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1. What is the probability of Item drops?
2. Does the number of party members affect the probability of drops?
3. Are Items dropped from enemies, green boxes or red boxes?
4. list up your confirmed drops with place depth box/enemy
(e.g. i found a 4* skelly shield right after vanaduke)
i don´t know if there actually is a post with this issue but if there´s one a link might be useful.
greets
4. list up your confirmed drops with place depth box/enemy
(e.g. i found a 4* skelly shield right after vanaduke)
People, please do NOT make this list here. There is an entire thread in the Wiki Editors forum for that purpose. Listing your drops there (rather than here) helps us improve the wiki. The thread:
Gear only comes from boxes.
There seems to be an higer chance of getting a weapon that matches the stratum of the level, but anything could drop on any level (excluding boss rewards). Most FSC reports have fire weapons, but there are exceptions.
found 2 4* shivermist (forgot the name) both in a arena (last part's boxes) remember it being the 2nd T3 stratum
and 2 weeks ago found the whole 3* skelly set (not in a single run btw) 1 in random clockwork lvl and other 2 in a treasure vault and these where on basil runs so all where stratum 1 (so think the item lvl depends on what stratum)
What happens if you kick someone while theres an item drop? Does the item stay with you and go with the guy you kicked too?
@Canozo
I tested this with a friend. He was the party leader, there were only me and him in the party and the drop was a Toxic Vaporizer. Based on what he said, as soon as he kicked me the item disappeared and it was with me after the loading.
My theory is that the knight who gets the drop is determined on the moment of the drop, rather than that of the pick up.
This probably holds for materials, too. I didn't test with those, feel free to try on your own if you want.
I haven't verified this (I don't get many opportunities), but I've seen Eeyup's answer given by several people, so it seems to be the consensus. So it's pointless to go solo when you get to the treasure room at the end of a danger mission, for example.
Let me repeat: If you want to list your treasure box item drops, please do so at Confirming Treasure Box Equipment Drops, so that we can use the information to improve the wiki!
So it's pointless to go solo when you get to the treasure room at the end of a danger mission, for example.
I was under the impression that while items which have already dropped will have a designated owner, the boxes themselves will be duplicated through different instances provided that they remain intact.
Kupoo, we're arguing exactly the opposite: While the boxes are replicated across instances, the item box will contain the item in only one instance. This agrees with my experience --- for example, never having the go-solo strategy lead to multiple items dropping --- although it would be good to have more testing, admittedly.
I've been hunting for a specific item drop and have in my efforts made some interesting observations on this very subject. Some may disagree and other may say I'm full of it or the wiki doesn't say that but these are my direct and tested observations
1) Probability of item drops are dependent on the player. I've noticed when I was hard core looking for the item if I played steadily for a week I would get a drop every 6-7 days dependent on the amount of hours played a day. Also this was observed and tested while being solo only. I had other knights try the same and each came back with a different answer. One knight would get a drop ever 2 weeks and one even would get one every 4 days(this was a shocker to him cause he started farming his drops immediately after learning this)
2) Yes and No. While the individual players chance of receiving a drop doesn't change the addition of players means that you get not only your own drop percentage but theirs as well. They don't compile or add up but work together. Again this has been tested. Once i figured out what days were my drop days I started partying with others on those day after my drop already came. I've gotten multiple drops in a day before meaning those weren't my drops but that they were the other player's drops. After that the only random factor is who in the party gets it (and I was lucky there for awhile)
3) Equipment tends to drop from red boxes more than from any other source. Enemies and yes even green boxes will give equipment drops but at much lower frequency. Except the red boxes at the end of OCH; they seem to only drop coins.
@eeyup Thanks for the heads up! I've wondered this for awhile. I knew that drops were determined before they were picked up but not that if u kick a player it goes with them.
Also about treasure rooms, Its true, its pointless to go solo for them and actually hurts you more than helps you. When u leave a treasure room and go solo, especially if the whole party is there when u do it, you lose all the items currently in the box and spawn new boxes with only your drop percentage in play. Again as stated before more players more chances(kinda) for a drop. When u leave you lower that chance to only your chance of a drop, granted if there is one you get it no matter what but not if your drop spawned in the previous party's treasure room. Again this has been tested as multiple times when players leave and I get a drop I ask them did they get the same drop to which they respond "no."
Again these are my observations which I have tested to a limited extent. I could be wrong but for as long as I have been playing equipment drops have followed these rules for quite some time. And though some of my comments may now lower my equipment income it sure was a good ride.
Thank you by the way to every player that leaves treasure rooms. I've made a lot of money selling your stuff.
a note on drop days I've also tested when I knew what days I get drops not playing for several days on that day and when I finally come back and play I still get my scheduled drop
While the boxes are replicated across instances, the item box will contain the item in only one instance.
Isn't this more likely to be a probability issue than the soloing aspect? If each box's contents are randomized per instance, then a replicated box not having a drop in both instances would be due to the overwhelmingly low chance of that happening. I haven't done any inventory/content checking, but I think that would be more likely than assigning all box contents to a player once the level has been generated.
That said, if
>Yes and No. While the individual players chance of receiving a drop doesn't change the addition of players means that you get not only your own drop percentage but theirs as well. They don't compile or add up but work together.
is true, then there's no personal benefit either way.
Also about treasure rooms, Its true, its pointless to go solo for them and actually hurts you more than helps you. When u leave a treasure room and go solo, especially if the whole party is there when u do it, you lose all the items currently in the box and spawn new boxes with only your drop percentage in play. Again as stated before more players more chances(kinda) for a drop. When u leave you lower that chance to only your chance of a drop, granted if there is one you get it no matter what but not if your drop spawned in the previous party's treasure room. Again this has been tested as multiple times when players leave and I get a drop I ask them did they get the same drop to which they respond "no."
If the probability is linearly related to the number of knights, then going solo shouldn't (theoretically) actually hurt your chances of getting an item - perhaps one of seeing a drop, but not actually getting it yourself. If the contents are generated on box spawn and if each box is randomly generated on level load, though, there should be an overall increase in the chances of finding an item - a benefit to other party members but not the individual knight.
I guess a good follow-up question would be:
Do cloned boxes contain the exact same drops if we disregard materials and/or equipment?
Kupoo, you raise a very good point about the probabilities. Perhaps I've never observed the dropped-items-in-multiple instances, just because it's so rare.
It seems to me that there are two ways this could work. The contents of each box, including whether or not the box contains an item, and the owner of that item, could be determined either (A) when the level/room is generated, or (B) when the box is opened. The owner cannot be determined at time (C) when the item is picked up. Because then going solo after a drop would work, and we know that it doesn't.
You've convinced me to go solo as often as possible, in the hopes of detecting the ultra-rare dropped-items-in-multiple instances. :)
I know that the whatever contents in box are generated at random every time a box spawns. So if you go solo you completely change its contents. I've had an all crown drop before for multiple boxes and a friend who went solo got mostly heat with very few crowns. This was actually an instance that made me aware that the boxes change every time they are spawned.
So to answer your question no, cloned boxes do not contain the same drops regardless of equipment and/or materials.
That said, if
Yes and No. While the individual players chance of receiving a drop doesn't change the addition of players means that you get not only your own drop percentage but theirs as well. They don't compile or add up but work together.
is true, then there's no personal benefit either way.
Maybe wasn't explained properly earlier but imagine each player has a dice that they roll for their drop chance. In a 4 man party each member rolls their dice so in a sense 4 chances for a drop, where as when u are solo the dice is only rolled once. I'm assuming that if all goes according to how I've observed if 4 people could time their drops to a single day and all party together for that day there would be a chance for 4 items to drop in a single room, were they all to receive their drops at the same time.
I know that the whatever contents in box are generated at random every time a box spawns. So if you go solo you completely change its contents. I've had an all crown drop before for multiple boxes and a friend who went solo got mostly heat with very few crowns. This was actually an instance that made me aware that the boxes change every time they are spawned.
That's good information. So, when you go solo, the contents are not cloned. In other words, algorithm (B) from my post #13 is a better model for what's going on, than algorithm (A) is.
No (A) is correct: when its level/room is generated. When u go solo you are generating a new box/level/room
Ultimately, I don't think that we can decide between (A) or (B), really. There's no way to tell, is there?
However, if you play the game with (B) as your mental model, then I think you will correctly predict what's going to happen. The software might not actually be doing (B), but it might as well be doing (B), as far as you're concerned.
If you play the game with (A) as your mental model, then there are some funky details to handle. For example, when you go solo, you aren't generating the room from scratch. If a box has already been opened, then it isn't re-spawned in your new instance, right?
It's simpler to say that, when you go solo, the current state of the level is simply copied to your new instance. But then how does a box contain crowns in your instance, and heat in your friend's instance? It's easy to explain, if (B) is the algorithm.
I dont think u understand what you are saying, especially since I believe I've stated 3 times now (and this is number 4) if you go solo the items in the box change as if it was a new box
...which doesn´t seem to affect ANY chances of getting better/worse stuff from boxes.
e.g.: i was in a party of 4, a friend of mine went solo, she got 4 seals and more cr in the end.
I've got some alts that I can test some of this with.
perfectly, ty hexzyle! :D
clwnbaby don´t get me wrong but it occurs to me that your information isn´t based on statiscical data. might be possible that you´ve seen more item drops in a group of 4 but i don´t believe you got more items that way.
I dont think u understand what you are saying, especially since I believe I've stated 3 times now (and this is number 4) if you go solo the items in the box change as if it was a new box
How is this inconsistent with my "algorithm (B)", in which the contents of a box are determined when the box is opened? It seems utterly consistent with that idea.
U think Hexzyle is the only player with alts? I got alts and friends and I wanted to know the answer to this question LONG ago. As stated before I've tested all of my observations and these are the guidelines drops "appear" to follow. I could be wrong but all the evidence says otherwise.
As to more drops in 4 people parties, yes I have gotten "other people's" drops. Like stated before I tested all this to the point that I could predict, quite accurately mind you, when I would get a drop. I ran solo, 2 man, 3 man and 4 man parties and results are always the same as stated above. In events when I would receive my own predicted drop, there were times shortly to immediately after I would receive another drop. The only logical conclusion is the drop was not mine but in fact belongs to the other players I was with. Also I still practice all of this today and I always play solo on the days I KNOW a drop is coming. So all other gear received when I'm in other parties are not my drops but other peoples.
And in your earlier comment about your friend going solo u mention she got more than you got and then preceded to state that it doesn't matter. Like Bopp you keep disagreeing and then adding evidence that proves my point.
@ Bopp your (B) scenario a)doesn't make any sense b)is untestable on account that as soon as the box is opened you cant respawn the exact same box to test if opening it at a sooner or later time alters it and c)has no evidence to support it. Scenario (A) has all those things on account that I and now others have stated (and this will be the 5th time now I've said this) when u go solo the contents of the box change.
Anyway this is what I have observed and tested to much success. Believe me or don't but you had a question and I happened to know the answer. I dont feel I should have to constantly explain something I've already explained pretty thoroughly now, and that I and at least every one I know works.
Hope it was helpful!
If you wish to test everything I've said, and even though its gonna suck for you I hope you do, I suggest playing the same levels over and over i.e. King of Ashes. That way your monster and treasure box distribution will remain constant throughout the whole test. When compiling my data it was done in the Arcade on all gremlin levels with arenas and danger rooms spread out all over that's why my drop prediction is off by a day or so because I don't know exactly how many monsters i need to kill and boxes to open in order to get a drop.
Also this can't be tested in one week. It took me several months to figure all this out and get it down to, for lack of a better word, a science.
Hope you test it! and don't give up its frustrating but clearly people want to know and wont take the word of just one person who has done all this.
Except that at the treasure room of a 2-person LoA party, Fehzor went solo from my party before hitting the party button and she got a Skelly Shield drop while I got no item.
Stop it. No matter how hard you test neither ideas can be proven 100% right or 100% wrong.
Just because one can't be checked easily and the other is more intuitive means nothing.
All we can do is hope for some developer to reveal the trick.
Clwnbaby, I know that you keep repeating the same information. You don't have to point it out. I've read everything you've written in this thread, every time you've written it.
Your argument might be more convincing if you shared your "data" with us. Human beings are notorious for seeking patterns in rare random events. But you claim to have a system, that makes item drops very common. I wonder how many observations you have, and how much detail there is in each, so that we can rule out confounding variables. It's not that I think you're lying. It's just that strong claims require strong evidence.
Thanks anyway for sharing your experience. I'll think about the issue a little more, and let you know if I agree with your position. Otherwise, I'm probably done here. Happy travels, all.
From my experience items (mats, equipment) that has already dropped is determined upon it dropping. If somebody goes solo/is kicked then anything that is "theirs" but not picked up will go with them. This is not the same for boxes that have yet to be opened. What drops from the box is random (tested with 3 guildees) and varies from person to person.
Gear itself can be anything, but seems heavily influenced by the theme of the strata. Several Gravitons, Emberbreak, and Owlite items have been found in FSC. Jelly items and Cauterary Swords are not uncommon to see drop in JK. I know that I managed to get a Toxic Vaporizer from a random Poison themed Clockwork Tunnel.
So yea, Clwnbaby's data seems correct based from what I've seen myself.
~Gwen
#1 Probability ranges from no. of stars and type of item
The more stars an item is, the less chance it has to drop
Gear and weapon drops are rarer than materials, so much rarer... even in treasure boxes
#2 No. of party members do not affect probability of drops, but rather probability of you achieving the drops...
If you solo, you get all the materials, but if you are in a party, you get some and your party members get some
#3 Materials are dropped from enemies and treasure boxes
Gear should be the same