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Woah. Prestige and linear gameplay. [FORUM GAME]

6 replies [Last post]
Wed, 04/03/2013 - 10:49
Fehzor's picture
Fehzor

So on the testing forum (and this doesn't spoil anything new), Nick said something about exactly "creates a very linear mindset regarding advancement within the game." with respect to crowns and what we consider money, largely implying that they aren't the point of the game despite clearly being what we all strive to attain constantly. And everyone was like "You do realize that the game IS legitimately tied entirely to crowns and energy and..." which is entirely correct.

But that got me thinking later. Zeddy pointed out that as seen in what can only be described as the official new-UI screenshot, the prestige mark for the knight is in the top corner at all times. So then I was writing a post earlier in suggestions because I apparently have time to do that, and was like "no one cares about prestige, it's just epeen, so don't make that the largest reward.." but then it hit me.

Prestige was not intended to be only epeen.

"These missions reward you with ‘prestige’ which acts as a running score attached to your knight. Knights with high prestige will earn a special bonus in the future." -Nick on prestige missions

The important part of that was "which acts as a running score". This sounds like progress to me. Prestige is meant to literally be how far your knight is in the game, not just an arbitrary number. The missions weren't/aren't supposed to try to replace the arcade, your knight was supposed to get through them AND still play the arcade.

The reason why this doesn't work is plainly that there isn't enough content, and that the game's crowns are off balance. Players, which are basically happy game theory solvers, see no to little reason to play levels that do not pay out highly to them. The arcade being one of those inferior levels. Before, the game was very similar in that FSC was played over and over by guilds that could invite players to them at basil (a concept foreign to players to-day.)

Then there is the 2nd part of that. "Knights with high prestige will earn a special bonus in the future."

But then we had this happen- "The first prestige reward, Prestige Badges, will now be granted to the most prestigious of knights! See the tooltip on any prestige reward for more information on all five levels of Prestige Badges." here- http://forums.spiralknights.com/en/node/50291

The important part of that one being "The first prestige reward, Prestige Badges" not "The reward for prestige is revealed, Prestige Badges!" But "THE FIRST". Implying that there was or is something beyond prestige badges being intended for us. This could mean that Nick

A week later the "Blast Processing" that truly fixed lag in Spiral Knights forever was introduced along with other things.. which could have taken precedence over a prestige benefit? But chances are that the intended prestige reward was simply not given to us because of it not being make-able in a time-frame that fit.

But basically, prestige is meant to represent how far you are in the game, which can be given by-
Prestige from missions + prestige from dailies. Which means that 2 players on the same missions can outclass one another in terms of Spiral-Knightednessss via daily missions. And that these players would/will somehow reflect their extra-knightness in some way?

Oh, and discussions are a type of forum game. Just like beating people over the head with sticks in the middle of an ice rink is a form of hockey game. Ice fight.

Wed, 04/03/2013 - 11:05
#1
Skyrazer's picture
Skyrazer
A pitty...

This is quite sad. Yet, true.

We were promissed "Something" in return for prestige.
The entire statement "Crown and CE inducators make the game linear and give people false objectives in the game" however, is just... How do I put this...
Ignorant... Every single MMO, be it Tripple A or F2P has and relies a lot on in-game currencies. And stripping the player of that knowledge of how much he's earned and has is counterproductive, and will only lead to more unhappy people and players Ragequitting.

As for "giving false objectives" What kind of objectives do they expect form players? A lot of people have already completed every mission, achieved the final Prestige badge, and already have soloed every single boss and level. These players need a new goal, because the lack of content in-game is holding them back. Which is why they start to expand towards gaining crowns, CE, and gear. Players NEED to know how much Energy or Crowns they have, because these are vital to their progession in the game. The entire game revolves around the CE market, and stripping the players of knowing how much of it they have is outrageous.

Wed, 04/03/2013 - 11:56
#2
Eltia's picture
Eltia
Cooperstown, ND

In summary, why this game is already linear in nature and "tweaking" UI won't solve it:

  • CE. It's like the fuel in your car. It measures how far you can travel in the SK world;
  • CR. This is a "benchmark" on how much time you have invested into the game. Time is linear (we don't have time travel in SK yet). It is a benchmark and not a real measurement, because of randomness in the game (like UVs) that could create leap in CR;
  • Prestige. It can only accumulate, therefore, linear.
Wed, 04/03/2013 - 12:12
#3
Merethif's picture
Merethif
Nick said: "Also, regarding

Nick said:
"Also, regarding crowns not appearing on the HUD at all times, we've come to believe that displaying currencies on the HUD creates a very linear mindset regarding advancement within the game.

I agree with that philosophy. Factors not important to game advancement should be non-existent or minimal in main HUD. Likewise, the more significant factor is, the bigger it is in HUD.

Applying this Nick's philosophy and looking at new HUD, I assume that what is really important in game advancement (at least according to developers' vision) is character portrait. So I suppose new HUD is supposed to creates mindset on character appearance, not crowns, energy or even prestige. Cool.

Wed, 04/03/2013 - 12:18
#4
Juances's picture
Juances

The gms already even edited the wiki.

Health bar in haven? WHY!??!
http://wiki.spiralknights.com/User_interface
http://wiki.spiralknights.com/File:Interface_new.png

Wed, 04/03/2013 - 12:31
#5
Eltia's picture
Eltia
Cooperstown, ND

Regarding health / shield bars in Haven. I'm going to wait and see. Who knows maybe later on monsters can raid Haven / Guild Halls and we have to defend them.

Wed, 04/03/2013 - 14:25
#6
Jacobey's picture
Jacobey
Rank and Title

Displaying rank # on the character portrait really serves no purpose, especially if you have achieved top rank.
It's not like - ZOMG - I only party with knights of Rank 7 and above.

Displaying rank title above knight name adds no value - why would anybody care?
If I want someone to know my rank - I can just wear the applicable badge I earned.

Both of these just add unnecessary clutter to a screen full of MORE white text.

Please consider removing or giving us a way to turn off what we see in our display options (a la monster health bars).

Thank you.

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