Spiral Knights - The Arcade Must Be Improved!

The Arcade Must Be Improved!

31 replies [Last post]

Wed, 01/16/2013 - 21:01

Axonnox

Way back in the early days of SK, the arcade used to be a bustling hub of players. Nowadays, it's a ghost town. As most of you know, crown payout in missions greatly overshadows that of running different depths in the arcade, even if they do include danger rooms or arenas. The arcade needs to be changed to at least be able to somehow compete with missions. I believe that bringing the arcade back would increase the longevity and number of active players in the community.

1. Crown Payout - Payout of running a full tier is meager in comparison to farming the most profitable missions of your appropriate rank. One full tier costs 70/80 energy, essentially being a full mist tank. Most players, when faced with either 6k cr per 100 mist or 14k cr per 100 mist, will choose the 14k option. Even when running the gate with Vana, the payout ends up at only 10k.
*Payout of a full arcade gate without boss should equal to around 2 or 3k less than farming of your appropriate rank!*

2. Cost to Create Party - Needs to be eliminated. When it's less profitable to run arcade, it makes zero sense to put a penalty for starting a party.

3. Eliminate the Arcade Tab on the Missions Menu - Perhaps maybe the arcade in Haven will become less obsolete then.

Popularizing the arcade again will increase SK's overall popularity. Many people I know have quit because the mission system was too "grindy." If the arcade had an increased payout, then SK would stay fresh, keeping more people in the game for a longer amount of time. More active players who like the game means more revenue for OOO. Wasn't the original idea of SK supposed to be a game that held endless amounts of content because of changing levels? Does grinding missions really reflect that?

TL;DR: Payout needs to be improved, penalty needs to be removed, arcade tab needs to be removed from mission menu, popularizing the arcade will be good for OOO and players.

Wed, 01/16/2013 - 21:04

Psychodestroyer

Rather, I find it's the opposite: Nerf Mission payouts. Arcade will be more profitable, so people will run it more.

Wed, 01/16/2013 - 21:42

Nineball-Seraph

@Psycho

Not to mention lowered mission payout would drop the price of CE substantially..

Thu, 01/17/2013 - 10:00

Shamanalah

My 2 cents

I think the huge difference between mission and Arcade is that I can start FSC right away and do it twice with 100 mist, unlike in Arcade where I have to use 80 mist (or is it 70?) to do FSC... and the payout is simply to little to be worthy of the time it takes

Although the good part about running Arcade is Basil recipe... But 50% of the recipe are in the Hall now so... what's the purpose? Finding Polaris, Gran Faust and Divine Avenger of course!

Arcade are outdated and did not evolved along the game. It's stalling, it is the same as it was 1 year and half ago...

I think the "normal" arcade depth should payout more in T3 and T2

So that we might consider doing Arcade run instead of Missions...

When I joined back in November and found out about those mission that starts you at the beginning of the bosses lair I was like "It's so awesome, no need to use Arcade anymore"

That's literally what I said

Edit: And all that complicated, so awesome structure to "choose" your depth type is long gone... It's useless, I mean... yeah you can still choose the depth if you want but it doesn't affect RJP or FSC...

Thu, 01/17/2013 - 10:12

Vtipoman

My idea

Put 10000 bombs in hall of heroes and blow it with all recipes.

Thu, 01/17/2013 - 11:47

Tini-Tiny

Save the Arcade

@Axonnox I totally agree! Arcade is way more fun. It gives variety and mystery, but lacks a good payout. Boss tokens don't help, either.
+A bajillion
+1 if previous form of petition is illegitimate.

Thu, 01/17/2013 - 13:44

Grantgalitz

Rather I think we need new

Rather I think we need new bosses that are tier 1/2/3 that can only be found in the clockworks. Insert redeemable tokens here for new spiffy gear only obtainable by said tokens. But this would require new content, which would take a lot from OOO.

Thu, 01/17/2013 - 13:56

Grittle

Do that Plus Remove ALL Heat

Do that

Plus

Remove ALL Heat payout in ALL ranked missions, So that people are forced to do arcade for them 4-5* items

Thu, 01/17/2013 - 14:38

Autofire

You are experiencing a PICNIC ERROR!

There's a better way...

Make it so replaying ANY rank mission will never give you any crowns, even if you're replaying it after loosing the first time. This encourages winning the mission on the first try, and prevents you from making an alt, getting to vana, and then playing it until the last level and going up.

And yes, 3 is a good idea. 2 shouldn't be done if missions are balanced because it encourages T3 players to go to T1/T2 to remove this fee. Payout on all of the levels with mediocre payouts should be buffed.

Thu, 01/17/2013 - 14:41

Canine-Vladmir

derp.

Most of SK fun came from the Arcade. I was then T1 and grinding SnarbyMan and buying 1 Star recipes

now im T3 and the game is crap. Do you know how scary it is to be soloing the arcade by myself?

+1 important upvote.

Thu, 01/17/2013 - 15:04

#10

Axonnox

I don't think nerfing mission

I don't think nerfing mission payouts would be the best move for OOO, as public response definitely won't be the best, and fixed prices will be harder to reach.

Thu, 01/17/2013 - 15:25

#11

Grittle

Do you think I really care??

Thu, 01/17/2013 - 15:26

#12

Psychodestroyer

"I don't think nerfing mission payouts would be the best move for OOO, as public response definitely won't be the best"

I doubt it. Most of the players realize they're taking the easy route by the missions. They'll be a little miffed that route is gone, but they'll understand that it's only fair; like when OOO patches glitches they abused.

Not to mention how ridiculous it'll sound when someone starts raging about not being able to grind missions for cr anymore 'because it was easier', when really all anyone should technically be running for extended periods of time is the CW.

In a situation like this, Public Response shouldn't matter.

Think of it this way; increase cr output, more people go to the better source: yes.

Bigger income of cr, more cr in the Market, CE price goes up.

It's better to decrease the thing at fault than to buff the neglected one. If everything was going in an 'up' direction, numbers would be as ridiculous as Power Levels.

Thu, 01/17/2013 - 15:47

#13

Fallconn

FALCON PUNCH!

I kind of like the missions because they don't take as long to get to the bosses such as vanaduke, I never had time to complete a whole vana run because I only had one hour to get to him and kill him. On the other hand I do miss running with random people and buying recipes and selling for more.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 21:22

#14

Tini-Tiny

Bumpity Bump

This thread needs more attention. Seerusly, I love the arcade.

Fri, 02/22/2013 - 22:01

#15

Troupe-Forums

Why force others to play with your playstyle by making their playstyles no longer viable? Missions are fine as they are, and so is the arcade. The arcade tab in the missions interface saves an extra loading screen, and the only real benefit of missions is that you can get to the levels you want to play without messing around wasting time and energy in other levels.
I do agree that the payout of the first stratum of a tier compared to the second needs to be increased. On average it's 2-3kcr for strat 5 and 6-8kcr for strat 6.

Sat, 02/23/2013 - 06:41

#16

Koffin-Kat

100% agree that something NEEDS to be done about the Arcade.

The best option would be to remove the "Arcade" tab from that Mission menu, as suggested above. It shouldn't be there!
When I was playing back then in 2011, the Arcade was what this game was all about, and it was such fun!

Sure it's easier with the missions, but where did the fun go?

OOO, let's make a compromis with this!
Raising the importance of the Arcade would definitelly be a step in the right direction ;)

Sat, 02/23/2013 - 15:07

#17

Shamanalah

my 2 cents

Why force others to play with your playstyle by making their playstyles no longer viable? Missions are fine as they are, and so is the arcade.

Why we play Mission then? All of us (older player) were running Arcade to farm SK, why did it changed? Because it was no longer viable? It still was, but if I have the choice between starting from depth 18 or 23 for a FSC run, I'll choose 23. It's a no brainer, but going from 18 encouraged us to get recipe but now with the Hall... /sigh

IDK where OOO is heading but I'm just anxious because the game as gone far from his original root... The Clockwork in an ever changing state.

Edit: The only purpose for the Arcade is Shadow Lair at this point... and some ultra rare recipe that you never get anyway...

Edit 2: since I commented 3 times

Sat, 02/23/2013 - 07:46

#18

Little-Juances

Just remember "your way of playing", with a straight shortcut to Vanaduke, is increasing the price of CE.
New free players have a harder time crafting T3 stuff because you're too lazy to do strat 5 before FSC.

Sat, 02/23/2013 - 09:05

#19

Klipik

"The best option would be to remove the "Arcade" tab from that Mission menu"

Why would that matter? No one uses the tab anyway...

Sat, 02/23/2013 - 10:55

#20

Nobodyno

@Klipik I do...

Sat, 02/23/2013 - 11:57

#21

Etharaes

Buff the arcade, nerf the missions

The arcade should be buffed so the general payout per level is the same as the current mission payouts. The mission payouts should then be nerfed to prevent endless grinding. Arenas should be very profitable.

And please for the love kittens make people who stumble into Treasure Vault: Fortune Smiles on the Greedy actually make the player go "Yay, treasure vault free money!" instead of "Ugh, treasure vault, there goes 10 mist down the drain."

This would probably benefit OOO well too becuase it would encourage weapon and armor type diversity.

Sat, 02/23/2013 - 12:05

#22

Softhead

No nerfing the missions.

Doesn't really do much anymore.

How about adding new content?

Sat, 02/23/2013 - 13:20

#23

Dmatter

simple solution. make

simple solution. make missions ether a one time only thing (name one mmo where you can replay missions), or make it so you can only run ONE mission a day. "So? What will that do?" you may say. Simple, you run vana, but what do you do with the 50 extra me? run stratum five ending where vana would start. Any normal person would realize that Doing the mission instead of the clockworks won't change anything, so they do the clockworks to start.

Sat, 02/23/2013 - 13:49

#24

Softhead

@Matter

What about those rare and fun missions like the Silent legion?

We really shouldn't restrict a gameplay aspect.

Also, the problem still wouldn't be solved.

People still wouldn't be going and exploring the Vastness of the CW.

THEY WOULD BE GRINDING VANA.

Problem still exists! it was there from the moment since post beta!

What we also asked for, is something that pays similarly to Vana.

Or buffing the non vana levels.

Sat, 02/23/2013 - 14:09

#25

Tin-Foil-Hat

Make Arcade like PvP, Get

Make Arcade like PvP, Get Random rewards with a chance of an epic unique reward at the end of tiers.

King has a chance to give out unique bomber helms, have unique costumes for arcade. Instead of Krogs, have a drop of primal sparks or something.

Thu, 06/27/2013 - 11:27

#26

Quaquonfaes

%100

I agree 100%, arcade is very fun but it's dead, I enjoy racing to the core more that meat-grinding slags and killing vanaduke all day.

I think a proper way to balance out the system, is to make arcade elevators cost only 2-3 energy, and make is so that more advanced grindable missions (like jk and vana), cost 100ce after completed the first time.
That would dissencourage rank mission grinding and encourage arcade more.

Thu, 06/27/2013 - 15:33

#27

Magmaul-Ace

Lets make a list.

Ok,I'll make a rundown of some of your opinions and put them into harmony(I'll try!)

--"I think a proper way to balance out the system, is to make arcade elevators cost only 2-3 energy, and make is so that more advanced grindable missions (like jk and vana), cost 100ce after completed the first time."

Well,the 10 mist for elevator is a bit of a iconic number,but something they could do about the prices is make rooms like treasure vault have no ce price or 5 instead of ten.And that 100 Ce thing is kind of greedy-like,so no.

--"simple solution. make missions ether a one time only thing (name one mmo where you can replay missions), or make it so you can only run ONE mission a day."

Yes,but that is a bit too harsh since fun and unique missions like Silent Mission would get blocked.
A adaptation of Dmatter's idea is still making missions unplayable once completed,but keep the iconic ones around to replay on a isolated place,like The Silent Legion could be sent to a list of replayable missions or the CW.(as well as any other that deserve credit for originality)

Well,and for the rank missions like these generic rescue missions or arena levels,turn them into sub objetives that appear somewhat randomly on certain levels,like you enter a desconstruction zone and get informed by Kora that Spiral HQ found out there are capture knights in the level,in wich you can then choose between rescuing them for a reward (maybe prestige) or not.That would keep the "content" of those missions replayable,as well as bring Kora back a bit.

--"The arcade should be buffed so the general payout per level is the same as the current mission payouts. The mission payouts should then be nerfed to prevent endless grinding. Arenas should be very profitable."

I agree with the end,but making such a invertion of profit is a bit too radical.They SHOULD make missions like King of Ashes or The royal jelly less profitable or at least more chalenging to make up for the money,but minimaly.And obviously DO make arcade levels more profitable,the only reason most players ever go there is either for the sake of challenge or recipes for token weps!

--"Put 10000 bombs in hall of heroes and blow it with all recipes."

I will interpretate as "Erase the hall of heroes",and as that,YES I AGREE.With a safe source of mostly all of this game's recipes for gear,clockwork adventures lose credit since the only times reaching the crossroads is rewarding are when Basil's recipes are for tokens weps(that are not in the HoH),otherwise its not worth it.They should destroy it or at least remove some recipes and leave only the most basic ones.Witouth a place to acquire them easily,not only recipes will be more valued at the AH,but starters will have to explore the Clockworks to get their gear,wich will then promote the Arcade more,as well as give a higher profit over missions.

As for Axonnox' comment,I dont think they should eliminate the party-making fee,and that is all.

Thu, 06/27/2013 - 17:20

#28

Toxxicpoison

+10000

I posted something similar to this, I agree 100% I want arcade runs to have same payouts as let's say Vana. This would keep the game more populated so people don't get bored of running the same stuff all the time to make money.

Thu, 06/27/2013 - 18:43

#29

Waffleconecake

how to fix missions for the time : 1

Just going to say it now, the simplest way to fix missions with out removing it is to make it into a detailed interactive tutorial instead of a "start to finish" thing. Have it end with the player doing a "preview" mission for the Gloaming Wild Woods so the player gets an idea of the Snarbolax and a bit of for shadowing but doens't get to fight it.
For the sake of it being a tutorial I feel TUTORIAL missions should only cost 5 energy so new players can do it faster and learn within 3 days instead of maybe a week how the game works. Obviously we should either make it a solo thing or a "recruit/squire" only thing.

Fri, 06/28/2013 - 07:01

#30

Blandaxt

Ideas LOve em

I love Etharaes, and I also like #1 and 3. Number 2, I’m debating whether for or against.

I also like these ideas

1. "Well,the 10 mist for elevator is a bit of a iconic number,but something they could do about the prices is make rooms like treasure vault have no ce price or 5 instead of ten.And that 100 Ce thing is kind of greedy-like,so no."

2. "Well,and for the rank missions like these generic rescue missions or arena levels,turn them into sub objetives that appear somewhat randomly on certain levels,like you enter a desconstruction zone and get informed by Kora that Spiral HQ found out there are capture knights in the level,in wich you can then choose between rescuing them for a reward (maybe prestige) or not.That would keep the "content" of those missions replayable,as well as bring Kora back a bit."

3. "--The arcade should be buffed so the general payout per level is the same as the current mission payouts. The mission payouts should then be nerfed to prevent endless grinding. Arenas should be very profitable."

Against this idea:

1. "--Put 10000 bombs in hall of heroes and blow it with all recipes."

For the idea I am against I would rather that the developers remove 30% of popular recipes that players like and go for and leave the recipes that players don’t really want to go for.

Fri, 06/28/2013 - 07:31

#31

The-Mighty-Potato

I mentioned this before in a previous topic, but...

I can't remember which one :p (+1 BTW)

But my idea was that once you complete a mission, you cannot replay it. Just like prestige missions. Once you replay a prestige mission you can no longer do it until the next day. For this case, make it so the next day you still can't do the mission. And for the day after, and that day after, and for the rest of the future of SK!

But yeah...Your friends would be able to invite you to KoA like in prestige missions, but the flaw in this is that people may leave once they get their tokens etc. First of all, make it so once you kill vanaduke it automatically ranks you up, so there's no escaping it. Once it's done, you can't get your friend to invite you again. (As s/he will also move up to 9-4).

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The Arcade Must Be Improved!