics on the map. So once again do it with someone you trust and make sure you're already dead.

@Msaad

Yeah. I wasn't sure if it should be in Suggestions considering it seems that most of the threads there are suggestions to OOO's. But I'll be sure to do that in a second.

@Paraneth

Well... I guess it can be sort of a gamble sometimes.

lun, 12/03/2012 - 16:07

#21

Pawsmack

/Disappointed

No more feedback?

Anyway if I do magically end up getting more feedback then make sure you read the entire post. If you want questions answered look at past comments. Have something new? Just post it if it hasn't been mentioned yet. ._.

lun, 12/03/2012 - 21:02

#22

Flareminute

Well……………………

mar, 12/04/2012 - 05:58

#23

Melisan

ok, you've had your

ok, you've had your Constructive criticism (cheers brady) now here's the bottom line
your idea is stupid the premise is flawed and people do it anyway.

mar, 12/04/2012 - 08:01

#24

Pawsmack

Response.

@Melisan

"People do it anyway.", Eliciting the fact that they don't pay you at the end of the run. Anyway you never directly told me how this thread is "stupid", I would love to know how this thread is incapable of making a valid point. I also noticed the abhorrence in your post and I don't know why you feel the need to attack a thread that wasn't intended to hurt anyone.

mar, 12/04/2012 - 08:18

#25

Fehzor

I think that we should advocate this kind of behavior- just to crush the hopes and dreams of those with a sense of ethics even further.

mar, 12/04/2012 - 09:02

#26

Pawsmack

Response.

@Fehzor

Don't get off topic now Fehzor. >->

mar, 12/04/2012 - 13:23

#27

Aureate

Processing Thoughts of You Always

Let me get this straight. You want to encourage this sort of behaviour in the Clockworks.

ಠ_ಠ

The faith you just made me lose in humanity is about 1/10 of the effect that F.A.T.A.L. had on me.
- 1

mar, 12/04/2012 - 14:09

#28

Melisan

how in any way is your idea

how in any way is your idea of any use to anyone, it is just something you wouldn't mind doing, not something that could be implimented into the game mechanic i.e. would you like to engage lazy mode? > lazy mode selected...sigh this idea has no merit whatsoever, if your friend can't be bothered to play thats fine, make more friends or solo. I have no idea why anyone would even entertain conversing with you on this.

EDIT pretty sure Fehzor was on topic...

mar, 12/04/2012 - 14:56

#29

Psychodestroyer

This confuses me.

I don't really even see how this is a suggestion.

In any case, doing so promotes laziness, plain and simple. Why bother doing a run when you can get someone better than you to drag your corpse? No hassle, no worries, (almost)free money.

People do it anyway in the sense that if they want it done they'll ask and probably do it.

But really, I don't see how this is a suggestion. Frankly, I don't like it.

mar, 12/04/2012 - 17:31

#30

Pawsmack

Responses.

@Aureate

Doesn't take much of a brain to figure out that I am encouraging it. Want a cookie? "The faith you just made me lose in humanity is about 1/10 of the effect that F.A.T.A.L. had on me.", I'm happy at the fact that you're a part of humanity just a clone of the others.

@Melisan

My idea is useful for me and the other people who are willing to use it. That itself is a good enough point. Of course it's something you wouldn't mind doing. That's the point... I never said it would be serious enough that the entire community would support it. "I have no idea why anyone would even entertain conversing with you on this.", start with yourself.

@Psychodestroyer

That's just it you don't have to like it. ._. I was expecting more people to like it but apparently I was wrong. Anyway this was actually in the General Discussion part of the forums. Then Msaad told me to move it to Suggestions.

Edit: Fehzor probably was on topic I thought he was talking about something else though.

mar, 12/04/2012 - 16:31

#31

Luguiru

Why is this still here

Fine. If no one else is going to go through this I may as well do something so you people know I am still alive.

"I was down in the Clockworks and I decided to offer one of my friends to join me on an F.S.C. run. They declined and said "I'm too lazy to do a run right now." "

You wanted to play the game. Your friend did not want to play the game. Nothing weird about that. Respect that your friend does not want to play at that time. How would you feel if you felt a locomotive coming to the station, so you leave your knight squatting in town so you can go squat elsewhere, when suddenly someone vomits constant demands for you to clench your cheeks and do whatever they want. Live a little. Relax. This is a game. Use the toilet when you need to.

"John wants to do a Jelly King run and get a few extra crowns out of it and his friend Peter wants to join but he's about to miss a 15 minute show on T.V."

So let Peter watch their show. Good for them.

"John decides to tell him he can join and leech off of him doing the run as long as he pays 1k Crowns in return"

Why would Peter want to play the game when he clearly wants to go watch his show? Because grinding crowns is the only purpose in his life? He can play the game when his show is over. It only goes for fifteen minutes, John can wait.

"So Peter agrees and comes with John"

What about his show? Do the needs of others have no significance as long as people can be grinding mindlessly for all eternity because there is nothing better in life or the game or whatever people are doing at the time?

"Peters dies then watches his show on T.V. Once the commercial comes up Peter checks on the run and suddenly John is on the elevator. He goes down and lets himself die again. John continues and does the rest of the run."

"What I mean by "Leeching players.", is if a person doesn't feel like putting much effort into a run but they still want the reward"

Peter is reaping loot by not playing the game. Not grinding actively like a lot of people do, but not even at his computer and he still gets rewards for it. If that needs any explanation beyond "games are for entertainment" then Peter may as well not play the game at all. Have you ever heard of Facebook games where you get money or whatever just for logging in? You just stand there, not even making any silly faces, and you get rewarded. How fun does that sound? How many memorable moments could that possibly create? How many other players are befriended after that? None. You get nothing from that. Sure, you get the money, but for what? So you can keep doing the same thing until you get to the end of the road? What happens then? Just keep going forever? Watching paint dry would be more entertaining than that. At least paint drying is something as opposed to not even being there.

"I'm new to the forums so please don't bash this thread"

Want the truth? Or how about whatever "truth" you want to see?

The truth is that request is never entertained. No one is going to give you a break for something so obviously designed for a negative result. If this was something like trading some of the heat you get from those floors for more crowns I could at least have a little sympathy, but this is the kind of idea that only comes from not wanting to enjoy the game you play. This is something Blandaxt would make a thread for.

The "truth" is you confused Spiral Knights with Facebook/Gaia and this is all a silly misunderstanding. We can all go home and uncle Jack off that old horse so we can walk into the sunset. Everything is happy and we all live happily ever after.

If this is something you honestly believe would be a positive addition to the game, get out. Never come back. In fact, never play any online game ever again. Not that you would need to since you would be too busy being rewarded for not playing the game at all to ever do anything.

Fehzor is talking about allowing this game to collapse on itself, not to seriously add this in hopes of improving the game. There are things called subtlety and sarcasm.

mar, 12/04/2012 - 17:12

#32

Pawsmack

Yay!

@Luguiru

I admire you so I'm going to take a chance to see how awesome you are and debate you! :D

"You wanted to play the game. Your friend did not want to play the game. Nothing weird about that. Respect that your friend does not want to play at that time. How would you feel if you felt a locomotive coming to the station, so you leave your knight squatting in town so you can go squat elsewhere, when suddenly someone vomits constant demands for you to clench your cheeks and do whatever they want. Live a little. Relax. This is a game. Use the toilet when you need to."

Then why were they logged on at all? I respect my friends but it was what he said that gave me the idea. I wasn't actually attempting to drag him into a run. Lol nice way to conclude the paragraph by the way.

"So let Peter watch their show. Good for them."

But Peter also wants Crowns! :D It's just Peter trying to multitask.

"Peter is reaping loot by not playing the game. Not grinding actively like a lot of people do, but not even at his computer and he still gets rewards for it. If that needs any explanation beyond "games are for entertainment" then Peter may as well not play the game at all. Have you ever heard of Facebook games where you get money or whatever just for logging in? You just stand there, not even making any silly faces, and you get rewarded. How fun does that sound? How many memorable moments could that possibly create? How many other players are befriended after that? None. You get nothing from that. Sure, you get the money, but for what? So you can keep doing the same thing until you get to the end of the road? What happens then? Just keep going forever? Watching paint dry would be more entertaining than that. At least paint drying is something as opposed to not even being there."

Peter can go off with his Crowns and buy something from A.H. and decide to play Lockdown and be able to take on some Dusker. I've heard of Facebook games and played them. Honestly they're very stale. I only use Facebook to promote myself and talk to family. I have Steam for my friends. Anyway back on what you were talking about. "You just stand there, not even making any silly faces, and you get rewarded.", it's your decision to how many times you want to leech off a friend or if you even want to do it at all.

"Want the truth? Or how about whatever "truth" you want to see?

The truth is that request is never entertained. No one is going to give you a break for something so obviously designed for a negative result. If this was something like trading some of the heat you get from those floors for more crowns I could at least have a little sympathy, but this is the kind of idea that only comes from not wanting to enjoy the game you play. This is something Blandaxt would make a thread for.

The "truth" is you confused Spiral Knights with Facebook/Gaia and this is all a silly misunderstanding. We can all go home and uncle Jack off that old horse so we can walk into the sunset. Everything is happy and we all live happily ever after.

Fehzor is talking about allowing this game to collapse on itself, not to seriously add this in hopes of improving the game. There are things called subtlety and sarcasm."

Actually I always appreciate people telling the truth. ._. I've never played "Gaia". I got a nice idea of what to post and what not to post now and even some input from people like you. :D

Anyway even you and everyone else know that I didn't put much thought or consideration into the post itself. Like I said "venting". I put more effort into my responses themselves honestly. XD It was not intended for me originally to gain lintel on anyone so don't get the wrong idea. I did put this out there to see if it was a good idea.

mar, 12/04/2012 - 17:33

#33

Melisan

please do not insult Aureate

please do not insult Aureate he's been here a damn sight longer than you and demands some respect, and don't wind up Psychodestroyer because....well, just don't.

"I did put this out there to see if it was a good idea"
yes, you did but when you were told that it was NOT a good idea, you got defensive, just take the hit graveyard this thread and think of an idea that will benefit the community.

mar, 12/04/2012 - 17:51

#34

Pawsmack

Lawlz.

I've been playing for 2 years though. :L I read one of Aureates stories fun stuff.

Anyway I wasn't planning on winding Psycho up. ._. He actually seems like a cool person. And yes I did get defensive. I was planning on putting this in the Graveyard but it was kind of fun talking to you guys honestly. XD

Ya I wasted everyones time! :D Derp

But time to Graveyard it since someone suggested it. :c Was fun though. Cya guys

mar, 12/04/2012 - 18:10

#35

Psychodestroyer

"and don't wind up Psychodestroyer because....well, just don't."

It's funny, because although I never actually thought of it that way, after some thinking, I found that getting on my bad side is actually not a good idea :D

/refers to previous examples of new forumers getting on my nerves (Those threads are like used battlefields.)

Also some of my confusion was cleared up in that last post. Understanding rocks.

"He actually seems like a cool person."

Stop that, you're gonna give me an ego...

And now for some random awesome that made me sad

mar, 12/04/2012 - 19:25

#36

Pawsmack

Derp.

Commenting on a thread that's in the Graveyard? *Tells admin Eurydice about Psycho breaking the rules.*

Lol anyway just wanted to add one more thing in.

@Aureate

Why you no like this thread? You commented and told someone to do this on another thread before this one was created.

http://forums.spiralknights.com/en/node/69146

"Pay someone to drag your corpse through it.
Simples.
Also, your weaponry and equipment sucks, to be frank. I would advise you get 4* all-round at least, with some fire resistance. Your Silent Nightblade doesn't count, the most common enemies resist shadow damage and Vanaduke is completely immune to shadow damage in his final stage, so you'd be using half a weapon against him. The bad half.
Get an upgrade for your Calibur at the very least. I'd say something about Blitz Needle and elemental-damage weapons, but it's half an hour to midnight and bluh bluh reading about Cthulhu Mythos at this time really not great for brain."

Lol jussayin I'm sort of confused by you now.

mar, 12/04/2012 - 20:29

#37

Psychodestroyer

"Commenting on a thread that's in the Graveyard? *Tells admin Eurydice about Psycho breaking the rules.*"

/twitches his eye

As a matter of fact, there is no rule against posting in Graveyarded threads. The graveyard is just the 'official' place for threads who have outlived their purpose, either because they were deemed useless or no longer relevant.

It's like how there's no rule against living in a cemetery. I don't think I need to explain that.

Aur's saying that because evidently the player sucks at Vana, and can't handle it.

On the other hand, your thread's promoting that idea that a completely able-player could/should/stillalittlefuzzyonthat pay someone to drag them through a level because they can't be bothered doing it themselves.

Put bluntly and simply:
Can't handle Vana 'cuz you suck? get someone to drag your useless corpse! .( ^.^ )~b

Can't be bothered so get someone to drag your lazy posterior? .( '~')~p

mer, 12/05/2012 - 09:32

#38

Pawsmack

Whaa? Guess I misunderstood

Whaa? Guess I misunderstood the sticky thread by the gm ._.

Yeah you really don't need to explain that. o-o

"Aur's saying that because evidently the player sucks at Vana, and can't handle it.

Put bluntly and simply:
Can't handle Vana 'cuz you suck? get someone to drag your useless corpse! .( ^.^ )~b

Can't be bothered so get someone to drag your lazy posterior? .( '~')~p"

Lol okie den. But I still didn't reach my 50 comments goal. :c

mer, 12/05/2012 - 12:32

#39

Aureate

Processing Thoughts of You Always

The issue is that they are specifically requesting someone to help out, and are willing to put in some effort to get the reward. Your suggestion is basically someone shoving a fistful of dollars at you and telling you to go turn it into more dollars whilst they do whatever else. They are not actively helping in any way, and are making matters more difficult during the run through their laziness.

Whilst it's true that less competent players can make it more difficult, at least they're putting in the effort. And even a new player can help out considerably in a Vanaduke run by watering down the boss, for starters.
The situation you describe is someone who cannot be bothered to even play the game.

Also, how does a Love Puppy seem masculine...

mer, 12/05/2012 - 15:03

#40

Psychodestroyer

Sowwy Aur :/

"Lol okie den. But I still didn't reach my 50 comments goal. :c"

We could just pull a derail until we hit 50.

mer, 12/05/2012 - 20:28

#41

Pawsmack

@Aureate I still think you're

@Aureate

I still think you're a guy. I still can't get over the fact that Nicoya-Kitty is a guy. -.- G.I.R.L. = Guy in real life. Lol I mean some people are girls but very little. ._. So I just stay away from it all and call everyone a guy.

@Psycho

Or we could just spam the thread until 50 if anyone really cares. Lol probably no one does. ._.

jeu, 12/06/2012 - 02:42

#42

Melisan

jeu, 12/06/2012 - 02:43

#43

Melisan

i'm

jeu, 12/06/2012 - 02:43

#44

Melisan

here

jeu, 12/06/2012 - 03:04

#45

Psychodestroyer

Discuss this

jeu, 12/06/2012 - 05:26

#46

Melisan

awesome... that is all

jeu, 12/06/2012 - 08:51

#47

Pawsmack

Only 47 comments? :c

Recherche

Leeching players in the Clockworks.